WE NEED MORE GUNS..

[Skepdick]

No it wouldn't be fair, and that's probably what encouraged you to imply it. It would be fair to say that it's my dislike of firearms that makes me approve of law that severely restricts ownership of them.

So it would also be fair to say that your dislike of firearms outweighs your like for my right to life and dignity.

No, that would not be a fair representation of my view. It would be fair to say that my dislike of firearms is such that I don't think private citizens should be allowed to possess them.

My assessment is spot on.

All private citizens posess the right to life and dignity.

You don't think private citizens should be allowed to posess fireaarms. Not even for the purpose of ensuring their right to life is upheld.

Therefore your dislike of firearms outweighs my right to protect my life with a firearm.

I gotta give it to your propaganda machine - they have brainwashed you good to feel the way you feel.

The thread is about guns and the possession of guns, and any implications about your right to life are incidental to that subject. Of course we are discussing your right to own a gun.

And that would be fair, except my right to own a gun is implicit in my right to defend my life.


Otherwise my right to life and my right to defend that life is worth less than the paper my rights are written on.

[commonsense]

Yes we have because we realised we have no use for gun ownership. Just as we understand not to allow children gun ownership.

If you personally have no hangups about guns, or every gun owning American have no hang ups about guns, then so to should every child in America own a gun.

The absence or presence of guns has absolutely no effect on a civil, mature, mentally ballanced intelligent and functioning society.

So why do you have or need laws against them?

Probably because today’s American society is not civil.

[Harbal]

I think that guns are too dangerous for the public in general to be allowed to possess them; therefore, I think your "constitutional right" to own a gun is misguided.

Yes I know you think that. But is your thinking grounded in any facts or is the law being subjugated to your feelings here?

My thinking is grounded in the fact that guns are dangerous to human life, with no practical value other than being efficient at destroying human life, and it is sesible to eliminate as much danger to our lives from our lives as possible. The law is not under my subjugation, but I would like to think that, along with enough others, my opinion goes towards helping to keep gun ownership in my country prohibited. Surely, the law should reflect the preferences of those it is meant to serve.

[Dontaskme]

Not all of us are as fortunate as you to have been born civil, mature, mentally ballanced, intelligent and socially functional.

Some of us needed to tame off our biological defaults.

Not all of us are fortunate to be born into a normal functioning country that has no need to arm itself with guns in fear for their lives everytime they leave the safety of their houses.

At the end of the day, America is not your average normal country, to the outsiders looking in, America appears to be in a rather poorly sick state of affairs, that it cannot shake off it's fear and it's irrational beliefs that it needs to arm itself to the teeth to function there. I'm blessed not to live in that country. I am happy I was born in the UK..but I could very well have been born in the USA and there is nothing we can do about what country we are born into...and so had I have been born there it would have meant I wouldn't have batted an eyelid about guns probably...because it seems normal to own guns in the US, but to countries that don't use guns as a personal protection, like in europe for example, personal gun ownership is seen as a bit weird....and that's all I need to say about the matter of guns for now.

[commonsense]

Good thing I don't use my gun for killing then. I use it to stop attacks other people.

The side-effect of that may be death, but hey - that's not my problem.

Hypocrite! Earlier you stated that it is your intention to kill anyone who harms your loved ones. Do you own a firearm to kill people or not?

Do I own a firearm to kill people? Maybe.
Do I own a firearm to murder people? No.

Thanks for the clarification.

[Skepdick]

My thinking is grounded in the fact that guns are dangerous to human life

If that were true why is the murder rate going down even though society is acquiring more guns?
Why is human life expectancy going up even though society acquires more guns?

If your thinking was grounded in facts I would absolutely expect the exact opposite of what's happening.

There's all sorts of things that are dangerous to human life if abused. Like nuclear energy. But hey... learning how to use dangerous things safely is part and parcel of moral progress.

[commonsense]

My thinking is grounded in the fact that guns are dangerous to human life

If that were true why is the murder rate going down even though society is acquiring more guns?
Why is human life expectancy going up even though society acquires more guns?

If your thinking was grounded in facts I would absolutely expect the exact opposite of what's happening.

There's all sorts of things that are dangerous to human life if abused. Like atomic energy. But hey... learning how to use dangerous things safely is part and parcel of moral progress.

Immunizations.

[Skepdick]

My thinking is grounded in the fact that guns are dangerous to human life

If that were true why is the murder rate going down even though society is acquiring more guns?
Why is human life expectancy going up even though society acquires more guns?

If your thinking was grounded in facts I would absolutely expect the exact opposite of what's happening.

There's all sorts of things that are dangerous to human life if abused. Like atomic energy. But hey... learning how to use dangerous things safely is part and parcel of moral progress.

Immunizations.

Fire.
Poisons used in medicinal quantities.
Surgery.
Microwaves.

The list is endless.

[Dontaskme]

Do I own a firearm to kill people? Maybe.
Do I own a firearm to murder people? No.

I am still here. The guys who tried to murder me aren't. So I guess it's was a bit like a parachute - if I didn't have it...

So it seems you killed some guys who according to you, were trying to murder you. But what if those guys were trying to kill you, not murder you? can you explain why you think those guys were trying to murder you, and not just kill you. ?

