The meaning of life

[Dontaskme]

Nobody has ever seen , heard, touched, or smelled a purpose. People have observed what seem to be people and other animals looking as if they purposed to do what they are doing or are about to do. But nobody can ever detect this thing people call
a purpose

Similarly nobody has ever detected this thing people call a meaning. There is no such THING as a meaning. What there is is people meaning some idea such as meaning to go to bed soon, or meaning that roses are pretty, or meaning that they are in love etc etc.

So there is no such THING as meaning of life.

Very well said Belinda.

To put in another context: The usefulness, purpose and meaning to a cup is in its emptiness.

[Lacewing]

The usefulness, purpose and meaning to a cup is in its emptiness.

Why isn't its usefulness in its fullness as well?

[Harbal]

Very well said Belinda.

What about me?

I suppose you think I'm just talking rubbish.

[Dontaskme]

The usefulness, purpose and meaning to a cup is in its emptiness.

Why isn't its usefulness in its fullness as well?

Yes,the usefulness of the emptiness becomes very apparent in the cups capacity to not only be empty but also be full simultaneously.

[Dontaskme]

Very well said Belinda.

What about me?

I suppose you think I'm just talking rubbish.

Not rubbish within the context of the dream of conceptual separation. As all concepts such as usefulness, purpose and meaning are known as invisible mental constructions only. These known concepts are NEVER SEEN

[Dontaskme]

Very well said Belinda.

What about me?

I suppose you think I'm just talking rubbish.

Not rubbish within the context of the dream of conceptual separation. As all concepts such as usefulness, purpose and meaning are known as invisible mental constructions only. These known concepts are NEVER SEEN

What is the artificial dream of conceptual separation? And why do we maintain this position, this duality?

http://praveennv.blogspot.com/2016/03/w ... -this.html

[Age]

Age wrote:

(Belinda had written: ↑Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:05 am
There is no such thing as an objective purpose.)




Nobody has ever seen , heard, touched, or smelled a purpose. People have observed what seem to be people and other animals looking as if they purposed to do what they are doing or are about to do. But nobody can ever detect this thing people call
a purpose

Have you EVER gone to the store to get some 'thing'?

If yes, then you did 'that' ON 'purpose'. That is; you PURPOSELY did some 'thing'. The 'purpose' of you going to the store was to GET some 'thing'.

Could there be an 'objective' 'purpose' for 'you', human beings, being here in 'Life', alive and living?

I SAY, 'Yes', but 'you' SAY, 'No', correct?

What you are proposing here is the SAME AS there proposing NO 'body' has EVER seen, heard, touched, no smelt hope, love, hate, wisdom, mind, anger, happiness, admiration, adoration, aesthetic appreciation, amusement, anger, anxiety, awe, awkwardness, boredom, calmness, confusion, craving, disgust, empathic pain, entrancement, excitement, fear, horror, interest, joy, nostalgia, relief, romance, sadness, satisfaction, sexual desire, nor surprise EITHER, therefore, to you, NO 'body' can detect these things people call 'all of the above'.

Similarly nobody has ever detected this thing people call a meaning. There is no such THING as a meaning. What there is is people meaning some idea such as meaning to go to bed soon, or meaning that roses are pretty, or meaning that they are in love etc etc.

So there is no such THING as meaning of life.

I think you have MISSED the POINT, COMPLETELY.

And, if you would like to CONTINUE on with this DISCUSSION, then GREAT. But, if you BELIEVE you have NOT MISSED ANY thing here and that there is NO such 'thing' as 'meaning' or 'purpose' in Life, and so there is NOTHING further to DISCUSS here, then that is PERFECTLY FINE with me, AS WELL.

I know and have used the phrase 'on purpose' in everyday conversations. I say "I came into the kitchen on purpose to do something and I forget what it was." When I am doing philosophy I have to be use more explicit language. If I had been a forgetful philosopher I'd have said " I came into the kitchen purposing to do something and I forget what it was." English is ambiguous and philosophers have to explain what they mean. No philosopher believes that purposes are real in the world things that hang about like invisible presences. So philosophers often prefer verbs to nouns.

I do NOT even know of ANY who speaks of 'purposes'.

And, you speak as though what so-called "philosophers" say and write is some sort of absolute truth. By the way, what, EXACTLY, IS a "philosopher" to you anyway?

