Quote of the day
- iambiguous
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- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Aldous Huxley from Brave New World
It is natural to believe in God when you're alone---quite alone, in the night, thinking about death.
Next up: it's natural to die.
We are not our own any more than what we possess is our own. We did not make ourselves, we cannot be supreme over ourselves. We are not our own masters.
That's going too far, of course. On the other hand, don't get me started.
Pain was a fascinating horror.
Define fascinating?
A man can smile and smile and be a villain.
Wow, I actually didn't know that.
And that, put in the Director sententiously, that is the secret of happiness and virtue — liking what you've got to do. All conditioning aims at that: making people like their unescapable social destiny.
No, really, that's probably how it works.
I'm claiming the right to be unhappy.
Then those who claim the right to make others unhappy.
It is natural to believe in God when you're alone---quite alone, in the night, thinking about death.
Next up: it's natural to die.
We are not our own any more than what we possess is our own. We did not make ourselves, we cannot be supreme over ourselves. We are not our own masters.
That's going too far, of course. On the other hand, don't get me started.
Pain was a fascinating horror.
Define fascinating?
A man can smile and smile and be a villain.
Wow, I actually didn't know that.
And that, put in the Director sententiously, that is the secret of happiness and virtue — liking what you've got to do. All conditioning aims at that: making people like their unescapable social destiny.
No, really, that's probably how it works.
I'm claiming the right to be unhappy.
Then those who claim the right to make others unhappy.
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Pleasantville
Jennifer [as Mary-Sue in geography class]: What’s outside of Pleasantville?
Teacher: I don’t understand.
Jennifer: Outside of Pleasantville. What’s at the end of Main Street?
Teacher: Mary Sue, you should know the answer to that. The end of Main Street is just the beginning again.
Eternal recurrence they call it.
Jennifer: Oh, skip, you can pin me anytime you want to.
Gee, I wonder what that means?
David: You can’t do this, Jennifer. I warned you!
Jennifer: So what’s the big deal? OK. They’re not good at basketball anymore. Oh, my God. What a tragedy.
David: You don’t understand. You’re messing with their whole goddamn universe.
Jennifer: Maybe it needs to be messed with, David. Did that ever occur to you?
David: They’re happy like this.
Jennifer: No, David. Nobody’s happy in a poodle skirt and a sweater set.
[pause]
Jennifer: You really like this, don’t you? No, it’s not like you think it’s funny or dorky. You really like it.
I certainly thought that he did.
Bill: What’s the point, Bud?
David [as Bud]: You make hamburgers. That is the point.
Bill: No. I know I do. It’s always the same, you know? Grill the bun, flip the meat, melt the cheese. It never changes. It never gets better or worse.
David: Sometimes you just gotta do it because it’s your job. And even if you don’t like it, you just gotta do it anyway.
Bill: Why?
David: So they can have their hamburgers!
Needless to say there were no veggieburgers back then. Either that or they had just started making them.
Betty: Mary Sue?
Jennifer: Yeah?
Betty: What goes on up at Lover’s Lane?
Jennifer: What do you mean?
Betty: Well, you hear these things lately…kids spending so much time up there. Uh, is it holding hands? That kind of thing?
Jennifer: Yeah! That and…
Betty: What?
Jennifer: It doesn’t matter.
Betty: No, I wanna know.
Jennifer: Well, sex.
Betty: Oh. What’s sex?
Next up: what's an abortion?
Betty [after Jennifer explains sex to her]: It’s just that…your father would never do anything like that.
Jennifer: Well, you know, Mom…there are other ways to enjoy yourself…without Dad.
Mother's little helpers for one thing, right Mick.
Jennifer: Hey, can I ask you a question?
David: Sure.
Jennifer: How come I’m still in black and white?
David: What?
Jennifer: I’ve had, like, ten times as much sex as the rest of these girls, and I still look like this. I mean, they spend, like, an hour in the back seat of some car and all of a sudden they’re in Technicolor?
David: I don’t know. Maybe it’s not just the sex.
Nothing is not just for sex though, is it?
George: What went wrong?
David: Nothing went wrong. People change.
George: People change?
David: Yeah, people change.
George: Can they change back again?
Of course, that's exactly what I am attempting to do here.
It's just that no one believes me.
Jennifer [as Mary-Sue in geography class]: What’s outside of Pleasantville?
Teacher: I don’t understand.
Jennifer: Outside of Pleasantville. What’s at the end of Main Street?
Teacher: Mary Sue, you should know the answer to that. The end of Main Street is just the beginning again.
Eternal recurrence they call it.
Jennifer: Oh, skip, you can pin me anytime you want to.
Gee, I wonder what that means?
David: You can’t do this, Jennifer. I warned you!
Jennifer: So what’s the big deal? OK. They’re not good at basketball anymore. Oh, my God. What a tragedy.
David: You don’t understand. You’re messing with their whole goddamn universe.
Jennifer: Maybe it needs to be messed with, David. Did that ever occur to you?
David: They’re happy like this.
Jennifer: No, David. Nobody’s happy in a poodle skirt and a sweater set.
[pause]
Jennifer: You really like this, don’t you? No, it’s not like you think it’s funny or dorky. You really like it.
I certainly thought that he did.
Bill: What’s the point, Bud?
David [as Bud]: You make hamburgers. That is the point.
Bill: No. I know I do. It’s always the same, you know? Grill the bun, flip the meat, melt the cheese. It never changes. It never gets better or worse.
David: Sometimes you just gotta do it because it’s your job. And even if you don’t like it, you just gotta do it anyway.
Bill: Why?
David: So they can have their hamburgers!
Needless to say there were no veggieburgers back then. Either that or they had just started making them.
Betty: Mary Sue?
Jennifer: Yeah?
Betty: What goes on up at Lover’s Lane?
Jennifer: What do you mean?
Betty: Well, you hear these things lately…kids spending so much time up there. Uh, is it holding hands? That kind of thing?
Jennifer: Yeah! That and…
Betty: What?
Jennifer: It doesn’t matter.
Betty: No, I wanna know.
Jennifer: Well, sex.
Betty: Oh. What’s sex?
Next up: what's an abortion?
Betty [after Jennifer explains sex to her]: It’s just that…your father would never do anything like that.
Jennifer: Well, you know, Mom…there are other ways to enjoy yourself…without Dad.
Mother's little helpers for one thing, right Mick.
Jennifer: Hey, can I ask you a question?
David: Sure.
Jennifer: How come I’m still in black and white?
David: What?
Jennifer: I’ve had, like, ten times as much sex as the rest of these girls, and I still look like this. I mean, they spend, like, an hour in the back seat of some car and all of a sudden they’re in Technicolor?
David: I don’t know. Maybe it’s not just the sex.
Nothing is not just for sex though, is it?
George: What went wrong?
David: Nothing went wrong. People change.
George: People change?
David: Yeah, people change.
George: Can they change back again?
Of course, that's exactly what I am attempting to do here.
It's just that no one believes me.
- iambiguous
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- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Meaning
“Whenever we proceed from the known into the unknown we may hope to understand, but we may have to learn at the same time a new meaning of the word "understanding.” Werner Karl Heisenberg
Not once we have the definition though, right?
“August: You know, somethings don't matter that much...like the color of a house...But lifting a person's heart--now that matters. The whole problem with people--"
Lily: They don't know what matters and what doesn't...
August:...They know what matters, but they don't choose it...The hardest thing on earth is to choose what matters.” Sue Monk Kidd
No, really, what does still matter?
“The meaning of life consists in the fact that it makes no sense to say that life has no meaning.” Niels Bohr
Yeah, that's one way of looking at it.
Of course, there are lots and lots and lots of other ways too.
“There’s a drive in a lost soul—in one that is searching for acceptance, companionship, belonging, whatever you want to call it. The slightest coincidence ignites a spark that one hopes will lead to something meaningful.” Doug Cooper
Actually, this is a real thing.
“Where words lose their meaning, people lose their lives.” Confucius
Let's just hope that never happens here.
“Not only are there meaningless questions, but many of the problems with which the human intellect has tortured itself turn out to be only 'pseudo problems,' because they can be formulated only in terms of questions which are meaningless. Many of the traditional problems of philosophy, of religion, or of ethics, are of this character. Consider, for example, the problem of the freedom of the will. You maintain that you are free to take either the right- or the left-hand fork in the road. I defy you to set up a single objective criterion by which you can prove after you have made the turn that you might have made the other. The problem has no meaning in the sphere of objective activity; it only relates to my personal subjective feelings while making the decision.” Percy Williams Bridgman
How can it not be crucial to determine if the things we think, feel, say and do, we think, feel, say and do them with at least some measure of autonomy?
“Whenever we proceed from the known into the unknown we may hope to understand, but we may have to learn at the same time a new meaning of the word "understanding.” Werner Karl Heisenberg
Not once we have the definition though, right?
“August: You know, somethings don't matter that much...like the color of a house...But lifting a person's heart--now that matters. The whole problem with people--"
Lily: They don't know what matters and what doesn't...
August:...They know what matters, but they don't choose it...The hardest thing on earth is to choose what matters.” Sue Monk Kidd
No, really, what does still matter?
