God and morality

[Gary Childress]

Look, you agreed when I asked you if you wanted me to define a path toward potential betterment. And after asking your permission to do so, I submitted my outline. These is no connection on any level between what I do or what I write here with whatever it is that you do or decide to do. And it is my opinion that you must observe all of the 10 points. But whether you do or not is not and cannot be any concern of mine.

I asked you to provide your outline. I said nothing about agreeing with it or taking it as Gospel.

That is exactly right. I will, however, provide what I think is a true and insightful conclusion in respect to you and forum participation.

You find ways to get attention and to make yourself and your self-declared sickness a topic of conversation. You must double-down on the insistence that your condition is hopeless, is a horrible misfortune, nothing can be done, because if you did genuinely accept it, and work to remedy what is possible in your circumstances, and did so, you could no longer play for sympathy and, naturally, continue to suck people into the whirlpool of pity that feeds the cycle.

You can’t let that go, it is a somewhat demented life-line.

Therefore (Alexis Jacobi intones in a resonant, thunderous voice ) I recommend that you do not pay any attention to my Ten Point Program! And you must, at the least on a daily if not hourly basis, worsen your condition. Meditate on life’s horrors! Feed on them! Keep on as you have been for years. The world is co-dependent and will feed you what you ask of it.

It seems hopeless to me. I'm not seeing how my position isn't hopeless. I mean I don't see a way out.

[Immanuel Can]

You find ways to get attention and to make yourself and your self-declared sickness a topic of conversation. You must double-down on the insistence that your condition is hopeless, is a horrible misfortune, nothing can be done, because if you did genuinely accept it, and work to remedy what is possible in your circumstances, and did so, you could no longer play for sympathy and, naturally, continue to suck people into the whirlpool of pity that feeds the cycle.

You can’t let that go, it is a somewhat demented life-line.

It seems hopeless to me. I'm not seeing how my position isn't hopeless. I mean I don't see a way out.

He's blunt, Gary.

But he's not wrong.

Your addiction to seeing yourself as merely a victim gives you the freedom from all responsibility, all action...and all hope of anything better. You're playing to the Phyllo version of yourself, against those who would wish better for you, but can only advise from the sidelines.

However, pity is nothing. Neither of us is interested in donating it to you. Encouragement, yes; hope, yes; even belief that you can do it, yes. But not pity. Pity is what you give somebody you're giving up on.

[Alexis Jacobi]

It seems hopeless to me. I'm not seeing how my position isn't hopeless. I mean I don't see a way out.

Now you have circled around to the “I am pitiable” “so pity me” strategy. And that is what it is. It is self-cursing. Negative affirmation.

You remind me of the relevance of Point #10:

10) Say to yourself and to the world (i.e. to the Universe, to “God”, to what has given you life: “I do not like it, I do not understand it, but I accept exactly what I have been given”.

[Gary Childress]

Fair enough. It is what it is. I accept that I have a mental illness. That's just the way life goes for me.

[Alexis Jacobi]

Wait! My Muse laboured…and she delivered:

11) Keep your dick in your pants.

This of course has universal applicability!

[phyllo]

Wait! My Muse laboured…and she delivered:

11) Keep your dick in your pants.

This of course has universal applicability!

I thought you wanted him to feel better.

[Gary Childress]

Wait! My Muse laboured…and she delivered:

11) Keep your dick in your pants.

This of course has universal applicability!

I thought you wanted him to feel better.

LOL! There's always a catch to someone who says they want you to "feel better".

[popeye1945]

Just as all creations of mankind are biological extensions of its own nature, so too is the concept of god and organized religion. Morality is the self-interest of the organism for its own well-being and survival; this, formalized into a society, is the concept of the self expanded to the species, or a particular in-group.

[Immanuel Can]

Morality is the self-interest of the organism for its own well-being and survival;

So you think "moral" means "egocentric"? But egocentricity cannot be extended to society, because the interests of others notoriously can conflict with the needs of the individual. In fact, they're often opposites.

[popeye1945]

Morality is the self-interest of the organism for its own well-being and survival;

So you think "moral" means "egocentric"? But egocentricity cannot be extended to society, because the interests of others notoriously can conflict with the needs of the individual. In fact, they're often opposites.

Yes, this occurs, and these individuals end up in prison. You're talking about wildcards that refuse to live by the standards of society. These people are misfits who do not recognize that society is there for their protection, as well as everyone else. Societies, large or small, packs, gangs, function on one principle: we look after our own.

[Gary Childress]

Morality is the self-interest of the organism for its own well-being and survival;

So you think "moral" means "egocentric"? But egocentricity cannot be extended to society, because the interests of others notoriously can conflict with the needs of the individual. In fact, they're often opposites.

Yes, this occurs, and these individuals end up in prison. You're talking about wildcards that refuse to live by the standards of society. These people are misfits who do not recognize that society is there for their protection, as well as everyone else. Societies, large or small, packs, gangs, function on one principle: we look after our own.

Does "our own" mean the same thing for large societies as it does for a small group or "gang"?

[popeye1945]

So you think "moral" means "egocentric"? But egocentricity cannot be extended to society, because the interests of others notoriously can conflict with the needs of the individual. In fact, they're often opposites.

Yes, this occurs, and these individuals end up in prison. You're talking about wildcards that refuse to live by the standards of society. These people are misfits who do not recognize that society is there for their protection, as well as everyone else. Societies, large or small, packs, gangs, function on one principle: we look after our own.

Does "our own" mean the same thing for large societies as it does for a small group or "gang"?

YES! The proverbial group is the one you belong to.

[Gary Childress]

Yes, this occurs, and these individuals end up in prison. You're talking about wildcards that refuse to live by the standards of society. These people are misfits who do not recognize that society is there for their protection, as well as everyone else. Societies, large or small, packs, gangs, function on one principle: we look after our own.

Does "our own" mean the same thing for large societies as it does for a small group or "gang"?

YES! The proverbial group is the one you belong to.

Can a person belong to both a gang and a nation? And if so, does one override the other if push comes to shove?

[Immanuel Can]

Morality is the self-interest of the organism for its own well-being and survival;

So you think "moral" means "egocentric"? But egocentricity cannot be extended to society, because the interests of others notoriously can conflict with the needs of the individual. In fact, they're often opposites.

Yes, this occurs, and these individuals end up in prison.

No, they usually don't.

There's nothing about seeking one's own interests that makes what you do guaranteed to be illegal...it may just be selfish. And selfishness isn't a crime. It's usually not punished at all. But it's still the opposite of the interests of others.

[Gary Childress]

So you think "moral" means "egocentric"? But egocentricity cannot be extended to society, because the interests of others notoriously can conflict with the needs of the individual. In fact, they're often opposites.

Yes, this occurs, and these individuals end up in prison.

No, they usually don't.

There's nothing about seeking one's own interests that makes what you do guaranteed to be illegal...it may just be selfish. And selfishness isn't a crime. It's usually not punished at all. But it's still the opposite of the interests of others.

So what is in one person's interest is never also in the interest of anyone else? Is that correct?