Imperefct God

[Lacewing]

Life sucks…anyone who denies the obvious is an idiot.

Your dumb trip does not apply to everyone else.

Oh but it’s just so much more than my limited view

Why wouldn't it be???

Thanks for the endless stream of your condescending gob shite.

It only sounds condescending (apparently) because you're being a big fucking baby (again). I'm simply challenging your claim that you know anything that applies to everyone else. You criticize other people for making such claims. But it's different for you to do so, right?

How is it that you continually morph out of being an intelligent woman into being a bratty child with mental diarrhea who blames the world for your own self-indulgent illusion? Yet you call other people idiots.

I know you love to play the little miss fix it woman of the year role.

Ah, something else you foolishly imagine that you "know". I don't need to fix anyone; I challenge the stupid things people claim on this forum.

There’s no bag on earth big enough to contain all the sick I want to upchuck listening to you drone on and on…

It can only be your incessant droning and mental crap that is making you sick -- you know this. Are you EVER going to stop blaming everyone else? Or is the "dumb game of life" (as you say) the only game you know how to play? "Miss Honesty" is just reporting the dumb crap she creates and sees and projects onto everyone else.

[Belinda]

Life sucks…anyone who denies the obvious is an idiot.

Your dumb trip does not apply to everyone else.

Oh but it’s just so much more than my limited view

Why wouldn't it be???

Thanks for the endless stream of your condescending gob shite.

It only sounds condescending (apparently) because you're being a big fucking baby (again). I'm simply challenging your claim that you know anything that applies to everyone else. You criticize other people for making such claims. But it's different for you to do so, right?

How is it that you continually morph out of being an intelligent woman into being a bratty child with mental diarrhea who blames the world for your own self-indulgent illusion? Yet you call other people idiots.

I know you love to play the little miss fix it woman of the year role.

Ah, something else you foolishly imagine that you "know". I don't need to fix anyone; I challenge the stupid things people claim on this forum.

There’s no bag on earth big enough to contain all the sick I want to upchuck listening to you drone on and on…

It can only be your incessant droning and mental crap that is making you sick -- you know this. Are you EVER going to stop blaming everyone else? Or is the "dumb game of life" (as you say) the only game you know how to play? "Miss Honesty" is just reporting the dumb crap she creates and sees and projects onto everyone else.

DAM is pessimistic. Pessimism is a safer springboard than optimism towards change. The problem is how to explain evil.

[Lacewing]

DAM is pessimistic. Pessimism is a safer springboard than optimism towards change. The problem is how to explain evil.

Can you explain more? I'm interested. How does evil fit in?

[RCSaunders]

... you presume to know what my life is like ...

I have no idea what your life is like. I only have what you have said to go by. I hope I'm mistaken and that you are enjoying you life as I am.

I never gave you any indication what my life is like, unlike you who keep advertising how happy you are never shy of affirming your success at it!

Good on you! May you rest happy wrapped in your own little cocoon. The outside world requires no further thought, except perhaps what may supplement your enjoyment of it.

You know, Dubious, I almost always agree with you, especially when rejecting all the mystic superstitions that most of the world embraces. I have no ax to grind, but I cannot imagine why you think someone should be ashamed of their success and happiness. That certainly sounds like sour grapes to me.

You started this conversation when you jumped on my response to Dontaskme's pessimism. Remember?

I could not be enjoying my life more and would not change a thing about it or the world I live in if I could.

Amazing you can't even see the contradiction! You note Mencken as saying, the average man never really thinks from end to end of his life and yet you claim I could not be enjoying my life more and would not change a thing about it or the world I live in if I could making this the best possible world as far as you're personally concerned! It's the default conclusion of the many millions like you who in their enjoyment of life avoid any mental inclination to examine it further.

That's accusing me of a lot based on one isolated statement. It certainly sounds like a resentment of someone else's happiness, even if that is not what you intended.

That and your anti-intellectualism are all I had to go on for my opinion:

Truth is the most undiscoverable thing there is therefore to progress we need not consider it overtly and only declare something true if it fits the data.

