Commercial art communicates feelings. Renaissance high art was commercial. The Beatles did not stop being good and true after they became popular an d made loads of money.The intention purely to exploit is what separates bad art from good art.
Popeye . Post id= 558525
What you say is quite true about structure, but it cannot be said about the appreciation of the beauty of form. One has an innate intelligence when it comes to the beauty of form. All through the beauty of form depends upon the quality of structure, the form of structure also has its own beauty and like you said, requires more knowledge in its creation and appreciation. Where it is said that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it depends on the form and structure of the appreciation of the subject, for it is the order and meaning of the subject which is to be bestowed upon the article/object of art.
[/quote]
Popeye,
the "innate intelligence" of which you write is always invaded, corrupted, and trained by the culture in which the individual is reared. Only the very young child can be as innocent as "innate intelligence" implies.
Please see Rousseau 'Emile' for an actual experiment and hypothesis.
Also Wordsworth:
shades of the prison house--------close upon the growing boy
Shades of the prison-house begin to close
Upon the growing Boy,
But he beholds the light, and whence it flows,
He sees it in his joy;
The Youth, who daily farther from the east
Must travel, still is Nature’s priest,
And by the vision splendid
Is on his way attended;
At length the Man perceives it die away,
And fade into the light of common day
There is, regrettably, no such adult person as has the innocent eye , the "innate intelligence".
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Jul 04, 2025 9:54 am
Popeye . Post id= 558525
What you say is quite true about structure, but it cannot be said about the appreciation of the beauty of form. One has an innate intelligence when it comes to the beauty of form. All through the beauty of form depends upon the quality of structure, the form of structure also has its own beauty and like you said, requires more knowledge in its creation and appreciation. Where it is said that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it depends on the form and structure of the appreciation of the subject, for it is the order and meaning of the subject which is to be bestowed upon the article/object of art.
Popeye,
the "innate intelligence" of which you write is always invaded, corrupted, and trained by the culture in which the individual is reared. Only the very young child can be as innocent as "innate intelligence" implies.
Please see Rousseau 'Emile' for an actual experiment and hypothesis.
Also Wordsworth:
shades of the prison house--------close upon the growing boy
Shades of the prison-house begin to close
Upon the growing Boy,
But he beholds the light, and whence it flows,
He sees it in his joy;
The Youth, who daily farther from the east
Must travel, still is Nature’s priest,
And by the vision splendid
Is on his way attended;
At length, the Man perceives it die away,
And fade into the light of common day
There is, regrettably, no such adult person as has the innocent eye, the "innate intelligence".
[/quote]
Perhaps not so, when consciousness is altered through meditation and/or drugs, a sense of wonder, a sense of awe, is possible to achieve, or, as has been my experience in the past, a complete loss of memory.
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Jul 04, 2025 9:54 am
Popeye . Post id= 558525
What you say is quite true about structure, but it cannot be said about the appreciation of the beauty of form. One has an innate intelligence when it comes to the beauty of form. All through the beauty of form depends upon the quality of structure, the form of structure also has its own beauty and like you said, requires more knowledge in its creation and appreciation. Where it is said that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it depends on the form and structure of the appreciation of the subject, for it is the order and meaning of the subject which is to be bestowed upon the article/object of art.
Popeye,
the "innate intelligence" of which you write is always invaded, corrupted, and trained by the culture in which the individual is reared. Only the very young child can be as innocent as "innate intelligence" implies.
Please see Rousseau 'Emile' for an actual experiment and hypothesis.
Also Wordsworth:
shades of the prison house--------close upon the growing boy
Shades of the prison-house begin to close
Upon the growing Boy,
But he beholds the light, and whence it flows,
He sees it in his joy;
The Youth, who daily farther from the east
Must travel, still is Nature’s priest,
And by the vision splendid
Is on his way attended;
At length, the Man perceives it die away,
And fade into the light of common day
There is, regrettably, no such adult person as has the innocent eye, the "innate intelligence".
Perhaps not so, when consciousness is altered through meditation and/or drugs, a sense of wonder, a sense of awe, is possible to achieve, or, as has been my experience in the past, a complete loss of memory.
[/quote]
I have taken consciousness -altering substances when I was younger, and I can remember their effects.
*A mild barbiturate made me unduly euphoric however I retained insight and understood the artificial euphoria that I felt could cause impaired judgement so I stopped using it.
* Amphetamine made me euphorically hypomanic however I retained insight and realised what a waste of time and subsequent hangover the intoxication caused so I gave up taking amphetamine.
*Transcendental meditation had no perceptible effect on my feelings or cognition despite that I persisted with it for eighteen months, and it was boring so I gave it up.
* One brief ,spontaneous , and unexpected absence of selflessness was not accompanied by a lack of insight, as I was aware of and could recall that the feeling was unusual whilst it was happening.
