Is it "stealing" for the government to tax people for social services?

[Age]

There would be some way to blame Trump, because that is what's important for the Left.

(Couldn't resist)

To you, is "donald trump" 'the greatest human being on the face of the earth', as well?

[Age]

It's ONLY Americans who ever make that claim.

Oh. So no "rule Britannia" and "God save the king," "I Vow to Thee, My Country," and "Jerusalem" for you, I guess.

What has any of 'this' got to do with 'the claim', 'the greatest country on the face of the earth'?

As far as I can see, there is absolutely nothing at all. So, maybe you might like to explain what you are 'seeing', here, "immanuel can", which I am 'missing', here.

And, there is no use saying some thing like, you will not do it because I am not capable of seeing and/or understanding.

Just do it to show 'the readers' what I do not see, and/or are incapable of seeing.

Now, if you do not explain how what you said and wrote, here, relates to, 'it is ONLY "americans" who ever make that claim', then, once again, 'we' have 'another one' who implies things, which that can not back up and support, at all.

[accelafine]

Oh. So no "rule Britannia" and "God save the king," "I Vow to Thee, My Country," and "Jerusalem" for you, I guess.

What does any of that have to do with the price of haddock?

The price of haddock is the same, whether in US dollars or British pounds.

The English, whom I know very well indeed, are less ostentatious than the Americans, but every bit as prone to nationalism, not less xenophobic, and in their "stiff upper lip" way, every bit as convinced of the superiority of English culture. Hence, their fondness for shows of state, for the Union Jack or the Cross of St. George, and their nostalgia about the days of the British Empire.

They just don't say it the way the Americans do. However, even their sense of superiority to the Americans is born of the same grudgy nationalism that England has always had.

Anybody who knows the English knows that, at least. And I like the English...and participate in their history myself.

However, this I will say for the Americans: they're much more open-hearted, ingenuous, unselfish and enthusiastic about other people's success than the Brits are. The English resent anybody who tries to improve his station in life, or who fails to hold his place. In America, if you move up in life, the Americans' attitude is, "Yay for you, pal: go for it." The English attitude is, "He's a fellow who doesn't know his place."

America may be brash, but England is still heirarchical and snobby. America's not. So that's a point for the Americans.

Why are you lecturing me about England? No, the English don't go around crowing that they are 'the greatest' and nor does anyone else but Americans.

[Age]

Oh. So no "rule Britannia" and "God save the king," "I Vow to Thee, My Country," and "Jerusalem" for you, I guess.

What does any of that have to do with the price of haddock?

The price of haddock is the same, whether in US dollars or British pounds.

The English, whom I know very well indeed,

LOL

Are you referring to the very few so-called "english people", personally, which you claim to know very well? Or, are you, laughably, 'trying to' claim that you, inherently, know very well, and indeed, all "english people"?

Either way, and any way, none of 'this' has absolutely any thing to do with what "accelafine" pointed out and said above, here.

are less ostentatious than the Americans, but every bit as prone to nationalism, not less xenophobic, and in their "stiff upper lip" way, every bit as convinced of the superiority of English culture.

you appear to have completely and utterly missed, and misunderstood, the 'very words' that "accelafine" said, and wrote, above, here.

Hence, their fondness for shows of state, for the Union Jack or the Cross of St. George, and their nostalgia about the days of the British Empire.

They just don't say it the way the Americans do.

Therefore, you are just backing up and supporting what "accelafine" actually said, and wrote, even further.

you are, therefore, just defeating what you were 'trying to' argue for, and proving further what you are 'trying to' argue against. But, as can be clearly seen throughout this forum, 'this' is a common trait of yours.

However, even their sense of superiority to the Americans is born of the same grudgy nationalism that England has always had.

Anybody who knows the English knows that, at least. And I like the English...and participate in their history myself.

However, this I will say for the Americans: they're much more open-hearted, ingenuous, unselfish and enthusiastic about other people's success than the Brits are. The English resent anybody who tries to improve his station in life, or who fails to hold his place. In America, if you move up in life, the Americans' attitude is, "Yay for you, pal: go for it."

Which explains, perfectly, why people, like you "immanuel can", hate and loath 'those' who you call, and believe, 'move down', in Life.

The English attitude is, "He's a fellow who doesn't know his place."

America may be brash, but England is still heirarchical and snobby. America's not. So that's a point for the Americans.

See how, once again, 'this one' absolutely and totally 'deflects' in an attempt to get its own views, and beliefs, across as though 'they' are somehow good, and/or right.

LOL 'This one' is the prime example of deceit and ego, with the strongest 'superiority complex' thrown in, as well.

Back to the 'actual point', what you said and above, here, obviously had absolutely nothing, at all, to do with what "accelafine" actually said, and wrote, above. Exactly as "accelafine" pointed, and showed.

[Age]

What does any of that have to do with the price of haddock?

The price of haddock is the same, whether in US dollars or British pounds.

The English, whom I know very well indeed, are less ostentatious than the Americans, but every bit as prone to nationalism, not less xenophobic, and in their "stiff upper lip" way, every bit as convinced of the superiority of English culture. Hence, their fondness for shows of state, for the Union Jack or the Cross of St. George, and their nostalgia about the days of the British Empire.

They just don't say it the way the Americans do. However, even their sense of superiority to the Americans is born of the same grudgy nationalism that England has always had.

