My Metaphysics

[Harbal]

As I stated above to iwannaplato, this thread was made in my frustration with talking to IC in the Christianity thread.

Frustrated by talking to IC about Christianity, you say?

[Gary Childress]

As I stated above to iwannaplato, this thread was made in my frustration with talking to IC in the Christianity thread.

Frustrated by talking to IC about Christianity, you say?

Yes, because he seems to think Christianity is the real deal (or whatever one should call it). It's a nice approach to life but as far as I'm concerned I don't see reason to believe that Christ was God incarnate any more than any other human being might or might not be. When asked to show his evidence for Christ being God incarnate, he doesn't give it. But that's fine, I'll accept that he's not going to share whatever it is that he thinks is evidence but I'm not going to accept his word for it 'just because' or whatever.

[Iwannaplato]

As I stated above to iwannaplato, this thread was made in my frustration with talking to IC in the Christianity thread.

Frustrated by talking to IC about Christianity, you say?

Yes, because he seems to think Christianity is the real deal (or whatever one should call it). It's a nice approach to life but as far as I'm concerned I don't see reason to believe that Christ was God incarnate any more than any other human being might or might not be. When asked to show his evidence for Christ being God incarnate, he doesn't give it. But that's fine, I'll accept that he's not going to share whatever it is that he thinks is evidence but I'm not going to accept his word for it 'just because' or whatever.

Sounds reasonable.

[phyllo]

As I stated above to iwannaplato, this thread was made in my frustration with talking to IC in the Christianity thread.

Frustrated by talking to IC about Christianity, you say?

Yes, because he seems to think Christianity is the real deal (or whatever one should call it). It's a nice approach to life but as far as I'm concerned I don't see reason to believe that Christ was God incarnate any more than any other human being might or might not be. When asked to show his evidence for Christ being God incarnate, he doesn't give it. But that's fine, I'll accept that he's not going to share whatever it is that he thinks is evidence but I'm not going to accept his word for it 'just because' or whatever.

What difference does it make whether Jesus was just a man with an understanding of God or Jesus was "God incarnate"?

The important point seems to be whether Jesus presents a good philosophy of life or not.

Does it work? Is it nonsense? Should one adopt Jesus' way of living?

[Wizard22]

As I stated above to iwannaplato, this thread was made in my frustration with talking to IC in the Christianity thread. I do not "refer to Christ as God". I refer to others' belief that Christ is "God" (or that one must "accept" Christ as the only way to God, or whatever).

As far as my other comments, I'm not going to go into an exhaustive reiteration of how they all fit into my views from a position of agnosticism because it is exhausting. The very fact that you all are questioning my views tells me that you think it's somehow important for me to be in some kind of particular alignment (or frame of mind) or for you all to know what my alignment (or frame of mind) is.

This is my alignment or frame of mind: As I've stated repeatedly, I am agnostic. When others tell me that there is a God or not a God or anything that I myself am unable to verify, then I am skeptical of those claims because if I can't verify it, then I see no way that anyone else can verify it either unless God did something miraculous to somehow reveal to them but didn't reveal to me. I'm not interested in taking sides. I'm more interested in getting along with others. If I am required by another to side against someone else, then I'm not going to do it unless there is good reason to, such as if the one I'm asked to side against is out to do serious harm. Then I would wish to ask the other who wishes to do serious harm why s/he wants to do serious harm and see if there's a way to peacefully settle it.

You've mentioned expectations, upon others and God, that leave you unfulfilled.

If your expectations are premised upon false beliefs or lies, then yes, you will remain unfulfilled in life.

If you do not want to engage with others about these expectations, then it is quite redundant to make a thread about it and press it toward the public.

Technically, you asked for this.

[Gary Childress]

As I stated above to iwannaplato, this thread was made in my frustration with talking to IC in the Christianity thread. I do not "refer to Christ as God". I refer to others' belief that Christ is "God" (or that one must "accept" Christ as the only way to God, or whatever).

As far as my other comments, I'm not going to go into an exhaustive reiteration of how they all fit into my views from a position of agnosticism because it is exhausting. The very fact that you all are questioning my views tells me that you think it's somehow important for me to be in some kind of particular alignment (or frame of mind) or for you all to know what my alignment (or frame of mind) is.

