free will: yep, another thread about 'that'...

[Dontaskme]

nah...that there is surrender to ignorance...can't see any reason for it

To surrender to ones ignorance is wisdom of the highest form, actually. Only ignorance is original.


''To know'' is a dexterous verb - instrinsic with the intellect that is the human mind. Every body of knowledge - the known - no matter the context, arises from the unknown, whilst the unknown arises from the source that can never be known – the unknowable.

This is akin to saying, "We do NOT (yet) know how a human made contraption could fly, so we will NEVER be able to know this", about 200 years prior to when this was being written.

Or, akin to saying, "We do NOT (yet) know how to live peacefully together in harmony, so we will NEVER be able to know this", in the days when this was being written.

What is 'the unknown', to 'you' here, "dontaskme", is ALREADY KNOWN, HOW, EXACTLY, 'that unknown', to you, arises from 'the source' is also ALREADY KNOWN, AND, even WHAT 'the source', EXACTLY, IS is ALSO ALREADY KNOWN.

And, to be even MORE CONTRARY to what 'you' BELIEVE here, ALL-OF-THIS just becomes KNOWN and just plain old COMMON KNOWLEDGE, like how it is so VERY POSSIBLE to fly in 'contraptions' called 'air planes' is just COMMON KNOWLEDGE to 'you', in the days when this was being written was.

The philosopher may come to understand that knowledge sought is known only as a word, which is basically composed of sound and light which is unknowable. The mind cannot know itself except as concept, which knows nothing.

Is this thee One and ONLY ACTUAL Truth that will EXIST, forever MORE?

Or, could this just be YOUR OWN so-called "reality", which is NOT ACTUALLY True NOR Real, AT ALL?

This is the real truth of the illusory nature of knowledge, which is indistinguishable from the concept known as ( I )

Just because you read from some book - " There is NO 'I' ", does NOT mean, and I will repeat, does NOT mean, that those words are ACTUALLY nor IRREFUTABLY True, AT ALL.

The philosopher, aka the minds/brain intellect comes to know the known from the unknown and not from the unknowable.

To CLAIM that there is "an unknowable" is to just make an ASSUMPTION, without ANY ACTUAL PROOF AT ALL.

In fact, it would be an IMPOSSIBILITY to HAVE PROOF for this CLAIM.

The unknowable can never be known.

OF COURSE.

BUT to CLAIM to KNOW that there is "an unknowable" is a logical IMPOSSIBILITY.

The source of the unknown is the unknowable.

CONTRARY to what 'you' ASSUME and BELIEVE here "dontaskme", 'the source' is ALREADY KNOWN.

Hence why Einstein also stated that life is an illusion...albeit appearing as if real, and why this appears to be the case, is because 'real' is only known as a word, which is fundamentally composed of sound and light.

Will you provide examples of WHERE the one known as "einstein", supposedly, stated 'this'?

If no, then WHY NOT?

Also, is it CLAIMED that "einstein" once actually made the witty remark, "Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one", instead?

If yes, then what was that 'witty remark' in relation to, EXACTLY?

So even what we think is our consciousness is an illusion.

I am NOT sure how you arrived at this ergo, from your previous claim, which may NOT be true and right at all anyway, but anyway you have. Do they somehow follow logically? And, if yes, then HOW, EXACTLY?

Also, what do you think your conscious is, EXACTLY?

God is Light.

God is also Dark, according to your previous definition, and claims.

Light is running the show, not man, not woman, only God, the one and only.

So, Light is running your OWN MISERY and wish of NEVER being born here, "dontaskme", correct?

Human animal is a transitory manifestion of God's Light. In other words,an optical and auditory illusion of Light.

If you say and BELIEVE so, then 'it' MUST BE SO, correct?

Human beings are not doing any action or deed, these things are being DONE - and that's as far as knowledge will reach, there is no going beyond what can only be known as the conceptual story of ( I ) the illusion of duality...blah blah blah...

So, whatever the one known as "dontaskme" KNOWS, then that is the END of knowledge, and as far as ANY one, FOREVER MORE, can 'reach'.

Well this is according to "dontaskme", and its so-called "logic", anyway.

And, if they are Correct, then there is NO going BEYOND 'that', which is ALL that can ONLY be KNOWN.

Anyways...believe what you want...it's your prerogative. I prefer the actual truth, over human pretence.

So, ONCE AGAIN, we have ANOTHER human being who CLAIMS to KNOW thee ACTUAL Truth, while also CLAIMING that 'others" do NOT.