“The meaning of life consists in the fact that it makes no sense to say that life has no meaning.” Niels Bohr
Yeah, that's one way of looking at it.
Of course, there are lots and lots and lots of other ways too.
“There’s a drive in a lost soul—in one that is searching for acceptance, companionship, belonging, whatever you want to call it. The slightest coincidence ignites a spark that one hopes will lead to something meaningful.” Doug Cooper
Actually, this is a real thing.
“Where words lose their meaning, people lose their lives.” Confucius
Let's just hope that never happens here.
“Not only are there meaningless questions, but many of the problems with which the human intellect has tortured itself turn out to be only 'pseudo problems,' because they can be formulated only in terms of questions which are meaningless. Many of the traditional problems of philosophy, of religion, or of ethics, are of this character. Consider, for example, the problem of the freedom of the will. You maintain that you are free to take either the right- or the left-hand fork in the road. I defy you to set up a single objective criterion by which you can prove after you have made the turn that you might have made the other. The problem has no meaning in the sphere of objective activity; it only relates to my personal subjective feelings while making the decision.” Percy Williams Bridgman
How can it not be crucial to determine if the things we think, feel, say and do, we think, feel, say and do them with at least some measure of autonomy?
- iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day
A perfect world? This is Texas in the early 1960s. In other words, for some, not even close.
Intriguing situation though. Convict escapes prison. Ends up taking a little boy hostage. The little boy and the escaped con then strike up one of those relationships that can only happen in an extra-ordinary set of circumstances. And, as luck would have it, they both share some things in common. They’re handsome devils, they like RC cola and neither one has an old man that’s worth a damn. And then there is more to Butch than meets the eye. He loves kids for one thing.
Nope, never seen one quite like this before.
One thing you do see lots of times though: the old style lawman getting stuck with the new-fangled “criminologist”. She [it’s a she this time] supposedly doesn’t know squat about real criminals out in the real world…and he supposedly doesn’t know squat about the more sophisticated ways to nab them. Dirty Harry [sort of] meets CSI [sort of].
And then there’s the Fed. And all the parts that are funny as hell.
A Perfect World
Phillip [after Terry snatches the car keys]: Why’d he take the keys?
Butch: So I won’t leave him.
Phillip: Would you leave him?
Butch: Oh, yeah.
Does he say that a lot? Oh, yeah.
Terry [after failing to find his cousin in a phonebook]: Must’ve moved. Probably couldn’t have heard him anyway, this goddamn ear’s still bleedin’. Don’t you ever try that shit again.
Butch [sternly]: What?
Terry [puzzled]: What?
Butch: You were in the middle of threatening me.
Terry: Ain’t a threat.
[holds up a pistol]
Terry: It’s a fact.
Butch: Here, kid, take the wheel.
[Phillip grabs the wheel as Butch turns to face Terry in the back seat]
Butch: In two seconds, I’m gonna break your nose. That’s a threat.
[Butch punches Terry in the nose, then grabs the gun]
Butch: And that’s a fact.
Terry: I’m gonna kill you for that.
Butch: And that’s a threat. Beginning to understand the difference?
Oh, yeah.
Terry [after Butch has Phillip point a pistol at his face]: You’re a fuckin’ crazy man.
Butch: And that’s a fact. I believe you’re getting the hang of this.
Anyway, he has a heart of gold, remember?
Sally: Why are you so hell-bent on embarassing me, Red?
Red: I’m only hell bent on one thing. You get to know me a little better, you’ll find that having a strong backside and a sense of humor will get you a lot.
Sally: Well I have a fine sense of humor. But the one thing I won’t do is be your straight man so you can play hero to morons who think you are some kind of hillbilly Sherlock Holmes.
We know where this is going:
Red: This your first time in the field. I thought so.
Sally: Who do you think I am…some dumb school girl who’s wandered into the boy’s locker room?
Make his day?
Red: So who is the other one?
Sally: Other one?
Red: Yeah, you said you are one of the two brains here. Who’s the other?
Sally: Butch Hayes. We tested him in prison.
At least they've got that straight.
Intriguing situation though. Convict escapes prison. Ends up taking a little boy hostage. The little boy and the escaped con then strike up one of those relationships that can only happen in an extra-ordinary set of circumstances. And, as luck would have it, they both share some things in common. They’re handsome devils, they like RC cola and neither one has an old man that’s worth a damn. And then there is more to Butch than meets the eye. He loves kids for one thing.
Nope, never seen one quite like this before.
One thing you do see lots of times though: the old style lawman getting stuck with the new-fangled “criminologist”. She [it’s a she this time] supposedly doesn’t know squat about real criminals out in the real world…and he supposedly doesn’t know squat about the more sophisticated ways to nab them. Dirty Harry [sort of] meets CSI [sort of].
And then there’s the Fed. And all the parts that are funny as hell.
A Perfect World
Phillip [after Terry snatches the car keys]: Why’d he take the keys?
Butch: So I won’t leave him.
Phillip: Would you leave him?
Butch: Oh, yeah.
Does he say that a lot? Oh, yeah.
Terry [after failing to find his cousin in a phonebook]: Must’ve moved. Probably couldn’t have heard him anyway, this goddamn ear’s still bleedin’. Don’t you ever try that shit again.
Butch [sternly]: What?
Terry [puzzled]: What?
Butch: You were in the middle of threatening me.
Terry: Ain’t a threat.
[holds up a pistol]
Terry: It’s a fact.
Butch: Here, kid, take the wheel.
[Phillip grabs the wheel as Butch turns to face Terry in the back seat]
Butch: In two seconds, I’m gonna break your nose. That’s a threat.
[Butch punches Terry in the nose, then grabs the gun]
Butch: And that’s a fact.
Terry: I’m gonna kill you for that.
Butch: And that’s a threat. Beginning to understand the difference?
Oh, yeah.
Terry [after Butch has Phillip point a pistol at his face]: You’re a fuckin’ crazy man.
Butch: And that’s a fact. I believe you’re getting the hang of this.
Anyway, he has a heart of gold, remember?
Sally: Why are you so hell-bent on embarassing me, Red?
Red: I’m only hell bent on one thing. You get to know me a little better, you’ll find that having a strong backside and a sense of humor will get you a lot.
Sally: Well I have a fine sense of humor. But the one thing I won’t do is be your straight man so you can play hero to morons who think you are some kind of hillbilly Sherlock Holmes.
We know where this is going:
Red: This your first time in the field. I thought so.
Sally: Who do you think I am…some dumb school girl who’s wandered into the boy’s locker room?
Make his day?
Red: So who is the other one?
Sally: Other one?
Red: Yeah, you said you are one of the two brains here. Who’s the other?
Sally: Butch Hayes. We tested him in prison.
At least they've got that straight.
- iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day
John Fowles from The Magus
One of the great fallacies of our time is that the Nazis rose to power because they imposed order on chaos. Precisely the opposite is true --- they were successful because they imposed chaos on order. They tore up the commandments, they denied the super-ego, what you will. They said, "You may persecute the minority, you may kill, you may torture, you may couple and breed without love." They offered humanity all its great temptations. Nothing is true, everything is permitted.
In other words...blah, blah, blah...they were nihilists.
The world began in hazard and will end in it.
Start preparing now?
The battle was over. Our casualties were some thirteen thousand killed--thirteen thousand minds, memories, loves, sensations, worlds, universes--because the human mind is more a universe than the universe itself--and all for a few hundred yards of useless mud.
So, who won?
I was too green to know that all cynicism masks a failure to cope - an impotence, in short; and that to despise all effort is the greatest effort of all.
Define all?
We lay on the ground and kissed. Perhaps you smile. That we only lay on the ground and kissed. You young people can lend your bodies now, play with them, give them as we could not. But remember that you have paid a price: that of a world rich in mystery and delicate emotion. It is not only species of animal that die out. But whole species of feeling. And if you are wise you will never pity the past for what it did not know. But pity yourself for what it did.
Not much in the way of mystery and delicate emotion here though, he noted.
If a person is intelligent, then of course he is either an agnostic or an atheist. Just as he is a physical coward. They are automatic definitions of high intelligence.
Or, perhaps, autonomic definitions?
One of the great fallacies of our time is that the Nazis rose to power because they imposed order on chaos. Precisely the opposite is true --- they were successful because they imposed chaos on order. They tore up the commandments, they denied the super-ego, what you will. They said, "You may persecute the minority, you may kill, you may torture, you may couple and breed without love." They offered humanity all its great temptations. Nothing is true, everything is permitted.
In other words...blah, blah, blah...they were nihilists.
The world began in hazard and will end in it.
Start preparing now?
The battle was over. Our casualties were some thirteen thousand killed--thirteen thousand minds, memories, loves, sensations, worlds, universes--because the human mind is more a universe than the universe itself--and all for a few hundred yards of useless mud.
So, who won?
I was too green to know that all cynicism masks a failure to cope - an impotence, in short; and that to despise all effort is the greatest effort of all.
Define all?
We lay on the ground and kissed. Perhaps you smile. That we only lay on the ground and kissed. You young people can lend your bodies now, play with them, give them as we could not. But remember that you have paid a price: that of a world rich in mystery and delicate emotion. It is not only species of animal that die out. But whole species of feeling. And if you are wise you will never pity the past for what it did not know. But pity yourself for what it did.
