questions about life and......

[Peter Kropotkin]

there are a few thoughts that cannot be denied..

that, as constituted, we human beings are limited..
we die... there is no forever in death...

but, in religion, we can be saved, achieve salvation and our souls
can live forever...and what exactly is the effect of this little escape
clause in death?

40 years ago, or more, I was temporarily frozen by the fear of death...
I ''discovered"" that death also means my death... and I was terrified...
but being a young lad, I promptly forgot... and lived for decades without
any fear of death or even thinking about death...and then one sunny day,
I woke up and recalled or remember that I too, I too will die...at some point..
and I wasn't frightened like I was 40 years ago... when one hits their
60's, death becomes a rather familiar thought.... when friends, family,
loved ones die.... heroes from our youth, they begin to pass away...

to push the day of death off, we begin to make changes, we eat
healthier, we begin to exercise, we take better care of our bodies...
and all in an effort to live a bit longer...when one is in their 60's,
every day alive is one day closer to that day of death...
and some begin to realize that being born is really a
death sentence... to be born is to die.... and we pretend otherwise
for decades...

but the interesting thing comes in thinking about death is that we
begin to think about our legacy...what legacy will I leave behind?
family, brothers and sisters will remember me for a few years
and loved ones like my wife and daughter will remember me
for a few years and then, I will become some distant memory...
to save my life, I can't remember what my father looked like....
he has been dead for 40 years... nor can I remember what my
grandmother looked like.....and friends long dead, I couldn't
pick them out of a police lineup... time heals all wounds,
and when seeing a scar, I can remember how I got that scar,
the same thing about family and friends long dead...
a scar can bring back memories of that person...but very
vague memories...almost like a dream....

existentialism, in one aspect, death is a powerful part of
existentialism.... the remembrance of death brings us to a place
of fear, ''The death of Ivan Ilyich" is an excellent example of this...
and yet, I oppose this understanding of death... I understand it,
but oppose it...

I oppose it because one of the problems with existentialism,
is its emphasis on the negative, on angst, despair, fear,
existentialism is about the negative parts of life, not
the positive aspects of life, of existence...for me,
there is nothing to fear about death... it is as part of life
as puberty, old age, diseases, pain and suffering,
and going from a baby to adulthood... changes
human beings go through... it is part of existence..
to deny death is to deny the rest of it... to make a long story
short, once I broke my leg, and I didn't even know it..
that is part of the ticket of existence... shit happens...
and we might not even know it...now one might say, that
makes human beings fatalistic, yes and no... yes, death is
coming, but no in the fact that we can still become even in
the face of death.... existentialism makes too much of a big
deal about death...instead of just taking it in stride.. we die,
and so what? what can we do before we die?

or as the Kantian questions ask, ''what am I to do, before I die?''
''what can I hope for, before I die?" ''What can I know, before I die?"

the fear of death shouldn't frighten us into non-action or being
unable to do something..... death should motive us into taking
actions before we are unable to... I write more and more as I grow
older because I fear I will die before I get these thoughts down...
death drives me to write more, study harder and think about things...
I resent every day not engaging in philosophy....and for me,
any day taking me away from my thinking about philosophy,
is a wasted day..

and what about you?

Kropotkin

[nemos]

I might be a fatalist. There are things I can influence and there are things I can't influence, e.g. death, or when Annushka spills the oil. I try not to waste time on things I can't impress and focus on the things I can. What should a kitten who has just been thrown from a boat do? There are two options swim or drown. I try to swim, when I have no more strength, then I will drown, but not before.

[Peter Kropotkin]

I might be a fatalist. There are things I can influence and there are things I can't influence, e.g. death, or when Annushka spills the oil. I try not to waste time on things I can't impress and focus on the things I can. What should a kitten who has just been thrown from a boat do? There are two options swim or drown. I try to swim, when I have no more strength, then I will drown, but not before.

K: and part of the nihilism of our age is to force us, all of us into fatalism..
to accept that life, all of it, is outside of our control... and this is especially
true within a universe with god...

but a no-god universe means we can affect what happens in our lives...
I have a greater say about my life in a no-god universe then I do in a universe
with a god... we have no say in our lives, economically, politically,
socially.... within ism's that are created to force us into fatalism...
communism, capitalism, Catholicism, Buddhism....where we can only
say no... we have no opportunity or chance to say, yes...

to jump into that water for that kitten, is to say yes.... I have
a choice... and I say, yes.... or I can say, no... and watch that kitten
drown... my choice, its life.... and what of the kitten? does it have
a choice? not really, no, it doesn't have a choice.... there is not a yes
for that kitten....and therein the kitten can only fight against
the inevitable or it can just accept its fate, to become fatalistic
about its death..... I would fight because I can... I have a choice..
and my choice can be yes or it can be no....

Kropotkin

[bahman]

there are a few thoughts that cannot be denied..

that, as constituted, we human beings are limited..
we die... there is no forever in death...

but, in religion, we can be saved, achieve salvation and our souls
can live forever...and what exactly is the effect of this little escape
clause in death?