There is no reason to be offended. We just disagree. I'm not your enemy.

[Belinda]

DAM is pessimistic. Pessimism is a safer springboard than optimism towards change. The problem is how to explain evil.

Can you explain more? I'm interested. How does evil fit in?

Evil fits in much as DAM describes and hates it. Everybody is acquainted with evil one way or another.

Evil seems to be an inescapable aspect of consciously aware living forms.
I think what mainly annoys Dam is people attempting to explain away evil as if it is not really as bad as we fear it is. I think what annoys people about DAM is her/his re-stating the obvious---that this is a terrible world.

[Lacewing]

Evil fits in much as DAM describes and hates it. Everybody is acquainted with evil one way or another.

Well, people's obsession with evil seems rather evil.

Anyone who looks only at a certain aspect of the world in order to make distorted arguments that somehow excuse/serve their hate, fear, delusion, etc., is not grounded in honesty. It is also not honest for one to claim that such a narrowly manipulated view is an accurate/complete view, and to project the distortions of that onto everyone else -- often excluding themselves, acting like heroic victims, and denying any of their own responsibility.

Blaming the world is a waste of time. Doing it over and over, as DAM does, is nothing more than a demonstration of what she apparently feels compelled to stew in. Her trip: "a dumb game" (as she describes it).

There is much evidence to show that we become what we think and we create what we think. So why not explore and utilize that to move beyond mediocre stories and excuses? What more can we realize and transform if we stop limiting potential with our thinking?

[Dubious]

I cannot imagine why you think someone should be ashamed of their success and happiness. That certainly sounds like sour grapes to me.

Kudos on you for being successful and happy, and I'm not being facetious here. What disgusts me is your view that everything is alright with the world just because everything is alright with you - per your words made explicit...

I could not be enjoying my life more and would not change a thing about it or the world I live in if I could

I find this nauseating since there is a multitude of things in the world which desperately require change, but in your perennial condition of self-satisfaction why change anything in the world which allowed you to prosper and be happy! And why keep flaunting your state of well-being? Is it to make others who are less happy feel like failures because they haven't reached your level of happiness and the conditions that brought you there?

Happiness for me is somewhat symmetric like a two lane highway, one going East the other West; in short, I'm neutral most of the time...neither happy nor unhappy. Too much happiness constipates the mind...which makes me unhappy. Being in the second half of one's sojourn, there's already too much entropy going on.

Re my statement >>>> Truth is the most undiscoverable thing there is therefore to progress we need not consider it overtly and only declare something true if it fits the data.

...is thoroughly realistic and exactly how science operates. Truth, like god, doesn't exist in nature. Truth, per se, has more of a moralistic persona than a scientific one and resolves mostly to what WE claim to be true.

[Dontaskme]

Life sucks…anyone who denies the obvious is an idiot.

Your dumb trip does not apply to everyone else.

Oh but it’s just so much more than my limited view

Why wouldn't it be???

Thanks for the endless stream of your condescending gob shite.

It only sounds condescending (apparently) because you're being a big fucking baby (again). I'm simply challenging your claim that you know anything that applies to everyone else. You criticize other people for making such claims. But it's different for you to do so, right?

How is it that you continually morph out of being an intelligent woman into being a bratty child with mental diarrhea who blames the world for your own self-indulgent illusion? Yet you call other people idiots.

I know you love to play the little miss fix it woman of the year role.

Ah, something else you foolishly imagine that you "know". I don't need to fix anyone; I challenge the stupid things people claim on this forum.

There’s no bag on earth big enough to contain all the sick I want to upchuck listening to you drone on and on…

It can only be your incessant droning and mental crap that is making you sick -- you know this. Are you EVER going to stop blaming everyone else? Or is the "dumb game of life" (as you say) the only game you know how to play? "Miss Honesty" is just reporting the dumb crap she creates and sees and projects onto everyone else.

Life makes me sick, I think it's the most foul and disgusting event to have ever manifested into being. I'm being 100% honest about that. Why can't you just accept my honesty, and stop fighting with it. Fighting with it, will do nothing to change my view, nothing at all.
I simply cannot unsee what I see in the world. I'm simply reporting it.

