You don’t come across many true stories stranger than this one. Not in this sport. Is it all in the genes? Or mostly in the genes? Or is part of it buried in experiences some have at a very early age.
Nong Toom is thought to be a kathoey in Thailand. A ladyboy. This, in other words:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathoey
But he [now she] is more a sao praphet song.
I have absolutely no interest whatsoever in these manly arts myself. But I do know a fascinating story when I see one. And what balls this guy had to step into the ring like that. But then he becomes a celebrity. Shades of Ziggy Stardust.
And there is the thrill of victory.
Beautiful Boxer
Jack [interviewer]: When did you first realize you wanted to be a woman? When did it all start?
And back in time we go…
Friend: Come to the temple fair with me, tonight.
Toom: I don’t like watching kickboxing. How could men just beat each other up like that? So painful…
Friend: For the prize money. If you win, you’ll get 500 baht!
Spot the irony yet?
Mother: Toom, don’t go and fight with people again. You could get hurt. And it’s not your kind of thing.
Toom: I know. But I felt good today.
Mother: To be punched and kicked at?
Toom: No, Ma, to be able to protect myself.
There is that part. For those who try to fuck with a professional boxer.
Toom: Pi Bua, I don’t belong here. I’ll never be good at kickboxing. And Thai boxing is nothing but violence.
Hardly ladylike behavior, is it?
Toom [to Jack]: It seemed the more makeup I put on the harder my opponents kicked me. So I kicked back harder still.
Go, girl!.
Toom [to Jack]: The crowd loved it when I kissed my defeated opponent. Especially the reporters. But they don’t know that I kiss to say, “I’m sorry, I don’t like to hurt strangers”. But in the ring, you have no choice.
Wow. Like being in the ring here.
Tam [to Noom]: Don’t you realize everyone thinks you’re a clown? They’re all laughing at you? Don’t you know that?!
Still, a bath is a bath.
Toom: Pi Moo, do you think they will let me wear a bra in the ring?
Go for it.
Toom: That was the first time I had fought a woman. And the first time I wasn’t sure who I was. Or what I had become. A woman in a boxer’s body? Or an animal in a circus show?
Yes.
Title card: Nong Toom is now a model and actress based in Bangkok. She no longer has to hide in toilets to put on her makeup.
Start here: https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=a ... =610&dpr=1
Quote of the day
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iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
It’s all about how lives intertwine and the meaning we give to them while immersed in the complex flow of contingency, chance and change. Part of a trilogy. Amores Perros is set in Mexico, 21 Grams in America and Babel spans the globe.
But it’s always about how human relationships become entangled in events and the extent to which we are or are not able to untangle them. Or make sense of them.
Some with and some without God.
Naomi Watts, Benicio del Toro and Sean Penn are nothing short of extraordinary here. Naomi Watts in particular. She just had the bad luck of being nominated for an Academy Award the same year that Monster came out.
These are extraordinary circumstances, sure, but most movies tend to revolve around them. They show us lives at their most ambiguous. But most of us can imagine [or try to imagine] our own reactions. And then measure them against the reactions of those on the screen.
"The title comes from the work of Dr. Duncan MacDougall of Haverhill, Massachusetts in the early twentieth century. MacDougall weighed dying subjects, in experiments of extremely dubious scientific value, believing that he was proving that the soul was material and measurable. His results in fact varied wildly." IMDb
21 Grams
Jack: Jesus gave me that truck.
Of course, that will come back to haunt him.
Jack: God knows when even a single hair moves on your head.
Of course, that will come back to haunt him too.
Paul [voiceover in ICU]: So, this is death’s waiting room. These ridiculous tubes. These needles swelling my arms. What am I doing in this pre-corpse club? What do I have to do with them?
Of course, we know the answer to that one.
Daughter: Mommy, Freddy hit me in the arm.
Jack: Which arm, baby?
Daughter: This one.
Marianne: Jack, don’t start.
Jack: Hold out your other arm and let your brother hit you.
Marianne: Jack, no!
Jack: Hold it out. Whoever slaps you on the right cheek, turn the other to him also. [then to his son] Hit her. Don’t be afraid.
Marianne: Jack, no!
Jack [pounding table ] Hit her!
A true Christian, let's call him.
Jack [after smacking his son upside the head for hitting his sister]: There’s no hitting in this house.
[hits him again]
Jack: You understand?!
A true Christian, let's call him.
Jack [to Marianne]: I just ran over a man and two little girls.
In the truck Jesus gave him.
But it’s always about how human relationships become entangled in events and the extent to which we are or are not able to untangle them. Or make sense of them.
Some with and some without God.
Naomi Watts, Benicio del Toro and Sean Penn are nothing short of extraordinary here. Naomi Watts in particular. She just had the bad luck of being nominated for an Academy Award the same year that Monster came out.
These are extraordinary circumstances, sure, but most movies tend to revolve around them. They show us lives at their most ambiguous. But most of us can imagine [or try to imagine] our own reactions. And then measure them against the reactions of those on the screen.
"The title comes from the work of Dr. Duncan MacDougall of Haverhill, Massachusetts in the early twentieth century. MacDougall weighed dying subjects, in experiments of extremely dubious scientific value, believing that he was proving that the soul was material and measurable. His results in fact varied wildly." IMDb
21 Grams
Jack: Jesus gave me that truck.
Of course, that will come back to haunt him.
Jack: God knows when even a single hair moves on your head.
Of course, that will come back to haunt him too.
Paul [voiceover in ICU]: So, this is death’s waiting room. These ridiculous tubes. These needles swelling my arms. What am I doing in this pre-corpse club? What do I have to do with them?
Of course, we know the answer to that one.
Daughter: Mommy, Freddy hit me in the arm.
Jack: Which arm, baby?
Daughter: This one.
Marianne: Jack, don’t start.
Jack: Hold out your other arm and let your brother hit you.
Marianne: Jack, no!
Jack: Hold it out. Whoever slaps you on the right cheek, turn the other to him also. [then to his son] Hit her. Don’t be afraid.
Marianne: Jack, no!
Jack [pounding table ] Hit her!
A true Christian, let's call him.
Jack [after smacking his son upside the head for hitting his sister]: There’s no hitting in this house.
[hits him again]
Jack: You understand?!
A true Christian, let's call him.
Jack [to Marianne]: I just ran over a man and two little girls.
In the truck Jesus gave him.
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iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Time
“I am what time, circumstance, history, have made of me, certainly, but I am, also, much more than that. So are we all.” James Baldwin
Of course: dasein.
Though, sure, for you it might actually be something else.
“Americans will put up with anything provided it doesn't block traffic.” Dan Rather
New thread?
“Between Ennui and Ecstasy unwinds our whole experience of time.” Emil Cioran
Then this part: https://youtu.be/VKcAYMb5uk4?si=zUVp1WFCYJwzFoLu
“Time has no meaning in itself unless we choose to give it significance” Leo Buscaglia
Tell that to God?
“We love to buy books because we believe we're buying the time to read them." Warren Zevon
That may well be true, right?
“Time has a wonderful way to show us what really matters. Margaret Peters
That we all die.
On the other hand, then what?
“I am what time, circumstance, history, have made of me, certainly, but I am, also, much more than that. So are we all.” James Baldwin
Of course: dasein.
Though, sure, for you it might actually be something else.
“Americans will put up with anything provided it doesn't block traffic.” Dan Rather
New thread?
“Between Ennui and Ecstasy unwinds our whole experience of time.” Emil Cioran
Then this part: https://youtu.be/VKcAYMb5uk4?si=zUVp1WFCYJwzFoLu
“Time has no meaning in itself unless we choose to give it significance” Leo Buscaglia
Tell that to God?
“We love to buy books because we believe we're buying the time to read them." Warren Zevon
That may well be true, right?
“Time has a wonderful way to show us what really matters. Margaret Peters
That we all die.
On the other hand, then what?
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iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
21 Grams
Jack: Did you go?
[Marianne nods]
Jack: Are they dead?
[Marianne nods]
Jack: I’m gonna turn myself in.
Marianne: John says nobody saw you. Nobody. They don’t know the license plate or what kind of car. Some asshole even swears it was a cab.
Jack: Marianne, what would you do if these were our children? Tell me.
Marianne: But they’re not. It didn’t happen to us.
Jack: No, it didn’t happen to us. It happened to me.
And, of course, to the three he killed. Including two little girls.
Marianne: What the fuck do you gain by turning yourself in?
Jack: It’s my duty, Marianne.
Marianne: No, Jack, your duty is here with us. With your family.