Not much in the way of mystery and delicate emotion here though, he noted.
If a person is intelligent, then of course he is either an agnostic or an atheist. Just as he is a physical coward. They are automatic definitions of high intelligence.
Or, perhaps, autonomic definitions?
- iambiguous
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- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
A Perfect World
Butch: I want you to make a list, Phillip…a list of all the things you aren’t allowed to do. Butch: I want you to make a list, Phillip…a list of all the things you aren’t allowed to do.
What could possibly go wrong, right?
Butch: We're goin' trick or treatin', Phillip.
[Phillip stops in his tracks]
Butch: ...What's the matter now?
Phillip: We ain't allowed to go trick or treatin'.
Butch: Huh?
Phillip: My mama doesn't allow it.
Butch: Trick or treatin' - why not?
Phillip: Against our religion.
Butch: It's against your... against your - what kind of foolishness is that?
Phillip: Jehovah's Witness.
Butch: ...Now, Phillip, I'm askin' you. I ain't askin' your mother; I ain't askin' Jehovah. You want to go trick or treatin', or not?
Phillip: [thinks for several seconds, then nods determinedly; Butch walks off, and Phillip follows]
See what I mean? Your options increase dramatically once you abandon God and religion. On the other hand, that's only all the way to the grave. And, needless to say, for better or for worse.
Red [interrupting Bobbie Lee harassing Sally]: How you take your steak, Sally?
Sally: Rare.
Red: Well, I’ll just wipe its ass, hurl it through and you can tear off a slab. How’d that be?
Sally: On second thought, maybe medium-rare.
Don't ask.
Butch: That was a hell of a thing to do, Phillip. You’re a hero! Probably be in all the papers tomorrow…how you saved those folks. Truth is though I don’t think I would have killed them. I’ve only killed two people in my whole life. One hurt my mama…one hurt you.
Fair enough?
Phillip [to Butch]: You kissed her backside, huh?
Oh, yeah.
Sally: You know you did everything you could. Don’t you?
Red: I don’t know nothin’.
[pause]
Red: Not one damn thing.
That's still a hell of a lot more than some here know.
Butch: I want you to make a list, Phillip…a list of all the things you aren’t allowed to do. Butch: I want you to make a list, Phillip…a list of all the things you aren’t allowed to do.
What could possibly go wrong, right?
Butch: We're goin' trick or treatin', Phillip.
[Phillip stops in his tracks]
Butch: ...What's the matter now?
Phillip: We ain't allowed to go trick or treatin'.
Butch: Huh?
Phillip: My mama doesn't allow it.
Butch: Trick or treatin' - why not?
Phillip: Against our religion.
Butch: It's against your... against your - what kind of foolishness is that?
Phillip: Jehovah's Witness.
Butch: ...Now, Phillip, I'm askin' you. I ain't askin' your mother; I ain't askin' Jehovah. You want to go trick or treatin', or not?
Phillip: [thinks for several seconds, then nods determinedly; Butch walks off, and Phillip follows]
See what I mean? Your options increase dramatically once you abandon God and religion. On the other hand, that's only all the way to the grave. And, needless to say, for better or for worse.
Red [interrupting Bobbie Lee harassing Sally]: How you take your steak, Sally?
Sally: Rare.
Red: Well, I’ll just wipe its ass, hurl it through and you can tear off a slab. How’d that be?
Sally: On second thought, maybe medium-rare.
Don't ask.
Butch: That was a hell of a thing to do, Phillip. You’re a hero! Probably be in all the papers tomorrow…how you saved those folks. Truth is though I don’t think I would have killed them. I’ve only killed two people in my whole life. One hurt my mama…one hurt you.
Fair enough?
Phillip [to Butch]: You kissed her backside, huh?
Oh, yeah.
Sally: You know you did everything you could. Don’t you?
Red: I don’t know nothin’.
[pause]
Red: Not one damn thing.
That's still a hell of a lot more than some here know.
- iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day
Yuval Noah Harari
The capitalist and consumerist ethics are two sides of the same coin, a merger of two commandments. The supreme commandment of the rich is ‘Invest!’ The supreme commandment of the rest of us is ‘Buy!’ The capitalist–consumerist ethic is revolutionary in another respect. Most previous ethical systems presented people with a pretty tough deal. They were promised paradise, but only if they cultivated compassion and tolerance, overcame craving and anger, and restrained their selfish interests. This was too tough for most. The history of ethics is a sad tale of wonderful ideals that nobody can live up to. Most Christians did not imitate Christ, most Buddhists failed to follow Buddha, and most Confucians would have caused Confucius a temper tantrum. In contrast, most people today successfully live up to the capitalist–consumerist ideal. The new ethic promises paradise on condition that the rich remain greedy and spend their time making more money and that the masses give free reign to their cravings and passions and buy more and more. This is the first religion in history whose followers actually do what they are asked to do. How though do we know that we'll really get paradise in return? We've seen it on television.
Praise the Lord!
Now, pass the ammunition.
...happiness does not really depend on objective conditions of either wealth, health or even community. Rather, it depends on the correlation between objective conditions and subjective expectations.
Next up: happiness here? Clouds, clouds and more clouds!!
The most common reaction of the human mind to achievement is not satisfaction, but craving for more.
Pick one
1] our achievments
2] their achievments
People are usually afraid of change because they fear the unknown. But the single greatest constant of history is that everything changes.
Thus the proliferation still today of these folks:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... traditions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_p ... ideologies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_s ... philosophy
In 2012 about 56 million people died throughout the world; 620,000 of them died due to human violence (war killed 120,000 people, and crime killed another 500,000). In contrast, 800,000 committed suicide, and 1.5 million died of diabetes. Sugar is now more dangerous than gunpowder.
Next up: salt.
Nothing captures the biological argument better than the famous New Age slogan: ‘Happiness begins within.’ Money, social status, plastic surgery, beautiful houses, powerful positions – none of these will bring you happiness. Lasting happiness comes only from serotonin, dopamine and oxytocin.
Though not necessarily in that order, of course.
The capitalist and consumerist ethics are two sides of the same coin, a merger of two commandments. The supreme commandment of the rich is ‘Invest!’ The supreme commandment of the rest of us is ‘Buy!’ The capitalist–consumerist ethic is revolutionary in another respect. Most previous ethical systems presented people with a pretty tough deal. They were promised paradise, but only if they cultivated compassion and tolerance, overcame craving and anger, and restrained their selfish interests. This was too tough for most. The history of ethics is a sad tale of wonderful ideals that nobody can live up to. Most Christians did not imitate Christ, most Buddhists failed to follow Buddha, and most Confucians would have caused Confucius a temper tantrum. In contrast, most people today successfully live up to the capitalist–consumerist ideal. The new ethic promises paradise on condition that the rich remain greedy and spend their time making more money and that the masses give free reign to their cravings and passions and buy more and more. This is the first religion in history whose followers actually do what they are asked to do. How though do we know that we'll really get paradise in return? We've seen it on television.
Praise the Lord!
Now, pass the ammunition.
...happiness does not really depend on objective conditions of either wealth, health or even community. Rather, it depends on the correlation between objective conditions and subjective expectations.
Next up: happiness here? Clouds, clouds and more clouds!!
The most common reaction of the human mind to achievement is not satisfaction, but craving for more.
Pick one
1] our achievments
2] their achievments
People are usually afraid of change because they fear the unknown. But the single greatest constant of history is that everything changes.
Thus the proliferation still today of these folks:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... traditions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_p ... ideologies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_s ... philosophy
In 2012 about 56 million people died throughout the world; 620,000 of them died due to human violence (war killed 120,000 people, and crime killed another 500,000). In contrast, 800,000 committed suicide, and 1.5 million died of diabetes. Sugar is now more dangerous than gunpowder.
Next up: salt.
Nothing captures the biological argument better than the famous New Age slogan: ‘Happiness begins within.’ Money, social status, plastic surgery, beautiful houses, powerful positions – none of these will bring you happiness. Lasting happiness comes only from serotonin, dopamine and oxytocin.
Though not necessarily in that order, of course.
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Whenever I think of Easy Rider, I’m reminded of the references made to it in the film Lost In America:
David: This is what we talked about when we were 19. Remember we kept saying “Let’s find ourselves,” but we didn’t have a dollar so we watched TV. Linda, this is just like Easy Rider except now it’s our turn. We can drop out and still have our nest egg!
But then:
Linda: In the movie you are basing your whole life on, Easy Rider, they had nothing. They had no nest egg!
David: Bullshit! They had a giant nest egg. They had all that cocaine!
Hippie dope dealers? In other words, you can be free as a bird if you got enough dough to avoid having to work for it.
There are lots of different ways that folks reduce the 1960s down to their own prejudicies. So pull yourself up out of it and do the same.
But it really was dangerous in some parts of the country [THE SOUTH] to look like them, to think like them, to behave like them. It could get you killed, for example.
Dennis Hopper and Peter Fonda did not write a full script for the movie and made most of it up as they went along. They didn’t hire a crew but instead picked up hippies at communes across the country, and used friends and passersby to hold the cameras and were drunk and stoned most of the time. IMDb
Easy Rider
Captain America: No, l mean it. You’ve got a nice place. lt’s not every man that can live off the land, you know? You can do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud.