In reality, the human being is just like any other animal, it's as ignorant and dumb as fuck...except for the conceptual pretence.

BUT, human beings are, and can be, the MOST INTELLIGENT animal, which is what, literally and actually, separates them from ALL the other animals. But, let us NOT FORGET that human beings are, and can be, the MOST STUPID animal AS WELL.

Pain is a deeply obnoxious unpleasant sensation that can totally overwhelm the conscious being to the point of paralysis and complete bodily disfunction.

Pain is ALSO a VERY NECESSARY part of life, and living.

Without pain, healing could not be achieved, and then animals would (have already) just die(d) out.

Can't believe nature would even want this, but then what do I know, and how could I know, I cannot.

I am still shocked that there are some adult human beings who are so SELF-CENTERED that they would prefer, even think, or BELIEVE that Nature, Itself, should have had 'them' ONLY, in thought, when creating thee Universe in which they found themselves IN.

Roll on bedtime.




.

Roll on WAKE UP time.

Age, I'm going to take this entire discussion over to your own thread, the one you created and titled...
''Philosophical DISCUSSION'' .. here...viewtopic.php?f=5&t=34118

I think it's better you and I discuss my disdain for the experience of ''sentient life'' on your own thread, as to not derail or distract Henry's thread about FREE WILL

See you on your own thread.

[henry quirk]

Henry, if you do not like my answer ...just say it's crap, I won't mind, just be honest, that's all I care about, honesty.

I'll just say I disagree, and leave it at that.

[henry quirk]

But I NEVER EVER asked you if you could or could not see and recognize that 'immaterial' literally means 'non-material'. So, WHY would you respond to 'that' UNASKED question. If I recall correctly I have NEVER even used the 'immaterial' word ANYWHERE throughout this thread. So, to bring that word into the 'equation' now is absolutely LUDICROUS, at best, and probably MISLEADING and DECEITFUL, at worst.

Can you REALLY NOT SEE NOR RECOGNIZE the words; "There must be another factor, and that factor would HAVE TO BE 'non-material'", literally, MEANS, or ASSERTS, that 'that factor' HAS TO BE 'non-material'?

I guess you didn't: my apologies...

[Dontaskme]

Henry, if you do not like my answer ...just say it's crap, I won't mind, just be honest, that's all I care about, honesty.

I'll just say I disagree, and leave it at that.

Okay.

I disagree with myself as well...since I do not have one. But only pretend to have one.

One thing I've learnt that took me ages to learn is that no one can never know me, and me can never know no one. And that's an absolute truth I will take to my grave, and is the peace that passes all understanding.

.

[Age]

But I NEVER EVER asked you if you could or could not see and recognize that 'immaterial' literally means 'non-material'. So, WHY would you respond to 'that' UNASKED question. If I recall correctly I have NEVER even used the 'immaterial' word ANYWHERE throughout this thread. So, to bring that word into the 'equation' now is absolutely LUDICROUS, at best, and probably MISLEADING and DECEITFUL, at worst.

Can you REALLY NOT SEE NOR RECOGNIZE the words; "There must be another factor, and that factor would HAVE TO BE 'non-material'", literally, MEANS, or ASSERTS, that 'that factor' HAS TO BE 'non-material'?

I guess you didn't: my apologies...

That is fine, and thank you for quoting correctly this time so that I was notified and so I would then see this response of yours.

[henry quirk]

quoting correctly

[Age]

Henry, if you do not like my answer ...just say it's crap, I won't mind, just be honest, that's all I care about, honesty.

I'll just say I disagree, and leave it at that.

Okay.

I disagree with myself as well...since I do not have one.

So, WHY keep saying, "myself"?

And, while we are here WHY keep usually the capital letter 'I' when 'you' keep saying that 'I' do NOT exist?

But only pretend to have one.

Who and/or what, EXACTLY, is pretending to have one?

One thing I've learnt that took me ages to learn is that no one can never know me,

But, I ALREADY KNOW 'me', KNOW 'you', and KNOW Thy 'Self'.

And did you mean 'ever' instead of 'never'?

and me can never know no one.

Not when the word 'me' is being referred to some thing/s.

When 'you' use the 'never' word with the 'no' word, like 'you' have here, then what 'you' literally could be saying is the 'me' is always knowing EVERY one.

Is this what that 'me' is saying and meaning here? Or, was that 'me' meaning something else here?

And that's an absolute truth I will take to my grave, and is the peace that passes all understanding.

.