Jack: My duty’s to God.
Unless, of course, it's the wrong God.
Paul: What abortion? What abortion, Mary?
Mary: I can explain.
Paul: Explain what?
Mary: There is an explanation.
Paul: Uh-huh. All that drama about artificial insemination. Kids’ names. You got pictures of our friends’ babies all over the place. Why? So you can flush it down the fuckin’ toilet?!
Besides, he has fallen on love with another woman.
Reverend John: Jack, Jesus didn’t come to free us from pain. He came to give us the strength to bear it.
Jack: Maybe He wanted this pain for me.
Reverend John: No, He had nothing to do with this. It was an accident.
Jack: No, it wasn’t an accident. Jesus chose me for this.
Reverend John: Jack, ask for the mercy of Jesus Christ.
Jack: If it was an accident, why do I have to ask for His mercy?
Just do it, Jack!
Reverend John: Stop this shit, or you’re going straight to hell!
Jack [pounding his skull with his knuckles]: Hell? This is hell. Right here!
Pound your own skull if you agree.
Jack: I did everything He asked me to do! I changed! I gave Him my life, and He betrayed me. He put that fucking truck in my hand so I could carry out His will. Made me kill that man and those girls. But hey, He didn’t give me the strength to stay and save them.
Reverend John: Don’t blaspheme, you bastard! Christ had nothing to do with this!
Jack: God knows when even a single hair moves on your head. And you taught me that.
Yeah, what about that, Reverend John?
Jack: Did you go?
[Marianne nods]
Jack: Are they dead?
[Marianne nods]
Jack: I’m gonna turn myself in.
Marianne: John says nobody saw you. Nobody. They don’t know the license plate or what kind of car. Some asshole even swears it was a cab.
Jack: Marianne, what would you do if these were our children? Tell me.
Marianne: But they’re not. It didn’t happen to us.
Jack: No, it didn’t happen to us. It happened to me.
And, of course, to the three he killed. Including two little girls.
Marianne: What the fuck do you gain by turning yourself in?
Jack: It’s my duty, Marianne.
Marianne: No, Jack, your duty is here with us. With your family.
Jack: My duty’s to God.
Unless, of course, it's the wrong God.
Paul: What abortion? What abortion, Mary?
Mary: I can explain.
Paul: Explain what?
Mary: There is an explanation.
Paul: Uh-huh. All that drama about artificial insemination. Kids’ names. You got pictures of our friends’ babies all over the place. Why? So you can flush it down the fuckin’ toilet?!
Besides, he has fallen on love with another woman.
Reverend John: Jack, Jesus didn’t come to free us from pain. He came to give us the strength to bear it.
Jack: Maybe He wanted this pain for me.
Reverend John: No, He had nothing to do with this. It was an accident.
Jack: No, it wasn’t an accident. Jesus chose me for this.
Reverend John: Jack, ask for the mercy of Jesus Christ.
Jack: If it was an accident, why do I have to ask for His mercy?
Just do it, Jack!
Reverend John: Stop this shit, or you’re going straight to hell!
Jack [pounding his skull with his knuckles]: Hell? This is hell. Right here!
Pound your own skull if you agree.
Jack: I did everything He asked me to do! I changed! I gave Him my life, and He betrayed me. He put that fucking truck in my hand so I could carry out His will. Made me kill that man and those girls. But hey, He didn’t give me the strength to stay and save them.
Reverend John: Don’t blaspheme, you bastard! Christ had nothing to do with this!
Jack: God knows when even a single hair moves on your head. And you taught me that.
Yeah, what about that, Reverend John?
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iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
God
“God saves - but not now, and not here. His salvation is on layaway. Like all grifters, He asks you to pay now and take it on faith that you will receive later. Whereas women offer a different sort of salvation, more immediate and fulfilling. They don't put off their love for a distant, ill-defined eternity but make a gift of it in the here and now, frequently to those who deserve it least. So it was in my case. So it is for many. The devil and woman have been allies against God from the beginning...” Joe Hill
Let's run this by Joan Baez.
“I know there is a God because in Rwanda I shook hands with the devil. I have seen him, I have smelled him and I have touched him. I know the devil exists and therefore I know there is a God.” Roméo Dallairep.
God and Rwanda?
“You push the TRUTH off a cliff, but it will always fly. You can submerge the TRUTH under water, but it will not drown. You can place the TRUTH in the fire, but it will survive. You can bury the TRUTH beneath the ground, but it will arise. TRUTH always prevails!” Amaka Imani Nkosazana
Come on, really, what are the odds that it is your Truth?
“It don't matter if you believe in God Nick, he believes in you.” Stephen King
Would you settle for that?
“God created Heaven on Earth but man created Hell.” Santosh Kalwar
You know what's coming:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_earthquakes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_l ... _eruptions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... l_cyclones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tsunamis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_landslides
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fires
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_epidemics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deadliest_floods
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... ore_deaths
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_diseases
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinction_events
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth . . . Then he said, "Let there be light." Which means he made the entire universe in the dark! How fucking good is that? He's brilliant. Ricky Gervais
I'll bet you never thought of that.
“God saves - but not now, and not here. His salvation is on layaway. Like all grifters, He asks you to pay now and take it on faith that you will receive later. Whereas women offer a different sort of salvation, more immediate and fulfilling. They don't put off their love for a distant, ill-defined eternity but make a gift of it in the here and now, frequently to those who deserve it least. So it was in my case. So it is for many. The devil and woman have been allies against God from the beginning...” Joe Hill
Let's run this by Joan Baez.
“I know there is a God because in Rwanda I shook hands with the devil. I have seen him, I have smelled him and I have touched him. I know the devil exists and therefore I know there is a God.” Roméo Dallairep.
God and Rwanda?
“You push the TRUTH off a cliff, but it will always fly. You can submerge the TRUTH under water, but it will not drown. You can place the TRUTH in the fire, but it will survive. You can bury the TRUTH beneath the ground, but it will arise. TRUTH always prevails!” Amaka Imani Nkosazana
Come on, really, what are the odds that it is your Truth?
“It don't matter if you believe in God Nick, he believes in you.” Stephen King
Would you settle for that?
“God created Heaven on Earth but man created Hell.” Santosh Kalwar
You know what's coming:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_earthquakes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_l ... _eruptions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... l_cyclones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tsunamis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_landslides
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fires
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_epidemics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deadliest_floods
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... ore_deaths
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_diseases
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinction_events
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth . . . Then he said, "Let there be light." Which means he made the entire universe in the dark! How fucking good is that? He's brilliant. Ricky Gervais
I'll bet you never thought of that.
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
21 Grams
Jack: This is God’s will. So be it.
Marianne: Two years ago, you didn’t believe in anything. Now everything has to do with God. I think I preferred you the way you were before.
Jack: I was a fucking pig before. Is that what you prefer?
Marianne: At least it was you. Now I don’t have the slightest fucking idea who you are. Life has to go on Jack. With or without God.
Right, like "without God" doesn't change everything.
Paul: Let me ask you something, and I want you to be really honest with me, okay? If I stay… will I be saved?
Dr. Rothberg: I can’t guarantee it. But if you don’t come back to the hospital, you’re condemning yourself to a terrible death. Your heart won’t work anymore. You’ll die, asphyxiated. It’s an awful death, Paul. You can’t imagine it. At least here we can help you to …
Paul: You can help me DIE better. That’s what you’re saying. You can help me die BETTER. Well, I’m not gonna do that, okay? I’d rather die outside.
Talk about the worst of all possible worlds...
Paul: There is a number hidden in every act of life, in every aspect of the universe. Fractals, matter-- that there’s a number screaming to tell us something. Am I boring you?
Cristina: No. No.
Paul: l–I’m sorry. I guess I try to tell them that numbers are a door to understanding a mystery that’s bigger than us. How two people, strangers, come to meet. There’s a poem by a Venezuelan writer that begins-- “The earth turned to bring us closer. It turned on itself and in us…until it finally brought us together in this dream.”
Cristina: That’s beautiful.
Paul: There are so many things that have to happen for two people to meet.
And she had to lose her husband and her children in order for him to meet her.
Daughter: Daddy, in school they said…you killed two little girls and their daddy. Is that true?
Jack: Yes.
Marianne: No.
Son: Yes. He killed them.
Marianne: It was an accident.
All in the family again.
Paul: Cristina, wait. I have to tell you something. Okay. I have to tell you something.
Cristina: Please, kiss me.
Paul: Wait. Cristina. l–Cristina. I have Michael’s heart.