You know, among other things.
Billy: Where ya from man?
Stranger on the Highway: Hard to say.
Next up: where ya going?
Stranger on the highway: I’m from the city… Doesn’t matter what city; all cities are alike.
Billy: Well, why’d you mention it then?
Stranger on the highway: 'Cause I’m FROM the city; a long WAY from the city, and that’s where I wanna be right now.
Thank God for the suburbs?
Captain America: Have you gotta helmet?
George: Have I gotta helmet? Ha ha ha! I got a beauty!
Well, it is a helmet.
Captain America: Here, do this instead.
George: No, thanks. l got some store-bought here of my own.
Captain America: No, man. This is grass.
George: You mean, marijuana? Lord have mercy! ls that what that is?
Lord have mercy?
George: You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I can’t understand what’s gone wrong with it.
Billy: Man, everybody got chicken, that’s what happened. Hey, we can’t even get into like, a second-rate hotel, I mean, a second-rate motel, you dig? They think we’re gonna cut their throat or somethin’. They’re scared, man.
George: They’re not scared of you. They’re scared of what you represent to ‘em.
Billy: Hey, man. All we represent to them, man, is somebody who needs a haircut.
George: Oh, no. What you represent to them is freedom.
Billy: What the hell is wrong with freedom? That’s what it’s all about.
George: Oh, yeah, that’s right. That’s what’s it’s all about, all right. But talkin’ about it and bein’ it, that’s two different things. I mean, it’s real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don’t ever tell anybody that they’re not free, ‘cause then they’re gonna get real busy killin’ and maimin’ to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they’re gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it’s gonna scare 'em.
Billy: Well, it don’t make ‘em runnin’ scared.
George: No, it makes 'em dangerous.
Or certainly something close to it..
Billy: We did it, man. We did it, we did it. We’re rich, man. We’re retirin’ in Florida now, mister.
Captain America: You know Billy, we blew it.
Billy: What? That’s what it’s all about man. I mean, like, you know. I mean, you go for the big money, man, and then you’re free. You dig?
Captain America: We blew it.
Did they? New thread?
David: This is what we talked about when we were 19. Remember we kept saying “Let’s find ourselves,” but we didn’t have a dollar so we watched TV. Linda, this is just like Easy Rider except now it’s our turn. We can drop out and still have our nest egg!
But then:
Linda: In the movie you are basing your whole life on, Easy Rider, they had nothing. They had no nest egg!
David: Bullshit! They had a giant nest egg. They had all that cocaine!
Hippie dope dealers? In other words, you can be free as a bird if you got enough dough to avoid having to work for it.
There are lots of different ways that folks reduce the 1960s down to their own prejudicies. So pull yourself up out of it and do the same.
But it really was dangerous in some parts of the country [THE SOUTH] to look like them, to think like them, to behave like them. It could get you killed, for example.
Dennis Hopper and Peter Fonda did not write a full script for the movie and made most of it up as they went along. They didn’t hire a crew but instead picked up hippies at communes across the country, and used friends and passersby to hold the cameras and were drunk and stoned most of the time. IMDb
Easy Rider
Captain America: No, l mean it. You’ve got a nice place. lt’s not every man that can live off the land, you know? You can do your own thing in your own time. You should be proud.
You know, among other things.
Billy: Where ya from man?
Stranger on the Highway: Hard to say.
Next up: where ya going?
Stranger on the highway: I’m from the city… Doesn’t matter what city; all cities are alike.
Billy: Well, why’d you mention it then?
Stranger on the highway: 'Cause I’m FROM the city; a long WAY from the city, and that’s where I wanna be right now.
Thank God for the suburbs?
Captain America: Have you gotta helmet?
George: Have I gotta helmet? Ha ha ha! I got a beauty!
Well, it is a helmet.
Captain America: Here, do this instead.
George: No, thanks. l got some store-bought here of my own.
Captain America: No, man. This is grass.
George: You mean, marijuana? Lord have mercy! ls that what that is?
Lord have mercy?
George: You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I can’t understand what’s gone wrong with it.
Billy: Man, everybody got chicken, that’s what happened. Hey, we can’t even get into like, a second-rate hotel, I mean, a second-rate motel, you dig? They think we’re gonna cut their throat or somethin’. They’re scared, man.
George: They’re not scared of you. They’re scared of what you represent to ‘em.
Billy: Hey, man. All we represent to them, man, is somebody who needs a haircut.
George: Oh, no. What you represent to them is freedom.
Billy: What the hell is wrong with freedom? That’s what it’s all about.
George: Oh, yeah, that’s right. That’s what’s it’s all about, all right. But talkin’ about it and bein’ it, that’s two different things. I mean, it’s real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don’t ever tell anybody that they’re not free, ‘cause then they’re gonna get real busy killin’ and maimin’ to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they’re gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it’s gonna scare 'em.
Billy: Well, it don’t make ‘em runnin’ scared.
George: No, it makes 'em dangerous.
Or certainly something close to it..
Billy: We did it, man. We did it, we did it. We’re rich, man. We’re retirin’ in Florida now, mister.
Captain America: You know Billy, we blew it.
Billy: What? That’s what it’s all about man. I mean, like, you know. I mean, you go for the big money, man, and then you’re free. You dig?
Captain America: We blew it.
Did they? New thread?
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Based on true events.
Most of the time as a boy I always felt there was a part of me that wasn’t particularly like anyone else. So another part of me was always on the lookout for someone I might be able to explain that to…or even to share it with. But I never really found this person. In this film they do find each other. For better and for worse.
If anything, the 1950s in New Zealand were even more conformist than for the rest of us. The God part especially. Lots and lots of rules about comportment.
So, were they lovers? Were they insane? It’s not like they needed to escape into fantasy because their reality was harsh and cruel. Their reality was rather pleasant. Well, not counting Juliet’s narcissistic parents. Or the limited options for “girls” back then.
Just out of curiosity, can someone be mad [as in the mental affliction] and know that they are mad?
This is Kate Winslet’s first film.
Heavenly Creatures
Juliet [she has just arrived at her new school]: Excuse me, Miss Waller, you’ve made a mistake. “Je doutais qu’il vienne” is in fact the spoken subjunctive.
Miss Waller: It is customary to stand when addressing a teacher,
[pause]
Miss Waller: Antoinette [her name in French class].
Juliet: You should have written “vînt”.
Miss Waller: I must have copied it incorrectly from my notes.
Juliet: You don’t need to apologise, Miss Waller. I found it frightfully difficult myself until I got the hang of it.
Miss Waller [in a huff]: Thank you, Juliet. Now open your textbook to page 17.
The times that some of us live for.
Pauline: Oh, I wish James Mason would do a religious picture! He’d be perfect as Jesus!
Juliet: Daddy says the Bible’s a load of bunkum!
Pauline: But we’re all going to heaven?
Juliet: I’M not! I’M going to The Fourth World… it’s sort of like Heaven. Only better, because there aren’t any Christians!
Any Fourth Worlders here? Any Christians?
Pauline [from her diary]: Today Juliet and I discovered the key to the Fourth World. We have had it in our possession for about six months, but we only realized it on the day of the death of Christ. We saw a gateway through the clouds. Everything was full of peace and bliss. We then realized we had the key. We now know we’re not genii, as we thought. We have an extra part of our brain that can appreciate the Fourth World. Only about people have it. When we die, we will go to the Fourth World, but meanwhile, on two days every year, we may use the key and look into that beautiful world which we have been lucky enough to be allowed to know of on this day of finding the key to the way through the clouds.
Uh, something like Narnia? Only not nearly as ridiculous??
Doctor Bennett: Uh, Mrs. Rieper… Uh, homosexuality.
Mrs Reiper: Oh.
Doctor Bennett: Oh. I agree, Mrs. Rieper. It’s not a pleasant word. But let us not panic unduly. This condition is often a passing phase with girls of Yvonne’s age.
Mrs. Reiper: But she’s always been a normal…happy child.
Doctor Bennett: Oh, it can strike at any time, and adolescents are particularly vulnerable.
Mrs Reiper: What about the vomiting? Uh, she’s lost a lot of weight.
Doctor Bennett: Physically, I can find nothing wrong. I’ve checked for TB, and she’s clear. I… I can only attribute her weight loss to her…mental disorder. Look, Mrs. Rieper, try not to worry too much. Yvonne’s young and strong, and she’s got a loving family behind her. Chances are she’ll grow out of it. If not, well, medical science is progressing in leaps and bounds.
Fast forward to, well, you know.
Pauline [from her diary]: My new years resolution is a far more selfish one than last year. It is to make my motto, eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow, you may be dead.
If you're not already, of course.
Pauline [from her diary]: Why could not mother die? Dozens of people are dying all the time, thousands, so why not mother? And father too.
The Antonio Salieri Syndrome, as some call it.
Pauline [from her diary]: We realised why Deborah and I have such extraordinary telepathy and why people treat us and look at us the way they do. It is because we are MAD. We are both stark raving MAD!
You know, a "condition".