40 years ago, or more, I was temporarily frozen by the fear of death...
I ''discovered"" that death also means my death... and I was terrified...
but being a young lad, I promptly forgot... and lived for decades without
any fear of death or even thinking about death...and then one sunny day,
I woke up and recalled or remember that I too, I too will die...at some point..
and I wasn't frightened like I was 40 years ago... when one hits their
60's, death becomes a rather familiar thought.... when friends, family,
loved ones die.... heroes from our youth, they begin to pass away...

to push the day of death off, we begin to make changes, we eat
healthier, we begin to exercise, we take better care of our bodies...
and all in an effort to live a bit longer...when one is in their 60's,
every day alive is one day closer to that day of death...
and some begin to realize that being born is really a
death sentence... to be born is to die.... and we pretend otherwise
for decades...

but the interesting thing comes in thinking about death is that we
begin to think about our legacy...what legacy will I leave behind?
family, brothers and sisters will remember me for a few years
and loved ones like my wife and daughter will remember me
for a few years and then, I will become some distant memory...
to save my life, I can't remember what my father looked like....
he has been dead for 40 years... nor can I remember what my
grandmother looked like.....and friends long dead, I couldn't
pick them out of a police lineup... time heals all wounds,
and when seeing a scar, I can remember how I got that scar,
the same thing about family and friends long dead...
a scar can bring back memories of that person...but very
vague memories...almost like a dream....

existentialism, in one aspect, death is a powerful part of
existentialism.... the remembrance of death brings us to a place
of fear, ''The death of Ivan Ilyich" is an excellent example of this...
and yet, I oppose this understanding of death... I understand it,
but oppose it...

I oppose it because one of the problems with existentialism,
is its emphasis on the negative, on angst, despair, fear,
existentialism is about the negative parts of life, not
the positive aspects of life, of existence...for me,
there is nothing to fear about death... it is as part of life
as puberty, old age, diseases, pain and suffering,
and going from a baby to adulthood... changes
human beings go through... it is part of existence..
to deny death is to deny the rest of it... to make a long story
short, once I broke my leg, and I didn't even know it..
that is part of the ticket of existence... shit happens...
and we might not even know it...now one might say, that
makes human beings fatalistic, yes and no... yes, death is
coming, but no in the fact that we can still become even in
the face of death.... existentialism makes too much of a big
deal about death...instead of just taking it in stride.. we die,
and so what? what can we do before we die?

or as the Kantian questions ask, ''what am I to do, before I die?''
''what can I hope for, before I die?" ''What can I know, before I die?"

the fear of death shouldn't frighten us into non-action or being
unable to do something..... death should motive us into taking
actions before we are unable to... I write more and more as I grow
older because I fear I will die before I get these thoughts down...
death drives me to write more, study harder and think about things...
I resent every day not engaging in philosophy....and for me,
any day taking me away from my thinking about philosophy,
is a wasted day..

and what about you?

Kropotkin

Good writing. Well, to tell you the truth I am not afraid of death but I am afraid if there is a life after death. If you think of it, in eternal life you learn everything that exists, and you enjoy everything you can,... so what is left at the end, is to live more, but what you are going to do when there is nothing left to do? That is to me an eternal Hell!

[LuckyR]

Pondering death while in good physical health (as youths typically do) is, by definition a very incomplete process. Most who face death are, in fact in poor health, often for long periods of time, hence death takes on a whole different meaning in that context.

[Peter Kropotkin]

Pondering death while in good physical health (as youths typically do) is, by definition a very incomplete process. Most who face death are, in fact in poor health, often for long periods of time, hence death takes on a whole different meaning in that context.

K: in fact, as one ages, whether in good health or not,
one faces questions about death that didn't exists before...
I am 64 (close to 65) and in relatively good health,
as friends and family die around me, I am faced, whether
I want to or not, with these questions of death..

the question of death is a question of a reevaluation of one's life...
was my life, did I get the most out of it? and the answer for most
people, is no... I wasted an extraordinarily large amount of time
on crap...working and drama and daily stuff like waiting in lines...
if I sought out the trinkets of existence, then I have wasted my life...
for wealth and power and fame and titles and material possessions
mean nothing...empty calories... if I have searched for, but perhaps
not found, what is my purpose in life, that is a far more productive
life than seeking out wealth or fame or material possessions...

to contemplate what it means to be human is a far more productive
life than seeking out the trinkets of existence...

to engage with how can I become a better human being or
to ask, what does it mean to be moral/ethical, is to have a far
better life than those who only seek out material possessions or fame or
titles...

as it has been noted, Bill Gates is not an ethical or moral person,
but he is set aside because he is very wealthy...
the wealth of someone seems to determine the ethical standard we hold
these people to.... the famous double standard of justice we have in
America... the wealthy and powerful get treated far differently than
the middle class or the poor... see the treatment of IQ45 and anyone
else who has taken top secret papers from the government..
or said another way, our justice system is about situational ethics..
the situation dictates the ethics....so what morals or values should
we engage with in, if not situational ethics? and that question is
worth a lifetime of engaging with...

Kropotkin

[LuckyR]

Pondering death while in good physical health (as youths typically do) is, by definition a very incomplete process. Most who face death are, in fact in poor health, often for long periods of time, hence death takes on a whole different meaning in that context.

