Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Should you think about your duty, or about the consequences of your actions? Or should you concentrate on becoming a good person?

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henry quirk
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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Will Bouwman wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:17 amWhy not?
If man has nuthin' extra, then he's just meat, and if he's just meat, then he's no person, and if he's no person, then he's nuthin'.

The universe is nothing but particles. All those particles follow laws of motion. They aren’t free. The brain is made up entirely of those same particles. Therefore, there is nothing in the brain that would give us freedom. These particles also don’t understand anything, they don’t make sense of anything, they don’t grasp the meaning of anything. Since the brain, again, is made up of those particles, it has no power to allow us to grasp meaning or understand anything. But we do understand. We do grasp meaning. Therefore, we are talking about qualities we possess which are not made out of energy. These qualities are entirely non-material. - a very dead Albert Einstein, by way of my fellow whackadoodle, Jon Rappoport
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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Immanuel Can wrote: Sun Jul 28, 2024 10:34 pmGiven Physicalism, there is actually no "opinion,"...
How would the sensation of having an opinion, the phenomenon, be different given dualism?
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 10:33 am
I demand better insults. You've known Mannie & me for a long time. We both deserve better of your worst.
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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henry quirk wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:42 pm
Will Bouwman wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:17 amWhy not?
If man has nuthin' extra, then he's just meat...
Is that not a possibility?
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henry quirk
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by henry quirk »

Will Bouwman wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:45 pmIs that not a possibility?
What do you think?
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bahman
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by bahman »

Will Bouwman wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:45 pm
henry quirk wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:42 pm
Will Bouwman wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:17 amWhy not?
If man has nuthin' extra, then he's just meat...
Is that not a possibility?
Each man has a self.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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Will Bouwman wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:44 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Sun Jul 28, 2024 10:34 pmGiven Physicalism, there is actually no "opinion,"...
How would the sensation of having an opinion, the phenomenon, be different given dualism?
Well, if Physicalism were true, "the sensation" might be different, or might be the same. We'd never know. The difference is that, sensation or not, the sensation would not be a signal that anything genuine or causal was taking place. It could be we'd "feel" we were making a decision or choice or holding an opinion, but really, all we were doing is responding to brain chemicals accidentally remixing, or just dancing to the accidental arrangments of our DNA.

But here's an even more interesting question that raises for the Physicalist: if Physicalism were true, how is that we even have a "sensation" of making a choice or having an opinion, since no such things exist in reality? :shock: What purely-physical mechanism has produced this delusion, through what kind of causal process, and (though we really cannot ask this question) why? :shock: What physical chain has "required" that we must believe something completely contrary to facts, and completely divorced from how reality actually operates -- if Physicalism were true?

Those are not easy questions for a Physicalist to handle, I think. He'd have to say we're simply totally wrong in the "sensation" we're having -- but proposing why, or how that's come about, or why we're more realistic to think the deep truth about what's at work is completely contrary to every such intuition and normal practice we have had for thousands of years...somehow, we've survived without the faintest suspicion that something as fundamental to all reality (as Physicalism is supposed to be) is even true. Believing in choice, identity, mind, opinion and so forth seem to be serving us very, very well...Physicalism looks to be no more than a speculative theoretical conceit, by comparison.

So Physicalism has some serious work to do, if it's going to overcome such questions. Unfortunately, when we finally believe in Physicalism (if we ever do) it will have to be only because our physical pre-causes have lined up for that...not because "we" are "knowing" that Physicalism is "true." :shock:
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by FlashDangerpants »

henry quirk wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:44 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 10:33 am
I demand better insults. You've known Mannie & me for a long time. We both deserve better of your worst.
Willy B is testing your boy, and Mannie is failing, this is an observation not an insult. You failing in the same way is neither here nor there because you don't pose as a man with a philosophical education the way Mannie does. Sadly, he has about the same education in philosophy that you do.

None of that is written specifically as an insult, it's clearly just the plain truth, and it comes into play because Mannie likes to pose as some professor in a field he doesn't even have a basic level of competence in.
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:22 pm
Go to jail. Go directly to jail. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.

Consolation prize: 🍪
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Immanuel Can
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by Immanuel Can »

henry quirk wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 5:44 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 10:33 am
I demand better insults. You've known Mannie & me for a long time. We both deserve better of your worst.
Without Flash's approval, I don't know if I can go on, Henry...I fear I shall faint.
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by FlashDangerpants »

henry quirk wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:35 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:22 pm
Go to jail. Go directly to jail. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.

Consolation prize: 🍪
Are you being all dramatic with your ignore list again?
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henry quirk
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

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Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:44 pmWithout Flash's approval, I don't know if I can go on, Henry...I fear I shall faint.
Yes, I'm beside myself! We are not approved of by...

⚡️Flash, Savior of the Universe⚡️
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henry quirk
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by henry quirk »

FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:46 pmAre you being all dramatic with your ignore list again?
I'm still talkin' at ya, aren't I?
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by FlashDangerpants »

henry quirk wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:57 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 6:46 pmAre you being all dramatic with your ignore list again?
I'm still talkin' at ya, aren't I?
Erm, ok. Well you guys keep doing your weird thing together then. In the meantime, idealism, physicalism, and dualism are all putative explanations for how the world is and how it presents itself to us, and so the way in which the world presents itself to us counts as prima facie evidence for each of them equally I just gave you two bozos the answer to the test, as if you are smart enough to let that happen.
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Re: Abortion is Not Permissible, Period!

Post by henry quirk »

FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Jul 29, 2024 7:00 pmas if you are smart enough to let that happen
9 out of 10 metaphysicians agree: Henry Quirk is not smart enough.
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