Life lives and feeds soley on the dead stuff that comes from billions and billions of years of dead rotting matter left over from other sentient living organisms that have lived and suffered just to die pointless deaths. This endless process of senseless killing and suffering is natures cycle. It's a means to justify and fulfil what is basically a purposeless mindless feeding frenzy of replicating molecules just so they can fulfil their function. All this crap comes at a very high cost, it's called endless suffering for the sentient creature. It's all disgusting in my opinion. If you think it's all wonderful, well good for you, you're welcome. But I don't.

What's even more disgusting is that the God people think it's all one big laughing joke. The God people believe natures brutal unforgiving carnage is all the good Gods work. I happen to think that's sick.

You Lacewing can spend the rest of your life challenging my views if that's what turns you on, but nothing you say to me, will make any difference to my opinion.

By the way, the ''Blame'' word is such a poor substitute of a word, for reality. Perhaps a reality check might suffice.

I've never once use the word BLAME.

Natures God, is way more sadistic, way more insideously evil, than any man-made God ..in my humble opinion.

PS, try to refrain from your good intentions to fix a broken world by sugar coating it with your flowery love sprinkles, it's not a bakery, and so efforts to mend the unmendable is futile...but if you are up for the job, then be my guest.

I'm simply challenging your claim that you know anything that applies to everyone else.

I am only reporting reality as it is seen from my perspective. I have never once said my perspective is the only one, or that it applies to everyone else. You just added that on because you only ever rollercoast over my writings. If you are not prepared to listen properly, then you'll just keep on forming your own opinions of what's been said according to your own limited understanding.

I have an opinion, that's all. If you don't like it fine, but don't fight with it, it's a futile game.

Just to remind you, I do speak mostly from a nondual context, but sometimes, I also speak from the dream of separation perspective, and so if my writings ..( views) appear to you as one big muddled jumbled up mess, then you would be right to take that stance. That said, if you really understood the concept of NONDUALITY, then you may just be able to glean a little sense out of my writings. In other worlds I do not think you and I sing from the same page. And that's fine, I have no hard feelings toward you as a person. We are just very different in our views that's all.

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[Dontaskme]

You have found some truths, and there are more truths that await your finding them. Therefore your life is about finding truths and that is good.

Nah, the only truth that was of any good use or value to my life, is knowing it will end

Who knows who is going to spawn at any given time. Spawning shows up everywhere. No thing knows when or where, that knowing is for the spawned to know.

Sigh!

Finitude and knowing finitude is indeed a great good if you are capable of knowing that you will die.Without knowledge of finitude it would be impossible to make any fully conscious decisions. DAM is very conscious of death and suffering and that is an attitude that is indispensable for making personal and political decisions that remove some of the suffering

With regard to the horrible way the Zebra met its death , the zebra could not know it would die horribly someday. But men can look forward and guess and fear. So the zebra lived a happier life than you and I. But the zebra and other animals can't plan for better futures with less dangerous crocodiles.That is how it is.

I agree in principle with what you are saying here, but my point is with the capacity to feel pain, and the suffering that comes with that.

While it is true that animals have no concept of self, in that they are all knowing of concepts....they do however feel the experience of pain exactly the same as all other sentient organisms do. Because we know pain and suffering, through out ability to identify with conceptual ideas, we can also know that other life forms are having the exact same feeling experiences when it comes to PAIN.

There is no better future for sentient feeling creatures, the senseless killing and suffering never changes. Pain and suffering is forever.

There is nothing good about knowing. If anything, knowing is bad news indeed, that's the only good here, is knowing just how bad it really is, and being able to do something about it, in the form of cessation from ever making more things live to then just suffer and die.

If there is better, then where is the better Belinda? where is it?


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[Dontaskme]

I cannot imagine why you think someone should be ashamed of their success and happiness. That certainly sounds like sour grapes to me.

Kudos on you for being successful and happy, and I'm not being facetious here. What disgusts me is your view that everything is alright with the world just because everything is alright with you - per your words made explicit...

