What if all troubles are works of Satan?

[bahman]

Again (explained this last year), if god designed the universe to work a certain way, there is nothing the universe can or will do that he doesn't know in advance.

If he's unable to know in advance what his own creation will do, there is something above and beyond god that is controlling shit.

Options are real dude. So the universe does not always behave in a deterministic way.

[promethean75]

The invention of god by the ruling classes was a great idea (for them), but they blundered it when they introduced him as 'all powerful' (the omnis). Much later, skeptic philosophers started probing the idea and as it began to fall apart, the scholastics (ruling class yes-men) came along and tried to defend the idea by playing logical tricks and language games.

[bahman]

The invention of god by the ruling classes was a great idea (for them), but they blundered it when they introduced him as 'all powerful' (the omnis). Much later, skeptic philosophers started probing the idea and as it began to fall apart, the scholastics (ruling class yes-men) came along and tried to defend the idea by playing logical tricks and language games.

Maybe it is not your time now to witness God. You can wait for it but you cannot avoid it!

[attofishpi]

I believe in the highest Mind/God who is Omnipresent (in all universes so-called multiverse), Omniscient, Omnipotent, and Just (delivers Evil and Good in the right proportion). I believe in lower Selves/All-Creatures-You-can-possibly-imagine who each is Omnipresent in a universe. We are not Omniscient, Omnipotent, and Just though.

Ok. I agree with that, but I don't agree that God is omniscient to the point of knowing ALL of the future. If God wishes a future event to occur however, then it certainly can acheive that - per omnipotent.

We are on the same page then!

So you don't believe in Jesus Christ?

I believe in Jesus. Whether He is the Christ or not? I am not sure. We have to wait for the second coming!

Forget the second coming. If you want to get on track and overcome the nonsense within the buy bull, my recomendation is comprehend Jesus was the Christ.

TBH - I believe Christ likely plays pool in California where my sage lives in a penthouse somewhere! The funny thing is, it's been a wish of mine for some time to play pool against Jesus (who might be called Barry or Frank or woteva these days) and when I first was hoping for that, I jumped into my van to go to the shops and on AM radio the hosts of whatever radio show stated "Jesus pots the white ball" - which I found hilarious, because that had been on my mind as to whether you could ever beat him - thus apparently he doesn't cheat!

[promethean75]

"If I write a computer program I may know most of what is going to happen, but if I set the wheels in motion with such complexity then what follows can become far from determinable."

Indeed, becuz u didn't design the world your compooter is a part of, and therefore could not know or predict how the world and its effects might influence the compooter.

Try again, mate.

[bahman]

Ok. I agree with that, but I don't agree that God is omniscient to the point of knowing ALL of the future. If God wishes a future event to occur however, then it certainly can acheive that - per omnipotent.

We are on the same page then!

So you don't believe in Jesus Christ?

I believe in Jesus. Whether He is the Christ or not? I am not sure. We have to wait for the second coming!

Forget the second coming. If you want to get on track and overcome the nonsense within the buy bull, my recomendation is comprehend Jesus was the Christ.

I don't think so! If Jesus is Christ then He has to come back at the end of time and make Judgment on each individual!

TBH - I believe Christ likely plays pool in California where my sage lives in a penthouse somewhere! The funny thing is, it's been a wish of mine for some time to play pool against Jesus (who might be called Barry or Frank or woteva these days) and when I first was hoping for that, I jumped into my van to go to the shops and on AM radio the hosts of whatever radio show stated "Jesus pots the white ball" - which I found hilarious, because that had been on my mind as to whether you could ever beat him - thus apparently he doesn't cheat!

If you say so...!

[attofishpi]

"If I write a computer program I may know most of what is going to happen, but if I set the wheels in motion with such complexity then what follows can become far from determinable."

Indeed, becuz u didn't design the world your compooter is a part of, and therefore could not know or predict how the world and its effects might influence the compooter.

Try again, mate.

How ridiculous. TBH I am not certain or particularly care whether or not God created the universe.

So I build the hardware, write an extremely complex bunch of s/w algorithms that interact with each other through time - doesn't mean I can determine everything of the future of the machine.

[attofishpi]

We are on the same page then!