K: in fact, as one ages, whether in good health or not,
one faces questions about death that didn't exists before...
I am 64 (close to 65) and in relatively good health,
as friends and family die around me, I am faced, whether
I want to or not, with these questions of death..

the question of death is a question of a reevaluation of one's life...
was my life, did I get the most out of it? and the answer for most
people, is no... I wasted an extraordinarily large amount of time
on crap...working and drama and daily stuff like waiting in lines...
if I sought out the trinkets of existence, then I have wasted my life...
for wealth and power and fame and titles and material possessions
mean nothing...empty calories... if I have searched for, but perhaps
not found, what is my purpose in life, that is a far more productive
life than seeking out wealth or fame or material possessions...

to contemplate what it means to be human is a far more productive
life than seeking out the trinkets of existence...

to engage with how can I become a better human being or
to ask, what does it mean to be moral/ethical, is to have a far
better life than those who only seek out material possessions or fame or
titles...

as it has been noted, Bill Gates is not an ethical or moral person,
but he is set aside because he is very wealthy...
the wealth of someone seems to determine the ethical standard we hold
these people to.... the famous double standard of justice we have in
America... the wealthy and powerful get treated far differently than
the middle class or the poor... see the treatment of IQ45 and anyone
else who has taken top secret papers from the government..
or said another way, our justice system is about situational ethics..
the situation dictates the ethics....so what morals or values should
we engage with in, if not situational ethics? and that question is
worth a lifetime of engaging with...

Kropotkin

Totally missed my point. Which is that those in poor health can view death as a welcome release from a very suboptimal existance.

As to Bill Gates, he doesn't strike me as particularly very far from the median of ethics or morality, though I admit I don't know him personally.

[Walker]

Totally missed my point. Which is that those in poor health can view death as a welcome release from a very suboptimal existance.

That reminds me of a line from a John Mayer tune, clearly vocalized in one of VT’s favourite mesmerizing performances.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9L0zAit4_4

Had a talk (hats off?) with my old man
Said help me understand
He said turn sixty-eight
You’ll renegotiate

[Walker]

K: in fact, as one ages, whether in good health or not,
one faces questions about death that didn't exists before...
I am 64 (close to 65) and in relatively good health,
as friends and family die around me, I am faced, whether
I want to or not, with these questions of death.
Kropotkin

I notice you've mentioned your age quite a few times. Are you one of those who thinks that age confers wisdom?

[Peter Kropotkin]

Totally missed my point. Which is that those in poor health can view death as a welcome release from a very suboptimal existance.

That reminds me of a line from a John Mayer tune, clearly vocalized in one of VT’s favourite mesmerizing performances.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9L0zAit4_4

Had a talk (hats off?) with my old man
Said help me understand
He said turn sixty-eight
You’ll renegotiate

K: as John Mayer is only 46, he has many years to wonder if that is true...
much of what we believe in our forties, becomes subject to review when
we are 68 or even my age, 64....but some may ''renegotiate" and some
may not....

Kropotkin

[Peter Kropotkin]

K: in fact, as one ages, whether in good health or not,
one faces questions about death that didn't exists before...
I am 64 (close to 65) and in relatively good health,
as friends and family die around me, I am faced, whether
I want to or not, with these questions of death.
Kropotkin

I notice you've mentioned your age quite a few times. Are you one of those who thinks that age confers wisdom?

K: My birthday is coming up and I tend to talk about my age as my
birthday comes closer.. it is one way to accept that fact... make it
routine.. part of the furniture...and it becomes less important,
not as, not worried or problematic, just another thing to
overcome... as for being wise... I know, after my many years,
just how wise I am....

Kropotkin

[Walker]

Hey, Happy Birthday!

[nemos]

I will go away and not return, like a wave on the seashore. White foam left from the wave, only memories from me.
The sun is the first memory for me, the last will be the sun as well.

[Age]

K: in fact, as one ages, whether in good health or not,
one faces questions about death that didn't exists before...
I am 64 (close to 65) and in relatively good health,
as friends and family die around me, I am faced, whether
I want to or not, with these questions of death.
Kropotkin

I notice you've mentioned your age quite a few times. Are you one of those who thinks that age confers wisdom?

K: My birthday is coming up and I tend to talk about my age as my
birthday comes closer.. it is one way to accept that fact... make it
routine.. part of the furniture...and it becomes less important,
not as, not worried or problematic, just another thing to
overcome... as for being wise... I know, after my many years,
just how wise I am....

Kropotkin

you may well, or may not well, however you did not answer and clarify the actual question posed, and asked to you here, "peter kropotkin".

[LuckyR]

Totally missed my point. Which is that those in poor health can view death as a welcome release from a very suboptimal existance.

That reminds me of a line from a John Mayer tune, clearly vocalized in one of VT’s favourite mesmerizing performances.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9L0zAit4_4

Had a talk (hats off?) with my old man
Said help me understand
He said turn sixty-eight
You’ll renegotiate

Yes, listening to those far from death speak about it is akin to listening to the childless go on about childrearing.