This is my alignment or frame of mind: As I've stated repeatedly, I am agnostic. When others tell me that there is a God or not a God or anything that I myself am unable to verify, then I am skeptical of those claims because if I can't verify it, then I see no way that anyone else can verify it either unless God did something miraculous to somehow reveal to them but didn't reveal to me. I'm not interested in taking sides. I'm more interested in getting along with others. If I am required by another to side against someone else, then I'm not going to do it unless there is good reason to, such as if the one I'm asked to side against is out to do serious harm. Then I would wish to ask the other who wishes to do serious harm why s/he wants to do serious harm and see if there's a way to peacefully settle it.

You've mentioned expectations, upon others and God, that leave you unfulfilled.

If your expectations are premised upon false beliefs or lies, then yes, you will remain unfulfilled in life.

If you do not want to engage with others about these expectations, then it is quite redundant to make a thread about it and press it toward the public.

Technically, you asked for this.

I didn't say I "don't want to engage with others." If you feel that I have some "false beiefs or lies" then I will welcome clarity on what "false beliefs or lies" my "expectations" are premised on, if you have interest or inclination in doing so.

[Gary Childress]

Frustrated by talking to IC about Christianity, you say?

Yes, because he seems to think Christianity is the real deal (or whatever one should call it). It's a nice approach to life but as far as I'm concerned I don't see reason to believe that Christ was God incarnate any more than any other human being might or might not be. When asked to show his evidence for Christ being God incarnate, he doesn't give it. But that's fine, I'll accept that he's not going to share whatever it is that he thinks is evidence but I'm not going to accept his word for it 'just because' or whatever.

What difference does it make whether Jesus was just a man with an understanding of God or Jesus was "God incarnate"?

The important point seems to be whether Jesus presents a good philosophy of life or not.

Does it work? Is it nonsense? Should one adopt Jesus' way of living?

If Jesus is/were God it might not make much difference to me or it might. I think Christ's words, most of them, show a great deal of awareness and care for those in society who live in great despair and therefore need people like him to be there for them too (as far as I'm able to tell).

[promethean75]

everyone's agnostic, gary, because nobody can know whether or not a god exists. what they believe and have faith in is irrelevant in this case. one doesn't cease being agnostic by choosing one particular religion or another. the fact remains; they don't know whether or not a god exists.

nevermind all that tho. the better question is, why would u willingly choose to worship and commit to a god like the one described in the bible, even if this god did exist? Are u a sadist or just an imbecile?

[Gary Childress]

everyone's agnostic, gary, because nobody can know whether or not a god exists. what they believe and have faith in is irrelevant in this case. one doesn't cease being agnostic by choosing one particular religion or another. the fact remains; they don't know whether or not a god exists.

nevermind all that tho. the better question is, why would u willingly choose to worship and commit to a god like the one described in the bible, even if this god did exist? Are u a sadist or just an imbecile?

I'm agnostic. I can't rule out that the Bible can't be the words of God. I hope God is not the type of God who would unleash disasters due to being angry with us, however, considering history and physics as they are understood to apply to the universe, I can't exactly rule that out either.

[promethean75]

the two biggest watershed moments is the history of what future historians who won't exist will refer to as 'the beginning of the end of the erf' were the codification of Christianity (platonism for the masses) and the death of Lenin when that super mario brothers lookin motherfucker Stalin took power.

no other two events were ever nor will ever be as decisive, and we are fast approaching that point of no return. how do i know this. i know this when i personally stop having sympathy and compassion for the working classes after observing what they've become (in first world countries). turned (back) into strangely gratuitous but super advanced monkeys by the powers of late stage capitalism/consumerism. over half the world still believes in god. there are people today in this 21rst century of space travel and quantum computing, still shitting in buckets if they don't starve to death. the wealth gap is so dramatic, some individual company owners have more money than entire countries. u have ordinary knucklehead working russian citizens rushing out into the street to greet and praise Putin. the very next day he orders a missle strike on Ukraine and obliterates a working class family of Ukrainians.

anyway what I'm saying is I think we might be too far gone

i can somehow intuit this... like a sixth sense. i think we need an alien intervention. yo I just watched the day the earth stood still again yesterday and we totally need Keanu Reeves as Klaatu.

