Ukraine Crisis

[promethean75]

"cut & paste, re-state, or stay silent."

Copy that, ghost rider.

"your cross-pollination project"

I am a refugee from a crumbling Idiocracy.

[iambiguous]

From the NYT...

"KYIV, Ukraine — President Volodymyr Zelensky of Ukraine agreed on Sunday to talks with Russia 'without preconditions,' even as President Vladimir V. Putin further escalated tensions by placing his nuclear forces on alert."

Talks and tanks. Negotiations and nuclear bombs. And it all comes down to dasein. To how Putin's past predisposed him to think this instead of that. Just like all the rest of us interacting with others out in the is/ought world. Only unlike us, Putin...

[henry quirk]

I would advise any and all Ukrainians to put down their weapons and apply civil disobediance - why fight the capitialsist war for them?

D4FB9077-E3A1-42E6-9981-0BE5E2DFF942.png

Good point. I suppose it would be better to ask the Russian soldiers why they are fighting Putin's war for him and for them to put down their weapons and apply civil disobedience.

Some are just followin' orders cuz it a job. Some truly believe in a resurgent Soviet State. Some are aimless and are comfortable bein' directed, and some have or will fight for other side.

[henry quirk]

dasein...how Putin's past predisposed him to think this instead of that

Yes, we know...there's nuthin' more to Putin, or you, or me, or him, or her than a program.

Roombas: all.

[iambiguous]

dasein...how Putin's past predisposed him to think this instead of that

Yes, we know...there's nuthin' more to Putin, or you, or me, or him, or her than a program.

Roombas: all.

Actually, my point is more in the way of suggesting that what's true of Putin is true of you and I too.

Russia invades Ukraine. Now, as philosophers or ethicists or political scientists, is there a way for us using the technical tools at our disposal -- logic, epistemology -- to determine either 1] the optimal frame of mind in reacting to it or 2] the only possible rational assessment period.

Is that how we ourselves go about determining our own point of view? Or is it far more likely that the reason many of the opinions expressed here are in conflict is because we have led very different lives. We have had very different experiences, interacted in very different relationships and came into contact with very different information, knowledge and ideas?

It's not a "program" so much as a predisposition. An existential predilection derived from a life we only have so much understanding of and control over.

Now, Putin strikes me as dangerous here because he is not a Lenin or a Mao or a Fidel. A full-blown Marxist out to change the world for the better. A revolutionary. Instead, he is dangerous because everything seems to revolve for him around "me, myself and I". He is a narcissist...maybe even a sociopath. A thug.

You can't "reason" with him by arguing that your own "principles" should prevail. And not just in Ukraine, right? But everywhere.

In other words, can't the self-righteous idealists here be equally dangerous?

It's just that now the stakes revolve around a possible nuclear exchange itself. The end of the world as we know it.

So, given your own assessment of the invasion, if you were Joe Biden, what would you do to drive the Russians out? What is the most rational and virtuous, uh, philosophical response?

[Age]

Oh, I'm a far bigger pain in the ass than you, and I'm crazier too.

-----



This...



...this a good example.

1. How, EXACTLY, does an "autistic" write?

2. If that is a "good example" of "autistic writing", then what is 'it', EXACTLY, which makes "those words" appear AUTISTIC, to you?

3. Do you understand what I am saying and meaning in 'those words'? If no, then WHY NOT?

4. If you were to just say, "because it is autistic writing", then I and others could also just make the claim that your writings are "'autistic writings" when we just do not understand what you are saying and meaning?

5. What does the word 'autistic' even mean, or refer to, to you?

6. If you do NOT understand what "another" is saying, then has it NEVER come to 'thought', nor occurred to you, to just question the "other" about what 'it' is EXACTLY that they are actually meaning? Or, if you have, then do you just not want to understand and learn more, and so do NOT question the "other"? After all 'you' have certainly NOT questioned 'me' about my writings and preferred to just SAY and CLAIM they are "autistic writings".

7. And, are you sure I only have one and only "problem"? If yes, then if I could solve 'this' "writing like an austistic" so-called "problem", then, to you, would 'you', human beings, then be able to FULLY understand my writings?

Oh, and by the way, when and IF 'you' ever work out, or learn, and discover 'Who and what 'I' am', EXACTLY, then what I have SAID and WROTE above will make PERFECT SENSE. So, what appears as "autistic writing", to some, may well EXPLAIN a GREAT DEAL, to "others".

We will just have to WAIT, to SEE.

See how you fixate on the irrelevant?

If, and WHEN, these questions are answered Honestly, then how much 'relevance' there REALLY IS will be REVEALED.

You just don't know when to stop.

