Assisted suicide

[Alexiev]

One of my girlfriend's good friends killed herself yesterday. She had Multiple Systems Atrophy, a rare disease that robs one of motor control. She was beginning to have trouble swallowing (she already couldn't move by herself, even in her electric wheel chair). In her state, you have to be able to swallow the legal assisted suicide pills, so her options were:intubate; do nothing and die of thirst; assisted suicide.

This woman was a former triathlete and claimed her life had become torture. Of course it is all sad. Her husband has been her caretaker for 7 years, as the disease slowly robbed her of her mobility. I'm sure he's very sad, but perhaps one reason for his wife's choice was to unburden him.

"Der tod ist gros," wrote Rilke. Death is huge. What do people think of assisted suicide?

[Maia]

One of my girlfriend's good friends killed herself yesterday. She had Multiple Systems Atrophy, a rare disease that robs one of motor control. She was beginning to have trouble swallowing (she already couldn't move by herself, even in her electric wheel chair). In her state, you have to be able to swallow the legal assisted suicide pills, so her options were:intubate; do nothing and die of thirst; assisted suicide.

This woman was a former triathlete and claimed her life had become torture. Of course it is all sad. Her husband has been her caretaker for 7 years, as the disease slowly robbed her of her mobility. I'm sure he's very sad, but perhaps one reason for his wife's choice was to unburden him.

"Der tod ist gros," wrote Rilke. Death is huge. What do people think of assisted suicide?

In those sorts of circumstances I think there's definitely a good argument for it. Sounds like a truly awful situation and I'm very sorry to hear about it.

[Immanuel Can]

It does sound awful.

But maybe there are more questions.

1. We have one life...what does it mean to give up any moment of it?

2. Who owns the life we have?

3. Who pays the price for our decision?

4. Where do we go when we die?

Absent answers to these questions, would we be making an informed decision about the end of life?

[accelafine]

It's about PERSONAL CHOICE. The fact that it's religious nuts spreading lies and propaganda with horror stories about hypothetical 'killer children' coercing sweet little grannies into it (it's ALWAYS grannies) only shows how utterly disingenuous and hypocritcal kristians are (as if any normal person needed convincing). It's ALWAYS about control with them. They can't get away with saying outright that it's 'murder' so they create imaginery 'murder' scenarios where apparently women 'of a certain age' are completely incapable of making decisions for themselves.
I would also add that if you have children who are all out to murder you then perhaps you might not be the sweetest 'granny' in the world.
Medical advances of this magnitude belong to ALL humans. Witholding it is akin to witholding an absolute cure for cancer or some other horrible disease. I'm sure the religious nuts who are unfortunately still amongst us would spread lies and propaganda about how sharing THAT breakthrough would be a terrible thing too. They can shove their 'suffering is good' crap up their arses. No one's stopping them from suffering as much as they like--just don't try to force it on others.
I can't believe that people actually buy their self-serving propaganda. Euthanasia choice is something that benefits evey single human. Why would anyone NOT want to have that choice if it came down to it? It's not dying that most people fear. It's the process that goes into dying that they are afraid of. That is often horrible and extremely messy. You don't hear these same naysayers spreading lies about pet euthanasia. No decent person would allow their doggy to suffer pointlessly.
The idiot poms protesting about this bill don't need to worry. You have to be practically dead anyway to qualify. All the red tape would ensure that you die before it gets processed, and the frustration would most likely only hasten death (and increase the suffering).
I firmly believe that anyone should qualify once they reach a certain age. Some people just feel that they've had enough--and who is anyone else to tell them otherwise? What's wrong with wanting to leave your home and assets to your children, without it all being eaten up by a 'life' of torture in a sub-grade 'care' home where you are completely at the mercy of 'care' workers? That's a horror that lies in wait for the majority of the elderly. That's not 'life'; it's slow, painful death.

[Walker]

Death is the most non-binary experience. We can only know life.

“I shall tell you how my Guru's Guru died. After announcing that his end was nearing, he stopped eating, without changing the routine of his daily life. On the eleventh day, at prayer time he was singing and clapping vigorously and suddenly died! Just like that, between two movements, like a blown out candle. Everybody dies as he lives. I am not afraid of death, because I am not afraid of life. I live a happy life and shall die a happy death. Misery is to be born, not to die. All depends how you look at it.”
- Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj

[Walker]

2. Who owns the life we have?

The creator of the life. Every body and brain is like a leaseholder with the responsibility of upkeep.

If one dies in agony, who will remember what the experience was like for the one who died? From the scant information available, it won't be the one who died, therefore it won't be anyone. Any witnesses will be inferring based on appearance of the experiencer, but not the experience itself. Witnesses have noticed that death can bring peace. I heard a story of a priest who died during the atrocities of WWII. Men, women and children from a village had been herded into an underground area to be murdered by the military, lots of people. They were going out of their minds with panic and fear. A priest asked to go down there with them, knowing the certainty of death, and when he went down there with the doomed he eased their suffering before death. The screaming and panic stopped. The priest was living as he had always lived, right until the last breath.

[Alexiev]

2. Who owns the life we have?

The creator of the life. Every body and brain is like a leaseholder with the responsibility of upkeep.

