Re: Wonkers and Israel
Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2023 2:18 pm
In other posts on other threads I have mentioned Fourth and Fifth Generation Warfare.
I have suggested (though I am as much in the dark as anyone and my speculations are guesses) that we are now well within a sort of global war. In a war of this sort the tools or armaments of that war are of another class but involve information, narrative, the engineering of perspectives by those who have the power to do so in order to achieve long-range war aims.
But in this sort of war an average person cannot make sense of the larger picture, cannot see the larger picture, because he is focused on details and, importantly, is propelled into partisan perspectives which he associates with his very self. That is, with which he is so identified that to suggest a different view, a different perspective, is taken as an assault on him and is fiercely resisted. (I suggest that a great deal of the bickering on this forum is of that sort: people who refuse to stand outside and above their own limited views to see a larger picture but also to talk, converse and argue reasonably and fairly).
In conditions such as these (if you accept the perspective I am suggesting) we have to think cynically. First things first: we must not immediately believe anything that is presented to us to believe. I will use an an example to be considered the events of 9/11 and I will suggest, because it seems true to me, that the beginning of world-level conflagration stems from that *fracturing* event.
Yes, you are right: I am suggesting that the event was used as a psy-op in order for specific global factions to be able to carry out long-range war-aims in that context I describe as Fourth and Fifth Generation Warfare. What happened? What was done? Anyone with two eyes can at least now, with retrospective vision, understand that specific global and geo-political war-aims were realized. In fact they are still going on.
With that said, and in keeping with my admonition that an ultra-cynical suspiciousness is what is needed -- so that we avoid getting sucked into a maelstrom of emotional reaction that is being cultivated in our media and by political figures -- I will suggest that it is nearly impossible that the State of Israel was unaware of a developing attack. There are narratives circulating that warnings were in fact given.
But let us consider the state of divided Israel society and the extremely critical political issues that have recently divided Israel and led to a political and social crisis. The most difficult political and social crisis is unfolding there for many reasons, but a major one is the definition of what Israel is and what it will be. A secular or a religious state. And on top of that the unsolveable issue that is at the root of Zionism itself: the displacement of an entire people who lived there. There are two choices: incorporate them *democratically* or annihilate them. That is why people compare Israel to South Africa and talk about an apartheid system. It is a cultural, religious, demographic and cultural issue that no one can solve.
I doubt that anyone on this forum is aware of the sort of narratives that are circulating in Israel that involve specific ultra-religious plans about how the Third Temple will be reconstructed and how "prophecy" is being fulfilled. I am not making this up. You are likely far on the outside of being informed about how the reestablishment of Israel is understood by such factions to be an historical culmination of Jewish prophecy and how the true-believing religious factions in Israel regard Israel as their state, and how they are obligated to follow the will of God (HaShem) in their efforts to construct a theocratic state. The so-called Ultra-Right in Israel have definite and significant ties with those factions that either think directly in these terms (prophetic reconquest) or are influenced by them in one degree or other. You have to understand the Jewish view of Amalek within the Jewish understanding of the reconquest of Israel by Zionism and the sort of imitation of the biblical narrative in all the events associated with the (re)founding of Israel.
You must understand how Christian Zionists have been roped-in to these hallucinatory views and you must understand that right now many Christian leaders are, for example, opening calling for the destruction and leveling of the Al Aqsa mosque so that the Third Temple can be constructed which then ushers in the Return of Jesus, the End of the World, and all the rest. Yes, these things are said among the mad Evangelical factions but these ideas pervade the thinking of religious Christians in the US.
You must notice how -- immediately! -- there arose a call to start war with Iran. And you must understand how a war on Iran is part of the chain of wars that were begun after (which had been planned prior to) 9/11. The *remodeling of the Middle East*.
Now with that said please consider the possibility that the recent events in Israel and the political and geo-political consequences and repercussions of them will result -- are resulting -- in further extensions of the same *general plan* that flowed out of the 9/11 events. If you accept the premise that it is impossible that the preparations for such a massive and consequential attack could have gone unnoticed by the security forces of Israel; and if you consider the deep political and social crisis that Israel was in that is now resolved by general unity; and if you consider how the Neoconservative establishment in the US (and other places) is gearing up to employ these events in definite ways; then I suggest that a different sort of interpretation can come forth from a more *distant* and as I say a *cynical* analysis.
I am not proposing to know or to understand what, if any, the ultimate function is of these (as I propose) contrived or managed events is. My interpretations must also be guessing of the sort by those who struggle to see and understand but who can't because of conflicting narratives or an abundance of narratives that overwhelm and confuse.
What I can say is that we should focus on 1) the unlikeliness that an event of this sort, with all the consequences that are and will flow from it, will not be employed within the power-dynamics and the political power-machinations in the United States. But there is a darker insinuation and that is that 2) in geo-political struggles of real consequence there is no manipulation that is kept off the table. We already know that 9/11 was a managed event, and we also know that events of real consequence flowed from those events. What we do not know, at least precisely, is to what degree they were known about and even 'managed' for larger purposes. Speculation (or paranoia) abounds but it always seems to remain nearly impossible to arrive at precise conclusions.
Ask this question: Is it possible that factions within Israel would or could allow such events to occur if the gains to be achieved as a result were worth the sacrifice? I am not saying that I know this to be true, and it is very hard for me to imagine that it could be possible. But what I do know, or believe I know, is that powerful factions, playing real geo-political games of vast consequence, have proven themselves capable of such manipulative machinations.