ACCUSATIONS, or CLAIMS, were MADE. What I do with THEM is my CHOICE.

If 'you' want 'me' to STOP, then tell "yourselves" to STOP SAYING and/or CLAIMING 'things'.

Classic autistic/aspergers/or whatever the fuck label they give insanity these days, behaviour.

We notice that 'you' have NOT YET STOPPED. Do 'you' put these SAME 'labels' onto 'you' as well?

If no, then WHY NOT?

Get over yourself.

'you', people, say and write 'things'. I CAN ask questions, challenge, or point out and show 'things' in response if I want to.

It could be argued that for one to say to "another", "You just do not know when to stop", with the expectation that "they" SHOULD, and telling "another" to, "Get over yourself", is a True SIGN of 'one' who has, literally, NOT YET worked out HOW to get over "them" 'self'.

TELLING 'me' to STOP, and NOT engage with "another" here, especially when they make ACCUSATIONS and CLAIMS about what 'I' am doing here, only encourages me MORE to NOT STOP. Understood?

[Sculptor]

Yes. I think this is the way of the future. Also, the executive power of US Presidents must be curtailed to exclude the ability to declare war without the consent of the American people. And there needs to be a free press that will report things objectively and not just the way official sources want them to be reported. I think something like that would best be achieved through the decentralization of media ownership.

Yes that was the early dream of the Internet but things are not turning out too well ATM.
I think we see the paradox between anarchy and control.
Control needed to keep to the facts, and the anarchy needed to avoid those facts being engineered for the agenda of sectional and powerful interests.
There is no objectivity here. All facts are selective.

Yes. All that seems very true to me as well.

FOr example - the western media have chosen to de-select information about the activities of the Azov batallion in east Ukraine against separatists after the 2014 west backed coup. And the pov of the ethnic russians in Ukraine.
Propaganda is most effective when it is "true", though it lies by omission.

[Age]

I would advise any and all Ukrainians to put down their weapons and apply civil disobediance - why fight the capitialsist war for them?

I totally agree.

See how long Putin can control Ukraine when no one obeys, and see how long his own political support in Russia would last.

That's so true.

Thing is, so it seems to me, the world doesn't want war, it's the last thing on peoples minds...and thanks to the expansion of knowledge via the internet, people today have grown a proper frontal lobe and realised they can think and act for themselves and make their own intelligent sensible informed decisions about how to live their lives in a harmonious and peaceful way.

World Leaders cannot make people listen and look up to them by force, so this war is doomed to fail for Russia, on that one basic principle alone.

Has ANY war succeeded?

Also, calling 'them' "leaders" only encourages 'them'.

And, 'they' can only be "leaders" if 'you', people, follow 'them'.

I've seen some videos of some of those Russian soldiers, they look so young, lost and confused...having grown up in peacetime they have no idea how to conduct a war.

Just KILL human beings DEAD, oh, and DESTROY property. What else is there to KNOW about how to conduct war?

[iambiguous]

How about this...

The White House insists that until Russia pulls out of Ukraine, no American corporations will be permitted to do business in Russia. See how that works.

Same for China if they invade Taiwan.

http://www.aalep.eu/american-companies-operating-russia
http://jiesworld.com/international_corp ... _china.htm

Or Congress can pass a law that, until both Russia and China are truly democratic, no American corporations can do business there.

Of course, the global economy is owned and operated by those who care very, very little about "democratic principles". Here the capitalists in America and Russia and China are, in many important ways, interchangeable. The bottom line is always the same: cheap labor, markets and natural resources.

What, American foreign policy is different here? It really is based solely on human rights and freedom and justice?

[Age]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sajngb0W6I

While old men talk - young men die - I wasn't really sure what was going on....

I would advise any and all Ukrainians to put down their weapons and apply civil disobediance - why fight the capitialsist war for them?
See how long Putin can control Ukraine when no one obeys, and see how long his own political support in Russia would last.

Yes. I think this is the way of the future.

But 'civil disobedience' only encourages the one/s who created the 'rules' to PUNISH more and further. That is; the more disobedience there is, then the harsher and stricter the 'penalties' become, until and and EVERY 'one' who is DISOBEDIENT ends up 'locked up' or 'dead', which then makes the 'rest' to scared to 'disobey' the 'made up rules'. As can be CLEARLY SEEN, and is PROVED True, within EVERY country, and especially in ones like in "north korea".

Also, because of 'generational child abuse' ALL of 'you', adult human beings, have a BELIEF that; "If MY RULES a 'disobeyed', then you WILL BE PUNISHED".