Cristina: What?
Paul: I have Michael’s heart. You understand what I’m saying? It was transplanted into me at St. Francis Hospital on October.
Cristina: No. No…
Paul: I tried to tell you. I just didn’t know how to tell you.
Cristina: How dare you. How dare you!
Paul: Cristina…
Cristina: How fucking dare you!
Paul: I’m here for a reason.
Cristina: Get out of my house!
Paul: Cristina…
Ceistina: Don’t touch me! Get out of my house now! You make me sick!
Paul: I had a reason. Can’t you see that?
Cristina: You get out of my fucking-- Get the fuck out of my house!
Paul: Okay.
Cristina: You make me sick! Get out!
The next morning, however...
Paul [watching Cristina snort drugs]: Cristina. Cristina. Listen to me. You don’t need that shit. You don’t need it.
Cristina [fiercely]: Don’t tell me what I need!
Exactly!
Cristina: Katie could have lived. She’d be alive right now but that bastard left her there. Laying in the street. He left the three of them like animals. He didn’t care. She could be here with me. That son of a bitch is walking the streets, and I can’t even go into their room. I wanna kill him. I’m gonna kill Jack Jordan. I’m gonna kill that son of a bitch.
Paul: Slow down, just slow down.
Cristina: Slow down. Slow down. While I what, huh? While I what?
Paul: Take it easy.
Cristina: Take it easy?! My husband and my little girls are dead, and I’m supposed to take it fucking easy?!! I can’t just go on with my life! I am paralyzed here! I am a fucking amputee! Do you see that? Who are you? You owe it to Michael. No, you’ve got his heart. You’re in his house fucking his wife! And sitting in his chair! We have to kill him!
Paul: Not like this. Not like this.
Cristina: Then how? Tell me how!
Not how either of them figured, that's for sure.
Paul [to Jack]: You…murderer. You just let them lie there on the street. Those two little girls, you just let them die like dogs…I should have killed you. Now you disappear. Don’t even go back to the motel and get your things. Just disappear.
But he doesn't, does he?
Paul [voiceover]: How many lives do we live? How many times do we die? They say we all lose 21 grams…at the exact moment of our death. Everyone. And how much fits into 21 grams? How much is lost? When do we lose 21 grams? How much goes with them? How much is gained? How much is gained? Twenty-one grams. The weight of a stack of five nickels. The weight of a hummingbird. A chocolate bar. How much did 21 grams weigh?
Note to God: Why 21 grams?
Jack: This is God’s will. So be it.
Marianne: Two years ago, you didn’t believe in anything. Now everything has to do with God. I think I preferred you the way you were before.
Jack: I was a fucking pig before. Is that what you prefer?
Marianne: At least it was you. Now I don’t have the slightest fucking idea who you are. Life has to go on Jack. With or without God.
Right, like "without God" doesn't change everything.
Paul: Let me ask you something, and I want you to be really honest with me, okay? If I stay… will I be saved?
Dr. Rothberg: I can’t guarantee it. But if you don’t come back to the hospital, you’re condemning yourself to a terrible death. Your heart won’t work anymore. You’ll die, asphyxiated. It’s an awful death, Paul. You can’t imagine it. At least here we can help you to …
Paul: You can help me DIE better. That’s what you’re saying. You can help me die BETTER. Well, I’m not gonna do that, okay? I’d rather die outside.
Talk about the worst of all possible worlds...
Paul: There is a number hidden in every act of life, in every aspect of the universe. Fractals, matter-- that there’s a number screaming to tell us something. Am I boring you?
Cristina: No. No.
Paul: l–I’m sorry. I guess I try to tell them that numbers are a door to understanding a mystery that’s bigger than us. How two people, strangers, come to meet. There’s a poem by a Venezuelan writer that begins-- “The earth turned to bring us closer. It turned on itself and in us…until it finally brought us together in this dream.”
Cristina: That’s beautiful.
Paul: There are so many things that have to happen for two people to meet.
And she had to lose her husband and her children in order for him to meet her.
Daughter: Daddy, in school they said…you killed two little girls and their daddy. Is that true?
Jack: Yes.
Marianne: No.
Son: Yes. He killed them.
Marianne: It was an accident.
All in the family again.
Paul: Cristina, wait. I have to tell you something. Okay. I have to tell you something.
Cristina: Please, kiss me.
Paul: Wait. Cristina. l–Cristina. I have Michael’s heart.
Cristina: What?
Paul: I have Michael’s heart. You understand what I’m saying? It was transplanted into me at St. Francis Hospital on October.
Cristina: No. No…
Paul: I tried to tell you. I just didn’t know how to tell you.
Cristina: How dare you. How dare you!
Paul: Cristina…
Cristina: How fucking dare you!
Paul: I’m here for a reason.
Cristina: Get out of my house!
Paul: Cristina…
Ceistina: Don’t touch me! Get out of my house now! You make me sick!
Paul: I had a reason. Can’t you see that?
Cristina: You get out of my fucking-- Get the fuck out of my house!
Paul: Okay.
Cristina: You make me sick! Get out!
The next morning, however...
Paul [watching Cristina snort drugs]: Cristina. Cristina. Listen to me. You don’t need that shit. You don’t need it.
Cristina [fiercely]: Don’t tell me what I need!
Exactly!
Cristina: Katie could have lived. She’d be alive right now but that bastard left her there. Laying in the street. He left the three of them like animals. He didn’t care. She could be here with me. That son of a bitch is walking the streets, and I can’t even go into their room. I wanna kill him. I’m gonna kill Jack Jordan. I’m gonna kill that son of a bitch.
Paul: Slow down, just slow down.
Cristina: Slow down. Slow down. While I what, huh? While I what?
Paul: Take it easy.
Cristina: Take it easy?! My husband and my little girls are dead, and I’m supposed to take it fucking easy?!! I can’t just go on with my life! I am paralyzed here! I am a fucking amputee! Do you see that? Who are you? You owe it to Michael. No, you’ve got his heart. You’re in his house fucking his wife! And sitting in his chair! We have to kill him!
Paul: Not like this. Not like this.
Cristina: Then how? Tell me how!
Not how either of them figured, that's for sure.
Paul [to Jack]: You…murderer. You just let them lie there on the street. Those two little girls, you just let them die like dogs…I should have killed you. Now you disappear. Don’t even go back to the motel and get your things. Just disappear.
But he doesn't, does he?
Paul [voiceover]: How many lives do we live? How many times do we die? They say we all lose 21 grams…at the exact moment of our death. Everyone. And how much fits into 21 grams? How much is lost? When do we lose 21 grams? How much goes with them? How much is gained? How much is gained? Twenty-one grams. The weight of a stack of five nickels. The weight of a hummingbird. A chocolate bar. How much did 21 grams weigh?
Note to God: Why 21 grams?
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
The two leads are Guy and Girl. Uh oh. But they are easy to like and [like me] they love music. And they create music. And the music they create is well worth listening to. And they are easy to look at. And intelligent and personable.
What they call a “pitch perfect” film. Well, for some. It helps to be young yourself here. And to have a passion that resides in and around the world of music.
The guy does say “cool” a lot though.
Love. It’s all about timing.
"Bob Dylan was such a big fan of the film that he arranged to have the two leads, Glen Hansard and Markéta Irglová, open for him on part of his world tour. Hansard and Irglová also covered Dylan’s song “You Ain’t Goin’ Nowhere” for I’m Not There." IMDb
Once
Guy [repeated line]: For fuck’s sake…
Does anyone know what that actually is?
Girl: How come you don’t play during daytime? I see you here everyday.
Guy: During the daytime people would want to hear songs that they know, just songs that they recognize. I play these song at night or I wouldn’t make any money. People wouldn’t listen.
Girl: I listen.
Guy: Yeah, but you just gave me 10 cents.
Another Garden Party?
Girl: Your son is a very talented guy, sir
Father: Well, he should be, I trained him myself.
Girl: Oh, no sir, I meant the songs.
Of course she did.
Girl: I have to go now.
Guy: Do you want to stay?
Girl: What do you mean?
Guy: Stay the night?
Girl [surprised]: What?
[Guy gives her that “you know why” look]
Girl: Fuck this. Thanks for the Hoover.
Let's run this by Harry and Sally.
Guy: You’re what? You’re married?
Girl: Does it surprise you.
Guy: For fuck’s sake.
On the other hand, how relevant is that these days?
Guy: What’s the Czech for, “Do you love him?”
Girl: Noor-esh-ho
Guy: So, noor-esh-ho?