People mean, people purpose. There is no a priori meaning or purpose to be found, apart from what people do.

And IF people are BEHAVING in A True and Right way, in accordance WITH 'Life', Itself, then it could be SAID and ARGUED that those people are FULFILLING their PURPOSE in Life.

But one HAS TO BE OPEN enough FIRST to ACCEPT that JUST MAYBE there IS A PURPOSE to Existence, or to this LIVING and BEING ALIVE 'thing'.

[Age]

I am WAITING, patiently, for those who are Truly INTERESTED.

Okay, I'll ask: Will you explain what the objective purpose of human beings is?

And, I will repeat what I have previously written. To make 'Life', Itself, BETTER for EVERY one.

COULD THERE BE 'objective purpose', to you?

I think it possible, but unlikely.

SAYING what you have here is MUCH BETTER than STATING and CLAIMING, There is NO 'objective purpose'. See, now we CAN have an ACTUAL DISCUSSION.

[Age]

I am WAITING, patiently, for those who are Truly INTERESTED.

Okay, I'll ask: Will you explain what the objective purpose of human beings is?

COULD THERE BE 'objective purpose', to you?

I think it possible, but unlikely.

It's unlikely that human beings as a species purpose anything in particular.

WHEN YOU SPEAK like you are here what are you ACTUALLY SAYING and MEANING?

Individual human beings sometimes purpose alike at least for a limited duration. For instance fans of a specific football team all purpose to support their team, then when the game is over a fan purposes to buy a fish supper, while another fan purposes to book a foreign holiday, another fan means to go home and feed her hens.

What does the word 'purpose' mean or refer to, to 'you', "belinda"?

Someone asked me "What is the objective purpose of your slow cooker?" I replied " I once meant to cook lentil stew in it, and now I mean to give it away."

WHEN did someone, PURPORTEDLY, asked you that question "belinda"? And, who were they?

If you want to know what God means humans to do you had better ask someone who knows God. There are a few of those who write here regularly.
There is no use asking Nature what she purposes for human beings as Nature does not purpose.

What IS the DIFFERENCE between God and Nature, to 'you', "belinda"?

[Age]

BOTH 'matter' AND 'space' have ALWAYS co-existed together FOREVER, and this is because there can NOT be ANY OTHER way. 'They' HAVE TO ALWAYS BE inter-being.

This continually ALWAYS CHANGING in the HERE-NOW 'co-existence' is what IS causing and creating EVERY 'thing'. 'Matter' being able to move ABSOLUTELY FREELY ALLOWS itself to REACT WITH its self, which is what IS CREATING thee Self.

Ultimately we cannot even say that reality exists prior to and beyond the limits of the finite mind,

To make this CLAIM, ACCURATE, one would have to FIRST be able to DEFINE the words 'reality', 'mind', AND 'finite mind' ABSOLUTELY and SUFFICIENTLY.

We AWAIT one's ACCURATE DEFINITIONS here now.

because there is no discrete, independently existing finite mind for reality to be either dependent or independent of. There is just a single, infinite and indivisible whole, whose nature is undefined, because it cannot be described with reference to non-existent things.

So, WHY even 'TRY TO' DEFINE or DESCRIBE ANY 'thing' with reference to non-existent things?

OBVIOUSLY there is ONLY One INDIVISIBLE 'Thing', BUT just AS OBVIOUS this One INDIVISIBLE 'Thing' has EVOLVED, which, ESSENTIALLY, just means CHANGED, into COMING-TO-HAVE 'thought' and 'thinking', 'language', and the ABILITY to CONCEPTUALLY 'SEPARATE' Its 'Self' into MANY 'things', through the ART of NAMELY and LABELING. AND, just because these NAMED and LABELLED 'things' might NOT ACTUALLY BE what IS ACTUALLY IRREFUTABLY True NOR REAL, DESCRIBING or DEFINING those 'things' as NON-EXISTENT 'things' will NEVER WORK in relation to what IS ACTUALLY IRREFUTABLY True, AND REAL.

But however we define it, it is a single, infinite and indivisible whole, which, interacting with itself in the form of the subject/object relationship, appears to itself as a universe. As such, the universe is eternal and changeless in nature but temporary and ever-changing in appearance.

OF COURSE.