Pauline [from her diary]: Our main idea for the day was to murder Mother. This notion is not a new one, but this time there is a definite plan which we plan to carry out.
And they do.
Pauline [from her diary]: The next time I write in this diary, Mother will be dead. How odd…yet how pleasing.
Can you say that?
Most of the time as a boy I always felt there was a part of me that wasn’t particularly like anyone else. So another part of me was always on the lookout for someone I might be able to explain that to…or even to share it with. But I never really found this person. In this film they do find each other. For better and for worse.
If anything, the 1950s in New Zealand were even more conformist than for the rest of us. The God part especially. Lots and lots of rules about comportment.
So, were they lovers? Were they insane? It’s not like they needed to escape into fantasy because their reality was harsh and cruel. Their reality was rather pleasant. Well, not counting Juliet’s narcissistic parents. Or the limited options for “girls” back then.
Just out of curiosity, can someone be mad [as in the mental affliction] and know that they are mad?
This is Kate Winslet’s first film.
Heavenly Creatures
Juliet [she has just arrived at her new school]: Excuse me, Miss Waller, you’ve made a mistake. “Je doutais qu’il vienne” is in fact the spoken subjunctive.
Miss Waller: It is customary to stand when addressing a teacher,
[pause]
Miss Waller: Antoinette [her name in French class].
Juliet: You should have written “vînt”.
Miss Waller: I must have copied it incorrectly from my notes.
Juliet: You don’t need to apologise, Miss Waller. I found it frightfully difficult myself until I got the hang of it.
Miss Waller [in a huff]: Thank you, Juliet. Now open your textbook to page 17.
The times that some of us live for.
Pauline: Oh, I wish James Mason would do a religious picture! He’d be perfect as Jesus!
Juliet: Daddy says the Bible’s a load of bunkum!
Pauline: But we’re all going to heaven?
Juliet: I’M not! I’M going to The Fourth World… it’s sort of like Heaven. Only better, because there aren’t any Christians!
Any Fourth Worlders here? Any Christians?
Pauline [from her diary]: Today Juliet and I discovered the key to the Fourth World. We have had it in our possession for about six months, but we only realized it on the day of the death of Christ. We saw a gateway through the clouds. Everything was full of peace and bliss. We then realized we had the key. We now know we’re not genii, as we thought. We have an extra part of our brain that can appreciate the Fourth World. Only about people have it. When we die, we will go to the Fourth World, but meanwhile, on two days every year, we may use the key and look into that beautiful world which we have been lucky enough to be allowed to know of on this day of finding the key to the way through the clouds.
Uh, something like Narnia? Only not nearly as ridiculous??
Doctor Bennett: Uh, Mrs. Rieper… Uh, homosexuality.
Mrs Reiper: Oh.
Doctor Bennett: Oh. I agree, Mrs. Rieper. It’s not a pleasant word. But let us not panic unduly. This condition is often a passing phase with girls of Yvonne’s age.
Mrs. Reiper: But she’s always been a normal…happy child.
Doctor Bennett: Oh, it can strike at any time, and adolescents are particularly vulnerable.
Mrs Reiper: What about the vomiting? Uh, she’s lost a lot of weight.
Doctor Bennett: Physically, I can find nothing wrong. I’ve checked for TB, and she’s clear. I… I can only attribute her weight loss to her…mental disorder. Look, Mrs. Rieper, try not to worry too much. Yvonne’s young and strong, and she’s got a loving family behind her. Chances are she’ll grow out of it. If not, well, medical science is progressing in leaps and bounds.
Fast forward to, well, you know.
Pauline [from her diary]: My new years resolution is a far more selfish one than last year. It is to make my motto, eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow, you may be dead.
If you're not already, of course.
Pauline [from her diary]: Why could not mother die? Dozens of people are dying all the time, thousands, so why not mother? And father too.
The Antonio Salieri Syndrome, as some call it.
Pauline [from her diary]: We realised why Deborah and I have such extraordinary telepathy and why people treat us and look at us the way they do. It is because we are MAD. We are both stark raving MAD!
You know, a "condition".
Pauline [from her diary]: Our main idea for the day was to murder Mother. This notion is not a new one, but this time there is a definite plan which we plan to carry out.
And they do.
Pauline [from her diary]: The next time I write in this diary, Mother will be dead. How odd…yet how pleasing.
Can you say that?
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Ludwig Wittgenstein
Philosophy, as we use the word, is a fight against the fascination which forms of expression exert upon us.
Next up: philosophy as we ought to use the word instead.
If I wanted to eat an apple, and someone punched me in the stomach, taking away my appetite, then it was this punch that I originally wanted.
Then going all the way back to the Big Bang.
If we take eternity to mean not infinite temporal duration, but timelessness, then eternal life belongs to those who live in the present.
Nope, doesn't comfort me at all. How about you?
For philosophical problems arise when language goes on holiday.
Hmm, not unlike philosophical solutions.
More wisdom is contained in the best crime fiction than in philosophy.
That is until In Cold Blood.
As there is only a logical necessity, so there is only a logical
impossibility.
What do you say, a particular context?
Philosophy, as we use the word, is a fight against the fascination which forms of expression exert upon us.
Next up: philosophy as we ought to use the word instead.
If I wanted to eat an apple, and someone punched me in the stomach, taking away my appetite, then it was this punch that I originally wanted.
Then going all the way back to the Big Bang.
If we take eternity to mean not infinite temporal duration, but timelessness, then eternal life belongs to those who live in the present.
Nope, doesn't comfort me at all. How about you?
For philosophical problems arise when language goes on holiday.
Hmm, not unlike philosophical solutions.
More wisdom is contained in the best crime fiction than in philosophy.
That is until In Cold Blood.
As there is only a logical necessity, so there is only a logical
impossibility.
What do you say, a particular context?
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Here’s how the film begins: https://youtu.be/8aqXmiZ0zpQ?si=wglcAD6B1a1bxqcj
It still gives me goosebumps. Why? Well, it takes me back to the time when I was young and it felt so fucking exhilarating to dance the night away with friends. Working class friends who understood what dancing like this was really all about: being physical, being uninhibited, being down and dirty.
Here’s a film that explores this amidst folks who don’t really have a clue. If I do say so myself. And it’s about a time in American history when big, big changes were just over the horizon. Or had already swept across the land. And even though Hollywood is woven into every frame here there are still places where the turbulent reality of it all manages to sneak through.
Between all the stick figures anyway. And, yes, some of the dialogue is nothing short of excruciating. Along with a ton of the acting.
Although it is never explicitly spelled out in so many words, the medical procedure for which Penny needs Baby’s money is an illegal, back-alley abortion (the doctor is described as having only “a dirty knife and a folding table”). In 1963, when this movie is set, abortion was still illegal in the US (it would become legal in New York State up to the 24th week of pregnancy in 1970 and across the country in 1973 with the Roe v. Wade Supreme Court decision), and women seeking abortions either went to a country where they were legal or (much more commonly) went to an abortionist who was willing to perform the procedure in secret. Since abortion was illegal, it was medically unregulated and often performed by people who were not even actually doctors (some women even tried performing the procedure on themselves), and thousands of women every year were killed, maimed, or rendered sterile from septic or botched illegal abortions. IMDb
Back to the future?
Dirty Dancing
Baby [voiceover]: That was the summer of 1963 - when everybody called me Baby, and it didn’t occur to me to mind. That was before President Kennedy was shot, before the Beatles came, when I couldn’t wait to join the Peace Corps, and I thought I’d never find a guy as great as my dad. That was the summer we went to Kellerman’s.
Hell, one way or another, that's the summer we all went to Kellerman's.
Lisa: Mom, I should’ve brought the coral shoes. You said I was taking too much.
Mom: Well, sweetheart, you brought ten pairs.
Lisa: But the coral shoes matched that dress.
Dad: This is not a tragedy. A tragedy is three men trapped in a mine or police dogs used in Birmingham.
Baby: Monks burning themselves in protest.
The background noise as it were back then.
Baby [to Johnny]: I carried a watermelon.
Check it out. She did.
Baby [talking about Penny]: So what’s wrong? What’s the matter with her?
Billy: She’s knocked up, Baby.
Johnny: Billy!
Baby [eyeing Johnny]: What’s he gonna do about it?
Johnny [angrily]: What’s he gonna to do about it? Oh, it’s mine, right? Right away you think it’s mine.
I know that I did. But, of course, it wasn't. It was "the creep".
Penny: Go back to your playpen, Baby.
And take him with you.
Robbie [who impregnated Penny]: I didn’t blow a summer hauling toasted bagels just to bail out some little chick who probably balled every guy in the place. Some people count and some people don’t.
[he brings out a copy of Ayn Rand’s The Fountainhead from his pocket]
Robbie: Read it. I think it’s a book you’ll enjoy, but make sure you return it; I have notes in the margin.
Baby: You make me sick. Stay away from me, stay away from my sister or I’ll have you fired.
[she pours a jug of water on him]
Yep, that's the sound of Ayn Rand spinning in her grave.
Baby: Well, why did you let him talk to you that way?
Johnny: What do you mean, and fight the bossman?
Baby: Yeah, tell him your ideas! He’s a person like everyone else. I’m sure he’ll think they’re great.