Girl: Noor-ho-tebbe.
If only he spoke Czech.
What they call a “pitch perfect” film. Well, for some. It helps to be young yourself here. And to have a passion that resides in and around the world of music.
The guy does say “cool” a lot though.
Love. It’s all about timing.
"Bob Dylan was such a big fan of the film that he arranged to have the two leads, Glen Hansard and Markéta Irglová, open for him on part of his world tour. Hansard and Irglová also covered Dylan’s song “You Ain’t Goin’ Nowhere” for I’m Not There." IMDb
Once
Guy [repeated line]: For fuck’s sake…
Does anyone know what that actually is?
Girl: How come you don’t play during daytime? I see you here everyday.
Guy: During the daytime people would want to hear songs that they know, just songs that they recognize. I play these song at night or I wouldn’t make any money. People wouldn’t listen.
Girl: I listen.
Guy: Yeah, but you just gave me 10 cents.
Another Garden Party?
Girl: Your son is a very talented guy, sir
Father: Well, he should be, I trained him myself.
Girl: Oh, no sir, I meant the songs.
Of course she did.
Girl: I have to go now.
Guy: Do you want to stay?
Girl: What do you mean?
Guy: Stay the night?
Girl [surprised]: What?
[Guy gives her that “you know why” look]
Girl: Fuck this. Thanks for the Hoover.
Let's run this by Harry and Sally.
Guy: You’re what? You’re married?
Girl: Does it surprise you.
Guy: For fuck’s sake.
On the other hand, how relevant is that these days?
Guy: What’s the Czech for, “Do you love him?”
Girl: Noor-esh-ho
Guy: So, noor-esh-ho?
Girl: Noor-ho-tebbe.
If only he spoke Czech.
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Sniff sniff.
Those kind of people. Both upstairs and downstairs.
The idea of someone waiting on me hand and foot is just short of repugnant. The idea of doing it myself for another is not short of it at all.
What is crucial for folks able to sustain this mentality [from either end] is pursuing the quotidian as though very single detail of every single day were a matter of life and death. They give me, how shall I put this, the creeps? As no doubt someone like I, them.
But it’s still no less intriguing to peek inside their world. To at least try to imagine what it might be like to live [and to think and feel] this way. And some do actually thrive on service to others.
And then there is the part about the Nazis. And the part about being oblivious to them. And the part about being afraid to resist them when more than you can bear to lose is at stake.
At heart a love story some insist. Not one I am familiar with though.
Remains of the Day
Father: There was this English butler out in India. One day, he goes in the dining room and what does he see under the table? A tiger. Not turning a hair, he goes straight to the drawing room. “Hum, hum. Excuse me, my lord,” and whispering, so as not to upset the ladies : “I’m very sorry my lord. There appears to be a tiger in the dining room. Perhaps his Lordship will permit use of the twelve bores?” They go on drinking their tea. And then, there’s three gunshots. Well, they don’t think nothing of it, this being out in India where they’re used to anything. When the butler is back to refresh the teapots, he says, cool as a cucumber: “Dinner will be served at the usual time, my lord. And I am pleased to say there will be no discernible traces left of the recent occurence by that time.” I’ll repeat that: “There will be no discernible traces of the recent occurrence by that time!”
What's one less tiger in the world, right?
Miss Kenton: Look at it! Is that or is it not the wrong chinaman?
Stevens: Miss Kenton, I’m very busy. I am surprised that you have nothing better to do than stand around all day…
Miss Kenton: Mr. Stevens, look at that chinaman and tell me the truth!
Stevens: Miss Kenton, I would ask you to keep your voice down. What would the other servants think to hear us shouting at the top of our voices about… chinamen?
Miss Kenton: And I would ask you, Mr. Stevens, to turn around and look at the chinaman.
Sniff, sniff.
Lewis: You are, all of you, amateurs. And international affairs should never be run by gentlemen amateurs. Do you have any idea of what sort of place the world is becoming all around you? The days when you could just act out of your noble instincts, are over. Europe has become the arena of realpolitik, the politics of reality. If you like: real politics. What you need is not gentlemen politicians, but real ones. You need professionals to run your affairs, or you’re headed for disaster!
You could say that. Of course, Stevens is as fiercely concerned about serving the meal as these men are at preventing [or waging] another war in Europe.
Miss Kenton: I’m sorry to say your father passed away four minutes ago.
Stevens: Oh, I see.
Miss Kenton: I’m so very sorry. Will you come up and see him?
Stevens: Well, I’m very busy at the moment. In a little while, perhaps.
Miss Kenton: In that case, will you permit me to close his eyes.
Stevens: I would be most grateful to you. Thank you.
Different folks, different strokes.
Mr Benn: Gentlemen, you speak of Jews and Gypsies and Negroes, so on and so forth. But one has to regard the racial laws of the Fascists as a sanitary measure, much overdue in my opinion. You cannot run a country without a penal system. Here in England we call them prision. There, they call them concentration camps. What’s the difference?
First, of course, we'll need to define "difference".
Stevens: In my philosophy, Mr. Benn, a man cannot call himself well-contented until he has done all he can to be of service to his employer. Of course, this assumes that one’s employer is a superior person, not only in rank, or wealth, but in moral stature.
And if he is a Nazi?
Stevens: My Lord, may I say the both work extremely well. They're intelligent, polite and very clean.
Lord Darlington: I’m sorry, but I’ve looked into this matter very carefully. There are larger issues at stake. I’m sorry but there it is. They’re Jews.
Send them to...prison?
Stevens: Didn’t you say you would be leaving because of the German girls?
Miss Denton: I’m not leaving. I’ve nowhere to go. I have no family. I’m a coward.
Stevens: No, no…
Miss Denton: Yes. I am a coward. I’m frightened of leaving, and that’s the truth. All I see out in the world is lonliness, and it frightens me. That’s all my high principles are worth. I’m ashamed of myself.
As well she should be?
Miss Kenton: What’s in that book? Come on, let me see!
Stevens: This is my private time. You’re invading it.
Miss Kenton: Oh, is that so?
Stevens: Yes.
Miss Kenton: I’m invading your private time, am I?
Stevens: Yes.
Options. That's what it often comes down to time and again.
Those kind of people. Both upstairs and downstairs.
The idea of someone waiting on me hand and foot is just short of repugnant. The idea of doing it myself for another is not short of it at all.
What is crucial for folks able to sustain this mentality [from either end] is pursuing the quotidian as though very single detail of every single day were a matter of life and death. They give me, how shall I put this, the creeps? As no doubt someone like I, them.
But it’s still no less intriguing to peek inside their world. To at least try to imagine what it might be like to live [and to think and feel] this way. And some do actually thrive on service to others.
And then there is the part about the Nazis. And the part about being oblivious to them. And the part about being afraid to resist them when more than you can bear to lose is at stake.
At heart a love story some insist. Not one I am familiar with though.
Remains of the Day
Father: There was this English butler out in India. One day, he goes in the dining room and what does he see under the table? A tiger. Not turning a hair, he goes straight to the drawing room. “Hum, hum. Excuse me, my lord,” and whispering, so as not to upset the ladies : “I’m very sorry my lord. There appears to be a tiger in the dining room. Perhaps his Lordship will permit use of the twelve bores?” They go on drinking their tea. And then, there’s three gunshots. Well, they don’t think nothing of it, this being out in India where they’re used to anything. When the butler is back to refresh the teapots, he says, cool as a cucumber: “Dinner will be served at the usual time, my lord. And I am pleased to say there will be no discernible traces left of the recent occurence by that time.” I’ll repeat that: “There will be no discernible traces of the recent occurrence by that time!”
What's one less tiger in the world, right?
Miss Kenton: Look at it! Is that or is it not the wrong chinaman?
Stevens: Miss Kenton, I’m very busy. I am surprised that you have nothing better to do than stand around all day…
Miss Kenton: Mr. Stevens, look at that chinaman and tell me the truth!
Stevens: Miss Kenton, I would ask you to keep your voice down. What would the other servants think to hear us shouting at the top of our voices about… chinamen?
Miss Kenton: And I would ask you, Mr. Stevens, to turn around and look at the chinaman.
Sniff, sniff.
Lewis: You are, all of you, amateurs. And international affairs should never be run by gentlemen amateurs. Do you have any idea of what sort of place the world is becoming all around you? The days when you could just act out of your noble instincts, are over. Europe has become the arena of realpolitik, the politics of reality. If you like: real politics. What you need is not gentlemen politicians, but real ones. You need professionals to run your affairs, or you’re headed for disaster!
