Why do guys who dress as girls get so much hate but not the other way around?

[Alexis Jacobi]

…

The more you write, the saner I feel!

Thank you!

[accelafine]

…

The more you write, the saner I feel!

Thank you!

Well this is normal. Tell us what you really think dear. I might be able to give you some makeup tips. Men are so bad at doing womanface. They don't have a clue. Poor things.

[carlafeit]

She is suggesting that she does not know about gender ideology, and thus presumably has not heard of autogynephelia, gender, fluidity, non-binarism, transitioning and other such aberrations, so is not defending them. I was expecting she would be, since they are routinely implicated in the defending of men wearing women's clothing and related stuff.

I have heard of such things - but obviously you spend a lot more time thinking about them.

I have not encountered any people who believe that definition of gender is purely circular "gender is that which one identifies with" - but apparently such people do exist, at least on the Internet. I assumed such people did not exist and it was a straw man argument but I have been assured by people I actually know in person that that is actually a thing. A silly thing but a thing.

Guys who get hard from wearing girly clothes are super-creepy. However, most guys I met who wear girly clothes are not fetishists of that sort. Many just like wearing girly clothes. Some do it as some kind of political statement. Some are thinking of transitioning. Some just look gorgeous in a dress.

[accelafine]

She is suggesting that she does not know about gender ideology, and thus presumably has not heard of autogynephelia, gender, fluidity, non-binarism, transitioning and other such aberrations, so is not defending them. I was expecting she would be, since they are routinely implicated in the defending of men wearing women's clothing and related stuff.

I have heard of such things - but obviously you spend a lot more time thinking about them.

I have not encountered any people who believe that definition of gender is purely circular "gender is that which one identifies with" - but apparently such people do exist, at least on the Internet. I assumed such people did not exist and it was a straw man argument but I have been assured by people I actually know in person that that is actually a thing. A silly thing but a thing.

Guys who get hard from wearing girly clothes are super-creepy. However, most guys I met who wear girly clothes are not fetishists of that sort. Many just like wearing girly clothes. Some do it as some kind of political statement. Some are thinking of transitioning. Some just look gorgeous in a dress.

Perhaps you need to think a tad more deeply about things. Just a suggestion.

[Alexis Jacobi]

Guys who get hard from wearing girly clothes are super-creepy.

Wait. Why creepy?

On what is your sense of the “creepy” based?

[Alexis Jacobi]

Perhaps you need to think a tad more deeply about things. Just a suggestion.

That is why I developed my 17-Week Email Course®.

My view is that everyone needs to think “a tad more deeply about things”.

If I could help you I would. I extend my loving hand. Will you take it or slap it away?!?

[accelafine]

eeeeuuuwwww

[Alexis Jacobi]

Your choice …

I am here for you when and if you choose to return to normalcy.

[carlafeit]

Guys who get hard from wearing girly clothes are super-creepy.

Wait. Why creepy?

On what is your sense of the “creepy” based?

I suppose - and I am oversimplyfing - they are creepy in a sense similar to creepy guys in general.

[Immanuel Can]

No, sorry...

Never, ever be sorry. For what?!

Sorry to embarass you by telling you that you're "help" was actually wrong. But if you're not embarassed by that revelation, then I don't have to be sorry about that.

[Immanuel Can]

She is suggesting that she does not know about gender ideology, and thus presumably has not heard of autogynephelia, gender, fluidity, non-binarism, transitioning and other such aberrations, so is not defending them. I was expecting she would be, since they are routinely implicated in the defending of men wearing women's clothing and related stuff.

I have heard of such things - but obviously you spend a lot more time thinking about them.

I don't imagine how you assume that. I actually spend very little time on them. They are pretty manifestly unhealthy.

I have not encountered any people who believe that definition of gender is purely circular "gender is that which one identifies with" - but apparently such people do exist, at least on the Internet. I assumed such people did not exist and it was a straw man argument but I have been assured by people I actually know in person that that is actually a thing. A silly thing but a thing.

All too common, in fact. You'll find it's pretty much Leftist orthodoxy these days.

[accelafine]

She is suggesting that she does not know about gender ideology, and thus presumably has not heard of autogynephelia, gender, fluidity, non-binarism, transitioning and other such aberrations, so is not defending them. I was expecting she would be, since they are routinely implicated in the defending of men wearing women's clothing and related stuff.