Anybody who knows the English knows that, at least. And I like the English...and participate in their history myself.

However, this I will say for the Americans: they're much more open-hearted, ingenuous, unselfish and enthusiastic about other people's success than the Brits are. The English resent anybody who tries to improve his station in life, or who fails to hold his place. In America, if you move up in life, the Americans' attitude is, "Yay for you, pal: go for it." The English attitude is, "He's a fellow who doesn't know his place."

America may be brash, but England is still heirarchical and snobby. America's not. So that's a point for the Americans.

Why are you lecturing me about England?

If you ever find out I am also very curious.

I am also very curios what has what "immanuel can" is saying, here, got to do with what you said, and wrote, and also how some one could be so self-absorbed, as "Immanuel can", to believe that it knows, very well indeed, a whole culture and/or the insight of a whole particular group of human beings.

No, the English don't go around crowing that they are 'the greatest' and nor does anyone else but Americans.

Why is it people like "immanuel can" not see that only 'this' is what is being talked about, and referred to, here?

[Age]

Imagine believing that using 'taxed money' to help and support life is 'stealing', while believing that using 'taxed money' to maim and kill life is 'not stealing'.

[LuckyR]

The old government threat ... Oh, so you're not going to increase the money we take, eh?

Well then, all essential services are hereby canceled.

- Your house will burn to the ground because of no fire department.
- You will be a victim because of no police.
- Your children won't pass basis proficiency tests because government teachers can't educate them.
- You won't be able to rebuild your burned out home because no one in the government is issuing the necessary permits.

Oh ... wait a minute ... that's when the government gets what it wants.


Uh huh.

Uummm... the topic is theft/stealing. Nice try at what-about-ism, though...

[Gary Childress]

Obviously not you, either. How are you going to pay other people's bills on $10,000 a year or less yourself?

Welcome to Socialism: everybody suffers, nobody's needs are met, and nobody adds value to the economy, so there's no hope for the future, either.

That's why we tax the rich who take all the money, moron!

You'd better learn to count, Gary. If Socialism were instituted $10,000 is all you'd have!

There's no more to tax. It's all gone. Nobody is rich from then on. Or ever again.

There's no point in talking to you anymore. You misinterpret everything and immediately go to worst case scenario even though no one is proposing worst case scenario or even anything remotely close to it. Tired of dealing with dishonest interlocutors. Bye, idiot.

[mickthinks]

Robert Reich has a few questions for Manny, Walker, et al:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DRLG7WnD0jA/

[mickthinks]

There would be some way to blame Trump, …

Walker’s TDS is flaring up again …

[promethean75]

"Okay, describe your plan: how does that happen? What are the steps to get there?"

It ain't gonna happen. That's why I issued a formal decree ordering all revolutionaries to become anarchist illegalists to help accelerate our decline.

Sometimes, you gotta kick what is already falling, as Nietzsche once put it.

[MikeNovack]

All this talk of "the government" as if that were foreign rulers over us.

Look, I believe all of us are writing from the position of citizens of representative democracies. It is all well and good to complain about faults in ours, faults which interfere with our limited democracy (limited by constitutions, a GOOD limitation). But it is not an external government imposingtxes. WE are imposing taxes upon ourselves. Or at least some subset of us are (imposing taxes on all).

It is NOT stealing when the majority of us decide to impose taxes upon all of us (including the minority opposed) for whatever purpose, including social services.

I will entertain objections from those who are not in favor of democracy (some variant). But I reject an argument"taxes imposed fo social services is stealing but imposing taxes for ___________________ (fill in the blank) is not.

Voluntary organizations to do XYZ of course. THAT is how you organize to get something done when you can't get the whole body to agree to vote XYZ done. I am, after all, an anarchist. But that is AFTER failing to get enough support in the whole to just vote it in. And we have a right to try to organize that support. Sorry folks who do not want XYZ, you do not have a valid objection against our trying to organize that support.

[phyllo]

Or at least some subset of us are (imposing taxes on all).

It is NOT stealing when the majority of us decide to impose taxes upon all of us (including the minority opposed) for whatever purpose, including social services.

The whole point is that it is stealing if one does not explicitly agree to the amounts of money and where they are spent.

[Alexiev]

Or at least some subset of us are (imposing taxes on all).

It is NOT stealing when the majority of us decide to impose taxes upon all of us (including the minority opposed) for whatever purpose, including social services.

The whole point is that it is stealing if one does not explicitly agree to the amounts of money and where they are spent.

No. "Stealing" is a legal term. It is " the action or offence of taking another person's property without permission or legal right and without intending to return it". Since taxation is legal, it is not stealing, as anyone can plainly see.

Property is also a legal concept. Without those same laws that have legalized taxation, there would be no property rights.

[phyllo]

Or at least some subset of us are (imposing taxes on all).

It is NOT stealing when the majority of us decide to impose taxes upon all of us (including the minority opposed) for whatever purpose, including social services.

The whole point is that it is stealing if one does not explicitly agree to the amounts of money and where they are spent.

No. "Stealing" is a legal term. It is " the action or offence of taking another person's property without permission or legal right and without intending to return it". Since taxation is legal, it is not stealing, as anyone can plainly see.

Property is also a legal concept. Without those same laws that have legalized taxation, there would be no property rights.

Sure, all you need is a law that makes taking somebody's stuff legal.