If one dies in agony, who will remember what the experience was like for the one who died? From the scant information available, it won't be the one who died, therefore it won't be anyone. Any witnesses will be inferring based on appearance of the experiencer, but not the experience itself. Witnesses have noticed that death can bring peace. I heard a story of a priest who died during the atrocities of WWII. Men, women and children from a village had been herded into an underground area to be murdered by the military, lots of people. They were going out of their minds with panic and fear. A priest asked to go down there with them, knowing the certainty of death, and when he went down there with the doomed he eased their suffering before death. The screaming and panic stopped. The priest was living as he had always lived, right until the last breath.

Of course my friend was not living as she had always lived. She was trapped inside her uncompliant body, barely able to talk, or move, or swallow.

Personally, I don't think I'd do it, although I can't be sure. I'd wonder what insights the end might bring.

When assisted suicide was on the ballot in Oregon (the first polity to legalize it, although it was already common in the Netherlands), I had mixed feelings. Like acel I thought the technicality that a physician had to certify imminent death was silly. Either a competent adult should be able to do the deed or not. I was also concerned with families pressuring the elderly to take the option in order to preserve an inheritance. This is a particularly troubling possibility in the U.S., where we don’t have National health insurance. I've actually looked into the issue since, and based on the evidence these fears were unfounded.

[attofishpi]

It does sound awful.

But maybe there are more questions.

1. We have one life...what does it mean to give up any moment of it?

By "one life" are you suggesting one lifetime? You can't possibly know that.

2. Who owns the life we have?

The person within the living body.

3. Who pays the price for our decision?

What does that mean? Loved ones will miss us, but certainly they could understand the decision.

4. Where do we go when we die?

Irrelevant.

Absent answers to these questions, would we be making an informed decision about the end of life?

They all appear rather irrelevant where the circumstances of the one with the affliction is concerned.

[Immanuel Can]

It does sound awful.

But maybe there are more questions.

1. We have one life...what does it mean to give up any moment of it?

By "one life" are you suggesting one lifetime? You can't possibly know that.

I think we can. Science tells us the system we're living in is entropic, so it's not going to last forever. And we do not see any unambiguous evidence of people having more than one life, so we have no reason at all to suppose it. But additionally, we have Biblical revelation, which clearly states, "It is appointed to men once to die, and then the Judgment."

2. Who owns the life we have?

The person within the living body.

Why? We neither created ourselves, nor can we determine our lifespan, nor can we even guarantee most of its conditions. What secures to you that you own anything?

3. Who pays the price for our decision?

What does that mean? Loved ones will miss us, but certainly they could understand the decision.

Maybe. Maybe not. But one thing for sure: you won't be the only one affected by your decision.

4. Where do we go when we die?

Irrelevant.

Most relevant. If you're suffering, do you really want to go somewhere worse than the pain you're currently in?

[Alexiev]

Most relevant. If you're suffering, do you really want to go somewhere worse than the pain you're currently in?

What if you're a masochist?

One famously kindly Catholic priest.(I forget the name) was asked if he believed in hell. "I believe in it, because that is the dogma of yhe church, but I don't think anyone is in it."

[LuckyR]

Those against assisted suicide like to imply that death can be avoided, when everyone who thinks about it for a moment knows it is inevitable. Thus the issue isn't life vs death, rather it's death at time #1 vs at time #2. Doesn't seem like the OP's friend didn't change the time much. Everyone else (including the government) should just butt out.

[attofishpi]

Those against assisted suicide like to imply that death can be avoided, when everyone who thinks about it for a moment knows it is inevitable.

I don't think it's the 'death can be avoided', it appears to be back to religious loons that think GOD will get upset.

Deaths nuffin! Living can be a right pain in the...er...everywhere.

[attofishpi]

It does sound awful.

But maybe there are more questions.

1. We have one life...what does it mean to give up any moment of it?

By "one life" are you suggesting one lifetime? You can't possibly know that.

I think we can. Science tells us the system we're living in is entropic, so it's not going to last forever. And we do not see any unambiguous evidence of people having more than one life, so we have no reason at all to suppose it.

..so there is no life for you in heaven?

And was Jesus wrong in stating that those that believe in him will never see death?

But additionally, we have Biblical revelation, which clearly states, "It is appointed to men once to die, and then the Judgment."

Yep, and as GOD/sage informed me in 2005, that once we die, we are judged as to what family we deserve to be reborn into, based on how we have lived our life. Thus, this is ongoing until people wise up, and never see death. (*become sages or other)

2. Who owns the life we have?

The person within the living body.

Why? We neither created ourselves, nor can we determine our lifespan, nor can we even guarantee most of its conditions. What secures to you that you own anything?

GOD created me, I own my body, once it's dead GOD can deal with my soul...no issue.

4. Where do we go when we die?

Irrelevant.

Most relevant. If you're suffering, do you really want to go somewhere worse than the pain you're currently in?

Your belief that GOD could be so EVIL as to burn someone in hell forever simply for switching a failed body off (* cockup in GOD's design) is a deep lack of faith on your part..not sure Y u like to use the emoji for such nonsense.

[accelafine]

Those against assisted suicide like to imply that death can be avoided, when everyone who thinks about it for a moment knows it is inevitable. Thus the issue isn't life vs death, rather it's death at time #1 vs at time #2. Doesn't seem like the OP's friend didn't change the time much. Everyone else (including the government) should just butt out.

Hear hear!

[Walker]

It’s already a societal virtue to defend one’s country to the death. On behalf of society, individuals already say to soldiers who take the risk, “Thank you for your service.”

With effective messaging, when state assisted suicide becomes state approved suicide, the acknowledgment of societal virtue could become, “Thank you for your suicide,” thus changing insult into compliment.