[promethean75]

"I hope God is not the type of God who would unleash disasters due to being angry with us

what the fuck does what some shmuck who existed five thousand years ago who happened to piss god off, have to do with me, and why am i being punished for it?

now check this out. while u can't be certain whether or not the bible is the word of god (it very well could be), u can be certain any god who would have a word like that has got to be a real piece of work, pal. that book literally reads like a harry potter novel for adults, gary. if a god actually existed, he'd talk like Kant or Aristotle. his 'word' would be clear, comprehensive, unambiguously instructive, elegant, not riddled with fantasy genre prose and stories of dragons with lion heads and impossibly large ships with two of every species of animal that no dude could ever possibly collect, sailing around a flooded earth, etc.

just think about the content of the bible. in fact think about the ten commandments. imagine that; life being so simple u only needed ten instructions.

and when u are faced with extremely complex social/economic/political problems, u are given something you'd find in a fortune cookie or one of those little daily reflections books u read while on the toilet: do onto others as u would have them do unto u and love you're neighbor.

Now compare how hard Aristotle and Kant went when describing good and virtuous conduct to the mickey mouse stuff in the bible.

[phyllo]

If Jesus is/were God it might not make much difference to me or it might.

At least that's settled.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

everyone's agnostic, gary, because nobody can know whether or not a god exists. what they believe and have faith in is irrelevant in this case. one doesn't cease being agnostic by choosing one particular religion or another. the fact remains; they don't know whether or not a god exists.

nevermind all that tho. the better question is, why would u willingly choose to worship and commit to a god like the one described in the bible, even if this god did exist? Are u a sadist or just an imbecile?

I'm agnostic. I can't rule out that the Bible can't be the words of God. I hope God is not the type of God who would unleash disasters due to being angry with us, however, considering history and physics as they are understood to apply to the universe, I can't exactly rule that out either.

Which is why IC homes in on you like a rat to cheese. Proselytising relgious nuts like IC can sniff out indecisiveness in a potential victim like an airport sniffer dog and cocaine.

[Gary Childress]

everyone's agnostic, gary, because nobody can know whether or not a god exists. what they believe and have faith in is irrelevant in this case. one doesn't cease being agnostic by choosing one particular religion or another. the fact remains; they don't know whether or not a god exists.

nevermind all that tho. the better question is, why would u willingly choose to worship and commit to a god like the one described in the bible, even if this god did exist? Are u a sadist or just an imbecile?

I'm agnostic. I can't rule out that the Bible can't be the words of God. I hope God is not the type of God who would unleash disasters due to being angry with us, however, considering history and physics as they are understood to apply to the universe, I can't exactly rule that out either.

Which is why IC homes in on you like a rat to cheese. Proselytising relgious nuts like IC can sniff out indecisiveness in a potential victim like an airport sniffer dog and cocaine.

Yes. I realize that.

It's like AJ telling me he'll send venomous Columbian jumping spiders to track me down if I pleasure myself or a witch doctor putting a vodoo curse on a Southern Plantation owner who has enslaved him. They prey on that seed of possibility that will haunt the mind of the guilty.

That's fine. I try not to make slaves out of others and I pleasure myself much less now than when I was younger and single. Therefore, I'll fire back an equal "curse" on anyone who tries to put one in my head. If there's a God, then some people maybe ought to worry about whether or not the creator of the universe approves of what they're doing before condemning others. But they'll try every trick in the book they can think of regardless.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

I'm agnostic. I can't rule out that the Bible can't be the words of God. I hope God is not the type of God who would unleash disasters due to being angry with us, however, considering history and physics as they are understood to apply to the universe, I can't exactly rule that out either.

Which is why IC homes in on you like a rat to cheese. Proselytising relgious nuts like IC can sniff out indecisiveness in a potential victim like an airport sniffer dog and cocaine.

Yes. I realize that.

It's like AJ telling me he'll send venomous Columbian jumping spiders to track me down if I pleasure myself or a witch doctor putting a vodoo curse on a Southern Plantation owner who has enslaved him. They prey on that seed of possibility that will haunt the mind of the guilty.

That's fine. I try not to make slaves out of others and I pleasure myself much less now than when I was younger and single. Therefore, I'll fire back an equal "curse" on anyone who tries to put one in my head. If there's a God, then some people maybe ought to worry about whether or not the creator of the universe approves of what they're doing before condemning others. But they'll try every trick in the book they can think of regardless.

Do you talk about 'pleasuring yourself' with strangers in your everyday life? It's not something I really need to know about.