'you', "dontaskme", have been 'saying' this ALL ALONG, which I have been continually INFORMING 'you' that what 'you' have been and are SAYING is ACTUALLY ESSENTIALLY True and Right, but as I have ALSO been INFORMING 'you', the language and words that 'you' have been USING do NOT and will NOT WORK.

But, as EVERY 'thing' CONTINUALLY CHANGES, so TO WILL the WORDS and LANGUAGE that 'you', human beings, USE, UNTIL ONE DAY WHEN 'you' ARRIVE AT and COME TO the True and Right WORDS and LANGUAGE, ALSO, and, literally, AS WELL.

[Harbal]

Okay, I'll ask: Will you explain what the objective purpose of human beings is?

And, I will repeat what I have previously written. To make 'Life', Itself, BETTER for EVERY one.

Will you now explain why you consider that to be an objective truth, rather than your own subjective intuition, or feeeling, that it ought to be the case?

[Age]

EXCEPT for the One and ONLY EXISTING Thing, known as, and called, 'The Universe'.

This One Thing is ALONE and SINGLE and thus is NOT dependent upon ANT thing else.

Every one individual 'thing' is alone 'all one' in it's own aloneness we call the universe. Every 'ONE' is alone.

To 'you', "dontaskme", are there MANY 'things' or just One 'Thing'?

“It is only when we have renounced our preoccupation with "I," "me," "mine," that we can truly possess the world in which we live.

But, the word 'I' MEANS or REFERS to thee One and ONLY 'Thing', or 'Self'.

The words 'me' and 'mine' are in reference to 'you', human beings, who like to SEE "yourselves" BIGGER and BETTER than what 'you' REALLY ARE.

Everything, provided that we regard nothing as property. And not only is everything ours; it is also everybody else's.”

EVERY 'thing', that is; EVERY 'one' TOGETHER is thee One True and REAL 'Self'. Which, literally, translates to; EVERY 'thing' is the property of thee One and ONLY True 'Self', but NOT in the sense of OWNING but in the sense of BEING. That is; CARING FOR One's True 'Self' is, literally, CARING for ABSOLUTELY EVERY 'thing' as being a PART OF 'One's Self'.

"All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone"

ALL 'problems' ARISE from 'you', human beings.

A 'problem' is, literally, just a question posed for a solution. So, EVERY 'problem', in Life, was and is CREATED by 'you', human beings. AND, for EVERY 'problem' there IS A 'solution'. AND, for EVERY 'solution' there is A 'formula'. And, the ONLY REAL 'problem', in Life, that is; the ONLY REAL question, posed for A 'solution', in Life, is: What is THE 'solution' to ALL of 'our', human being made, problems? And, THE answer, thus solution to that question and problem IS - Honesty, Openness, with a serious Willing, or Want, to CHANGE, for the better. Therefore, the formula, which WILL SOLVE ALL of human beings made and created problems IS - H.O.W.

H.O.W is, literally, HOW ALL problems CAN BE and WILL BE RE-SOLVED. I say RE-SOLVED because this RESOLUTION to this One and ONLY REAL 'problem', in Life, will come-to-be THE SOLUTION that IS ALREADY KNOWN, DEEP DOWN as some might say, IN THE UNCONSCIOUS. This RESOLUTION is ACTUALLY THE RE-SOLUTION as when 'It' BECOMES CONSCIOUSLY KNOWN was ALREADY ALWAYS KNOWN INSTINCTIVELY, INTERNALLY, and/or INTUITIVELY anyway.

BUT, in the days when this is being written, 'you', adult human beings are STILL somewhat away from SEEING and UNDERSTANDING this FULLY and ACCURATELY.

[Age]

There is no such THING as a purpose. To purpose is a verb. Purposing is something only people and other animals that have central nervous systems do, if they do it at all. Many people and other animals don't purpose they simply react.

But "purpose" is also a noun, isn't it? This is what I understand the word to mean: "The reason for which something is done or created or for which something exists."

For those who do NOT KNOW HOW to FIND the MEANING of 'things/words', then what "harbal" HAS DONE HERE is a PERFECT EXAMPLE of WHAT TO DO.

A saw is designed and made with conscious intention as a tool for cutting through wood. Therefore, the purpose of a saw is to cut through wood. A saw has that purpose by virtue of being given it by its creator. A heart could be said to have the purpose of pumping blood, but hearts are not the product of conscious intention; they came about by a different process altogether.

