Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism

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aswarbs
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Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2024 11:30 pm

Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism

Post by aswarbs »

Hello everyone! I joined this forum to get some opinions on arguments I have made, this one is for the Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism: Epiphenomenalism fails because it has no evolutionary advantage and so would not have evolved alongside humans.

My Response: I think this fails because of pleitropic genes. I read a book by Richard Dawkins that addressed this phenomenon: A pleiotropic gene is a single gene that controls more than one trait, and there is much evidence that pleitropic genes exist. An example would be Marfan syndrome, which is caused by a variation in the FBN1 gene. People with Marfan syndrome tend to be tall with long thin fingers, toes and limbs. They are also, however, prone to a wide variety of symptoms, including heart defects and problems with the eyes and spine. The point is that these phenotypes seem to have no obvious relation, but they are highly correlated. My view is that if epiphenomenalism is true, perhaps it is the result of a similar phenomenon: an advantageous trait that we hold could be pleitropically tied to the development of consciousness. Consciousness does not need to have an evolutionary advantage in this case: it is unavoidably developed as a side-effect of the advantageous gene.

Please let me know any comments or feedback you have! Recommendations for further research are also appreciated :) !
Impenitent
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Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 2:04 pm

Re: Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism

Post by Impenitent »

the connection between brain structure and consciousness is strong in some instances (lobotomies)

brain structures are as unique as fingerprints

a complete map of each structure is not yet within our grasp

the evolutionary advantage of consciousness may not seen as necessarily advantageous... (transcend)

-Imp
Iwannaplato
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:55 pm

Re: Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism

Post by Iwannaplato »

aswarbs wrote: Thu Mar 28, 2024 11:33 pm Hello everyone! I joined this forum to get some opinions on arguments I have made, this one is for the Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism: Epiphenomenalism fails because it has no evolutionary advantage and so would not have evolved alongside humans.
Evolution can lead to phenomena in organisms that are neutral, even bad, as long as the organism continues to survive and procreate. I don't think the evolutionary argument works.

I think the problem with epiphenomenalism is that is asserts that consciousness cannot be causal.
And yet we end up talking about it.
It is clearly within the network of causal chains.
wrenloren
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Re: Counter Argument for the Evolution problem for Epiphenomenalism

Post by wrenloren »

This is a fascinating perspective! I like how you combined the notions of epiphenomenalism with pleiotropic genes. It's fascinating to consider consciousness as a result of beneficial features rather than a direct choice. I'm curious whether there are any cases in evolutionary biology where we may see similar patterns of seemingly unrelated qualities emerging together. It might undoubtedly help your argument! Also, I'm interested in potential counterpoints to the influence of consciousness on behavior and survival—could there be indirect evolutionary benefits that aren't immediately apparent? I'm looking forward to seeing how this topic progresses and what further research you unearth!
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