A Possible Explanation to the Phenomenon of "Telepathy"

[chaz wyman]

Skeptics are such pompous gits. They expect others to believe that life is all about physical mechanism, even consciousness. How doughy is that? They applaud each other in their little dark corners, they keep their spirits under wraps - tied and chain to their unfaced fears of oblivion and chaos. How can they see that there is nowhere empty of life - that life is the story, that life is the god-head? ...

Then explain what you mean by "telepathy"? Do you mean reading anothers thoughts at a distance?
Can you tell us what techniques and practices you used that convinced you that whatever it is exists?

The night of their lives will fall, the dark of their minds will fail.

We're all going to die but is this a threat? You going to psi-blast us?

It's okay. I know for a certain fact that drinking tea, is a sure fire way to avoid all psionic blasts from the telepathy fairies.
I am as sure of it as I am of my anti-lion amulet which I wear.
"How do you know it works?" I was asked the other day,
" can you see any lions around here?"
So just keep drinking tea and you will be safe from Bernardo.

[converge]

Mike, was Mozart an occultist? How about Einstein?

Does the fact that none of us could write symphonies when we were 7 years old prove that Mozart was some kind of hyped up fantasy scam?

Er... one big difference is that we actually have evidence that Mozart wrote symphonies and that Einstein studied physics. Not only do we lack evidence that Bernard has magical mind reading powers, but he actually said that it's physically impossible for him to show us and that the only way to see the "proof" that he has them is to give up rationality and logic.

I have telepathy mind reading powers myself. It's true. Let me see here, I'll put on a demonstration. Hold one moment please.....

Ok, I'm ready.

Right now Chaz is poised over his keyboard, about to yell "YOU FRIGGING FANTASY IDIOT!!!!"

Ooops, now that he's read my prediction, he's changed his mind.

See?

Easy peasy!

You were close... that was actually me poised over the keyboard, not chaz.

[Mike Strand]

Hi again, Typist!

I admit (confess? - oh, no inquisition here, I guess) I have no information that moves me to believe in mental telepathy. If Mozart or Einstein had it, I like to tell myself they were benevolent and didn't use it against people, except for the headaches I get trying to understand Einstein's theories, and listening to some, but certainly not all of Mozart's music (he wrote some amazing stuff!)

I used to think my mother could read my mind, and I thought it was unfair, at the time, that I couldn't read hers.

There are people who say they know what I'm going to say before I say it. However, that may be more of a reflection on my lack of originality than on their powers of mind-reading.

[chaz wyman]

Hubris - anyone can have it -- scientists as well as occultists. But occultists tend to claim no one else, or at most a very few others, understand their "powers", whereas scientists, and even police detectives and their colleagues in forensics, while proud of their hard-won evidence, at least can show it to others, even school children, and actually must show it as part of their jobs.

The pride of the occultist, it seems to me almost by necessity, takes on a different and even darker hue than the pride of a scientist. The occultist claims to have powers beyond what the vast majority of people have or even would claim to be possible. It seems there isn't anything that makes them doubt themselves. Even if their claims are a pose, for the sake of publicity or fame, they are too proud to give it up. The whole point of the pose is to achieve -- what is it they're trying to achieve? Admiration? Book sales? Or more dangerous -- power over gullible people?

Here's my point: Even if it were true that some people can read the thoughts of others, why should any of the rest of us accept or admire that power? Given the frailty of human beings, the holder of such power could be dangerous. The mind-reader would be tempted to use it for ill purposes. Watch out for the occultist who, if you challenge him with the possible abuse of power, says that he is also morally superior to the rest of humanity. Then we might see him as a potential threat and recommend he undergo psychotherapy, whether he has the power or not. In any case, if it were true that the occultist both had the power and was wise and benevolent, you could argue that he wouldn't use that power, and so what's the use of having it in the first place?

The occultist to worry about is the one who is like the rest of us morally and uses his claimed powers (whether he actually has them or not) to do actual harm. But it's still OK to buy his book voluntarily, for example, if you're curious.

On the other hand, a professional magician, while proud of his skill, knows, as does the audience, that it's that skill that is being admired, not some special power that puts him above the rest of humanity.

Also distinct from the occultist, scientists and detectives are at least expected to be open to new evidence, or better reasoning on existing evidence -- it's really the definition of their job. This is not to say a detective or scientist is not above faking or hiding evidence, but the penalties for being caught are severe.

