Compatibilism is impossible

[Atla]

Why does it mean those 59% of philosophers are entirely unconcerned with science?

I mean some of them may use the word determinism, but it has nothing to do with the determinism from science. And if you ignore something that basic, you're pretty much ignoring science in general.

I feel like there are a lot of things you're leaving unstated that make it look like large leaps to me, I'm not following. In what way do compatibilist philosophers use the word determinism that makes you say what you're saying?

Why are you asking me that, how should I know. To me determinism is a concept from science, so if compatibilists subscribe to a position that is a contradiction according to science, then those of them who are using the word honestly, must be talking about something unrelated to (modern) science.

[Flannel Jesus]

Why are you asking me that, how should I know. To me determinism is a concept from science, so if compatibilists subscribe to a position that is a contradiction according to science, then those of them who are using the word honestly, must be talking about something unrelated to (modern) science.

I'm asking you your reasons and thought processes for saying the things you're saying. If you don't know, who does?

[Atla]

Why are you asking me that, how should I know. To me determinism is a concept from science, so if compatibilists subscribe to a position that is a contradiction according to science, then those of them who are using the word honestly, must be talking about something unrelated to (modern) science.

I'm asking you your reasons and thought processes for saying the things you're saying. If you don't know, who does?

I just did. Why do you think that subscribing to a self-contradictory view is valid?

[Flannel Jesus]

Why are you asking me that, how should I know. To me determinism is a concept from science, so if compatibilists subscribe to a position that is a contradiction according to science, then those of them who are using the word honestly, must be talking about something unrelated to (modern) science.

I'm asking you your reasons and thought processes for saying the things you're saying. If you don't know, who does?

I just did.

I don't see that. You've said that compatibilists are somehow contradicting science, but you have not made it explicit at all which thing compatibilists are saying, and which bit of science they are contradicting. My questions here are aimed at getting some clarity in regards to these ideas you're presenting. I'm curious about them and what thoughts are behind them.

You've said they're contradicting science, would you clarify which of their statements are contradicting which bits of science?

[Atla]

I'm asking you your reasons and thought processes for saying the things you're saying. If you don't know, who does?

I just did.

I don't see that. You've said that compatibilists are somehow contradicting science, but you have not made it explicit at all which thing compatibilists are saying, and which bit of science they are contradicting. My questions here are aimed at getting some clarity in regards to these ideas you're presenting. I'm curious about them and what thoughts are behind them.

You've said they're contradicting science, would you clarify which of their statements are contradicting which bits of science?

Really?
There is no known example of breaking determinism according to science. There is no known method for it even in principle.

You can test this yourself in seconds, want something that goes against the known deterministic laws of physics, and it won't happen.

So those who claim that we can do it, are either ignoring science or just sophists engaged in the above conflation fallacy.

[Flannel Jesus]

Really?
There is no known example of breaking determinism according to science. There is no known method for it even in principle.

You can test this yourself in seconds, want something that goes against the known deterministic laws of physics, and it won't happen.

So those who claim that we can do it, are either ignoring science or just sophists engaged in the above conflation fallacy.

Ah, that's the thing you've been hiding. You believe compatibilists think free will is about breaking determinism. Thank you for making it explicit, that makes it much easier to have a discussion.

You might be surprised to learn that, in general, compatibilists don't actually think that.

[Atla]

Really?
There is no known example of breaking determinism according to science. There is no known method for it even in principle.

You can test this yourself in seconds, want something that goes against the known deterministic laws of physics, and it won't happen.

So those who claim that we can do it, are either ignoring science or just sophists engaged in the above conflation fallacy.

Ah, that's the thing you've been hiding. You believe compatibilists think free will is about breaking determinism. Thank you for making it explicit, that makes it much easier to have a discussion.

You might be surprised to learn that, in general, compatibilists don't actually think that.

Which is why those kind of compatibilists are sophists, engaged in a conflation fallacy. Which is what I said. So much for "hiding".

The average philosophers need to get paid too, so they'll spend their time on stuff like this.

[Flannel Jesus]

Which is why those kind of compatibilists are sophists, engaged in a conflation fallacy. Which is what I said. So much for "hiding".

The average philosophers need to get paid too, so they'll spend their time on stuff like this.

Which kind of compatibilists? I don't understand.

[Atla]

Which is why those kind of compatibilists are sophists, engaged in a conflation fallacy. Which is what I said. So much for "hiding".

The average philosophers need to get paid too, so they'll spend their time on stuff like this.

Which kind of compatibilists? I don't understand.

The ones you just mentioned?

[Flannel Jesus]

The ones you just mentioned?

I didn't mention any specific type of compatibilists. I said that the thing you disagreed with about compatibilism is in fact not a thing most compatibilists think (arguably ANY, though I can't discount the possibility that some person out there calls themselves a compatibilist and thinks the thing you said).

[Atla]

The ones you just mentioned?

I didn't mention any specific type of compatibilists. I said that the thing you disagreed with about compatibilism is in fact not a thing most compatibilists think (arguably ANY, though I can't discount the possibility that some person out there calls themselves a compatibilist and thinks the thing you said).

You can't remember what you just said but you keep remembering something I didn't say?

[Flannel Jesus]

You can't remember what you just said but you keep remembering something I didn't say?

What am I remembering that you didn't say?

What thing did I say that I can't remember?

[Atla]

You can't remember what you just said but you keep remembering something I didn't say?

What am I remembering that you didn't say?

What thing did I say that I can't remember?

I acknowledged from the start that compatibilists typically believe in determinism.

[Flannel Jesus]

You can't remember what you just said but you keep remembering something I didn't say?

What am I remembering that you didn't say?

What thing did I say that I can't remember?

I acknowledged from the start that compatibilists typically believe in determinism.

You are not answering my questions very directly in this conversation, but instead very indirectly, making it hard for me to find out what you actually think. I have no idea how this is an answer to my question. I would like to just have a chilled out discussion with you about your thoughts but you seem reluctant to clarify.

[Atla]

What am I remembering that you didn't say?

What thing did I say that I can't remember?

I acknowledged from the start that compatibilists typically believe in determinism.

You are not answering my questions very directly in this conversation, but instead very indirectly, making it hard for me to find out what you actually think. I have no idea how this is an answer to my question. I would like to just have a chilled out discussion with you about your thoughts but you seem reluctant to clarify.

I was clear enough, it's like you can't or don't want to follow anything.