I have suggested (though I am as much in the dark as anyone and my speculations are guesses) that we are now well within a sort of global war. In a war of this sort the tools or armaments of that war are of another class but involve information, narrative, the engineering of perspectives by those who have the power to do so in order to achieve long-range war aims.
But in this sort of war an average person cannot make sense of the larger picture, cannot see the larger picture, because he is focused on details and, importantly, is propelled into partisan perspectives which he associates with his very self. That is, with which he is so identified that to suggest a different view, a different perspective, is taken as an assault on him and is fiercely resisted. (I suggest that a great deal of the bickering on this forum is of that sort: people who refuse to stand outside and above their own limited views to see a larger picture but also to talk, converse and argue reasonably and fairly).
In conditions such as these (if you accept the perspective I am suggesting) we have to think cynically. First things first: we must not immediately believe anything that is presented to us to believe. I will use an an example to be considered the events of 9/11 and I will suggest, because it seems true to me, that the beginning of world-level conflagration stems from that *fracturing* event.
Yes, you are right: I am suggesting that the event was used as a psy-op in order for specific global factions to be able to carry out long-range war-aims in that context I describe as Fourth and Fifth Generation Warfare. What happened? What was done? Anyone with two eyes can at least now, with retrospective vision, understand that specific global and geo-political war-aims were realized. In fact they are still going on.
With that said, and in keeping with my admonition that an ultra-cynical suspiciousness is what is needed -- so that we avoid getting sucked into a maelstrom of emotional reaction that is being cultivated in our media and by political figures -- I will suggest that it is nearly impossible that the State of Israel was unaware of a developing attack. There are narratives circulating that warnings were in fact given.
But let us consider the state of divided Israel society and the extremely critical political issues that have recently divided Israel and led to a political and social crisis. The most difficult political and social crisis is unfolding there for many reasons, but a major one is the definition of what Israel is and what it will be. A secular or a religious state. And on top of that the unsolveable issue that is at the root of Zionism itself: the displacement of an entire people who lived there. There are two choices: incorporate them *democratically* or annihilate them. That is why people compare Israel to South Africa and talk about an apartheid system. It is a cultural, religious, demographic and cultural issue that no one can solve.
I doubt that anyone on this forum is aware of the sort of narratives that are circulating in Israel that involve specific ultra-religious plans about how the Third Temple will be reconstructed and how "prophecy" is being fulfilled. I am not making this up. You are likely far on the outside of being informed about how the reestablishment of Israel is understood by such factions to be an historical culmination of Jewish prophecy and how the true-believing religious factions in Israel regard Israel as their state, and how they are obligated to follow the will of God (HaShem) in their efforts to construct a theocratic state. The so-called Ultra-Right in Israel have definite and significant ties with those factions that either think directly in these terms (prophetic reconquest) or are influenced by them in one degree or other. You have to understand the Jewish view of Amalek within the Jewish understanding of the reconquest of Israel by Zionism and the sort of imitation of the biblical narrative in all the events associated with the (re)founding of Israel.
You must understand how Christian Zionists have been roped-in to these hallucinatory views and you must understand that right now many Christian leaders are, for example, opening calling for the destruction and leveling of the Al Aqsa mosque so that the Third Temple can be constructed which then ushers in the Return of Jesus, the End of the World, and all the rest. Yes, these things are said among the mad Evangelical factions but these ideas pervade the thinking of religious Christians in the US.
You must notice how -- immediately! -- there arose a call to start war with Iran. And you must understand how a war on Iran is part of the chain of wars that were begun after (which had been planned prior to) 9/11. The *remodeling of the Middle East*.
Now with that said please consider the possibility that the recent events in Israel and the political and geo-political consequences and repercussions of them will result -- are resulting -- in further extensions of the same *general plan* that flowed out of the 9/11 events. If you accept the premise that it is impossible that the preparations for such a massive and consequential attack could have gone unnoticed by the security forces of Israel; and if you consider the deep political and social crisis that Israel was in that is now resolved by general unity; and if you consider how the Neoconservative establishment in the US (and other places) is gearing up to employ these events in definite ways; then I suggest that a different sort of interpretation can come forth from a more *distant* and as I say a *cynical* analysis.
I am not proposing to know or to understand what, if any, the ultimate function is of these (as I propose) contrived or managed events is. My interpretations must also be guessing of the sort by those who struggle to see and understand but who can't because of conflicting narratives or an abundance of narratives that overwhelm and confuse.
What I can say is that we should focus on 1) the unlikeliness that an event of this sort, with all the consequences that are and will flow from it, will not be employed within the power-dynamics and the political power-machinations in the United States. But there is a darker insinuation and that is that 2) in geo-political struggles of real consequence there is no manipulation that is kept off the table. We already know that 9/11 was a managed event, and we also know that events of real consequence flowed from those events. What we do not know, at least precisely, is to what degree they were known about and even 'managed' for larger purposes. Speculation (or paranoia) abounds but it always seems to remain nearly impossible to arrive at precise conclusions.
Ask this question: Is it possible that factions within Israel would or could allow such events to occur if the gains to be achieved as a result were worth the sacrifice? I am not saying that I know this to be true, and it is very hard for me to imagine that it could be possible. But what I do know, or believe I know, is that powerful factions, playing real geo-political games of vast consequence, have proven themselves capable of such manipulative machinations.