The occultist has more of a tendency (understatement?) to hide evidence or submit to a test or discount evidence that goes against his case -- or get other people to say, yes, yes, and have them hide the evidence for him. And the penalties for being found out? -- Severe only if someone actually got hurt by the occultist's actions according to existing civil or criminal law. Otherwise, the occultist loses book sales or gets laughed at ... hmmm, ... which may be the most severe penalty of all for the proud occultist, I would imagine.

This is not intended as criticism of those of you who are curious about mental telepathy and want to look into any studies about it or buy books by occultists out of curiosity. Back when I was taking a course in experimental statistics as a young college student, I did experiments with my family and a deck of cards to see if any of us had the power to read minds. We have extremely weak powers, if any at all. Anyway, I'm still occupied with trying to "read the thoughts" of people when they write them down for me in black and white!

There is a deep irony to Occultism. It was just the sort of investigations and assumptions that led to early science in the 16thC. However Alchemy (which did not work) led to chemistry, Astrology in use from the time of Babylon and beloved by Galileo turned out to be crapola, and transformed itself into astronomy; and whole range of mystical mumbo-jumbp got real after people like Bacon, Descartes, Hobbes, Spinoza, Leibniz et al, started to establish that the aims and attributes of the occult were best put under an epistemological basis, and something useful, that did not require belief for it was be acceptable, was founded. Why this idiocy persists in people like Bernard is beyond me.
There is nothing he might offer in evidence that cannot be explained by mundane circumstances.

If telepathy is the ability to read minds, or to predict what people will say, then why is it that people who do it the best tend to be psychologists, or long-term partners who have lived so long together that they speak 'with one mind'.
If such a phenomenon or remote sensing is true than it would be easy enough to demonstrate without the usual stupid objections against reason.

[Arising_uk]

Mike, was Mozart an occultist? How about Einstein?

Does the fact that none of us could write symphonies when we were 7 years old prove that Mozart was some kind of hyped up fantasy scam? ...

All it proves is that hot-housing works and that none of us were, hence all the Chinese musical prodigies.

Did you study the bell curve as a statistics student? If we are not to suffer from hubris ourselves, perhaps we should recognize that just because the vast majority in the middle of the bell curve do not have ability XYZ, that doesn't prove that rare individuals out at the ends of the bell curve don't. ...

You think telepathy and musical ability are the same?

I have telepathy mind reading powers myself. It's true. Let me see here, I'll put on a demonstration. Hold one moment please.....

Ok, I'm ready.

Right now Chaz is poised over his keyboard, about to yell "YOU FRIGGING FANTASY IDIOT!!!!"

Ooops, now that he's read my prediction, he's changed his mind.

See?

Easy peasy!

This is a self-fullfilling prophecy, as such is now untestable. I'd have been more impressed and much more likely to believe in your mind-reading powers if you'd timestamped it and revealed it after, and if, CW posted.

[chaz wyman]

Sorry But I have not been reading your posts (really), because this whole discussion is crap as Bernard is a FRIGGING FANTASY IDIOT!!!!

[Bernard]

Skeptics are such pompous gits. They expect others to believe that life is all about physical mechanism, even consciousness. How doughy is that? They applaud each other in their little dark corners, they keep their spirits under wraps - tied and chain to their unfaced fears of oblivion and chaos. How can they see that there is nowhere empty of life - that life is the story, that life is the god-head? ...

Then explain what you mean by "telepathy"? Do you mean reading anothers thoughts at a distance?
Can you tell us what techniques and practices you used that convinced you that whatever it is exists?

The night of their lives will fall, the dark of their minds will fail.

We're all going to die but is this a threat? You going to psi-blast us?

No, I obviously didn't make a threat. I made a prediction.

The best experiences I had were through studying modern shamanism, itself based on ancient Mexican shamanism, via Carlos Castaneda's work and seminars. Its a a very exigent and formal lifestyle that I was fortunate to get a real window into through practice and involvement with others. One of the keystone techniques is the recapitulation in which one exhaustively lists everyone one has known from the present to the past. Its a meditation practice with a simple breathing technique recapitulate the interactions. This may take years, and has several purposes. Primarily it restores energy that has become knotted up through interaction. The process expunges unnecessary social habits and behaviours and leaves one with free energy with which to access and explore unknown possibilities. Many things occured which I would not go near mentioning here, but instances of projecting over distances voiced words and sentences were not uncommon and something I experienced myself.

