Free will, freedom from what?

[Fairy]

Reality is obscured by your our thoughts about it.

I'm very clear. But since we don't have a common commitment to reality, I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

If you say so, then so it will be, on your belief only. Not mine.

Nothing lived because nothing died. That which lives never dies, and that which dies never lived.

The Patterns Of Life Reveal The Secrets Of Death
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbEqq6k27iM

[Fairy]

I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

You say this very often to people when you do not understand what they are saying, you are never prepared to listen to others properly. Likewise, do not expect people to listen to you. Your ideas are nothing special either, for even your story is the unknown.

Nonduality the one question to all our answers. Take it or leave it, it's always your prerogative.

Perhaps your just not ready to hear the truth, don't worry, your not alone.

[Immanuel Can]

Reality is obscured by your our thoughts about it.

I'm very clear. But since we don't have a common commitment to reality, I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

If you say so, then so it will be, on your belief only. Not mine.

On yours, actually. It's you that's insisting that reality is unknowable -- or doesn't count, in some fashion. So that's on your end, not mine.

[Fairy]

I'm very clear. But since we don't have a common commitment to reality, I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

If you say so, then so it will be, on your belief only. Not mine.

On yours, actually. It's you that's insisting that reality is unknowable -- or doesn't count, in some fashion. So that's on your end, not mine.

Ok it's on my end. I agree with you, it's an unknowable end.

[Immanuel Can]

I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

You say this very often to people when you do not understand what they are saying,

I understand what you are trying to say. And I am familiar with the "nonduality" nonsense. And it's nonsense, even on its own terms: for it proposes to be the truth, which means it's dual, again, and binary, again.

That is to say, that if one can believe all the premises of an ideology, and still cannot, on that basis, find its wanted conclusion to be warranted, then it's an irrational belief.

Nonduality is irrational, because its wanted conclusion is denied by its own first premise.

But one would have to believe in basic logic to realize that, perhaps. And nondualists usually do not.

[Fairy]

I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

You say this very often to people when you do not understand what they are saying,

I understand what you are trying to say. And I am familiar with the "nonduality" nonsense. And it's nonsense, even on its own terms: for it proposes to be the truth, which means it's dual, again, and binary, again.

That is to say, that if one can believe all the premises of an ideology, and still cannot, on that basis, find its wanted conclusion to be warranted, then it's an irrational belief.

Nonduality is irrational, because its wanted conclusion is denied by its own first premise.

But one would have to believe in basic logic to realize that, perhaps. And nondualists usually do not.

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

There is no such thing as a nondualist, there is however, nothing being everything.

You just don't listen to anyone except yourself. And neither do I

You are simply clueless and have no actual understanding of what nonduality is pointing to. Even Belinda said that to you ages ago.

You've perhaps had a dabble in nonduality once upon a time and rejected it. You reject it and turned to the comfort of Christianity.

[Immanuel Can]

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

No, we can just disagree...while behaving respectfully toward each other, we would hope.

[Gary Childress]

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

No, we can just disagree...while behaving respectfully toward each other, we would hope.

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

[Walker]

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

No, we can just disagree...while behaving respectfully toward each other, we would hope.

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

I thought that people went to hell because of their actions, since actions define the reality of what you think (for instance, Christian actions) and belief (speculated choice before action) merely defines speculation about action. Maybe I'm wrong ...

You're free to think anything, without limitation, unless limitation is self-imposed.

[Gary Childress]

No, we can just disagree...while behaving respectfully toward each other, we would hope.

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

I thought that people went to hell because of their actions, since actions define the reality of what you think (for instance, Christian actions) and belief (speculated choice before action) merely defines speculation about action. Maybe I'm wrong ...

You're free to think anything, without limitation, unless limitation is self-imposed.

Don't tell me. Tell IC. According to him you worship demons if you practice Yoga.

[Walker]

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

I thought that people went to hell because of their actions, since actions define the reality of what you think (for instance, Christian actions) and belief (speculated choice before action) merely defines speculation about action. Maybe I'm wrong ...

You're free to think anything, without limitation, unless limitation is self-imposed.

Don't tell me. Tell IC. According to him you worship demons if you practice Yoga.

Like I said, perhaps you didn't notice, Gary.

Folks are free to think anything without limitation. Their actions define the reality of what they think, since not all thoughts manifest. When one lives doing Christian actions, that is the reality of what they think, and they are still free to think anything without limitation.

This is why compassion is an essential element in the fabric of spirituality. Compassion generates forgiveness, as Christians well know as evidenced through IC, for his forgiveness for all the crap you heap upon him, and Christianity.

[Immanuel Can]

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

No, we can just disagree...while behaving respectfully toward each other, we would hope.

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

Here's the more important question: are those beliefs true? And is Hell real?

Unless you want to tell people, "I'll respect you all the way to Hell," then those are the questions you should be asking.

[Immanuel Can]

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

I thought that people went to hell because of their actions, since actions define the reality of what you think (for instance, Christian actions) and belief (speculated choice before action) merely defines speculation about action. Maybe I'm wrong ...

You're free to think anything, without limitation, unless limitation is self-imposed.

Don't tell me. Tell IC. According to him you worship demons if you practice Yoga.

You'll have to point out where I have said that, Gary. I never have. Interesting that now you have, though.

[Belinda]

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

No, we can just disagree...while behaving respectfully toward each other, we would hope.

Is believing that someone is going to go to hell because they don't subscribe to your specific religious beliefs "respectful"?

But there is no need to be concerned that some people believe that , except when such a belief becomes political, and actively punitive.

[Belinda]

Reality is obscured by your our thoughts about it.

I'm very clear. But since we don't have a common commitment to reality, I don't think there's anything further we can discuss. We lack the common basis upon which to arbitrate answers.

So...

If you say so, then so it will be, on your belief only. Not mine.

Nothing lived because nothing died. That which lives never dies, and that which dies never lived.

The Patterns Of Life Reveal The Secrets Of Death
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbEqq6k27iM

Immanuel Can's messages are clear and simple English. Also IC is quite a mine of information as to the Scriptures. I wish I could understand what Fairy's ideas are!