[Skepdick]

So it seems you killed some guys who according to you, were trying to murder you. But what if those guys were trying to kill you, not murder you? can you explain why you think those guys were trying to murder you, and not just kill you. ?

So you don't know what murder is and why what you are asking is completely nonsensical?

They were "just trying to kill me". Them lacking a legally justifiable reason to kill me is what qualifies the act as attempted murder.

[Dontaskme]

So it seems you killed some guys who according to you, were trying to murder you. But what if those guys were trying to kill you, not murder you? can you explain why you think those guys were trying to murder you, and not just kill you. ?

So you don't know what murder is and why what you are asking is completely nonsensical?

They were attempting to kill me. Them lacking a legally justifiable reason to do so is what made it attempted murder.

So to have a valid reason to end someones life is to kill them not murder them.

But to murder someone is to kill them with no valid reason to do so.

A car or plane crash never murdered the people inside those forms of transport, those people were just killed.

Ok, thanks for the clarification. People who kill other people without a valid reason to do so are murders, not killers. No one in their right mind would just kill someone for no reason other than to just feel like murdering someone.

I guess those guys were just out to murder you then, for there lack of having nothing better to do with their lives, but to murder someone for no justifable reason is why you had to kill them so they wouldn't be able to attempt to murder someone else for no reason at all.

They were attempting to kill you without any reason to do so, so it was seen as attempted murder, they were trying to murder you in their attempt to kill you without valid justified reason.

Oh lord just beam me up off this clown planet, it's simply too dangerous being alive.

[Skepdick]

So it seems you killed some guys who according to you, were trying to murder you. But what if those guys were trying to kill you, not murder you? can you explain why you think those guys were trying to murder you, and not just kill you. ?

So you don't know what murder is and why what you are asking is completely nonsensical?

They were attempting to kill me. Them lacking a legally justifiable reason to do so is what made it attempted murder.

So to have a valid reason to end someones life is to kill them not murder them.

But to murder someone is to kill them with no valid reason to do so.

A car or plane crash never murdered the people inside those forms of transport, those people were just killed.

Ok, thanks for the clarification. People who kill other people without a valid reason to do so are murders, not killers. No one in their right mind would just kill someone for no reason other than to just feel like murdering someone.

I guess those guys were just out to murder you then, for there lack of having nothing better to do with their lives, but to murder someone for no justifable reason is why you had to kill them so they wouldn't be able to attempt to murder someone else for no reason at all.

They were attempting to kill you without any reason to do so, so it was seen as attempted murder, they were trying to murder you in their attempt to kill you without valid justified reason.

Oh lord just beam me up off this clown planet, it's simply too dangerous being alive.

Your inability to navigate the complexities of life is hardly a problem with the planet.

It's a problem with you.

I guess that's why you want to ban all the things that you don't understand. Rules sure simplify stuff.

[Dontaskme]

Your inability to navigate the complexities of life is hardly a problem with the planet.

It's a problem with you.

Yes, I have a problem having to navigate people. I have no problem with life in general. It's the people that seem to create all the problems.

I think we should just resort back to being apes and chimps and monkies, that are not held accountable for their killing sprees, that would be less stressful actually.

I'd much prefer the simple life, to the man made complexities.

[Skepdick]

Your inability to navigate the complexities of life is hardly a problem with the planet.

It's a problem with you.

Yes, I have a problem having to navigate people. I have no problem with life in general. It's the people that seem to create all the problems.

I think we should just resort back to being apes and chimps and monkies, that are not held accountable for their killing sprees, that would be less stressful actually.

I'd much prefer the simple life, to the man made complexities.

So you are a misanthrope and a sociopath.

Good to know.

[Harbal]

So it would also be fair to say that your dislike of firearms outweighs your like for my right to life and dignity.

No, that would not be a fair representation of my view. It would be fair to say that my dislike of firearms is such that I don't think private citizens should be allowed to possess them.

My assessment is spot on.

I'm sure it is, when viewed with sufficient bias.

All private citizens posess the right to life and dignity.

You don't think private citizens should be allowed to posess fireaarms. Not even for the purpose of ensuring their right to life is upheld.

Therefore your dislike of firearms outweighs my right to protect my life with a firearm.

The fact that you seem prepared to shoot someone just to preserve your dignity alarms me, I must say, but if we agreed that not having a gun puts one's life in imminent jeopardy, as you seem to be suggesting, I would say, carry two guns. But we do not agree about that. In fact, it might even make matters worse. Someone intending to mug you would have more incentive to shoot you in the head and take your wallet if he thought you might have a gun, when he would otherwise only point his gun at you and ask for the wallet. Who knows?

I gotta give it to your propaganda machine - they have brainwashed you good to feel the way you feel.

Resorting to this does not put you in a good light. Do you want to come across as petulant when not getting your own way?

And that would be fair, except my right to own a gun is implicit in my right to defend my life.


Otherwise my right to life and my right to defend that life is worth less than the paper my rights are written on.

Times have changed quite considerably since the powers that be -or were- granted the right to bear arms. You no longer live in isolated pockets in the middle of nowhere, miles from any kind of law enforcement, filled with constant anxiety about redskins appearing on the horizon, making a bee line for your little shack. I'm sure having a gun was considered pretty essential back then, and I can completely see why, but I don't think it's appropriate in this day and age, in a supposedly civilised country. If it really is appropriate, then I would say something is very wrong somewhere.