You could say that. Of course, Stevens is as fiercely concerned about serving the meal as these men are at preventing [or waging] another war in Europe.
Miss Kenton: I’m sorry to say your father passed away four minutes ago.
Stevens: Oh, I see.
Miss Kenton: I’m so very sorry. Will you come up and see him?
Stevens: Well, I’m very busy at the moment. In a little while, perhaps.
Miss Kenton: In that case, will you permit me to close his eyes.
Stevens: I would be most grateful to you. Thank you.
Different folks, different strokes.
Mr Benn: Gentlemen, you speak of Jews and Gypsies and Negroes, so on and so forth. But one has to regard the racial laws of the Fascists as a sanitary measure, much overdue in my opinion. You cannot run a country without a penal system. Here in England we call them prision. There, they call them concentration camps. What’s the difference?
First, of course, we'll need to define "difference".
Stevens: In my philosophy, Mr. Benn, a man cannot call himself well-contented until he has done all he can to be of service to his employer. Of course, this assumes that one’s employer is a superior person, not only in rank, or wealth, but in moral stature.
And if he is a Nazi?
Stevens: My Lord, may I say the both work extremely well. They're intelligent, polite and very clean.
Lord Darlington: I’m sorry, but I’ve looked into this matter very carefully. There are larger issues at stake. I’m sorry but there it is. They’re Jews.
Send them to...prison?
Stevens: Didn’t you say you would be leaving because of the German girls?
Miss Denton: I’m not leaving. I’ve nowhere to go. I have no family. I’m a coward.
Stevens: No, no…
Miss Denton: Yes. I am a coward. I’m frightened of leaving, and that’s the truth. All I see out in the world is lonliness, and it frightens me. That’s all my high principles are worth. I’m ashamed of myself.
As well she should be?
Miss Kenton: What’s in that book? Come on, let me see!
Stevens: This is my private time. You’re invading it.
Miss Kenton: Oh, is that so?
Stevens: Yes.
Miss Kenton: I’m invading your private time, am I?
Stevens: Yes.
Options. That's what it often comes down to time and again.
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Death
“Sometimes I think gravity may be death in disguise. Other times I think gravity is love, which is why love's only demand is that we fall.” Shaun David Hutchinson
Close enough?
“Dirge Without Music
I am not resigned to the shutting away of loving hearts in the hard ground.
So it is, and so it will be, for so it has been, time out of mind:
Into the darkness they go, the wise and the lovely. Crowned
With lilies and with laurel they go; but I am not resigned.
Lovers and thinkers, into the earth with you.
Be one with the dull, the indiscriminate dust.
A fragment of what you felt, of what you knew,
A formula, a phrase remains,—but the best is lost.
The answers quick and keen, the honest look, the laughter, the love,—
They are gone. They are gone to feed the roses. Elegant and curled
Is the blossom. Fragrant is the blossom. I know. But I do not approve.
More precious was the light in your eyes than all the roses in the world.
Down, down, down into the darkness of the grave
Gently they go, the beautiful, the tender, the kind;
Quietly they go, the intelligent, the witty, the brave.
I know. But I do not approve. And I am not resigned.” Edna St. Vincent Millay
Dirge with music: https://youtu.be/GhFIc994bB8?si=ubI2G5ORGXRTUp9H
“Death does not concern us, because as long as we exist, death is not here. And when it does come, we no longer exist.” Epicurus
Comforting enough for some, I suppose, though hardly enough for others.
“Live free or die.” Lauren Oliver
Though for others that translates as, "live like we do or we'll kill you."
I wonder if I'll ever have to decide which is worse, life as we're living or no life at all.” Susan Beth Pfeffer
The "tired of living but scared of dying" syndrome.
“It was a great mistake, my being born a man, I would have been much more successful as a seagull or a fish. As it is, I will always be a stranger who never feels at home, who does not really want and is not really wanted, who can never belong, who must be a little in love with death!” Eugene O'Neill
Pain and pleasure. Weigh them and decide.
“Sometimes I think gravity may be death in disguise. Other times I think gravity is love, which is why love's only demand is that we fall.” Shaun David Hutchinson
Close enough?
“Dirge Without Music
I am not resigned to the shutting away of loving hearts in the hard ground.
So it is, and so it will be, for so it has been, time out of mind:
Into the darkness they go, the wise and the lovely. Crowned
With lilies and with laurel they go; but I am not resigned.
Lovers and thinkers, into the earth with you.
Be one with the dull, the indiscriminate dust.
A fragment of what you felt, of what you knew,
A formula, a phrase remains,—but the best is lost.
The answers quick and keen, the honest look, the laughter, the love,—
They are gone. They are gone to feed the roses. Elegant and curled
Is the blossom. Fragrant is the blossom. I know. But I do not approve.
More precious was the light in your eyes than all the roses in the world.
Down, down, down into the darkness of the grave
Gently they go, the beautiful, the tender, the kind;
Quietly they go, the intelligent, the witty, the brave.
I know. But I do not approve. And I am not resigned.” Edna St. Vincent Millay
Dirge with music: https://youtu.be/GhFIc994bB8?si=ubI2G5ORGXRTUp9H
“Death does not concern us, because as long as we exist, death is not here. And when it does come, we no longer exist.” Epicurus
Comforting enough for some, I suppose, though hardly enough for others.
“Live free or die.” Lauren Oliver
Though for others that translates as, "live like we do or we'll kill you."
I wonder if I'll ever have to decide which is worse, life as we're living or no life at all.” Susan Beth Pfeffer
The "tired of living but scared of dying" syndrome.
“It was a great mistake, my being born a man, I would have been much more successful as a seagull or a fish. As it is, I will always be a stranger who never feels at home, who does not really want and is not really wanted, who can never belong, who must be a little in love with death!” Eugene O'Neill
Pain and pleasure. Weigh them and decide.
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
They’re just friends. But from his end who is kidding who. Or, to invoke Harry Burns, no man can stay “just friends” with a woman he finds sexually attractive. And what’s not to find sexually attractive about Lori? Or course it works pretty much the same way regarding women. They just seem a tad less biologically engineered to go in that direction. But not being one of them myself that’s just a personal observation based on my own experiences.
Then he meets Darcy. Sometimes. But she is young and beautiful all the time too. And more…exotic? mysterious? Tough choice. But [given who he is] not really.
Let the games begin!
But often it is less about the games we play and more about the ambiguities we feel in sorting out love from sex and both from friendship. And this is more clearly the case here when both parties are introspective…loners. Or one for sure.
But there are secrets here none of us are really privy to.
Charlotte Sometimes
Michael: We’re just friends.
Darcy: Do you find her sexually attractive?
Michael: Sometimes.
It's, uh, complicated.
Right, Supannika?
Darcy: We could have some fun tonight if you admit that’s what you want.
Michael: There are other ways to get to know someone.
Darcy: Sex is faster.
Come again?
Darcy: I really can’t decides just what it is you want from me.
Michael: What I would really like is to spend more time with you.
But she only has tonight and [maybe] tomorrow. Then she’ll be gone.
Michael: Does any of this even matter to you? No shortcuts.
Darcy: Okay, no shortcuts.
Shortcuts it is then.
Then behind the curtain...
Lori: Two requests. One, stay away from Justin. He might be the one. We might get married.
Darcy: That’s wonderful.
Lori: Just say you’ll do it.
Darcy: Fine.
Lori: My other condition has to do with Michael.
Darcy: I might have guessed.
Lori: Please, just keep it real.
Darcy: You really do see me as a monster.
Lori: I’ve seen what you can do.
Going back years now.
Justin: You know, it’s not really that far a drop. If she fell, she might survive.
Darcy: Or then again I might die. I’ll decide on the way down.
Enigmatic enough for you?
Michael: I know who you are.
Darcy: She told you?
Michael: No, I saw pictures of you as kids.
Darcy: I’m sorry.
Another 'now what?' moment.
Darcy [to Justin…but more to herself]: It doesn’t wait anymore. It doesn’t wait until afterwards. I feel it even as I’m coming. This wave of loneliness. This wave of disgust. I hate it so much. I wish I didn’t have to do this.
Come again?
Lori: She’s a liar. You should be glad she’s gone.
Michael: I’m not.
Lori: You don’t even know her. You don’t even know her name. Do you?
And there's still the two of them to untangle.
Michael: What is her name, anyway?
Lori [whispering in his ear]: That can wait…Michael.
Lost in translation?
Then he meets Darcy. Sometimes. But she is young and beautiful all the time too. And more…exotic? mysterious? Tough choice. But [given who he is] not really.