There are psychopathic states which are so designated as they include loss of insight
Popeye, what were the circumstances accompanying your own "sense of wonder, a sense of awe, is possible to achieve, or, as has been my experience in the past, a complete loss of memory." ? And did you retain your insight during some of these states?
Insight is like one doesn't forget who one is, but one can simultaneously remember an alternative mood.
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Jul 04, 2025 9:54 am
Popeye . Post id= 558525
What you say is quite true about structure, but it cannot be said about the appreciation of the beauty of form. One has an innate intelligence when it comes to the beauty of form. All through the beauty of form depends upon the quality of structure, the form of structure also has its own beauty and like you said, requires more knowledge in its creation and appreciation. Where it is said that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it depends on the form and structure of the appreciation of the subject, for it is the order and meaning of the subject which is to be bestowed upon the article/object of art.
Popeye,
the "innate intelligence" of which you write is always invaded, corrupted, and trained by the culture in which the individual is reared. Only a very young child can be as innocent as "innate intelligence" implies.
Please see Rousseau's 'Emile' for an actual experiment and hypothesis.
Also, Wordsworth:
shades of the prison house--------close upon the growing boy
Shades of the prison-house begin to close
Upon the growing Boy,
But he beholds the light, and whence it flows,
He sees it in his joy;
The Youth, who daily farther from the east
Must travel, still is Nature’s priest,
And by the vision splendid
Is on his way attended;
At length, the Man perceives it die away,
And fade into the light of common day
There is, regrettably, no such adult person as has the innocent eye, the "innate intelligence".
Perhaps not so, when consciousness is altered through meditation and/or drugs, a sense of wonder, a sense of awe, is possible to achieve, or, as has been my experience in the past, a complete loss of memory.
I have taken consciousness-altering substances when I was younger, and I can remember their effects.
*A mild barbiturate made me unduly euphoric; however, I retained insight and understood the artificial euphoria that I felt could cause impaired judgment so I stopped using it.
* Amphetamine made me euphorically hypomanic however I retained insight and realized what a waste of time and subsequent hangover the intoxication caused, so I gave up taking amphetamine.
*Transcendental meditation had no perceptible effect on my feelings or cognition despite that I persisted with it for eighteen months, and it was boring so I gave it up.
* One brief, spontaneous, and unexpected absence of selflessness was not accompanied by a lack of insight, as I was aware of and could recall that the feeling was unusual whilst it was happening.
There are psychopathic states which are so designated as they include loss of insight
Popeye, what were the circumstances accompanying your own "sense of wonder, a sense of awe, is possible to achieve, or, as has been my experience in the past, a complete loss of memory." ? And did you retain your insight during some of these states?
Insight is like one doesn't forget who one is, but one can simultaneously remember an alternative mood.
[/quote]
I read that life is lived forward and only understood backwardly. I was raised in an extremely poor environment, meaning on all levels, it is possible to be. As a child, I was epileptic from a very early age, which complicated life even more. This is the understanding backwardly, as children take what is in place to be natural and normal. I won't go into too much of a confessional here; it was the repeated loss of memory due to seizures and the absence of an identity that tweaked my wonder and turned me somewhat philosophical, which wonder tends to do. You sound like you've always been intellectually inclined and rather adventurous. I had the opportunity to take mind-altering drugs through the sixties, but never engaged in anything but weed. With weed, I found a source of wonder with the complicated colored patterns I would experience with the movement of the music, and time distortion. I found the world intellectually barren growing up, but didn't know what was missing, couldn't give it a name. Another experience I had involving the loss of self was that I ended up in the Canadian High Arctic, and a number of times I felt I lost myself in the landscape in the moment, feeling at one with it. Sounds weird, I know, but it made me appreciate the Inuit's identification with their land as something more than a cliché. I wouldn't say I am a well-rounded individual, and as a result, have spent an inordinate amount of time alone. Which tends to make the mind get more familiar with itself. Old age I find also makes one entertain one's thoughts with more frequency it seems to be getting more interesting with age.
Another experience I had involving the loss of self was that I ended up in the Canadian High Arctic, and a number of times I felt I lost myself in the landscape in the moment, feeling at one with it. Sounds weird, I know, but it made me appreciate the Inuit's identification with their land as something more than a cliché.
It is more than a cliche as you and I know from our own experience, and it does not sound at all weird to me. It is an alternative state of consciousness. I have no idea whether or not the blessed mood can be got deliberately. My guess is that this is what happened to Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus. Maybe the mood is more common for people who also experience the epileptic aura.
1. Yayoi Kusama: Kusama's mental illness and subsequent hallucinations were a powerful source of inspiration for her art. She used her experiences to create her iconic polka dot patterns and infinity installations, demonstrating how altered perceptions can translate into unique artistic expressions.