Johnny: Look, I know these people, Baby. They’re all rich and they’re mean.
They still are, I'm guessing.
Lisa: I’ve been thinking a lot about the Domino Theory. Now, when Vietnam falls, is China next?
For one thing, the fucking irony!
Robbie [to Baby]: Looks like I picked the wrong sister. That’s okay, Baby. I went slummin’ too.
Next up: the near equivalent of that here.
Jake: Don’t you tell me what to see. I see someone in front of me who got his partner in trouble…and sent her off to some butcher while he moved on to an innocent, young girl like my daughter.
Johnny: Yeah, I guess that’s what you would see.
Mr. Law and order let's call him.
Max: You and me, Tito. We’ve seen it all, eh? Bubbah and Zeda serving the first pasteurized milk to the boarders. Through the war years when we didn’t have any meat. Through the Depression when we didn’t have anything.
Tito: Lots of changes, though, Max.
Max: It’s not the changes so much this time. It’s that it all seems to be ending. You think kids want to come with their parents and take fox-trot lessons? It’s all slipping away.
Next up: where's it's still sticking around.
Johnny: Nobody puts Baby in the corner.
Next up: they go after her nose.
It still gives me goosebumps. Why? Well, it takes me back to the time when I was young and it felt so fucking exhilarating to dance the night away with friends. Working class friends who understood what dancing like this was really all about: being physical, being uninhibited, being down and dirty.
Here’s a film that explores this amidst folks who don’t really have a clue. If I do say so myself. And it’s about a time in American history when big, big changes were just over the horizon. Or had already swept across the land. And even though Hollywood is woven into every frame here there are still places where the turbulent reality of it all manages to sneak through.
Between all the stick figures anyway. And, yes, some of the dialogue is nothing short of excruciating. Along with a ton of the acting.
Although it is never explicitly spelled out in so many words, the medical procedure for which Penny needs Baby’s money is an illegal, back-alley abortion (the doctor is described as having only “a dirty knife and a folding table”). In 1963, when this movie is set, abortion was still illegal in the US (it would become legal in New York State up to the 24th week of pregnancy in 1970 and across the country in 1973 with the Roe v. Wade Supreme Court decision), and women seeking abortions either went to a country where they were legal or (much more commonly) went to an abortionist who was willing to perform the procedure in secret. Since abortion was illegal, it was medically unregulated and often performed by people who were not even actually doctors (some women even tried performing the procedure on themselves), and thousands of women every year were killed, maimed, or rendered sterile from septic or botched illegal abortions. IMDb
Back to the future?
Dirty Dancing
Baby [voiceover]: That was the summer of 1963 - when everybody called me Baby, and it didn’t occur to me to mind. That was before President Kennedy was shot, before the Beatles came, when I couldn’t wait to join the Peace Corps, and I thought I’d never find a guy as great as my dad. That was the summer we went to Kellerman’s.
Hell, one way or another, that's the summer we all went to Kellerman's.
Lisa: Mom, I should’ve brought the coral shoes. You said I was taking too much.
Mom: Well, sweetheart, you brought ten pairs.
Lisa: But the coral shoes matched that dress.
Dad: This is not a tragedy. A tragedy is three men trapped in a mine or police dogs used in Birmingham.
Baby: Monks burning themselves in protest.
The background noise as it were back then.
Baby [to Johnny]: I carried a watermelon.
Check it out. She did.
Baby [talking about Penny]: So what’s wrong? What’s the matter with her?
Billy: She’s knocked up, Baby.
Johnny: Billy!
Baby [eyeing Johnny]: What’s he gonna do about it?
Johnny [angrily]: What’s he gonna to do about it? Oh, it’s mine, right? Right away you think it’s mine.
I know that I did. But, of course, it wasn't. It was "the creep".
Penny: Go back to your playpen, Baby.
And take him with you.
Robbie [who impregnated Penny]: I didn’t blow a summer hauling toasted bagels just to bail out some little chick who probably balled every guy in the place. Some people count and some people don’t.
[he brings out a copy of Ayn Rand’s The Fountainhead from his pocket]
Robbie: Read it. I think it’s a book you’ll enjoy, but make sure you return it; I have notes in the margin.
Baby: You make me sick. Stay away from me, stay away from my sister or I’ll have you fired.
[she pours a jug of water on him]
Yep, that's the sound of Ayn Rand spinning in her grave.
Baby: Well, why did you let him talk to you that way?
Johnny: What do you mean, and fight the bossman?
Baby: Yeah, tell him your ideas! He’s a person like everyone else. I’m sure he’ll think they’re great.
Johnny: Look, I know these people, Baby. They’re all rich and they’re mean.
They still are, I'm guessing.
Lisa: I’ve been thinking a lot about the Domino Theory. Now, when Vietnam falls, is China next?
For one thing, the fucking irony!
Robbie [to Baby]: Looks like I picked the wrong sister. That’s okay, Baby. I went slummin’ too.
Next up: the near equivalent of that here.
Jake: Don’t you tell me what to see. I see someone in front of me who got his partner in trouble…and sent her off to some butcher while he moved on to an innocent, young girl like my daughter.
Johnny: Yeah, I guess that’s what you would see.
Mr. Law and order let's call him.
Max: You and me, Tito. We’ve seen it all, eh? Bubbah and Zeda serving the first pasteurized milk to the boarders. Through the war years when we didn’t have any meat. Through the Depression when we didn’t have anything.
Tito: Lots of changes, though, Max.
Max: It’s not the changes so much this time. It’s that it all seems to be ending. You think kids want to come with their parents and take fox-trot lessons? It’s all slipping away.
Next up: where's it's still sticking around.
Johnny: Nobody puts Baby in the corner.
Next up: they go after her nose.
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Science
“Science is the great antidote to the poison of enthusiasm and superstition.” Adam Smith
As often as not, let's wager.
“Philosophy [nature] is written in that great book which ever is before our eyes -- I mean the universe -- but we cannot understand it if we do not first learn the language and grasp the symbols in which it is written. The book is written in mathematical language, and the symbols are triangles, circles and other geometrical figures, without whose help it is impossible to comprehend a single word of it; without which one wanders in vain through a dark labyrinth.” Galileo
Rough translation for some: Praise the Lord!
“It is harder to crack prejudice than an atom.” Albert Einstein
Some here still ain't cracked!
“I want to put on the table, not why 85% of the members of the National Academy of Sciences reject God, I want to know why 15% of the National Academy don’t.” Neil deGrasse Tyson
Want me to explain that again for you?
“Miracles are not contrary to nature but only contrary to what we know about nature.” St. Augustine
No getting around that, right?
“Life is and will ever remain an equation incapable of solution, but it contains certain known factors.” Nikola Tesla
The fool!
After all, you've already solved it, right?
“Science is the great antidote to the poison of enthusiasm and superstition.” Adam Smith
As often as not, let's wager.
“Philosophy [nature] is written in that great book which ever is before our eyes -- I mean the universe -- but we cannot understand it if we do not first learn the language and grasp the symbols in which it is written. The book is written in mathematical language, and the symbols are triangles, circles and other geometrical figures, without whose help it is impossible to comprehend a single word of it; without which one wanders in vain through a dark labyrinth.” Galileo
Rough translation for some: Praise the Lord!
“It is harder to crack prejudice than an atom.” Albert Einstein
Some here still ain't cracked!
“I want to put on the table, not why 85% of the members of the National Academy of Sciences reject God, I want to know why 15% of the National Academy don’t.” Neil deGrasse Tyson
Want me to explain that again for you?
“Miracles are not contrary to nature but only contrary to what we know about nature.” St. Augustine
No getting around that, right?
“Life is and will ever remain an equation incapable of solution, but it contains certain known factors.” Nikola Tesla
The fool!
After all, you've already solved it, right?
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
This was Lebanon "back then". What's unfolding there now however may well precipitate World War III. And if that happens, we're all "under the bombs" aren't we?
Collateral damage? Well, they didn’t mean to inflict it. It was their intention to only go after the bad guys. It’s just the sort of tragedy that is inherent in war.
The pain and suffering are everywhere. Especially the children. The destruction is unbelievable. It’s everywhere too. It enrages you but who exactly should it be directed at? And even if you find the right target what exactly can you do about it?
The rest is politics. And religious bullshit. And those who profit from war.
How then is one to react to a single story embedded in it all?
He’s a Christian who drives a cab and she’s a Shiite Muslim desparate to go South. She’s trying to locate her son in the middle of hell. For $300 dollars he’ll take her there.
The paradox is always the same for some. They know that God is the rationale for the war. But then God is all they have to fall back on when the war ravages them. The one truly bizarre facet here is that it’s the same fucking God!
The man playing Tony and the woman playing Zenia were the only professional actors used in the film. All the rest were the actual people involved in the war.
Under the Bombs
Title card: August 2006. For 33 days Lebanon has suffered heavy Israeli airstrikes. On the 34th day, a cease fire was declared, controlled by the UN. Lebanon was in ruins. There were 1,189 dead and almost a million refugees.
Uh, start here?
https://youtu.be/zE8GCX1w3ys?si=Q7et0JAV01lcFbQl
Tony [to Zeina]: Do you have any idea what it is like in the South?
Next up: in the North, the East and the West.