Let the games begin!
But often it is less about the games we play and more about the ambiguities we feel in sorting out love from sex and both from friendship. And this is more clearly the case here when both parties are introspective…loners. Or one for sure.
But there are secrets here none of us are really privy to.
Charlotte Sometimes
Michael: We’re just friends.
Darcy: Do you find her sexually attractive?
Michael: Sometimes.
It's, uh, complicated.
Right, Supannika?
Darcy: We could have some fun tonight if you admit that’s what you want.
Michael: There are other ways to get to know someone.
Darcy: Sex is faster.
Come again?
Darcy: I really can’t decides just what it is you want from me.
Michael: What I would really like is to spend more time with you.
But she only has tonight and [maybe] tomorrow. Then she’ll be gone.
Michael: Does any of this even matter to you? No shortcuts.
Darcy: Okay, no shortcuts.
Shortcuts it is then.
Then behind the curtain...
Lori: Two requests. One, stay away from Justin. He might be the one. We might get married.
Darcy: That’s wonderful.
Lori: Just say you’ll do it.
Darcy: Fine.
Lori: My other condition has to do with Michael.
Darcy: I might have guessed.
Lori: Please, just keep it real.
Darcy: You really do see me as a monster.
Lori: I’ve seen what you can do.
Going back years now.
Justin: You know, it’s not really that far a drop. If she fell, she might survive.
Darcy: Or then again I might die. I’ll decide on the way down.
Enigmatic enough for you?
Michael: I know who you are.
Darcy: She told you?
Michael: No, I saw pictures of you as kids.
Darcy: I’m sorry.
Another 'now what?' moment.
Darcy [to Justin…but more to herself]: It doesn’t wait anymore. It doesn’t wait until afterwards. I feel it even as I’m coming. This wave of loneliness. This wave of disgust. I hate it so much. I wish I didn’t have to do this.
Come again?
Lori: She’s a liar. You should be glad she’s gone.
Michael: I’m not.
Lori: You don’t even know her. You don’t even know her name. Do you?
And there's still the two of them to untangle.
Michael: What is her name, anyway?
Lori [whispering in his ear]: That can wait…Michael.
Lost in translation?
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Some make comparisons between this and the “infamous murder of James Bulger”:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of ... _the_media
Some kids do terrible things because they are “just kids”. They don’t think them through with the level of maturity or understanding [of the consequences] that most adults would. Or they follow the leader…get involved with the wrong person. But it can all come back to haunt them…follow them to the grave. Or even push them into it.
In films like this we are always forced to choose the manner in which we will stitch together the present and the past.
For one thing he was bullied as a boy. And then he met someone who stopped that dead in its tracks. And his family was a bit…dysfunctional.
And why does his new life fall apart at the seams? Because of a few mumbled words in drunken stupor? That’s about it.
This is what can happen to children who [in any number of ways] are grieviously abused. Eventually others will pay the price for it. And not just the ones that deserve to.
Look for Peter Parker.
Boy A
Jack: They…They said I could choose me own name.
Terry: That’s right.
Jack: Any name.
Terry: You got one?
Jack it is then.
Jack: I was wondering if m-maybe at some stage we could take a trip.
Terry: To where?
Jack: To see Philip’s grave.
Yep, that Philip.
Jack [at Philip’s grave]: Was it guilt, do you think?
Terry: Who knows?
Jack: Or…a way of saying sorry? Was he sick of the world?
Terry: We should go.
Then the extent to which that is or is not your own frame of mind. Here and now for example.
Jack reading a tabloid headline about his release: EVIL COMES OF AGE
Here too.
Son: I really despised you.
Terry: No, no.
Son: No, no, no. Let me explain, me. Let me…All the shit that happened, I know it wasn’t your fault. It was just shit that happens, right? But as a kid, the point of view you take - is the one that’s given to you…
Terry: Your mum?
Son: Yeah, my mum.
See how it works? In reality, for example.
Philip: You ever get fucked by a guy?
Eric [Jack as a boy]: What? No.
Philip: I did.
Eric: Oh. Yeah?
Philip: You remember my brother?
Eric: Did…Did he put it right in?
Philip: Mm-hmm, a lot of times.
Eric: Did it hurt?
Philip: What do you think? Just closed my eyes. When he does it. Just close 'em. And I think of a room with hundreds of doors. Hundreds of doors, and they’re closing. The one’s furthest away first, and then getting closer, just closing, just banging shut. And I think, if I can keep from crying until the last one shuts… then I won’t cry at all. And I don’t.
Does that explain Angela?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of ... _the_media
Some kids do terrible things because they are “just kids”. They don’t think them through with the level of maturity or understanding [of the consequences] that most adults would. Or they follow the leader…get involved with the wrong person. But it can all come back to haunt them…follow them to the grave. Or even push them into it.
In films like this we are always forced to choose the manner in which we will stitch together the present and the past.
For one thing he was bullied as a boy. And then he met someone who stopped that dead in its tracks. And his family was a bit…dysfunctional.
And why does his new life fall apart at the seams? Because of a few mumbled words in drunken stupor? That’s about it.
This is what can happen to children who [in any number of ways] are grieviously abused. Eventually others will pay the price for it. And not just the ones that deserve to.
Look for Peter Parker.
Boy A
Jack: They…They said I could choose me own name.
Terry: That’s right.
Jack: Any name.
Terry: You got one?
Jack it is then.
Jack: I was wondering if m-maybe at some stage we could take a trip.
Terry: To where?
Jack: To see Philip’s grave.
Yep, that Philip.
Jack [at Philip’s grave]: Was it guilt, do you think?
Terry: Who knows?
Jack: Or…a way of saying sorry? Was he sick of the world?
Terry: We should go.
Then the extent to which that is or is not your own frame of mind. Here and now for example.
Jack reading a tabloid headline about his release: EVIL COMES OF AGE
Here too.
Son: I really despised you.
Terry: No, no.
Son: No, no, no. Let me explain, me. Let me…All the shit that happened, I know it wasn’t your fault. It was just shit that happens, right? But as a kid, the point of view you take - is the one that’s given to you…
Terry: Your mum?
Son: Yeah, my mum.
See how it works? In reality, for example.
Philip: You ever get fucked by a guy?
Eric [Jack as a boy]: What? No.
Philip: I did.
Eric: Oh. Yeah?
Philip: You remember my brother?
Eric: Did…Did he put it right in?
Philip: Mm-hmm, a lot of times.
Eric: Did it hurt?
Philip: What do you think? Just closed my eyes. When he does it. Just close 'em. And I think of a room with hundreds of doors. Hundreds of doors, and they’re closing. The one’s furthest away first, and then getting closer, just closing, just banging shut. And I think, if I can keep from crying until the last one shuts… then I won’t cry at all. And I don’t.
Does that explain Angela?
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Philosophy
“Now, my own suspicion is that the universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose." J. B. S. Haldane
Next up: the transgender universe.
"I have read and heard many attempts at a systematic account of the universe, from materialism and theosophy to the Christian system or that of Kant, and I have always felt that they were much too simple. I suspect that there are more things in heaven and earth that are dreamed of, or can be dreamed of, in any philosophy. That is the reason why I have no philosophy myself, and must be my excuse for dreaming.” J. B. S. Haldane
Very little...almost nothing, let's call it.
“I knew a man who gave twenty years of his life to a scatterbrained woman, sacrificing everything to her, his friendships, his work, the very respectability of his life and who one evening recognized that he had never loved her. He had been bored, thats all, bored like most people. Hence he had made himself out of whole cloth a life full of complications and drama. Something must happen and that explains most human commitments. Something must happen even loveless slavery, even war or death.” Albert Camus
Does what we do still count?
“I've often thought that there isn't any 'I' at all; that we are simply the means of expression of something else; that when we think we are ourselves, we are simply the victims of a delusion.” Aleister Crowley
I wouldn't go that far myself. At least until my brain compels me to.
“Imagine others complexly.” John Green
Next up: imagine others objectively.
“You asked me how to get out of the finite dimensions when I feel like it. I certainly don't use logic when I do it. Logic's the first thing you have to get rid of.” J.D. Salinger
Piece of cake?
“Now, my own suspicion is that the universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose." J. B. S. Haldane
Next up: the transgender universe.
"I have read and heard many attempts at a systematic account of the universe, from materialism and theosophy to the Christian system or that of Kant, and I have always felt that they were much too simple. I suspect that there are more things in heaven and earth that are dreamed of, or can be dreamed of, in any philosophy. That is the reason why I have no philosophy myself, and must be my excuse for dreaming.” J. B. S. Haldane
Very little...almost nothing, let's call it.