I could not be enjoying my life more and would not change a thing about it or the world I live in if I could

I find this nauseating since there is a multitude of things in the world which desperately require change, but in your perennial condition of self-satisfaction why change anything in the world which allowed you to prosper and be happy! And why keep flaunting your state of well-being? Is it to make others who are less happy feel like failures because they haven't reached your level of happiness and the conditions that brought you there?

Happiness for me is somewhat symmetric like a two lane highway, one going East the other West; in short, I'm neutral most of the time...neither happy nor unhappy. Too much happiness constipates the mind...which makes me unhappy. Being in the second half of one's sojourn, there's already too much entropy going on.

Re my statement >>>> Truth is the most undiscoverable thing there is therefore to progress we need not consider it overtly and only declare something true if it fits the data.

...is thoroughly realistic and exactly how science operates. Truth, like god, doesn't exist in nature. Truth, per se, has more of a moralistic persona than a scientific one and resolves mostly to what WE claim to be true.

I personally resonate with pretty much most of how you say it.

And just for fun, I'm personally happy being unhappy. Feeling miserable comes effortlessly for me. Feeling positive takes more effort. I usually follow the path of least resistance, I'm just naturally drawn to the narrow minded path...I'm at my happiest when I allow myself to feel the misery of being, and anything else that just happens to arise within my sentient feeling organism, I can do this effortless without having to make an effort to fight with any of it.

It's so amusing that minds project things to be there, when they are are not actually there in reality. All we can do is report what we see, and conceptualise that report. All we can do is interpret or misinterpret the data of our reports to fit with our own intellectual understanding of conceptual meaningless meaning...haha!

Notice how people like to use the Blame and Shame word in the same context. And yet fail to see the source of their interpretations are from their own mind only....People are just insane, they simply fail to see the truth, in their consistant denial, that there is only their own personal truth and no other truth. And that goes for every other truth claimer. If one claimer is being denied of their truth by another, while clinging for dear life to their own truth claim...that's the insanity right there...

I personally believe truth to go something like this .........> where there is no claim, there is no shame, no blame.

The human mind likes to apportion a truth upon reality, so be it, for what can the mind do without it's artificially constructed truth claims. What can the mind do with nothing...nothing at all. And so the madness continues....

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[Lacewing]

Life makes me sick, I think it's the most foul and disgusting event to have ever manifested into being. I'm being 100% honest about that. Why can't you just accept my honesty, and stop fighting with it. Fighting with it, will do nothing to change my view, nothing at all.

So... as presented by you... you are just walking along, minding your own business (on a public forum), offering your honest perspective -- and the offering of my honest perspective is perceived by you as "fighting with you". How rude and pointless of me to challenge anything you say! Interesting.

You Lacewing can spend the rest of your life challenging my views if that's what turns you on, but nothing you say to me, will make any difference to my opinion.

That's not the goal. Are you trying to change people's opinions when you express yours? Or are you pointing out what you see as absurdities and lies in the things people claim?

try to refrain from your good intentions to fix a broken world by sugar coating it with your flowery love sprinkles

That's not what I'm doing. Try to refrain from projecting and distorting. Really... just try.

I have never once said my perspective is the only one, or that it applies to everyone else.

If you are reporting what you see... and you claim that other people are stupid if they don't "admit the obvious" that you see... then you are applying what you see to everyone else.

Just to remind you, I do speak mostly from a nondual context, but sometimes, I also speak from the dream of separation perspective, and so if my writings ..( views) appear to you as one big muddled jumbled up mess, then you would be right to take that stance.

Yes, I've pointed out how that may be serving you.

That said, if you really understood the concept of NONDUALITY, then you may just be able to glean a little sense out of my writings.

I do understand it. We've talked about it. But I suppose you'd like to believe that it's my lack of understanding which explains the reason your claims are absurd at times (even by your own standards).

In other worlds I do not think you and I sing from the same page. And that's fine, I have no hard feelings toward you as a person. We are just very different in our views that's all.