Its all a matter of having the energy and intent to accomplish what you wish, though much simpler said than done. But its a mild and joyful path, one that I will never tire of visiting. The more interesting stuff is to do with what men and women of ancient Mexico discovered about awareness and perception. They really knew what they were on about, and had years and years to develop on it. They were not just banging their tom-toms for all those thousands of years. They had intelligence as good as ours but used it in ways very opposed to ours. Some of what they did went haywire, dark and chaotic.

[Typist]

Hi again, Typist!

My man the Mr. Mike!

I admit (confess? - oh, no inquisition here, I guess) I have no information that moves me to believe in mental telepathy.

Ok, agreed, me neither.

However, having seen that certain rare individuals can express seemingly unbelievable talents in some arenas, it seems logical to remain open to the prospect that other rare individuals may have seemingly unbelievable talents in other arenas.

Being open is not the same as belief. I would agree that Mozart demonstrated his rare talent in public, and that if others wish to declare they have rare talents too, they should make the same demonstration.

The most interesting people are those who have rare talents of whatever kind, but feel no need to prove their abilities to anybody. Imagine the composer who was 5 times better than Mozart, but was so deeply interested in composing, that there was no energy left over for an interest in fame.

Often the case is that those who achieve fame are those with a rare talent for fame.

[chaz wyman]

Skeptics are such pompous gits. They expect others to believe that life is all about physical mechanism, even consciousness. How doughy is that? They applaud each other in their little dark corners, they keep their spirits under wraps - tied and chain to their unfaced fears of oblivion and chaos. How can they see that there is nowhere empty of life - that life is the story, that life is the god-head? ...

Then explain what you mean by "telepathy"? Do you mean reading anothers thoughts at a distance?
Can you tell us what techniques and practices you used that convinced you that whatever it is exists?

The night of their lives will fall, the dark of their minds will fail.

We're all going to die but is this a threat? You going to psi-blast us?

No, I obviously didn't make a threat. I made a prediction.

The best experiences I had were through studying modern shamanism, itself based on ancient Mexican shamanism, via Carlos Castaneda's work and seminars. Its a a very exigent and formal lifestyle that I was fortunate to get a real window into through practice and involvement with others. One of the keystone techniques is the recapitulation in which one exhaustively lists everyone one has known from the present to the past. Its a meditation practice with a simple breathing technique recapitulate the interactions. This may take years, and has several purposes. Primarily it restores energy that has become knotted up through interaction. The process expunges unnecessary social habits and behaviours and leaves one with free energy with which to access and explore unknown possibilities. Many things occured which I would not go near mentioning here, but instances of projecting over distances voiced words and sentences were not uncommon and something I experienced myself.

I've taken mushrooms and acid too. It was about the time I became King of the Universe and was able to walk though invisible walls.
I've also taken 'E", that was around the time that everybody seemed to love me. I had loads of 'free energy' and shit.
More recently I've taken Tramadol when I had cancer but I thought I was gonna die!


Its all a matter of having the energy and intent to accomplish what you wish, though much simpler said than done. But its a mild and joyful path, one that I will never tire of visiting. The more interesting stuff is to do with what men and women of ancient Mexico discovered about awareness and perception. They really knew what they were on about, and had years and years to develop on it. They were not just banging their tom-toms for all those thousands of years. They had intelligence as good as ours but used it in ways very opposed to ours. Some of what they did went haywire, dark and chaotic.

You've achieved nothing. I was master of the Universe, loved by all, a wall walker!
You have nothing compared to that.

[Arising_uk]

No, I obviously didn't make a threat. I made a prediction. ...

Well, its hardly a prediction that we're going to die or were you implying something else?

So not only telepathy but precognition as well?

[Bernard]

No, I obviously didn't make a threat. I made a prediction. ...

Well, its hardly a prediction that we're going to die or were you implying something else?

So not only telepathy but precognition as well?

Cut out the spin, I said nothing about anyone dying.

[Arising_uk]

The night of their lives will fall, the dark of their minds will fail.

So what was this meant to mean?

[Bernard]

The night of their lives will fall, the dark of their minds will fail.

So what was this meant to mean?

That doubt is associated with darkness, and when darkness leaves so does doubt.

[Arising_uk]

Deep.

What happens if their doubt is a big shiny positive thing?

[Bernard]

Fire is wet, confusion is order, male is female, ground is sky, disfunction is efficiency: all likely utterances of many contemporary political animals, and you applaud it all.

Yes, doubt has its place, but often it stands in the place of belief.

Deep.

What happens if their doubt is a big shiny positive thing?

"The cynical man is left with nothing but a potato - a friggin' potato!"

- Don Juan Matus.