Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:17 am
Note this;
Fear and Trembling (original Danish title: Frygt og Bæven) is a philosophical work by
Søren Kierkegaard [a Christian], published in 1843 under the pseudonym Johannes de silentio (John of the Silence). The title is a reference to a line from Philippians 2:12, "...continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling." — itself a probable reference to Psalms 55:5,[1] "Fear and trembling came upon me..." (the Greek is identical).
Kierkegaard wanted to
understand the anxiety[2] that must have been present in
Abraham when "God tested [him] and said to him, take Isaac, your only son, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah and offer him as a burnt offering on the mountain that I shall show you."[3]
Abraham had a choice to complete the task or to refuse to comply to God's orders.
He resigned himself to the three-and-a-half-day journey and to the loss of his son.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear_and_Trembling
An interesting fact about Soren Kierkegaard is that he was suffering from severe chronic depression. He said about himself in one of his writings: “In addition to my other numerous acquaintances, I have one more intimate confidant. ...
My depression is the most faithful mistress I have known—no wonder, then, that I return the love.”
Søren Kierkegaard “Diapsalmata”, Either/Or (1843) Vol. 1, of 1987 Hong translation.
Now, no human being nowadays may know for sure the cause of his chronic depression, but if he was like Nietzsche- who by the way greatly admired him and helped revived Kierkegaard who was falling into oblivion- then it is known that Nietzsche got so depressed in doing biblical studies to become a Christian minister that he eventually rejected Christianity to become an atheist. However, even if Nietzsche ended up becoming the most virulent critic of Judaism and Christianity (even me, I dare not even quote his criticisms of Judaism and Christianity!), but interesting it is to note that Nietzsche admired the Muslims and had very kind words towards the Muslims and Islam. He even gave his peace and friendship to Islam. One Muslim philosopher who was also a lawyer and a poet by the name of Sir Muhammad Iqbal from Pakistan, who was also an erudite in Nietzsche philosophy said of him, “His heart believes but his mind disbelieves.”
Anyway, this interlude is just meant to be a dip into the history of philosophy/philosophers which no doubt should greatly interest a lot of members of the forum or else benefit the neophyte philosophers. But now without further ado, let us get back to philosophy proper.
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Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:17 am
I am familiar with Abraham of the Abrahamic religions.
I am more interested in the psychological processes that was going in Abraham's mind during his willingness to sacrifice his son and how this psychological process is still pulsing in the mind of Muslims, Christians and Jews.
You have mentioned the scientific field of study “psychology” in the above quote. The dictionary defines psychology as follows:
Psychology: the scientific study of the human mind and its functions, especially those affecting behaviour in a given context.
And all scientists agree with the dictionary definition of science and that is:
Science: the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world
through observation and experiment.
But now there is a problem! How do you intend to do a psychological study/assessment of Prophet Abraham’s (pbuh) state of mind “during his willingness to sacrifice his son” (as you say) when this event occurred at least 3500 years ago? How do you intend to gather the scientific data for your psychological study/investigation? For you can no longer directly observe this historical event and if your assessment is to qualify as psychological you need to have empirical data otherwise it is not scientific! Don’t you agree?
So now, I see only one possibility to salvage your planned psychological study, and that is through consulting historical documents which have recorded the event accurately. But here again there are issues! I know of no secular historical document which has recorded this great historical event! The only documents that I know of which covers this historical event are, in chronological order:
1. The Hindu scriptures particularly what remains of the Vedas
2. The Judeo-Christian scriptures, particularly what remains of the Torah and the Tanakh, and
3. The Glorious Quran.
So from which of these documents mentioned above do you intend to gather your needed historical facts on which to base your psychological study?
But here again there are other issues! For example, if you intend to gather your needed historical facts from the Bible available nowadays, then scientific community will vehemently object with your methodology! Even the Vatican will object with this data gathering methodology! Indeed, even the Vatican has lost all hope of finding scientific and historical truths in their Bible!
These questions came up during
the Second Vatican Council when some theologians asserted that Scripture indeed contained such errors. Cardinal Koenig of Vienna attempted to prove it using Mark 2:26, where David "went into the house of God when Abiathar was high priest and ate the bread of offering that only the priests could lawfully eat, and shared it with his companions." According to 1 Samuel 21:1, Abiathar was not the high priest, but rather his father, Ahimelech.