I don't have any hard feelings toward you either. It's nothing personal. You simply offer a boatload of convoluted and melodramatic claims to respond to, if one is in the mood to challenge and play with such things. Why wouldn't you expect this on a forum, where you respond in the same way to other people?

Are you aware of the difference in standards that you want for yourself and others?

[Belinda]

Dontaskme wrote:

Life makes me sick, I think it's the most foul and disgusting event to have ever manifested into being. I'm being 100% honest about that. Why can't you just accept my honesty, and stop fighting with it. Fighting with it, will do nothing to change my view, nothing at all.
I simply cannot unsee what I see in the world. I'm simply reporting it.

Life lives and feeds soley on the dead stuff that comes from billions and billions of years of dead rotting matter left over from other sentient living organisms that have lived and suffered just to die pointless deaths. This endless process of senseless killing and suffering is natures cycle. It's a means to justify and fulfil what is basically a purposeless mindless feeding frenzy of replicating molecules just so they can fulfil their function. All this crap comes at a very high cost, it's called endless suffering for the sentient creature. It's all disgusting in my opinion. If you think it's all wonderful, well good for you, you're welcome. But I don't.

I regret I can't justify evil. I can however support good.
Nature's cycle is a truth that consciousnesses such as ourselves have created. It is good that scientists have pursued this truth as well as they can within their remit of human reason.

It is good that you have feelings of disgust and express them even though it annoys people.

It is good that human centres of experience have been brave enough to take on the fact of suffering and death and try to rise above it to try to make the world a better place. Personally I love heroes.

I guess what would answer Lacewing would be for pessimism to be utilised instead of which you seem to be too fatalistic. Fatalism is common in Eastern religions, probably for historical and sociological reasons.

[RCSaunders]

I find this nauseating since there is a multitude of things in the world which desperately require change, but in your perennial condition of self-satisfaction why change anything in the world which allowed you to prosper and be happy!

Because changing things is how a human being is happy in this world. It is only by doing all one can to be and achieve all they can that successful human life is possible. Every bit of work one does to provide a service or product of value to one's self or others is the only kind of, "changing things," that is of any value to anyone.

Unfortunately most people think changing things means changing others, changing "society," or, "the political system," or getting the right laws passed and programs put over or attempting to make others think and behave they way they would like.

The world and others are not yours or mine to make what we would like them to be. The material world is the raw material available to all human beings. It is a dangerous and difficult world to live and succeed in, absolutely ruthless and unforgiving, but it is a world of infinite potential and possibility and it is that world which I would not change. No matter how difficult or costly it is, because the joy of life is worth any price. How others choose to live their lives is not my business, and most choose to squander their lives pursuing ideologies and political solutions, comfort, safety, and insipid pleasures that cannot possibly satisfy a human nature, which only make themselves unhappy and produce all the things about the world you don't like, like war, oppression, poverty, and terrorism.

If you really want to change the world, learn to live your own life in way that makes you a totally productive, happy, successful human being. If everyone did that, all the problems you see would be solved.

[Lacewing]

I guess what would answer Lacewing would be for pessimism to be utilised instead of which you seem to be too fatalistic.

That is a good distinction. Pessimism can be useful in spurring/inspiring new solutions and ideas... in order to experience/move beyond any particular space. If one is inclined to stay and sit in it, that seems fatalistic, which appears to be a closed view with no growth.

Personally, I think there is always more to see and explore. The world is a harsh place/experience -- and it is glorious too. Seeing and considering a range of qualities seems more true and beneficial.

[Lacewing]

It is a dangerous and difficult world to live and succeed in, absolutely ruthless and unforgiving, but it is a world of infinite potential and possibility and it is that world which I would not change.

Agreed... although I wish it were a bit kinder. Still, as I've shared, I've had experiences of sensing a beauty and perfection underlying all the surface drama. It may be difficult to accept and reconcile that with all the horrors we can see. But, to me, it suggests how much bigger things could be. The human experience feels very personal and serious. Perhaps that's the point of it. When we combine that with a vast landscape of potential, what can/will we create?