Philosophy Now Forum

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:53 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:23 pm
If God exists, what's at stake is one's eternal soul...its destiny, and its ultimate value. The stakes literally could not be higher. One is deciding on the disposition of one's soul forever...and one is receiving the outcome of one's own determination.

Compared to that, nothing on Earth is serious business.

Actually, that would be if your version of God existed.

Of course.

Other versions are available.

But we don't need "versions." We need God.

Your God is particularly problematic because I don't believe in souls either, so if I were to believe in a God, I would almost certainly choose one that presented me with fewer hurdles.

Well, we don't get to pick what the truth turns out to be, based on our convenience or presuppositions, do we? Rather, the goal is to conform our own opinions to the truth, because only the truth counts, at the end of the day.

...would someone who can create universes really be bothered whether what would amount to less than a spec of dust believed in him or not?

The Bible asks the same question: "When I consider Your heavens, the work of Your hands, the moon and the stars, which You have set in place; what is man that You think of him, and a son of man that You are concerned about him?" (Ps. 8 )

It's a good question. Yet the Bible says He does, and the time of the presence of His Son on Earth assures us of it.

And when you think about a God who can span all the universes, what is "the right size" for Him to be caring about? There's no particular "size" that's better than any other. If this world is the theatre of His focus, what metric do we use to decide it's "too small"?

I'm gonna risk it, so I am still going to need that word that means, "don't know and don't care."

I can't help you. I'm sorry. If I could, I'd invent a term, maybe.

However, you'll find it's not a common position. Almost anyone who understands what's at stake has a reason to care. The alternative is merely ignorance. I know of nobody who wants to own that label.

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:53 pm You know what, IC, ...

I've got an unrelated question, if I may.

You've gone from your "what me worry" avatar to the old "grumpy schoolmaster" one. Any particular reason?

I don't mind either. I'm just idly curious whether or not it indicates anything, or is just a "nice change."

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:57 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 12:43 pm It also begs the question as to who is keeping God in check where morality is concerned.

His elder brother of course -- the First Born.

Nah, I was talking about their Dad.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:17 pm

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:53 pm You know what, IC, ...

I've got an unrelated question, if I may.

You've gone from your "what me worry" avatar to the old "grumpy schoolmaster" one. Any particular reason?

I don't mind either. I'm just idly curious whether or not it indicates anything, or is just a "nice change."

Evolution, IC, evolution . . .

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:57 pm ..?..

Since you believe (as I do) in reincarnation, I am interested to hear your thoughts re various scripture on the concept, and how you conceive of the idea yourself?

Is there an entity in your opinion that 'judges' where you (soul) progress through time?

As you are probably aware by now, I am a Christian Pantheist/Panentheist with an extremely open mind.

Iambiguous: I’ve run out of energy to correct your constant erroneous rephrasing of what I say into what you imagine that I’m saying or want me to have said.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:47 pm

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:57 pm ..?..

Since you believe (as I do) in reincarnation, I am interested to hear your thoughts re various scripture on the concept, and how you conceive of the idea yourself?

Is there an entity in your opinion that 'judges' where you (soul) progress through time?

As you are probably aware by now, I am a Christian Pantheist/Panentheist with an extremely open mind.

Let me get to this and your other post soon.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:17 pm
I've got an unrelated question, if I may.

You've gone from your "what me worry" avatar to the old "grumpy schoolmaster" one. Any particular reason?

I don't mind either. I'm just idly curious whether or not it indicates anything, or is just a "nice change."

I just felt like a change, although I have used the avatar here before. It was quite some time back. I don't yet know if the different image will influence my behaviour, but it would be nice if it helped me to take life a little less seriously.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:26 pm

Lacewing wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:25 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 8:45 pm
Yes. It has but one essential precept: no god(s).

Oh, so that's why I hear atheists constantly screaming 'No Gods!" as they stand on street corners handing-out pamphlets.

Like Dawkins, Hitchens and Harris, you mean?

Yes. But they use books and lectures, not just streetcorners.

You may be inclined to judge people based on limited examples, but that's a bit self-servingly dense. That would be like characterizing all Christians based on your representation and extremism.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:14 pm

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:53 pm
I'm gonna risk it, so I am still going to need that word that means, "don't know and don't care."

I can't help you. I'm sorry. If I could, I'd invent a term, maybe.

However, you'll find it's not a common position. Almost anyone who understands what's at stake has a reason to care. The alternative is merely ignorance. I know of nobody who wants to own that label.

That could be a good thing, it means I might get it cheap.

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:53 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:17 pm
I've got an unrelated question, if I may.

You've gone from your "what me worry" avatar to the old "grumpy schoolmaster" one. Any particular reason?

I don't mind either. I'm just idly curious whether or not it indicates anything, or is just a "nice change."

I just felt like a change, although I have used the avatar here before. It was quite some time back. I don't yet know if the different image will influence my behaviour, but it would be nice if it helped me to take life a little less seriously.

I kind of like the "grumpy schoolmaster" one. It's cantankerous, yet funny...sort of appropriate, really.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:14 pm Almost anyone who understands what's at stake has a reason to care. The alternative is merely ignorance.

It's ignorant to imagine that something is at stake.

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:53 pm I just felt like a change, although I have used the avatar here before. It was quite some time back. I don't yet know if the different image will influence my behaviour, but it would be nice if it helped me to take life a little less seriously.

I suggest the great Peter Griffin.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Fri Jan 20, 2023 12:04 am
I kind of like the "grumpy schoolmaster" one. It's cantankerous, yet funny...sort of appropriate, really.

And, just like God, he actually exists.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qLGOjy1Z6M&t=10s

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:53 pm I just felt like a change, although I have used the avatar here before. It was quite some time back.

I remember it. It's my favorite one and I think it fits you well. It's a suitable expression for the discussions on this forum.