“I knew a man who gave twenty years of his life to a scatterbrained woman, sacrificing everything to her, his friendships, his work, the very respectability of his life and who one evening recognized that he had never loved her. He had been bored, thats all, bored like most people. Hence he had made himself out of whole cloth a life full of complications and drama. Something must happen and that explains most human commitments. Something must happen even loveless slavery, even war or death.” Albert Camus
Does what we do still count?
“I've often thought that there isn't any 'I' at all; that we are simply the means of expression of something else; that when we think we are ourselves, we are simply the victims of a delusion.” Aleister Crowley
I wouldn't go that far myself. At least until my brain compels me to.
“Imagine others complexly.” John Green
Next up: imagine others objectively.
“You asked me how to get out of the finite dimensions when I feel like it. I certainly don't use logic when I do it. Logic's the first thing you have to get rid of.” J.D. Salinger
Piece of cake?
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Boy A
Jack: Listen, I’m not really sure…
Dave: What?
Jack: Well, that I want my photo taken, all right?
Dave: Why? Jesus, Jack, it’s just a photo.
Not to Boy A it's not.
Terry: You can never do this. You understand what I’m saying? You can never ever do this. Never!
Jack: Never?
Terry: Never, never.
Jack: Michelle would understand. I know it.
Terry: Listen, listen. Her understanding’s not the issue, okay? Knowledge is the issue. Your safety is the issue. Okay? Do you, do you know… Fuck it. There’s been a bounty posted for you on the internet.
Jack: A what?
Terry: For information regarding your whereabouts. Now listen, I wasn’t going to tell you.
Jack: Am I in danger?
Terry: No, no, no, no. But do you now realize there are people out there who want you? They hate you. They will never let go of what happened. Ever, ever!
You know, the folks you just can't reason with.
Jack: How much is it for?
Terry: It doesn’t matter.
Jack: Terry how much is it for?
Terry [after long pause]: 20 grand.
Jack: Oh, fuck.
And then some as it turned out.
Dave [on phone]: Jack, Dave. Listen, we’re not going to need you at work today.
Jack: Oh, why not?
Dave: Or for the foreseeable future.
Jack: What’ve I done?
Dave: Don’t come to the depot again. Do you understand? We’ll send you what you’re owed in wages.
Jack: Wait. Dave, Dave? Um, uh, just…
Dave: Goodbye, Jack.
And then, just like that, it all collapses.
Jack [on phone]: Oi, mate, it’s Jack here. Hey, um, Dave just called me. Told me not to come in.
Chris: He obviously knows you’re not who you say you are. Is he wrong?
Jack: Chr- Chris?
Chris: No, of course he’s not.
He’s back in the news.
Son: A monster, Dad! You choose a monster over me!!
I would have too.
In this case.
Jack [reading a letter from the little girl he rescued]: “Thank you for saving me. I hope you were an angel. Love, Catharine Thompson.”
To jump or not to jump.
Let's run that by Michelle.
Jack: Listen, I’m not really sure…
Dave: What?
Jack: Well, that I want my photo taken, all right?
Dave: Why? Jesus, Jack, it’s just a photo.
Not to Boy A it's not.
Terry: You can never do this. You understand what I’m saying? You can never ever do this. Never!
Jack: Never?
Terry: Never, never.
Jack: Michelle would understand. I know it.
Terry: Listen, listen. Her understanding’s not the issue, okay? Knowledge is the issue. Your safety is the issue. Okay? Do you, do you know… Fuck it. There’s been a bounty posted for you on the internet.
Jack: A what?
Terry: For information regarding your whereabouts. Now listen, I wasn’t going to tell you.
Jack: Am I in danger?
Terry: No, no, no, no. But do you now realize there are people out there who want you? They hate you. They will never let go of what happened. Ever, ever!
You know, the folks you just can't reason with.
Jack: How much is it for?
Terry: It doesn’t matter.
Jack: Terry how much is it for?
Terry [after long pause]: 20 grand.
Jack: Oh, fuck.
And then some as it turned out.
Dave [on phone]: Jack, Dave. Listen, we’re not going to need you at work today.
Jack: Oh, why not?
Dave: Or for the foreseeable future.
Jack: What’ve I done?
Dave: Don’t come to the depot again. Do you understand? We’ll send you what you’re owed in wages.
Jack: Wait. Dave, Dave? Um, uh, just…
Dave: Goodbye, Jack.
And then, just like that, it all collapses.
Jack [on phone]: Oi, mate, it’s Jack here. Hey, um, Dave just called me. Told me not to come in.
Chris: He obviously knows you’re not who you say you are. Is he wrong?
Jack: Chr- Chris?
Chris: No, of course he’s not.
He’s back in the news.
Son: A monster, Dad! You choose a monster over me!!
I would have too.
In this case.
Jack [reading a letter from the little girl he rescued]: “Thank you for saving me. I hope you were an angel. Love, Catharine Thompson.”
To jump or not to jump.
Let's run that by Michelle.
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
Free Will
“Free will is a kind of miracle; when we make a genuine choice, we bring about a result that cannot be reduced to the workings of physical law. Every act of volition is, like the creation of the universe, a first cause.” Ted Chiang
A miracle? Not much that can't include.
“My message to you is this: Pretend that you have free will. It’s essential that you behave as if your decisions matter, even though you know they don’t. The reality isn’t important; what’s important is your belief.” Ted Chiang
No, what's important is not pretending at all, but actually knowing...knowing if, in fact, we do have free will.
“In discussions about free will, a lot of people say that for an action of yours to be freely chosen—for you to bear moral responsibility for that action—you must have had the ability to do something else under exactly the same circumstances.” Ted Chiang
Unless, of course, those discussions themselves are wholly determined.
“And the world, to each individual, means the part of it with which he comes in contact” John Stuart Mill
Not to worry, Mr. Objectivist, you may well be compelled yourself one day to finally grasp this.
“Chuck it in the fuckit bucket.” Nadine Dalton
Freely if you can.
“Is the theory that lifeless, mindless atoms (obeying either deterministic laws or probabilistic laws of indeterminism) produce weird, unfathomable, ineffectual, pointless, mental illusions supposed to be more convincing than that we have genuine free will? The whole notion that a world made exclusively of matter, as materialist fundamentalists such as Harris insist, can suffer from illusions, delusions, hallucinations, mental illness, mental breakdowns, mental disorders, is so spectacularly silly that no sane person could ever take it seriously.
Harris, in his pathological determination to rid us of free will, has posited instead a world of delusional atoms in need of psychiatric help! What, do electrons hallucinate? Do protons have delusions of grandeur? Do quarks imagine themselves free? Are 1D-strings narcissistic? If none of these things is true, how on earth does Sam Harris propose that if humans are made of atoms alone, we can suffer from such illusions? Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and Harris doesn’t offer any evidence at all!” Mike Hockney
Indeed, illusions are particularly problematic here.
“Free will is a kind of miracle; when we make a genuine choice, we bring about a result that cannot be reduced to the workings of physical law. Every act of volition is, like the creation of the universe, a first cause.” Ted Chiang
A miracle? Not much that can't include.
“My message to you is this: Pretend that you have free will. It’s essential that you behave as if your decisions matter, even though you know they don’t. The reality isn’t important; what’s important is your belief.” Ted Chiang
No, what's important is not pretending at all, but actually knowing...knowing if, in fact, we do have free will.
“In discussions about free will, a lot of people say that for an action of yours to be freely chosen—for you to bear moral responsibility for that action—you must have had the ability to do something else under exactly the same circumstances.” Ted Chiang
Unless, of course, those discussions themselves are wholly determined.
“And the world, to each individual, means the part of it with which he comes in contact” John Stuart Mill
Not to worry, Mr. Objectivist, you may well be compelled yourself one day to finally grasp this.
“Chuck it in the fuckit bucket.” Nadine Dalton
Freely if you can.
“Is the theory that lifeless, mindless atoms (obeying either deterministic laws or probabilistic laws of indeterminism) produce weird, unfathomable, ineffectual, pointless, mental illusions supposed to be more convincing than that we have genuine free will? The whole notion that a world made exclusively of matter, as materialist fundamentalists such as Harris insist, can suffer from illusions, delusions, hallucinations, mental illness, mental breakdowns, mental disorders, is so spectacularly silly that no sane person could ever take it seriously.