But it is WITH True understanding where Peace actually exists. As it is only with understanding, itself, that True and FULL forgiveness is obtained, which is what actually leads to a Truly peaceful, in harmony with EVERY one, way of life and living.

[Age]

quoting correctly

What does that emoji mean, to you?

And, WHY did you use that one here?

[Dontaskme]

Henry, if you do not like my answer ...just say it's crap, I won't mind, just be honest, that's all I care about, honesty.

I'll just say I disagree, and leave it at that.

Okay.

I disagree with myself as well...since I do not have one.

So, WHY keep saying, "myself"?

And, while we are here WHY keep usually the capital letter 'I' when 'you' keep saying that 'I' do NOT exist?

But only pretend to have one.

Who and/or what, EXACTLY, is pretending to have one?

One thing I've learnt that took me ages to learn is that no one can never know me,

But, I ALREADY KNOW 'me', KNOW 'you', and KNOW Thy 'Self'.

And did you mean 'ever' instead of 'never'?

and me can never know no one.

Not when the word 'me' is being referred to some thing/s.

When 'you' use the 'never' word with the 'no' word, like 'you' have here, then what 'you' literally could be saying is the 'me' is always knowing EVERY one.

Is this what that 'me' is saying and meaning here? Or, was that 'me' meaning something else here?

And that's an absolute truth I will take to my grave, and is the peace that passes all understanding.

.

But it is WITH True understanding where Peace actually exists. As it is only with understanding, itself, that True and FULL forgiveness is obtained, which is what actually leads to a Truly peaceful, in harmony with EVERY one, way of life and living.

Age you are using a lot of HOW - WHO - WHAT and WHY words above...

If I told you the answers to these words, you will not believe the answers I give you...because you have already declared that you have no beliefs.

So what's the point in you and I discussing anything at all, so all I can say to you is that you do not need to seek answers from me here, when you already know the truth of things in the me that is you there.

.

[Dontaskme]

But it is WITH True understanding where Peace actually exists. As it is only with understanding, itself, that True and FULL forgiveness is obtained, which is what actually leads to a Truly peaceful, in harmony with EVERY one, way of life and living.

This one here, is already in-line with the absolute truth. I am already in total harmonious alignment with what is this immediate nondual seamless reality.

I am already at peace and understanding with my being.

But that does not mean I cannot express the feelings and emotions of hatred toward this organic sentience and the inevitable pain and suffering that comes with a nervous system, and also a wishing this sentient reality didn't have to happen, that's all just part and parcel of a thinking organism, so it's ok to express those thoughts and feelings, whether they be hatred or loving, they are part of the emotion that is sentience, so whatever the emotion sentience expresses, that does not take anything away from the peace and understanding that is my fundamental being.

Forgiveness is such a stupid word by the way, my point is, why create a reality that begs for forgiveness. Why not bother at all in the first place creating sentient life. That would be a better and more intelligent option in my opinion. Problem is, no one ever did create sentient life, it's just not personal, even though it sometimes feels like it is, and that's the peace that passes all understanding in this one here.

Forgive...to stop feeling angry or resentful towards (someone) for an offence, flaw, or mistake.

Better to have never created a reality where anger and resentment could exist in the first place, is more intelligent, in my opinion. I mean why would you want that kind of life anyway, it's just stupid, it's like lets create a life where we have to have these negative emotions, but it's alright, we can just forgive ourselves for having them...noooo, lets just stop procreating so that others do not have to experience anger as well. . that's the most intelligent solution.

Lets all be complete morons and idiots because we can after all just forgive ourselves for we know not what we do...is such a stupid idea, we do know what we do, as we are the one creating the knowledge through our words.

Noooo, lets just carry on making more morons and idiots, because we love being able to forgive ourselves for the lunacy that we are.

We love inflicting pain and suffering upon ourselves, it's fun.

.

[Age]

Okay.

I disagree with myself as well...since I do not have one.

So, WHY keep saying, "myself"?

And, while we are here WHY keep usually the capital letter 'I' when 'you' keep saying that 'I' do NOT exist?

But only pretend to have one.

Who and/or what, EXACTLY, is pretending to have one?

One thing I've learnt that took me ages to learn is that no one can never know me,

But, I ALREADY KNOW 'me', KNOW 'you', and KNOW Thy 'Self'.

And did you mean 'ever' instead of 'never'?

and me can never know no one.

Not when the word 'me' is being referred to some thing/s.

