Philosophy Now Forum

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:15 pm Really... because a particle and a wave existing simultaneously is measurement from a different context. The superposition is subject to a context of measurement, such as a living and dead cat in the box being a measurement.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:15 pm If a prediction is wrong it is not a prediction now is it?

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:19 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:15 pm Really... because a particle and a wave existing simultaneously is measurement from a different context. The superposition is subject to a context of measurement, such as a living and dead cat in the box being a measurement.

Q.E.D you don't know what "now" means. Nor "measurement' for that fact.

Then you can't make any predictions if the future stems from it now can you?

The cat is in superposition (dead or alive) UNTIL measured.

The cat both alive and dead in a box is a context of measuring the cat.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:15 pm If a prediction is wrong it is not a prediction now is it?

It's a wrong prediction, a.k.a an error. That's why I also predicted my error rate

So is it 50% (either true or false) or 33% (true, false, or both) and which of this two predictions can be predicted accurately as it is a 50% chance you can choose one of the two methods.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm The cat both alive and dead in a box is a context of measuring the cat.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm So is it 50% (either true or false) or 33% (true, false, or both)

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm
and which of this two predictions can be predicted accurately as it is a 50% chance you can choose one of the two methods.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:31 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm The cat both alive and dead in a box is a context of measuring the cat.

No, it isn't. It's measuring your state of knowledge about the cat.

And the cat as alive is progressively dying, thus both dead and alive.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm So is it 50% (either true or false) or 33% (true, false, or both)

You ever seen a coin land on heads and tails at the same time? I haven't.

Stand it on its side.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm
and which of this two predictions can be predicted accurately as it is a 50% chance you can choose one of the two methods.

The prediction that can be predicted accurately is that I WILL be wrong 50% of the time.

If I am wrong about being wrong, then I was right about the coin being deterministic.

or 33%.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:33 pm And the cat as alive is progressively dying, thus both dead and alive.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:33 pm Stand it on its side.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm or 33%

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:36 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:33 pm And the cat as alive is progressively dying, thus both dead and alive.

More dead and less alive with each passing second.

Or more alive than dead considering entropy then negentropy of cells (ie still growing"). The cat always maintains a state of contraction and expansion of some context.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:33 pm Stand it on its side.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:27 pm or 33%

When you find a coin that lands on its side 33% of the time - call me.

Coin slot full of quarters.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:33 pm Coin slot full of quarters.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:41 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:33 pm Coin slot full of quarters.

I said 33%. In a coin slot full of quarters 100% of them are on their side.

Find a context in which coins land heads 33% of the time, tails 33% of the time and on their side 33% of the time.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:06 pm Find a context where a coin flips head and tails equally 50% of the time, it would be an ever changing number approaching infinity.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:14 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:06 pm Find a context where a coin flips head and tails equally 50% of the time, it would be an ever changing number approaching infinity.

Sure. What error-margin are you willing to tolerate?

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:35 pm

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:14 pm Sure. What error-margin are you willing to tolerate?

0.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:02 pm What you are doing is you are unable to back-propagate the error margins you are dealing with, so you are treating all errors as equivalently wrong.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:47 pm If you are looking for a gap to play semantic sophistry you could always argue that there is a non-0% margin of error. That's what pyrrhonists do.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:36 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:35 pm

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:14 pm Sure. What error-margin are you willing to tolerate?

0.

Q.E.D I guess I predicted that you expect zero-error, huh?

That is because I started the premises with that and all premises self reference through further premises. Any prediction is a tautology from the premises.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:02 pm What you are doing is you are unable to back-propagate the error margins you are dealing with, so you are treating all errors as equivalently wrong.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:47 pm If you are looking for a gap to play semantic sophistry you could always argue that there is a non-0% margin of error. That's what pyrrhonists do.

Irrelevent as non zero margin of error is still a margin of error. You are arguing probabilism. The future cannot be completely predicted due to variables required to measure it not being seen as a whole.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:53 pm Irrelevent as non zero margin of error is still a margin of error. You are arguing probabilism. The future cannot be completely predicted due to variables required to measure it not being seen as a whole.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:07 pm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:53 pm Irrelevent as non zero margin of error is still a margin of error. You are arguing probabilism. The future cannot be completely predicted due to variables required to measure it not being seen as a whole.

If you think that 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999% margin of error is the same thing as 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% percent margin of error, then your view is 100% erroneous.

https://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience ... fWrong.htm

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:19 pm Any percent of a margin of error is a margin of error. Do 99.99999999....% and .000...0001% differ? Yes, drastically.