Harris, in his pathological determination to rid us of free will, has posited instead a world of delusional atoms in need of psychiatric help! What, do electrons hallucinate? Do protons have delusions of grandeur? Do quarks imagine themselves free? Are 1D-strings narcissistic? If none of these things is true, how on earth does Sam Harris propose that if humans are made of atoms alone, we can suffer from such illusions? Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and Harris doesn’t offer any evidence at all!” Mike Hockney
Indeed, illusions are particularly problematic here.
-
iambiguous
- Posts: 11317
- Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:23 pm
Re: Quote of the day
The rule of God…and patriarchy. Not a good time to be of the female gender. And especially not if you are deeply enscounced in a working class community besotted of Catholicism. One of those places where you are raped and it is you that are sent away to be “reformed”…to be “saved”. Here’s how it works:
Sister Bridgett: All men are sinners and therefore, prone to temptation. and therefore, all men are prone to temptation. In God fearing countries, if men want to be saved from themselves, temptation must be removed.
The assumption some embrace today is that we can never go back to that again. But that’s politics. It’s just getting harder and harder to brainwash people. But not altogether out of the question.
It’s almost impossible at times to comprehend just how inane these people are. But that’s the way most of us would have behaved too had we been raised among them. You’re watching this thinking, “no way in hell I would have put up with it. The bastards would all be dead.”
But life doesn’t work that way for the preponderance of us. Ideas, realites are put into our heads as children and you can’t just make them go away like snapping your fingers. But some do manage to prevail. Then it’s only a matter of what they put in its place, isn’t it? But the crucial factor here is always God. Take religion out of the picture and the sky is the limit. That and the power to prevail.
In one particular way rather than another.
Start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene ... %20Ireland.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Woman_in_the_Wall
The Magdalene Sisters
Father Doonigan: Rose, I am father Doonigan. I work for the St. John Adoption Society. Your father and I think the best thing for the child is to give him up for adoption. A child born outside of wedlock is a bastard. You want him to live all his life as an outcast, refused and scorned by all honest members of society? You committed a horrible sin.
Rose: I know, Father. I am repentant.
Father Doonigan: Do you want your child to pay for your sins?
Rose: No, Father.
Father Doonigan: So you do want to give him a chance in life, and have him raised in a Catholic family with a mother and father. Sign here.
On the dotted line.
Sister Bridget: The philosophy that supports us in the Magdalene Asylums is simple: Thanks to the power of prayer, of cleanliness, of hard work, Iost, fallen women can find their way back to Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior. Mary Magdalene, holy patron of the Magdalene Asylums, was a sinner of the worst kind. For money, she gave her body to the depraved and lustful. She was saved by doing pennance for her sins, giving up the pleasures of the flesh, including food and sleep. She worked beyond the resistance of a human being so that she could offer her soul to God, cross the gates of Paradise, and live an eternal life.
Religion in a nutshell let's call it.
Mr. O’Connor [returning his daughter to the asylum]: You’ve got no home. You have no mother. You got no father. You killed us, you slut. You killed us both. You run away again, I’ll cripple you. I swear to God.
Praise the Lord!
Bernadette: Having a baby’s not a crime.
Rose: Having a baby before you’re married is a mortal sin!
Bernadette: All the mortal sins in the world wouldn’t justify this place. I’ll tell you, I’d commit any sin, mortal or otherwise, to get the hell out of here.
Enough said?
Sister Bridget: Open your eyes, girl. Open them. I want you to see what you really are. Now that your hair and your vanity has gone and your arrogance has been defeated, you are free to choose between right and wrong, good and evil. Look into the bottom of your soul and find what is pure and offer it up to God. That is the only way to salvation.
The scary part: what if that's actually true?
Sister: There’s nothing like exercise before dinner. Anyway, someone should eat less potatoes. Hands along your sides. Frances, not only are your breasts the smallest I’ve ever seen, but you don’t even have nipples! Did you notice? That can’t be natural, right? We agree. Frances has the smallest breasts. Who has the biggest? I’d say Patricia. No. She has a big behind. Turn around, Patricia. See? Patricia, you have a bricklayer’s back. With a couple of tattoos, you’d look like a sailor. No, Cecilia is surely the winner for the biggest breasts. An applause for Cecilia. Good girl. We saw the biggest breasts, the smallest, and the biggest behind. There is only the hairiest one left. Crispina, one step forward. Bernadette, one step forward. Get alongside of each other. Crispina, take your hands away from there! Bernadette, you have more hair there than on your head. But the winner is… Crispina. Crispina, you won! Why are you crying?
Crispina: I don’t know, Sister.
Sister: Well, neither do I. It’s just a game. Ah, put your clothes on the lot of you. Time for tea.
Uh, a Catholic thing?
Sister Bridgett: All men are sinners and therefore, prone to temptation. and therefore, all men are prone to temptation. In God fearing countries, if men want to be saved from themselves, temptation must be removed.
The assumption some embrace today is that we can never go back to that again. But that’s politics. It’s just getting harder and harder to brainwash people. But not altogether out of the question.
It’s almost impossible at times to comprehend just how inane these people are. But that’s the way most of us would have behaved too had we been raised among them. You’re watching this thinking, “no way in hell I would have put up with it. The bastards would all be dead.”
But life doesn’t work that way for the preponderance of us. Ideas, realites are put into our heads as children and you can’t just make them go away like snapping your fingers. But some do manage to prevail. Then it’s only a matter of what they put in its place, isn’t it? But the crucial factor here is always God. Take religion out of the picture and the sky is the limit. That and the power to prevail.
In one particular way rather than another.
Start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene ... %20Ireland.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Woman_in_the_Wall
The Magdalene Sisters
Father Doonigan: Rose, I am father Doonigan. I work for the St. John Adoption Society. Your father and I think the best thing for the child is to give him up for adoption. A child born outside of wedlock is a bastard. You want him to live all his life as an outcast, refused and scorned by all honest members of society? You committed a horrible sin.
Rose: I know, Father. I am repentant.
Father Doonigan: Do you want your child to pay for your sins?
Rose: No, Father.
Father Doonigan: So you do want to give him a chance in life, and have him raised in a Catholic family with a mother and father. Sign here.
On the dotted line.
Sister Bridget: The philosophy that supports us in the Magdalene Asylums is simple: Thanks to the power of prayer, of cleanliness, of hard work, Iost, fallen women can find their way back to Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior. Mary Magdalene, holy patron of the Magdalene Asylums, was a sinner of the worst kind. For money, she gave her body to the depraved and lustful. She was saved by doing pennance for her sins, giving up the pleasures of the flesh, including food and sleep. She worked beyond the resistance of a human being so that she could offer her soul to God, cross the gates of Paradise, and live an eternal life.
Religion in a nutshell let's call it.
Mr. O’Connor [returning his daughter to the asylum]: You’ve got no home. You have no mother. You got no father. You killed us, you slut. You killed us both. You run away again, I’ll cripple you. I swear to God.
Praise the Lord!
Bernadette: Having a baby’s not a crime.
Rose: Having a baby before you’re married is a mortal sin!
Bernadette: All the mortal sins in the world wouldn’t justify this place. I’ll tell you, I’d commit any sin, mortal or otherwise, to get the hell out of here.
Enough said?
Sister Bridget: Open your eyes, girl. Open them. I want you to see what you really are. Now that your hair and your vanity has gone and your arrogance has been defeated, you are free to choose between right and wrong, good and evil. Look into the bottom of your soul and find what is pure and offer it up to God. That is the only way to salvation.
The scary part: what if that's actually true?
Sister: There’s nothing like exercise before dinner. Anyway, someone should eat less potatoes. Hands along your sides. Frances, not only are your breasts the smallest I’ve ever seen, but you don’t even have nipples! Did you notice? That can’t be natural, right? We agree. Frances has the smallest breasts. Who has the biggest? I’d say Patricia. No. She has a big behind. Turn around, Patricia. See? Patricia, you have a bricklayer’s back. With a couple of tattoos, you’d look like a sailor. No, Cecilia is surely the winner for the biggest breasts. An applause for Cecilia. Good girl. We saw the biggest breasts, the smallest, and the biggest behind. There is only the hairiest one left. Crispina, one step forward. Bernadette, one step forward. Get alongside of each other. Crispina, take your hands away from there! Bernadette, you have more hair there than on your head. But the winner is… Crispina. Crispina, you won! Why are you crying?
Crispina: I don’t know, Sister.
Sister: Well, neither do I. It’s just a game. Ah, put your clothes on the lot of you. Time for tea.
Uh, a Catholic thing?