I believe in Jesus. Whether He is the Christ or not? I am not sure. We have to wait for the second coming!

Forget the second coming. If you want to get on track and overcome the nonsense within the buy bull, my recomendation is comprehend Jesus was the Christ.

I don't think so! If Jesus is Christ then He has to come back at the end of time and make Judgment on each individual!

Don't be daft. Yeah, like a man (Christ) is going to go through judging 7 billion humans and throw lots of them into some furnace. FFS

[bahman]

Forget the second coming. If you want to get on track and overcome the nonsense within the buy bull, my recomendation is comprehend Jesus was the Christ.

I don't think so! If Jesus is Christ then He has to come back at the end of time and make Judgment on each individual!

Don't be daft. Yeah, like a man (Christ) is going to go through judging 7 billion humans and throw lots of them into some furnace. FFS

That is what He promised. Like it or not!

[attofishpi]

I don't think so! If Jesus is Christ then He has to come back at the end of time and make Judgment on each individual!

Don't be daft. Yeah, like a man (Christ) is going to go through judging 7 billion humans and throw lots of them into some furnace. FFS

That is what He promised. Like it or not!

So you are daft. You take everything within a book that God in "his" omnipotence allowed the title of which to be phonetically be identical to "buy bull"..literally.

So God spoke the universe into existence did "HE"?

[bahman]

Don't be daft. Yeah, like a man (Christ) is going to go through judging 7 billion humans and throw lots of them into some furnace. FFS

That is what He promised. Like it or not!

So you are daft. You take everything within a book that God in "his" omnipotence allowed the title of which to be phonetically be identical to "buy bull"..literally.

What else do you think the verses about the end of time mean?

So God spoke the universe into existence did "HE"?

It depends on what you mean by the universe!

[attofishpi]

That is what He promised. Like it or not!

So you are daft. You take everything within a book that God in "his" omnipotence allowed the title of which to be phonetically be identical to "buy bull"..literally.

What else do you think the verses about the end of time mean?

buy bull bollocks.

(entropy would be the end of time eventually)

So God spoke the universe into existence did "HE"?

It depends on what you mean by the universe!

Well, let's take the providing of light upon Earth, do you believe that God spoke the light from the Sun into existence?

[bahman]

So you are daft. You take everything within a book that God in "his" omnipotence allowed the title of which to be phonetically be identical to "buy bull"..literally.

What else do you think the verses about the end of time mean?

buy bull bollocks.

(entropy would be the end of time eventually)

Do you believe that God cannot control the entropy?

So God spoke the universe into existence did "HE"?

It depends on what you mean by the universe!

Well, let's take the providing of light upon Earth, do you believe that God spoke the light from the Sun into existence?

I don't think so. We know well that the Sun formed from dust, mainly Hydrogen and Helium. All planets including Earth formed from Heavier elements like Iron and the like.

[attofishpi]

What else do you think the verses about the end of time mean?

buy bull bollocks.

(entropy would be the end of time eventually)

Do you believe that God cannot control the entropy?

Dunno.

It depends on what you mean by the universe!

Well, let's take the providing of light upon Earth, do you believe that God spoke the light from the Sun into existence?

I don't think so. We know well that the Sun formed from dust, mainly Hydrogen and Helium. All planets including Earth formed from Heavier elements like Iron and the like.

So you don't believe God spoke the Sun into existence, but you do believe that Christ would return to Earth and manage to judge 7 billion people individually and throw the naughty ones into a furnace?

[bahman]

buy bull bollocks.

(entropy would be the end of time eventually)

Do you believe that God cannot control the entropy?

Dunno.

I know. Anything that can be destroyed can be created. Therefore, God could control the entropy.

Well, let's take the providing of light upon Earth, do you believe that God spoke the light from the Sun into existence?

I don't think so. We know well that the Sun formed from dust, mainly Hydrogen and Helium. All planets including Earth formed from Heavier elements like Iron and the like.

So you don't believe God spoke the Sun into existence, but you do believe that Christ would return to Earth and manage to judge 7 billion people individually and throw the naughty ones into a furnace?

I said this before. I don't know whether Jesus is Christ or not.