BUT, it MIGHT JUST BE FOUND OUT and DISCOVERED, or UNCOVERED, that ACTUALLY there WAS/IS some sort of 'conscious intention' WAS/IS INVOLVED here. We WILL just HAVE TO WAIT, to SEE. Unless, OF COURSE, 'you', "harbal", ALREADY KNOW, FOR SURE and WITHOUT DOUBT, that human beings and/or the hearts within human bodies ARE DEFINITELY and ABSOLUTELY NOT the product of 'conscious intention' AT ALL.

So, although -it seems to me- saws and hearts both have a purpose, there is a distinction of some sort to be made between "purpose" as applied to one, and "purpose" as applied to the other. Or maybe that distinction isn't relevant in the case of what is being discussed here. I don't know.

I think what will be FOUND and UNCOVERED here is that there IS ACTUALLY MORE 'relevance' than was FIRST THOUGHT.

Of course, the aforementioned distinction would disappear if someone were to bring God, or some other intelligent designer of human beings into the matter, but then theists and none theists would have to go their seperate ways at that point.

WOULD God NEED "someone ELSE" to 'bring God', or some other 'intelligent designer of human beings, and EVERY 'thing' ELSE into the matter?

There is NO ACTUAL REAL DISTINCTION here. But this ALL BECOMES VERY CLEAR WHEN one LEARNS and KNOWS HOW to SEE ALL 'things' for what they ALL REALLY ARE, EXACTLY.

[Age]

The usefulness, purpose and meaning to a cup is in its emptiness.

Why isn't its usefulness in its fullness as well?

Yes,the usefulness of the emptiness becomes very apparent in the cups capacity to not only be empty but also be full simultaneously.

So, to FIND and SEE the True and REAL 'usefulness', 'purposefulness', and 'meaningfulness' IS to LOOK AT, and preferably DISCUSS, ALL 'things', or EVERY 'thing', and NOT just SOME 'things', Right?

[Age]

Very well said Belinda.

What about me?

I suppose you think I'm just talking rubbish.

Not rubbish within the context of the dream of conceptual separation. As all concepts such as usefulness, purpose and meaning are known as invisible mental constructions only. These known concepts are NEVER SEEN

BUT THEY ARE.

They ARE SEEN in written words, or sign language, and they ARE HEARD in spoken words.

ALL 'mental constructs', which are, essentially just PERCEPTIONS or REFLECTIONS of the Everything, broken down into PARTS, are ALSO SEEN, literally, IN and WITH 'understanding', itself.

When 'I' ask 'you', Do 'you' UNDERSTAND what 'I' MEAN? 'I' am ALSO asking, Do 'you' SEE what 'I' MEAN? Which MEANS 'I' have SHARED the 'mental constructs', or 'concepts', WITHIN one human body to "ANOTHER" human body, and 'you' can EITHER SEE AND UNDERSTAND what was being MEANT, or NOT.

Therefore, KNOWN 'concepts' CAN, literally, be SEEN, or UNDERSTOOD. But, just AS OBVIOUS are 'thoughts', themselves, can NEVER be SEEN with the physical human eyes. And, ALL 'mental constructs' and 'concepts' ARE, essentially, JUST 'thoughts', themselves. But the MEANING BEHIND ALL 'thoughts' and 'perception' can BE UNDERSTOOD, and thus SEEN.

ONCE MORE, 'it', or absolutely 'EVERY thing', is ALL DEPENDENT UPON what is ACTUALLY being MEANT. So, what this MEANS IS IF 'known concepts' can be SEEN or NEVER SEEN ALL DEPENDS on what 'you' MEAN by the word 'SEEN' and/or WHAT MEANING 'you' ARE GIVING to the word 'SEEN' here.

AGAIN, ABSOLUTELY EVERY 'thing' is, literally, RELATIVE to the "observer".

What IS, and IS NOT, 'SEEN' is ALL DEPENDENT UPON on THE WAY the "observer" LOOKS AT and SEES 'things', and ALSO ON what MEANING the "observer" HAS and GIVES to the words that 'they' USE.

What 'you', human beings, do NOT YET REALIZE, in the days when this is being written, is just HOW IMPORTANT the words ARE that 'you' SAY and USE to "yourselves". This MEANS 'internally' AND 'externally', but maybe more so INTERNALLY.