Refugee: No one can help you. You can even forget your own children.
Refugee Mother: I left mine behind to get into a van. There were 15 of us. I took two kids and left the others in a garage.
Zenia: You left them behind?
Refugee Mother: Yes! When we went back to the village, they were all dead. Under the rubble we found my husband, his brother, his wife and four children. My cousin, shot down outside—11 people.
Refugee: That’s life. That’s what Israel wants. They were aiming at people–women, children, anywhere with civilians. My cousin—they blew her up on the doorstep.
Uh, the more things change?
Zenia [outside her sister’s home bombed to rubble]: Maha! Karim! Dear Lord, tell me they weren’t inside!
Muslim woman: Who are you looking for?
Zenia: I’m Maha’s sister.
Muslim woman: Her sister?
Zenia: Yes. Was she inside? Answer me. Was she inside?
Muslim woman: You have to be strong. Your sister’s a martyr. She is in Paradise. Don’t be afraid. Don’t cry.
Zenia: In Paradise?
Muslim woman: Don’t cry. Be proud of her
But her son is still alive. God is merciful. Unless, of course, He’s not.
Sign on a wall: YOU’VE DESTROYED THE BRIDGES. WE HAVE MENDED THEIR HEARTS. HEZBOLLAH.
Sign on the wall today: YOU TELL ME.
Zenia [to Tony]: My son is lost. All this this terror, these bombs—the madness of some. It doesn’t matter. We must search. Many have died. It doesn’t matter. Everything can wait. We must search. My son is lost. What did he do wrong? We have to fight back. It’s not important. First we must search. Then we’ll resist. Have I been a good mother? It’s not important. I don’t care. America, Israel, the Hezbollah, Syria or Iran. I don’t care. I don’t care about religion. My son is lost. The ruins, the bombs, your help. I don’t give a damn. My son is lost. I must find him.
Whatever works.
Tony’s friend #1: They’ve bombed everything the bastards. Even the Christian villages. To them we’re all Arabs.
Tony’s friend #2: You can say what you like. Elie did join his brothers in Israel.
Tony: Whatever the reason we mustn’t go there. They have to return. It’s their land! I don’t understand. These bastards bomb you, destroy your houses and bridges, take your children, send you to prison, and you—you work for them?!
Tony’s friend #1: When your life is at stake you deal with the devil if you have to. That’s what happens.
Tony’s friend #3: That’s right. We know the song. We’ve been through it enough times. But what can we do?
Pick three:
1] options
2] options
3] options
Tony [to boy]: Karim?
[the boy shakes his head]
Tony: Tarek?
Boy: They are all dead.
Zenia: This isn’t your jacket.
Boy: It’s Karim’s.
Zenia: Why are you wearing it?
Boy: My mother was under the rubble. I took my shirt off to cover her face. When he saw me, he gave me his jacket.
Zenia: Where is Karim?
Boy: He stayed under the bombs.
Would you?
Title card: Under the bombs, most were crushed to death. It is for them that this film is made. To tell the suffering of the innocent.
That still going on today?
Collateral damage? Well, they didn’t mean to inflict it. It was their intention to only go after the bad guys. It’s just the sort of tragedy that is inherent in war.
The pain and suffering are everywhere. Especially the children. The destruction is unbelievable. It’s everywhere too. It enrages you but who exactly should it be directed at? And even if you find the right target what exactly can you do about it?
The rest is politics. And religious bullshit. And those who profit from war.
How then is one to react to a single story embedded in it all?
He’s a Christian who drives a cab and she’s a Shiite Muslim desparate to go South. She’s trying to locate her son in the middle of hell. For $300 dollars he’ll take her there.
The paradox is always the same for some. They know that God is the rationale for the war. But then God is all they have to fall back on when the war ravages them. The one truly bizarre facet here is that it’s the same fucking God!
The man playing Tony and the woman playing Zenia were the only professional actors used in the film. All the rest were the actual people involved in the war.
Under the Bombs
Title card: August 2006. For 33 days Lebanon has suffered heavy Israeli airstrikes. On the 34th day, a cease fire was declared, controlled by the UN. Lebanon was in ruins. There were 1,189 dead and almost a million refugees.
Uh, start here?
https://youtu.be/zE8GCX1w3ys?si=Q7et0JAV01lcFbQl
Tony [to Zeina]: Do you have any idea what it is like in the South?
Next up: in the North, the East and the West.
Refugee: No one can help you. You can even forget your own children.
Refugee Mother: I left mine behind to get into a van. There were 15 of us. I took two kids and left the others in a garage.
Zenia: You left them behind?
Refugee Mother: Yes! When we went back to the village, they were all dead. Under the rubble we found my husband, his brother, his wife and four children. My cousin, shot down outside—11 people.
Refugee: That’s life. That’s what Israel wants. They were aiming at people–women, children, anywhere with civilians. My cousin—they blew her up on the doorstep.
Uh, the more things change?
Zenia [outside her sister’s home bombed to rubble]: Maha! Karim! Dear Lord, tell me they weren’t inside!
Muslim woman: Who are you looking for?
Zenia: I’m Maha’s sister.
Muslim woman: Her sister?
Zenia: Yes. Was she inside? Answer me. Was she inside?
Muslim woman: You have to be strong. Your sister’s a martyr. She is in Paradise. Don’t be afraid. Don’t cry.
Zenia: In Paradise?
Muslim woman: Don’t cry. Be proud of her
But her son is still alive. God is merciful. Unless, of course, He’s not.
Sign on a wall: YOU’VE DESTROYED THE BRIDGES. WE HAVE MENDED THEIR HEARTS. HEZBOLLAH.
Sign on the wall today: YOU TELL ME.
Zenia [to Tony]: My son is lost. All this this terror, these bombs—the madness of some. It doesn’t matter. We must search. Many have died. It doesn’t matter. Everything can wait. We must search. My son is lost. What did he do wrong? We have to fight back. It’s not important. First we must search. Then we’ll resist. Have I been a good mother? It’s not important. I don’t care. America, Israel, the Hezbollah, Syria or Iran. I don’t care. I don’t care about religion. My son is lost. The ruins, the bombs, your help. I don’t give a damn. My son is lost. I must find him.
Whatever works.
Tony’s friend #1: They’ve bombed everything the bastards. Even the Christian villages. To them we’re all Arabs.
Tony’s friend #2: You can say what you like. Elie did join his brothers in Israel.
Tony: Whatever the reason we mustn’t go there. They have to return. It’s their land! I don’t understand. These bastards bomb you, destroy your houses and bridges, take your children, send you to prison, and you—you work for them?!
Tony’s friend #1: When your life is at stake you deal with the devil if you have to. That’s what happens.
Tony’s friend #3: That’s right. We know the song. We’ve been through it enough times. But what can we do?
Pick three:
1] options
2] options
3] options
Tony [to boy]: Karim?
[the boy shakes his head]
Tony: Tarek?
Boy: They are all dead.
Zenia: This isn’t your jacket.
Boy: It’s Karim’s.
Zenia: Why are you wearing it?
Boy: My mother was under the rubble. I took my shirt off to cover her face. When he saw me, he gave me his jacket.
Zenia: Where is Karim?
Boy: He stayed under the bombs.
Would you?
Title card: Under the bombs, most were crushed to death. It is for them that this film is made. To tell the suffering of the innocent.
That still going on today?
- iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Soldiers have been coming home from wars now for…forever. I came home from the same one Luke did. But with my legs still intact. On the other hand, I had a close friend come home from it with neither his legs nor his arms intact. And then he committed suicide.
And here I am now bascially arguing that it is futile [philosophically or otherwise] to try to pin down whether it was “worth it” or not. That’s embodied in dasein and in politics. But there will always be folks who profit from war. And it is almost always the case that those who clamor for it the loudest are often the ones who never really come close to actually fighting it.
And then there’s the part about the VA facilities…the part after the war. I use them now myself. But I’m no where near as dependant upon it as these guys are.
And it’s heartbreaking to see what they have to go through just to make it to the next day. And it’s hard to decide which are worse off: those fucked up from the neck down or from the neck up.
Vietnam: What a fuckimg waste of lives. And what a bunch of fucking lies.
Sylvester Stallone, Jack Nicholson and Al Pacino declined the role that went to Jon Voight.
Jon Voight’s role of Luke Martin was loosely inspired by paralyzed Vietnam veteran Ron Kovic, who was making inroads in Hollywood with his book “Born on the Fourth of July” at the time. Of course, Kovic’s book and story was in 1989 put on the screen with Tom Cruise in the role of Kovic.
The opening scene where the vets in the hospital are talking was totally unscripted. They were real Vietnam vets discussing their own views about the war. Jon Voight was supposed to have added to the dialog, but out of respect stayed silent and listened.
One of the first films even partially dealing openly with the idea of sex between an able-bodied person and a disabled one. Other films dealing with disability and romance had indirectly implied it or avoided it altogether (such as in “The Best Years of Our Lives”. IMDb
Coming Home
Luke [after his arms are removed from the restraints]: Pew Wee, I can crawl again.
On the other hand, not very far.
Sally [to the wives of military officers]: There’s not enough beds, there’s not enough staff. It’s really crowded. They’re just not prepared for the number of wounded guys that are being sent back.