'you', adults, HAVE and HOLD this BELIEF and SAY this, now, because this is what 'you' ALL CONTINUALLY heard as children.

When 'you' STOP BELIEVING, "If you do NOT do as I TELL YOU, then you WILL BE PUNISHED", then those that ARE 'above you' WILL EVENTUALLY STOP having and HOLDING 'this BELIEF', ALSO.

Also, the executive power of US Presidents must be curtailed to exclude the ability to declare war without the consent of the American people.

WHY 'would you' and WHY 'did you', adult human beings, give that sort of POWER to one human being in the FIRST PLACE?

And from what I have OBSERVED the ones 'you', people, give that POWER to, on just about EVERY occasion is the VERY LAST 'human being' I would give that POWER to.

But, as I say 'you' ARE completely and utterly FREE to do absolutely whatever you CHOOSE TO DO.

And there needs to be a free press that will report things objectively and not just the way official sources want them to be reported.

STOP giving POWER to 'some people', and to "the press", and then "they" will STOP reporting 'things', and then 'things' WILL CHANGE.

I think something like that would best be achieved through the decentralization of media ownership.

Just STOP WANTING and 'buying' completely UNNECESSARY 'things', then "the media" has NO other purpose than to just report what is ONLY and ACTUALLY IRREFUTABLY True.

Because 'you', adult human beings, will BUY 'reports' and 'reporting', as well as 'products', "the media" exists solely to OBTAIN MONEY. Just about ALL of the "current media", in the days when this is being written, exists because of, and for, 'money' through SELLING 'information' and ADVERTISING. So, that "current media" will NOT let, "The Truth get in the way of a good story".

Most of 'you', adult human beings, in the days when this is being written, Honestly, much prefer to hear a so-called "good story", than thee Truth.

But the GREATEST 'story', EVER to be TOLD, WILL BE, and IS, thee Truth. But, anyway, the "current media", in the days when this is being written, SOLELY works around the 'premise of'; 'obtaining MORE money'.

Which is also about the SOLE 'premise' of EVERY adult human being, in the days when this was being written. Thus, the continuous conflict and WARS, hitherto when this was being written.

[henry quirk]

if you were Joe Biden, what would you do to drive the Russians out?

rephrased: what ought Joe do?

not a goddamned thing

What is the most rational and virtuous, uh, philosophical response?

What Ukrainians are doin' right now.

[Gary Childress]

I would advise any and all Ukrainians to put down their weapons and apply civil disobediance - why fight the capitialsist war for them?
See how long Putin can control Ukraine when no one obeys, and see how long his own political support in Russia would last.

Yes. I think this is the way of the future.

But 'civil disobedience' only encourages the one/s who created the 'rules' to PUNISH more and further. That is; the more disobedience there is, then the harsher and stricter the 'penalties' become, until and and EVERY 'one' who is DISOBEDIENT ends up 'locked up' or 'dead', which then makes the 'rest' to scared to 'disobey' the 'made up rules'. As can be CLEARLY SEEN, and is PROVED True, within EVERY country, and especially in ones like in "north korea".

Also, because of 'generational child abuse' ALL of 'you', adult human beings, have a BELIEF that; "If MY RULES a 'disobeyed', then you WILL BE PUNISHED".

'you', adults, HAVE and HOLD this BELIEF and SAY this, now, because this is what 'you' ALL CONTINUALLY heard as children.

When 'you' STOP BELIEVING, "If you do NOT do as I TELL YOU, then you WILL BE PUNISHED", then those that ARE 'above you' WILL EVENTUALLY STOP having and HOLDING 'this BELIEF', ALSO.

Also, the executive power of US Presidents must be curtailed to exclude the ability to declare war without the consent of the American people.

WHY 'would you' and WHY 'did you', adult human beings, give that sort of POWER to one human being in the FIRST PLACE?

And from what I have OBSERVED the ones 'you', people, give that POWER to, on just about EVERY occasion is the VERY LAST 'human being' I would give that POWER to.

But, as I say 'you' ARE completely and utterly FREE to do absolutely whatever you CHOOSE TO DO.

And there needs to be a free press that will report things objectively and not just the way official sources want them to be reported.

STOP giving POWER to 'some people', and to "the press", and then "they" will STOP reporting 'things', and then 'things' WILL CHANGE.

I think something like that would best be achieved through the decentralization of media ownership.

Just STOP WANTING and 'buying' completely UNNECESSARY 'things', then "the media" has NO other purpose than to just report what is ONLY and ACTUALLY IRREFUTABLY True.