When 'you' use the 'never' word with the 'no' word, like 'you' have here, then what 'you' literally could be saying is the 'me' is always knowing EVERY one.

Is this what that 'me' is saying and meaning here? Or, was that 'me' meaning something else here?

And that's an absolute truth I will take to my grave, and is the peace that passes all understanding.

.

But it is WITH True understanding where Peace actually exists. As it is only with understanding, itself, that True and FULL forgiveness is obtained, which is what actually leads to a Truly peaceful, in harmony with EVERY one, way of life and living.

Age you are using a lot of HOW - WHO - WHAT and WHY words above...

When 'you' say, "a lot", in relation to 'what', EXACTLY?

If I told you the answers to these words, you will not believe the answers I give you...because you have already declared that you have no beliefs.

I will NOT 'believe' the answers 'you' give 'me' NOT because I ALREADY have NO 'beliefs', but rather because I neither 'believe' NOR 'disbelieve' ANY thing.

So what's the point in you and I discussing anything at all, so all I can say to you is that you do not need to seek answers from me here, when you already know the truth of things in the me that is you there.

.

But the 'me', which is 'that body', is NOT the 'you' here, in 'this body'. And NEVER will be.

Thee 'I' is NEVER 'different', but the 'you' and 'me' ARE.

Oh, and by the way, the point in 'you' and 'I' discussing ANY thing at all, to me, is that by doing so I am able to learn how to DISCUSS with, and be UNDERSTOOD, BETTER by, 'you', human beings.

[Age]

But it is WITH True understanding where Peace actually exists. As it is only with understanding, itself, that True and FULL forgiveness is obtained, which is what actually leads to a Truly peaceful, in harmony with EVERY one, way of life and living.

This one here, is already in-line with the absolute truth.

Okay, and I could NOT agree more.

But could that one EVER ACCEPT that the words, and language, that that one uses, sometimes, does NOT align with thee ACTUAL and absolute Truth of 'things'? Or, is this NOT even a possibility from that one's perspective?

I am already in total harmonious alignment with what is this immediate nondual seamless reality.

Okay, but are you in 'total harmonious alignment' with EVERY one in 'this immediate nondual seamless reality'?

"others" see otherwise.

I am already at peace and understanding with my being.

Great, so WHY, EXACTLY, is 'it' you wish you were NEVER born, again?

But that does not mean I cannot express the feelings and emotions of hatred toward this organic sentience and the inevitable pain and suffering that comes with a nervous system, and also a wishing this sentient reality didn't have to happen, that's all just part and parcel of a thinking organism, so it's ok to express those thoughts and feelings, whether they be hatred or loving, they are part of the emotion that is sentience, so whatever the emotion sentience expresses, that does not take anything away from the peace and understanding that is my fundamental being.

OF COURSE you CAN express WHATEVER you like. And, IF, and WHEN, 'you', human beings, do START feeling that you CAN FREELY express EACH and EVERY thought and emotion WITHOUT being 'judged' NOR 'punished' for doing so, then 'you' ALL will START moving to that Truly peaceful and harmonious life, which 'you' ALL WANT and DESIRE, and have been LOOKING and SEARCHING FOR.

Forgiveness is such a stupid word by the way, my point is, why create a reality that begs for forgiveness.

And, WHY this became STUPID is because 'you' make up some make-belief scenario of "begging for forgiveness".

You have TWISTED and DISTORTED the words that I ACTUALLY used, were ACTUALLY SAYING, and were ACTUALLY MEANING, and TURNED them around COMPLETELY to MEAN the VERY OPPOSITE. Which is VERY COMMON among 'you', adult human beings, in the days when this was being written, so NOTHING unexpected.

Why not bother at all in the first place creating sentient life. That would be a better and more intelligent option in my opinion. Problem is, no one ever did create sentient life, it's just not personal, even though it sometimes feels like it is, and that's the peace that passes all understanding in this one here.

Forgive...to stop feeling angry or resentful towards (someone) for an offence, flaw, or mistake.

Better to have never created a reality where anger and resentment could exist in the first place, is more intelligent, in my opinion.

And, you probably think or BELIEVE that just being born 'happy', living EVERY day without pain while remaining Truly 'happy', and then one day just going to sleep, 'happy', and then NEVER waking up again, would be a far 'more intelligent' creation also, correct?

Would you want this for EVERY one/thing, or just for 'you', and maybe a few "others" that you would decide this kind of 'life' for?