Woman: I don’t think we’re really clear on what you’re asking us for, Sally.
Sally: Well, it’s what I said. We could do an article in the paper…maybe using some of these photographs, interviewing some of the guys maybe.
Woman: Isn’t it difficult for the men to be around young women? When I joined Weight Watchers, I didn’t want any candy around.
Woman: I don’t think that is our function. It seems we’re more a base gossip sheet. You know, fun and games for the fellas.
[the ladies move on to other aggendas like little league games]
Sally: I just want to say that I am really shocked. I’m shocked that you’d rather write about a goddamn home run than about what’s going on in this hospital. I mean, you wouldn’t feel that way if they were your husbands.
Uh, let's not go there. Just for now.
Luke: Kevin? I thought you died Wednesday.
Not to be confused with wishing that you had.
Luke: You know, I spend 95% of the time at the hospital thinking of making love with you.
Hanoi Jane no less.
Bob: It’s not you. It’s just all fucked up. I can’t get all this bullshit about 'Nam out of my head.
Sally: Well why don’t you talk to me about it. I want to know what it’s like.
Bob: I don’t know what it’s like. I only know what it is. A TV show is what it’s like. They sure as hell don’t show what it is.
Next up: what it was.
Bob [to Sally]: Is that the way you massage the basket cases in the hospital?
Fuck you, Bob.
Luke: [being interviewed by a television news crew after chaining himself to a Marines Recruitment Facility] The reason why I’m here is because a buddy of mine who’d been in 'Nam took his own life today. This is kind of a funeral service. And I’m here because I’m trying to tell people, man, if we want to commit suicide, we have plenty of reasons to do it right here at home. We don’t have to go to Vietnam to find reasons to kill ourselves. I just don’t think we should be over there.
I won't go there if you don't mind.
Sally: Can you feel that?
Luke: I can’t feel it but I can see it.
Then those who can't see it but never fail to feel it.
Marine Recruiter: The Marine Corps builds body, mind and spirit. Thank you.
High School Class Pres.: And now, with a different perspective, we have Luke Martin, combat veteran of the Marine Corps.
Luke: Sergeant, do you mind if I ask you a question?
Marine Recruiter: No, sir.
Luke: Just call me Sergeant. That’s what I was. Where were you stationed?
Marine Recruiter: Danang.
Luke [his speech is spliced with final scene of Bob at the beach] You know, you want to be a part of it, patriotic, go out and get your licks in for the U.S. of A. And when you get over there, it’s a totally different situation. I mean, you grow up real quick. Because all you’re seeing is, um, a lot of death…And I know some of you guys are going to look at the uniformed man and you’re going to remember all the films and you’re going to think about the glory of other wars and think about some vague patriotic feeling and go off and fight this turkey too. And I’m telling you it ain’t like it’s in the movies. That’s all I want to tell you, because I didn’t have a choice. When I was your age, all I got was some guy standing up like that, man, giving me a lot of bullshit, man, which I caught. I was really in good shape then, man. I was captain of the football team. And I wanted to be a war hero, man, I wanted to go out and kill for my country. And now, I’m here to tell you that I have killed for my country or whatever…And I don’t feel good about it. Because there’s not enough reason, man, to feel a person die in your hands or to see your best buddy get blown away. I’m here to tell you, it’s a lousy thing, man. I don’t see any reason for it. And there’s a lot of shit that I did over there that I find fucking hard to live with. And I don’t want to see people like you, man, coming back and having to face the rest of your lives with that kind of shit. It’s as simple as that. I don’t feel sorry for myself. I’m a lot fucking smarter now than when I went. And I’m just telling you that there’s a choice to be made here.
And the band played Waltzing Matilda : https://youtu.be/uEMcLcGJ79s?si=APB4rLBjZm7sC_3l
And here I am now bascially arguing that it is futile [philosophically or otherwise] to try to pin down whether it was “worth it” or not. That’s embodied in dasein and in politics. But there will always be folks who profit from war. And it is almost always the case that those who clamor for it the loudest are often the ones who never really come close to actually fighting it.
And then there’s the part about the VA facilities…the part after the war. I use them now myself. But I’m no where near as dependant upon it as these guys are.
And it’s heartbreaking to see what they have to go through just to make it to the next day. And it’s hard to decide which are worse off: those fucked up from the neck down or from the neck up.
Vietnam: What a fuckimg waste of lives. And what a bunch of fucking lies.
Sylvester Stallone, Jack Nicholson and Al Pacino declined the role that went to Jon Voight.
Jon Voight’s role of Luke Martin was loosely inspired by paralyzed Vietnam veteran Ron Kovic, who was making inroads in Hollywood with his book “Born on the Fourth of July” at the time. Of course, Kovic’s book and story was in 1989 put on the screen with Tom Cruise in the role of Kovic.
The opening scene where the vets in the hospital are talking was totally unscripted. They were real Vietnam vets discussing their own views about the war. Jon Voight was supposed to have added to the dialog, but out of respect stayed silent and listened.
One of the first films even partially dealing openly with the idea of sex between an able-bodied person and a disabled one. Other films dealing with disability and romance had indirectly implied it or avoided it altogether (such as in “The Best Years of Our Lives”. IMDb
Coming Home
Luke [after his arms are removed from the restraints]: Pew Wee, I can crawl again.
On the other hand, not very far.
Sally [to the wives of military officers]: There’s not enough beds, there’s not enough staff. It’s really crowded. They’re just not prepared for the number of wounded guys that are being sent back.
Woman: I don’t think we’re really clear on what you’re asking us for, Sally.
Sally: Well, it’s what I said. We could do an article in the paper…maybe using some of these photographs, interviewing some of the guys maybe.
Woman: Isn’t it difficult for the men to be around young women? When I joined Weight Watchers, I didn’t want any candy around.
Woman: I don’t think that is our function. It seems we’re more a base gossip sheet. You know, fun and games for the fellas.
[the ladies move on to other aggendas like little league games]
Sally: I just want to say that I am really shocked. I’m shocked that you’d rather write about a goddamn home run than about what’s going on in this hospital. I mean, you wouldn’t feel that way if they were your husbands.
Uh, let's not go there. Just for now.
Luke: Kevin? I thought you died Wednesday.
Not to be confused with wishing that you had.
Luke: You know, I spend 95% of the time at the hospital thinking of making love with you.
Hanoi Jane no less.
Bob: It’s not you. It’s just all fucked up. I can’t get all this bullshit about 'Nam out of my head.
Sally: Well why don’t you talk to me about it. I want to know what it’s like.
Bob: I don’t know what it’s like. I only know what it is. A TV show is what it’s like. They sure as hell don’t show what it is.
Next up: what it was.
Bob [to Sally]: Is that the way you massage the basket cases in the hospital?
Fuck you, Bob.
Luke: [being interviewed by a television news crew after chaining himself to a Marines Recruitment Facility] The reason why I’m here is because a buddy of mine who’d been in 'Nam took his own life today. This is kind of a funeral service. And I’m here because I’m trying to tell people, man, if we want to commit suicide, we have plenty of reasons to do it right here at home. We don’t have to go to Vietnam to find reasons to kill ourselves. I just don’t think we should be over there.
I won't go there if you don't mind.
Sally: Can you feel that?
Luke: I can’t feel it but I can see it.
Then those who can't see it but never fail to feel it.
Marine Recruiter: The Marine Corps builds body, mind and spirit. Thank you.
High School Class Pres.: And now, with a different perspective, we have Luke Martin, combat veteran of the Marine Corps.
Luke: Sergeant, do you mind if I ask you a question?
Marine Recruiter: No, sir.
Luke: Just call me Sergeant. That’s what I was. Where were you stationed?
Marine Recruiter: Danang.
Luke [his speech is spliced with final scene of Bob at the beach] You know, you want to be a part of it, patriotic, go out and get your licks in for the U.S. of A. And when you get over there, it’s a totally different situation. I mean, you grow up real quick. Because all you’re seeing is, um, a lot of death…And I know some of you guys are going to look at the uniformed man and you’re going to remember all the films and you’re going to think about the glory of other wars and think about some vague patriotic feeling and go off and fight this turkey too. And I’m telling you it ain’t like it’s in the movies. That’s all I want to tell you, because I didn’t have a choice. When I was your age, all I got was some guy standing up like that, man, giving me a lot of bullshit, man, which I caught. I was really in good shape then, man. I was captain of the football team. And I wanted to be a war hero, man, I wanted to go out and kill for my country. And now, I’m here to tell you that I have killed for my country or whatever…And I don’t feel good about it. Because there’s not enough reason, man, to feel a person die in your hands or to see your best buddy get blown away. I’m here to tell you, it’s a lousy thing, man. I don’t see any reason for it. And there’s a lot of shit that I did over there that I find fucking hard to live with. And I don’t want to see people like you, man, coming back and having to face the rest of your lives with that kind of shit. It’s as simple as that. I don’t feel sorry for myself. I’m a lot fucking smarter now than when I went. And I’m just telling you that there’s a choice to be made here.
And the band played Waltzing Matilda : https://youtu.be/uEMcLcGJ79s?si=APB4rLBjZm7sC_3l