Calling All Liberal Race Baiters

[Skepdick]

Okay. Let's start there.

WHY did he die?

Suppose he didn't die.

There is still a problem.

[SteveKlinko]

There is a problem.

A man in the custody of law enforcement died while law enforcement was applying force to the man.

That’s a problem.

Whenever there is a Death there is a full investigation. The Cops are usually put on administrative leave. Just because a suspect dies does not mean the Police did anything wrong. That's what the investigation is for. Sometimes the Cops are proved to have done something wrong but in the vast number of cases the Cops were proven to merely be using legal and sanctioned techniques in difficult situations.

[henry quirk]

There is a problem.

A man in the custody of law enforcement died while law enforcement was applying force to the man.

That’s a problem.

seems to me: that's the result of the problem

is the problem: poor or inadequate training?

is the problem: institutional bigotry?

is the problem: qualified immunity?

I think it's the immunity

[Skepdick]

Deflection.

No need to narrate your own behaviour - we can all see.

Last call for your evidence.

That which you are deflecting from is the evidence.

[commonsense]

There is a problem.

A man in the custody of law enforcement died while law enforcement was applying force to the man.

That’s a problem.

Okay. Let's start there.

WHY did he die?

Because his brain was deprived of oxygen.

[commonsense]

There is a problem.

A man in the custody of law enforcement died while law enforcement was applying force to the man.

That’s a problem.

seems to me: that's the result of the problem

is the problem: poor or inadequate training?

is the problem: institutional bigotry?

is the problem: qualified immunity?

I think it's the immunity

Good point.

I think the problem is immunity of law enforcement officers, and I would add to that the immunity the policy authors have (in general and mebbe in this case) for creating a fucked up policy (in this case they mebbe didn’t include a time limit for how long a neck restraint can be applied).

[Immanuel Can]

There is a problem.

A man in the custody of law enforcement died while law enforcement was applying force to the man.

That’s a problem.

Okay. Let's start there.

WHY did he die?

Because his brain was deprived of oxygen.

What deprived his brain of oxygen? Was he in respiratory arrest, and did he claim not to be able to breathe even before he was knelt on? Did fentanyl have anything to do with it? Was his neck compressed unduly? Was his treatment contrary to procedure for arresting officers? Did he have any pre-existing medical conditions? Did anyone say anything racist? Were the officers involved rookies or vets, and did any of them have a history of unjust treatment of suspects?

These are not idle questions. Each one makes a big difference to what we think "the problem" actually is.

[Skepdick]

What deprived his brain of oxygen? Was he in respiratory arrest, and did he claim not to be able to breathe even before he was knelt on? Did fentanyl have anything to do with it? Was his neck compressed unduly? Was his treatment contrary to procedure for arresting officers? Did he have any pre-existing medical conditions? Did anyone say anything racist? Were the officers involved rookies or vets, and did any of them have a history of unjust treatment of suspects?

These are not idle questions. Each one makes a big difference to what we think "the problem" actually is.

But none of those questions make any difference to the fact that there is a problem. Irrespective of the problem's causes.

And that's why you are problem-solving.

You sure seem to have sided with the "outraged Liberals Race Baiters" without letting us know.

[Immanuel Can]

But...

Sorry, Skep. I've completely lost interest.

[commonsense]

Okay. Let's start there.

WHY did he die?

Because his brain was deprived of oxygen.

What deprived his brain of oxygen? Was he in respiratory arrest, and did he claim not to be able to breathe even before he was knelt on? Did fentanyl have anything to do with it? Was his neck compressed unduly? Was his treatment contrary to procedure for arresting officers? Did he have any pre-existing medical conditions? Did anyone say anything racist? Were the officers involved rookies or vets, and did any of them have a history of unjust treatment of suspects?

These are not idle questions. Each one makes a big difference to what we think "the problem" actually is.

The problem is that someone died in custody while being restrained. That is a problem no matter what the cause.

As such, the problem merits an investigation, as is the custom in law enforcement agencies. That investigation may find answers to the very valid questions you ask.

Those answers may identify the cause(s) for the problem.

As described earlier, the solution(s) to the problem will likely include a review &/or rescinding of immunity for officers &/or their superiors.

I suggest that you read the coroner’s report for the immediate cause of death.

[Skepdick]

Sorry, Skep. I've completely lost interest.

So now you are problem-solving a problem you've "completely lost interest" in?!?

It seems lying comes naturally to you.

[commonsense]

But...

Sorry, Skep. I've completely lost interest.

I will not disturb you with further replies to your posts. You’re welcome.

[commonsense]

Skep, I asked you earlier if the officer followed procedure correctly, do you think just-following-orders would be a successful defense, in your opinion. Just curious.

[Skepdick]

Skep, I asked you earlier if the officer followed procedure correctly, do you think just-following-orders would be a successful defense, in your opinion. Just curious.

Sorry - I missed that.

Let me rewind...

[Immanuel Can]

The problem is that someone died in custody while being restrained. That is a problem no matter what the cause.

Okay. But for whom is it a problem?

Is it a problem for fentanyl users? Or criminals? Is it a problem for a society? Is it a police problem? Is it a race problem? Is it a parenting problem, a justice problem, a medical problem... or a choice-making problem?

What kind of problem is it?