Putting ''Immanuel Can'' In The Religious Spotlight Part 2

[VVilliam]

2.382 billion Christians could make a whole good difference to this world if they actually understood what Jesus was saying...and practiced that 'for real'.

Wow.

Well, maybe you'd better tell us about that. What do you think "Jesus was saying," as you put it?

You are a Christian.... you tell me.

[Immanuel Can]

2.382 billion Christians could make a whole good difference to this world if they actually understood what Jesus was saying...and practiced that 'for real'.

Wow.

Well, maybe you'd better tell us about that. What do you think "Jesus was saying," as you put it?

You are a Christian.... you tell me.

No, no...I'm utterly fascinated. I can't help but be impressed by your claim that you know much better than 2.382 billion Christians what "Jesus was saying." Apparently, we've all been getting it wrong. You'll do us all a favour if you straighten us out.

[Walker]

Wow.

Well, maybe you'd better tell us about that. What do you think "Jesus was saying," as you put it?

You are a Christian.... you tell me.

No, no...I'm utterly fascinated. I can't help but be impressed by your claim that you know much better than 2.382 billion Christians what "Jesus was saying." Apparently, we've all been getting it wrong. You'll do us all a favour if you straighten us out.

After pages and pages of telling you what you think, I'd be surprised if anyone answers that.
It's just so much easier to invalidate what someone else says, you really don't have to think, which is why you must now say what Jesus said, so your words can be picked at.

"I know what Jesus meant, but billions don't." Uh huh. Okay.



I swear, atheists are obsessed with the topic of God.

Anyway, I'm waiting with baited breath to hear what it is that so many don't understand.

[Walker]

Why would anyone want to reincarnate into a life of sin?

This is what I am trying to understand.

Why do you sin?

[Immanuel Can]

I swear, atheists are obsessed with the topic of God.

Indeed they are. In fact, they've defined themselves (sometimes just their personal creed, but, as I'm sure you've noted, it can go beyond that sometimes, to characterize their whole identities) by their refusal to believe in Him...hence, the name "Atheists." Look at how many topics in the PN list are devoted to this particular question...and almost all of them started by somebody who has a skeptical view of God, if not an outright Atheist.

One gets the sense that a guy like a Dawkins or a Harris is pretty much entirely defined by his own disbelief in God, and wouldn't' really know what to do with himself if he didn't have a God to disbelieve in.

You're right: Atheists are relentless in their interest in God. It's paradoxical, and more than a little bizarre.

[Walker]

I swear, atheists are obsessed with the topic of God.

Indeed they are. In fact, they've defined themselves (sometimes just their personal creed, but, as I'm sure you've noted, it can go beyond that sometimes, to characterize their whole identities) by their refusal to believe in Him...hence, the name "Atheists." Look at how many topics in the PN list are devoted to this particular question...and almost all of them started by somebody who has a skeptical view of God, if not an outright Atheist.

One gets the sense that a guy like a Dawkins or a Harris is pretty much entirely defined by his own disbelief in God, and wouldn't' really know what to do with himself if he didn't have a God to disbelieve in.

You're right: Atheists are relentless in their interest in God. It's paradoxical, and more than a little bizarre.

Atheists are closet agnostics, they just won’t admit their uncertainty.

[Dontaskme]

2.382 billion Christians could make a whole good difference to this world if they actually understood what Jesus was saying...and practiced that 'for real'.

Wow.

Well, maybe you'd better tell us about that. What do you think "Jesus was saying," as you put it?

What if the Bible was written by the Roman Empire - as a psyop that would ensure the mind control of every thinking hominoid brain?
Lets face facts, a thinking hominoid mind/brain mechanism, has the potential to make up just about any story is cares to imagine.
( That's a dangerous prospect ) A threat.


After-all, a self aware entity can very quickly become aware of itself as something that is very much in control of it's own actions. Once it believes it is the controller, it can control others. That's when the mind games of manipulation started. One example of that is when your parents gave you an identity, they named you, and that was the beginning of separation for you.
Suddenly a thought arises in you, ''I am a someone''

Any yet thought itself has ''no idea'' how or from where THOUGHT is sourced, but thought will of course think of something, any source will do..for what can thought do with ''no answer'' but to make up any answer it can think of ?

How can anyone alive today, who were not around in the days when the Bible was written, know for absolute certain that the Bible is Gods word, as opposed to some 'experiential thought streams' that just happened to be believed by human subjects who were experiencing the thought, who then thought they were the ones to whom the thoughts were speaking to ?


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[Dontaskme]

Atheists are relentless in their interest in God. It's paradoxical, and more than a little bizarre.

No mannie, the concept 'Atheist' is just a label known, it is a thought. So is the label 'God' a 'thought'

What if the interest goes much deeper than the 'thought label' that is known as God/theist /atheist?