Because 'you', adult human beings, will BUY 'reports' and 'reporting', as well as 'products', "the media" exists solely to OBTAIN MONEY. Just about ALL of the "current media", in the days when this is being written, exists because of, and for, 'money' through SELLING 'information' and ADVERTISING. So, that "current media" will NOT let, "The Truth get in the way of a good story".

Most of 'you', adult human beings, in the days when this is being written, Honestly, much prefer to hear a so-called "good story", than thee Truth.

But the GREATEST 'story', EVER to be TOLD, WILL BE, and IS, thee Truth. But, anyway, the "current media", in the days when this is being written, SOLELY works around the 'premise of'; 'obtaining MORE money'.

Which is also about the SOLE 'premise' of EVERY adult human being, in the days when this was being written. Thus, the continuous conflict and WARS, hitherto when this was being written.

To be honest, Age, I don't think it serves any constructive purpose to blame the rest of us for what is happening any more than it serves a constructive purpose to include yourself in that blame. I doubt people not buying things we need in order to stop the press from being privately owned and manipulated by corporations is going to work. As far as giving power to others, there's no one in office right now whom I voted for in the last election. So you'll have to find someone else to blame for all the world's problems, preferably someone other than yourself, I'm sure.

[Age]

See how you fixate on the irrelevant? You just don't know when to stop. Classic autistic/aspergers/or whatever the fuck label they give insanity these days, behaviour. Get over yourself.

Yep. It's the relentlessness of the questions, the obsession with minutia, the off-puttin' style, and the sheer volume of it all, that makes my eyes bleed.

When 'you' learn how to SEE ALL 'things' for what they Truly ARE, then 'things' become MUCH CLEARER and APPEAR MUCH DIFFERENT.

If 'you', posters, can NOT just answer ONE question I pose to 'you' in A reply, then this SHOWS and REVEALS just how IRRELEVANT and INSIGNIFICANT YOUR PROPOSITIONS, ACCUSATIONS, and/or CLAIMS REALLY ARE.

ONCE AGAIN, if you can NOT back up and support YOUR CLAIMS, BEFORE you make THEM public, then I suggest REFRAINING from making THEM, AT ALL.

Which MEANS if one has NOT YET 'thought through, absolutely FULLY', what they are about to SAY or WRITE, then I suggest they DO.

Oh, and by the way, the ' volume of 'this' ' is NOTHING compared to what is about to come. What is being prepared to be TOLD, I WARN, 'WILL BE DEAFENING', as some would say.

Eyes do NOT 'bleed'.

And, do NOT FORGET that I am USING 'you', posters, here to PROVE A POINT. So, what 'you' call MY 'off-putting style' was done PURPOSELY to SHOW and PROVE just how the brain, itself, with the BELIEF-system STOPPED 'you', adult human beings, from HEARING and SEEING thee ACTUAL Truth of 'things'. Even though 'It' is being CLEARLY SPELLED out for 'you', literally, in the VERY WRITTEN WORDS, BEFORE 'you', or, "staring you in the face", as some would say.

I HAVE written in A WAY so that to those who have ALREADY BECOME Truly OPEN can SEE absolutely CLEARLY, EXACTLY, what WAS going on, and occurred HERE.

But for those who WERE somewhat CLOSED, because of their ASSUMPTIONS and BELIEFS, they ARE, as being PROVED True, NOT ABLE TO SEE, NOR HEAR, what ACTUALLY HAPPENED and OCCURRED HERE.

'you', posters, REFUSING to answer my CLARIFYING questions, Honestly, PROVES just how SIMPLE and EASY it REALLY IS to MANIPULATE the human brain, and thus 'you', into DOING EXACTLY what I WANT 'you' TO DO.

SEE, the LESS Honest 'you' ARE, or the MORE Dishonest 'you' ARE, the MORE CLOSED 'you' ARE, and BECOMING, and thus the MORE PROOF 'you', "yourselves", are PROVIDING Me, for MY CLAIMS about HOW thee Mind and the brain ACTUALLY WORKS. Which is what I NEED in order to CREATE thee Truly Peaceful and Harmonious 'world' that I have SET OUT and PLANNED for ALL of 'you'.

So, PLEASE carry on EXACTLY as 'you' ARE.

[Age]

I think we need to clear some things up here. Mr. Speaker, if you will please....

https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_111767.htm

The ONLY 'thing' that was CLEARED UP, and which can be CLEARLY SEEN here, are the ' self-"justifications" ' for the OBVIOUS Wrongs BEING DONE.

[Age]

dasein...how Putin's past predisposed him to think this instead of that

Yes, we know...there's nuthin' more to Putin, or you, or me, or him, or her than a program.

Roombas: all.

ONLY IF 'you' ALLOW "yourselves" to be "robots".