I mean why would you want that kind of life anyway, it's just stupid, it's like lets create a life where we have to have these negative emotions, but it's alright, we can just forgive ourselves for having them...noooo, lets just stop procreating so that others do not have to experience anger as well. . that's the most intelligent solution.

Have 'you' EVER considered that 'you' SHOWING the EXTREME DIFFERENCES, in emotions, in how the people, in your days, you HAD TO live with, or ENDURE, which the EXTREME NEGATIVE emotions which 'you' CLEARLY HAVE and HOLD here, and the VERY REASONS WHY 'you' HAVE and HOLE THEM, while "others" do NOT even have this degree of these emotions, WILL BE USED in and for future generations in helping to KEEP creating thee Truly peaceful and harmonious 'world', which IS BECOMING?

Or, do you just consider that you are just "letting of some steam" here, for NO purpose AT ALL REALLY?

Lets all be complete morons and idiots because we can after all just forgive ourselves for we know not what we do...is such a stupid idea, we do know what we do, as we are the one creating the knowledge through our words.

If, as you say, 'is such a stupid idea', then WHY bring this one up here? I NEVER brought this idea up, NOR was even thinking about this idea. Until you brought it up here.

Noooo, lets just carry on making more morons and idiots, because we love being able to forgive ourselves for the lunacy that we are.

But 'children', themselves, are NEVER morons NOR idiots. ONLY 'you', adult humans, can be so-called "morons" AND "idiots" sometimes, by the moronic and stupid things that ALL of 'you', adult human beings, sometimes do do.

We love inflicting pain and suffering upon ourselves, it's fun.

.

If it REALLY is 'fun', then WHY is it 'you', "dontaskme", who is the one who complains the most here about 'pain' and 'suffering'?

Is this because 'you' feel the most 'pain' and the most 'suffering' from what 'you' had to endure, as a child, from the actions, or behaviors, of some adult human beings?

[Dontaskme]

So, WHY keep saying, "myself"?

And, while we are here WHY keep usually the capital letter 'I' when 'you' keep saying that 'I' do NOT exist?



Who and/or what, EXACTLY, is pretending to have one?


But, I ALREADY KNOW 'me', KNOW 'you', and KNOW Thy 'Self'.

And did you mean 'ever' instead of 'never'?



Not when the word 'me' is being referred to some thing/s.

When 'you' use the 'never' word with the 'no' word, like 'you' have here, then what 'you' literally could be saying is the 'me' is always knowing EVERY one.

Is this what that 'me' is saying and meaning here? Or, was that 'me' meaning something else here?



But it is WITH True understanding where Peace actually exists. As it is only with understanding, itself, that True and FULL forgiveness is obtained, which is what actually leads to a Truly peaceful, in harmony with EVERY one, way of life and living.

Age you are using a lot of HOW - WHO - WHAT and WHY words above...

When 'you' say, "a lot", in relation to 'what', EXACTLY?

If I told you the answers to these words, you will not believe the answers I give you...because you have already declared that you have no beliefs.

I will NOT 'believe' the answers 'you' give 'me' NOT because I ALREADY have NO 'beliefs', but rather because I neither 'believe' NOR 'disbelieve' ANY thing.

So what's the point in you and I discussing anything at all, so all I can say to you is that you do not need to seek answers from me here, when you already know the truth of things in the me that is you there.

.

But the 'me', which is 'that body', is NOT the 'you' here, in 'this body'. And NEVER will be.

Thee 'I' is NEVER 'different', but the 'you' and 'me' ARE.

Oh, and by the way, the point in 'you' and 'I' discussing ANY thing at all, to me, is that by doing so I am able to learn how to DISCUSS with, and be UNDERSTOOD, BETTER by, 'you', human beings.

Look, if you feel like you have this need to learn to be understood and be a better human being, then good for you, but I do not have such a need, I am already at perfect peace with reality, I do not desire betterness, or to become wiser andmore understanding, because what the fucking use is that going to be for me, I'm already the whole entire universE. I live like I'm already DEAD...nothing ever happens in death that can be known. So what's the fucking point in striving to be wiser and more understanding when everything is fucking dead anyway.

[Dontaskme]

Age, just so you know...I live my life like I'm already DEAD...OK


That's how I cope with this lunatic asylum that is sentient life.

I have feelings about life but that does not mean I want to kill myself, I always give myself permission to hate being alive, and that frees me to endure it.

[henry quirk]

What does that emoji mean, to you?

that there is the laughin' till I cry smiley

And, WHY did you use that one here?

cuz I quoted you sayin' quoting correctly incorrectly, and that's damn funny