I have heard of such things - but obviously you spend a lot more time thinking about them.

I don't imagine how you assume that. I actually spend very little time on them. They are pretty manifestly unhealthy.

I have not encountered any people who believe that definition of gender is purely circular "gender is that which one identifies with" - but apparently such people do exist, at least on the Internet. I assumed such people did not exist and it was a straw man argument but I have been assured by people I actually know in person that that is actually a thing. A silly thing but a thing.

All too common, in fact. You'll find it's pretty much Leftist orthodoxy these days.

What on earth does she think sex 'self ID' is? That's at the crux of what this fight is all about

[FlashDangerpants]

I have not encountered any people who believe that definition of gender is purely circular "gender is that which one identifies with" - but apparently such people do exist, at least on the Internet. I assumed such people did not exist and it was a straw man argument but I have been assured by people I actually know in person that that is actually a thing. A silly thing but a thing.

I question whether you have done sufficient research to arrive at that conclusion?

The people you are in debate with here are all heavily inclined to trust their intutions and to dismiss arguments that don't conform to their existing ideological commitments without really needing logical consistency or any of the other trappings of philosophy. But they aren't exactly three of the best. One wants to convert you to his religion so you can become a trad-wife, one wants to convert you to his white-supremacist race-war cult*, and the other just has a cluster B personality disorder and a chip on her shoulder that could choke a whale.

So don't be like them. At present you find the notion that gender identity is an internal truth that you know about yourself rather than an external truth that is written about you on your birth certificate to be countertintuitive, but that isn't evidence that it is silly or wrong. You would have to look into the arguments presented that run counter your assumptions and show a flaw in the reasoning of them before you can seriously make that claim.





* so that you can get pregnant every week and churn out white babies

[Alexis Jacobi]

No, sorry...

Never, ever be sorry. For what?!

Sorry to embarass you by telling you that you're "help" was actually wrong. But if you're not embarassed by that revelation, then I don't have to be sorry about that.

Embarrassment is not a feeling that ever assails me.

You need be sorry about nothing! in my opinion. Hoist the flag of your true self!

My help wrong?! Hardly possible. But go on. I am not closed to hearing more.

[Immanuel Can]

I have heard of such things - but obviously you spend a lot more time thinking about them.

I don't imagine how you assume that. I actually spend very little time on them. They are pretty manifestly unhealthy.

I have not encountered any people who believe that definition of gender is purely circular "gender is that which one identifies with" - but apparently such people do exist, at least on the Internet. I assumed such people did not exist and it was a straw man argument but I have been assured by people I actually know in person that that is actually a thing. A silly thing but a thing.

All too common, in fact. You'll find it's pretty much Leftist orthodoxy these days.

What on earth does she think sex 'self ID' is? That's at the crux of what this fight is all about

Yes, right: and we might ask, if the "self" is supposed to form an ID, from what data is it supposed to form its conclusion? The most obvious is the physical; what else would one access to tell the "self" what one is?

Moreover, we might ask, how would a man know he feels "like a woman"? In our experience, do men have good purchase on what the real experiences of women are, or do they just make up what they suppose? And do women have privileged access to the cognitions of men, or do they generally find them perplexing and somewhat difficult to sympathize with? If men and women don't understand each other instantly, how does a man know that what he's feeling is "like a woman," and how does a woman know that what she's experiencing is "like a man"? Neither has ever been the other.

This accounts for the extravagant, overblown, theatrical and clumsy "cross dresser" affect that so many of these men exhibit. These posers understand "like a woman" only in terms of awkward externals, like too much makeup, high heels and feather boas. As to the existential inner life of women, they have neither insight nor means of insight to an experience of "being a woman" that actual women find recognizable.

Therefore, why wouldn't real women, and real men, too, find the bombastic gestures of cross-dressers indicative of a lack of authenticity, and thus rightly dismiss them as deranged or autogynephelic? By contrast, the understated, less aggressive, pseudo-masculine gestures of the tomboy type are less likely to attract doubt, and with good reason; so why wouldn't such women attract less opposition? It makes simple sense that that's how it would be.