2. Surrealism: Surrealist artists like Salvador Dali, René Magritte, and Frida Kahlo actively sought to tap into the subconscious mind through techniques like automatic writing and dream imagery. They aimed to bypass rational thought and access a realm of unfiltered creativity.
3. Alex and Allyson Grey: These contemporary artists are known for their visionary art, which often depicts spiritual and psychedelic experiences. Their work explores themes of consciousness, interconnectedness, and the nature of reality.
4. Abstract Expressionism: This movement, with artists like Jackson Pollock, was influenced by Jungian psychology and the idea of a "collective unconscious." They sought to express universal human experiences and emotions through abstract forms and spontaneous gestures.
5. Dino Valls: This artist creates highly detailed and surreal paintings that explore the boundaries of perception and the nature of the self. His work often features dreamlike imagery and symbolic elements.
6. Other Notable Artists and Movements:
William Blake:
His mystical visions and spiritual beliefs fueled his unique artistic style.
The Psychedelic Art Movement:
This movement, prominent in the 1960s, celebrated the use of psychedelic substances to explore altered states of consciousness and create vibrant, visually stimulating art.
Video Art:
Artists like Bill Viola have used video to explore themes of spirituality, perception, and the human condition, often incorporating elements of altered states and introspection.
In essence, altered states of consciousness can be a powerful catalyst for artistic creation, offering artists new perspectives, emotional depth, and unique visual languages.
Effect of Altered States of Consciousness on Art | UKEssays.com
3 Nov 2020 — Yayoi Kusama. Yayoi Kusama is a contemporary Japanese artist who is known for her extensive use of polka dots and her in...
UK Essays
Dali's “Metamorphosis”: Paranoiac-Critical Activity and the ...
26 Mar 2014 — Dali maintained that he was not mad, but could participate in paranoic delirium as both an actor and a spectator. Dali'
Belinda wrote: ↑Sun Jul 06, 2025 10:47 am
Popeye wrote:
Another experience I had involving the loss of self was that I ended up in the Canadian High Arctic, and several times I felt I lost myself in the landscape in the moment, feeling at one with it. Sounds weird, I know, but it made me appreciate the Inuit's identification with their land as something more than a cliché.
It is more than a cliche as you and I know from our own experience, and it does not sound at all weird to me. It is an alternative state of consciousness. I have no idea whether or not the blessed mood can be got deliberately. My guess is that this is what happened to Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus. Maybe the mood is more common for people who also experience the epileptic aura.
Perhaps my experience in the high Arctic was due to culture shock; four days before that, I was in downtown Toronto, and I suddenly found myself standing on the shore of the Arctic Ocean near an Inuit village called Arctic Bay. The whole experience was surreal, with daylight twenty-four hours a day. I had the experience several times while there, but it never repeated for me in the South. I had a computer friend who had frontal lobe epilepsy, which is a hallucinatory condition, and many religious-type experiences, which in the long term just made her super-rational; she became a psychologist and writer. I have never experienced an epileptic aura, no warning whatsoever. What was Saul's description of his experience on the road to Damascus? I am largely illiterate biblically.
Belinda wrote: ↑Sun Jul 06, 2025 10:47 am
Popeye wrote:
Another experience I had involving the loss of self was that I ended up in the Canadian High Arctic, and several times I felt I lost myself in the landscape in the moment, feeling at one with it. Sounds weird, I know, but it made me appreciate the Inuit's identification with their land as something more than a cliché.
It is more than a cliche as you and I know from our own experience, and it does not sound at all weird to me. It is an alternative state of consciousness. I have no idea whether or not the blessed mood can be got deliberately. My guess is that this is what happened to Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus. Maybe the mood is more common for people who also experience the epileptic aura.
Perhaps my experience in the high Arctic was due to culture shock; four days before that, I was in downtown Toronto, and I suddenly found myself standing on the shore of the Arctic Ocean near an Inuit village called Arctic Bay. The whole experience was surreal, with daylight twenty-four hours a day. I had the experience several times while there, but it never repeated for me in the South. I had a computer friend who had frontal lobe epilepsy, which is a hallucinatory condition, and many religious-type experiences, which in the long term just made her super-rational; she became a psychologist and writer. I have never experienced an epileptic aura, no warning whatsoever. What was Saul's description of his experience on the road to Damascus? I am largely illiterate biblically.
Saul of Tarsus was a Jew who was also a Roman citizen, a well -off official who had a horse for his personal transport, and was going to Damascus to arrest Christian Jews who were too stroppy for the regime to tolerate. Briefly, Saul fell off his horse during the long ride to Damascus. He was not simply a bad rider or had an unsafe horse, but seems to have lost consciousness while sitting on the horse, then fell off. While on the ground he experienced changed consciousness that included love for Christians and Jesus. i think it was then his name became Paul instead of Saul, I don't know why. The rest is history----Paul travelled in the Roman empire and introduced Judeo Christianity to people who were not Jews.