This scriptural example on the surface appears to support his claim that the Bible contains historical errors. Catholic site:
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print ... bible-true
We have already addressed this subject thoroughly on this forum, me and member gaffo mainly. You can check my posts on the following thread for an in depth coverage and more scholarly references on the subject:
viewtopic.php?p=364376#p364376
Moreover, case in point, the verse of the Bible that is quoted from your Wikipedia reference and which Soren Kierkegaard quoted, itself contains an error. The verse in question is Genesis 22:1-2 and it reads as follows:
- After these things God tested Abraham, and said to him, “Abraham!” And he said, “Here am I.” 2 He said, “Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Mori′ah, and offer him there as a burnt offering upon one of the mountains of which I shall tell you.” [Genesis 22:1-2 RSV]
Where is the error you might be asking? There are many! But let us consider only the most relevant to the discussion. In that verse Prophet Isaac (pbuh) is qualified as being the only son of Prophet Abraham(pbuh), and this was never the case. Prophet Abraham first became a father with the birth of Prophet Ishmael and only the latter can ever qualify to be the only son of his father Prophet Abraham, and this was before Prophet Isaac was born (peace be upon them all). So the verse which caused Kierkegaard to be depressed itself contains historical errors!
So now we are only left with the Vedas and the Glorious Quran as potential candidates for your data gathering process. I already quoted translations of the verses from the Glorious Quran where mentioned is made of the sacrifice. There are other verses as well, and I can look for them if you ask. However, for now let me give you the relevant verses from the Vedas as you said you are not much “into Hinduism”.
A Brahmin Hindu scholar by the name of Dr Ved Prakash Uppadhay has written a book in which he translated the relevant verses from the Vedas. I will be quoting from the English translation of that book:
Dr Ved Prakash Uppadhay wrote:
- ---The Male Child Sacrifice- Atharva Veda (10:1:2, mantras 26-33):
In ancient times, Brahma had two sons : Atharva and Angira. Upon receiving divine command, he prepared to sacrifice the eldest son Atharva. In the scriptures, this is known as ‘the Male Child Sacrifice’. This is celebrated up until today, in which an animal is sacrificed instead of a human being. The above verses are recited at the time of slaughtering the animal. These verses contain the following:
26- Atharva put his head and heart together. Religious zeal radiating from his forehead.
27- The head of Atharva, the abode of the Lord. Protected from all sides by soul, mind and spirit.
28.-It stands not a great height, nor its walls equal in measure. But the Lord is Visible all around it. One who knows about the House of the Lord, knows it. Because the Lord is remembered there.
29.- Saturated with Spiritual Bliss is this House of the Lord. One who has experienced this, is endowed with insight, life and children, by Brahma.
30- One who knows the Holy House, his spiritual power and insight intact, never leaves the House; for reasons that the Lord is remembered there.
31- Surrounded by eight circles is this Holy Place of the angels, and nine gates. House of security, it is the precious eternal life, covered with Divine Light.
32- Precious Holy Spirit is there, established. Three pillars and three wooden girders hold it up. But, it is the center-point of the Soul of Brahma.
33- Brahma lives there. Bright with heavenly Glow, soaked in heavenly Blessing, is this place. To man it offers precious Immortality, and that is Security indeed!
According to the Qur’an, the great Sage Ibrahim had two sons: Ismail and Ishaque. He too received Divine command, and was ready to sacrifice his eldest son Ismail. At the point of slaughter, the Lord gave him a lamb from Paradise, which was then sacrificed in place of Ismail. The Muslims do celebrate this event every year, even today.
The Sage Ibrahim built a house of worship. As per the description given in the Vedas, its height is not much, its walls are not equal. It stands on three pillars. It had three wooden girders. Nine gates and eight circular paths around it still exist. In the Qur’an, it is called the House of Allah and the House of Security. Muslims, who have the means to do so, perform pilgrimage to this House of the Lord, situated at Makka. Thus, we find an amazing similarity between the Vedas and the Qur’an.
Muhammad is the descendant of that Ismail, i.e. the Sage Atharva.---
Link to book freely available here:
https://www.scribd.com/doc/8620683/Kalki-Avtar-Book
Now one thing that I need to clarify to those who are not well versed in the Hindu scriptures is the following:
Please do not confuse the names Brahman and Brahma in the Hindu Scriptures because these names in the Hindu scriptures refer to completely distinct beings. Brahma was a man who the Hindu scholars such as Dr Uppadhay, for example, among many others have identified with Prophet Abraham (pbuh), and understandably so, given the striking similarities. And Brahman is the name of the Supreme Being, the Creator and Sustainer of the universe, Who has no parent or lord and Who cannot be represented by an image, picture or idol, the All-Powerful, and other attributes as well. Brahman is the God of Brahma. I think we can all easily recognize to whom these names are referring!