What if the interest has more to do with the actual 'original source' of the labels that are known as God/theist /atheist?

Is there any way for the 'original source' of all known labels to be known ? ...I think you know the answer to that.



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[Dontaskme]

I swear, atheists are obsessed with the topic of God.

Indeed they are. In fact, they've defined themselves (sometimes just their personal creed, but, as I'm sure you've noted, it can go beyond that sometimes, to characterize their whole identities) by their refusal to believe in Him...hence, the name "Atheists." Look at how many topics in the PN list are devoted to this particular question...and almost all of them started by somebody who has a skeptical view of God, if not an outright Atheist.

One gets the sense that a guy like a Dawkins or a Harris is pretty much entirely defined by his own disbelief in God, and wouldn't' really know what to do with himself if he didn't have a God to disbelieve in.

You're right: Atheists are relentless in their interest in God. It's paradoxical, and more than a little bizarre.

If you who goes by the title/avatar IC ..are a believer in God. Then why call out a non-believer in your belief - to be a paradoxical bizarre?

If there were no such thing existing as a non-believer of your belief, you would not even be interested in arguing for your belief on this forum. And correct me if I am wrong, but isn't that what you are doing here in the first place?

What would be your motive here on the forum, if there were no such thing existing as a non-believer in your personal belief. Would you have anywhere to bounce your ideas around, for your own personal examination. So for arguments sake, you are wholly dependant and in need of the non-believers in your belief to EXIST.

So it's you that is trapped within your own mental fixations of believing there is such an entity known to you as an Atheist. This is your own self created paradoxical bizarre idea that you project into the world...you are muddling within your own mental cavern.



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[Immanuel Can]

Atheists are closet agnostics, they just won’t admit their uncertainty.

Yes. When they are dogmatic, and say, "There is no God," they have a level of rhetorical power, a kind of threat they try to pose to Theists..but no ability to justify their strong claim.

When they say, "I just disbelieve in God," they have no power to imply anything about anyone else, but their claim might be warranted, at least.

So a strong Atheist is irrational, and a weak one is an agnostic.

[Immanuel Can]

2.382 billion Christians could make a whole good difference to this world if they actually understood what Jesus was saying...and practiced that 'for real'.

Wow.

Well, maybe you'd better tell us about that. What do you think "Jesus was saying," as you put it?

What if the Bible was written by the Roman Empire...

We know historically it wasn't, because it wasn't even written in Latin, but in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, and the manuscripts for much of it predate the entire Roman Empire considerably.

But how does this line of (erroneous) speculation help answer the question above?

[Immanuel Can]

Is there any way for the 'original source' of all known labels to be known ? ...I think you know the answer to that.

Hmmm...I'm afraid you think wrongly, because I don't know how you can deny something you say is already "known," without thereby denying that it is "known" at all.

You see why I can't even make sense of your view? You're contradicting your own premise in your (implied) conclusion.

[Immanuel Can]

Then why call out a non-believer in your belief - to be a paradoxical bizarre?

An Atheist isn't merely a "non-believer," D., he's a guy who thinks he knows there's no God. But he admits he has no evidence sufficient to that claim, so collapses back into "I don't know," which makes him merely an agnostic, and diffuses any threat to Theism.

So yeah, it's paradoxical and bizarre. Atheism is one seriously toothless tiger...lots of roaring, but nothing to bite with.

[Dontaskme]

Is there any way for the 'original source' of all known labels to be known ? ...I think you know the answer to that.

Hmmm...I'm afraid you think wrongly, because I don't know how you can deny something you say is already "known," without thereby denying that it is "known" at all.

You interpret what I've said wrongly. I've never denied what is known. I've always said the ''known'' is apparent to the knowing. The only knowing there is.
In fact I've always said that knower and known are inseparably one and the same. The problem here, is that you misinterpret what I am pointing to using your own self bias filter that is in you there, in how you perceive what I here have said.

I talk about a not-knowing known. It's not denying anything, it's a pointing to a self evident fact. I really do not know why you keep bringing up the word DENY ... I've never mentioned the word myself, so this is all coming from your own misinterpretation of what's actually being pointed to, which is the nondual nature of reality.

[Dontaskme]

Wow.

Well, maybe you'd better tell us about that. What do you think "Jesus was saying," as you put it?

What if the Bible was written by the Roman Empire...

We know historically it wasn't, because it wasn't even written in Latin, but in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, and the manuscripts for much of it predate the entire Roman Empire considerably.

But how does this line of (erroneous) speculation help answer the question above?

Ok, but then the scripture that predated the days of when Jesus lived makes no sense anyway. For example: the annunaki story who mixed their dna with humans to make human hybrids of their gods, and then you have the days of noah when people lived for 800 years and such.

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