There is another similarity between Prophet Abraham and Brahma in the Hindu scriptures that I have yet to mention, and this is very interesting, but later, if God wills, so as not to crowd this already crowded post with too much information.
Back to the psychological study literature review now. So now you have the choice between the Vedic verses and the Glorious Quran. There still remains a final issue here that I need to clear out. Even though the above quoted verses of the Vedas are very beautiful, nevertheless, as Hindu scholar Pandit Ahmed has said in the lecture already linked to, even the Vedas has been corrupted through time. It might not be specially concerning the quoted verses above but this should be kept in mind for other verses.
So this leaves us with the only reliable document concerning information on the life of Prophet Abraham (pbuh) and the only scripture which has withstood critical analysis, namely the Glorious Quran. Indeed, in the Holy Quran there is no contradiction whatsoever, it is replete with accurate historical and scientific facts which the historians and eminent scientists nowadays themselves have acknowledged. This is a subject I have already addressed much before, but I can wholeheartedly go into it again if need be.
So here you go, I have already done the literature review for your intended psychological study of the state of mind of the great prophet and friend of God, the Almighty namely Prophet Abraham when about to sacrifice his son Prophet Ishmael (peace be upon the prophets). But please do let me know how you intend to gather the scientific data for the planned psychological study. If I can help some more whether with the literature review or the scientific study itself, I humbly remain at your disposal.
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Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:17 am
This is one negative point that would not make Islam as superior to Hinduism [on average].
Now respectfully, you used the term “average,” this term is a statistical term and the way you are using it is violating fundamental statistical principles! It is a great sin in statistics to take an outlier (you say “one negative point”) as an estimator of the population mean which is the average. For you to be able to use the term “average” correctly, there are certain statistical conditions that must be satisfied. In order to calculate an average, you can either consider the whole population or consider a representative sample of that population. Taking an isolated case as an estimator of population mean is not statistically valid.
To give you an intuition of why your statistical analysis is not valid let me take an example in another setting than Islam. For example, let us take the case of Buddhism now. So, if I were to take Buddhist monks such as the hate preacher Ashin Wiranthu in Burma or the obnoxious Galagodo Gnanasara in Sri Lanka and generalize their case to all Buddhists, do you think this could be considered a valid statistical inference of mean behavior? Now, the expert analysts in international affairs are saying that these two Buddhist monks are principally responsible through their hate preaches for the massacre of tens of thousands of Rohingya Muslims in Burma and the persecution of Muslims in Sri Lanka. On the basis of this information now, were I to relate their immoral actions to Siddhartha Gautama by pointing to the fact that Siddhartha Gautama was of the Kshatriya (soldier) caste (i.e. second caste in the caste system in ancient India), would that then also be accepted as valid? What do you think? If we are to be consistent with your reasoning then the latter would also have to be valid inferences! However, a healthy intellect would be inclined to think that even if Siddhartha Gautama was a second class citizen in ancient India, it does not mean that his modern followers must now adopt a second class barbaric behavior. Don’t you agree? What do you think of Ashin Wiranthu and Galagodo Gnanasara? What do you think of their behavior and the many Buddhists, among them many monks, who have been rapping, butchering and killing tens of thousands of innocent Muslim women and children in Burma and Sri Lanka? Is there behavior representative of the Buddhists in general?
Here is a documentary by the BBC which give you some facts about the actions of those who claim to be strict followers of Siddhartha Gautama in Burma:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irQhr9DOfbg
Please, what are your thoughts on this? Is this what Siddhartha Gautama taught? Did Siddhartha Gautama teach people to kill tens of thousands of innocent and defenseless women and children?
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Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:17 am
Btw, which madhhab [school] or sect of Islam do you belong or is inclined to?
I am a Muslim and that’s it. And being a Muslim means making an effort to follow the Holy Quran to the best of one’s ability and in the Holy Quran, Allah, the All-Wise says to follow His Messenger Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). So following the prescriptions of the Holy Quran also includes following the tradition (sunnah) of the blessed Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him). Dividing Islam into sects is prohibited in Islam. Allah, the All-Knowing says in the Holy Quran, interpretation of meaning:
- Indeed, those who have divided their religion and become sects - you, [O Muhammad], are not [associated] with them in anything. Their affair is only [left] to Allah; then He will inform them about what they used to do. [Quran 6:159]
Now, may I in turn ask you about your religious or cultural (or whatever you might judged to be an appropriate term) inclinations or belonging?
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Well, he said he would get back to me when he has the time, and I am still waiting after about five months!