Göbekli Tepe

[Atla]

The amount of racism and absolute stupidity that comes from those that claim to be intelligent never ceases to amaze me.

I wonder if these people who actually think/believe that they are smart/intelligent even have the ability at all to see just how they are the MOST stupid of ALL peoples?

There is NOT one shred of evidence, support, nor proof to back up and support what you claim, other than you saying: "you are simply dumb or delusional (or both)" AND "aboriginals have an average iq of about 64".

The human beings who actually think/believe that an iq score has any actual real bearing on the intelligence of a human being, is actually showing MORE STUPIDITY than the human being with the lowest iq score.

If you can not answer my clarifying questions, then so be it. You would be better of not saying any thing at all, because responding with the remark that you have just now is not helping you at all.

Life is cruel and I admit that your people drew like the shortest stick out of a hundred. That can't be fixed.

"your people".

Could 'you' get more racist?

When did "my people" "draw like the shortest stick out of a hundred"? In the last few years? About 200 years ago? Around 12,000 years ago? 100,000 years ago? Some time in between? Or before?

Or, do you still believe that the "first humans" still only came about around 12,000 years ago?

Would the people around 10,000 years bc have a higher or lower iq score than the people around 2,000 years ac have?

Do you really believe that an iq score is racist dependent?

And, is this TRYING TO belittle and ridicule "others" type of comment ALL you can come up? Considering what it shows of the person who makes such comments, especially in a philosophy forum, I would suggest doing what you are doing is not really helping 'you'?

Why can you not just form arguments and/or just answer clarifying questions about your OWN assumptions and beliefs?

Do you think you know what's 'helping me' and what isn't?

[Age]

Life is cruel and I admit that your people drew like the shortest stick out of a hundred. That can't be fixed.

"your people".

Could 'you' get more racist?

When did "my people" "draw like the shortest stick out of a hundred"? In the last few years? About 200 years ago? Around 12,000 years ago? 100,000 years ago? Some time in between? Or before?

Or, do you still believe that the "first humans" still only came about around 12,000 years ago?

Would the people around 10,000 years bc have a higher or lower iq score than the people around 2,000 years ac have?

Do you really believe that an iq score is racist dependent?

And, is this TRYING TO belittle and ridicule "others" type of comment ALL you can come up? Considering what it shows of the person who makes such comments, especially in a philosophy forum, I would suggest doing what you are doing is not really helping 'you'?

Why can you not just form arguments and/or just answer clarifying questions about your OWN assumptions and beliefs?

Do you think you know what's 'helping me' and what isn't?

In the eyes of "others", YES.

[Atla]

Do you think you know what's 'helping me' and what isn't?

In the eyes of "others", YES.

Did the universe tell you or is that an assumption?

[Age]

…

You seem to create a lot of noise with what you think, and that obscures clarity.

I'm not interested in wading into that much noise to the degree that you seem to.

Sharing or having understanding does not have to be as convoluted as you appear to make it -- and I don't think it can even occur clearly in the midst of so much noise.

I answered your original questions here in this thread simply, honestly, and directly. You did NOT respond to any of those answers of mine.

You appear to just want to focus on other 'stuff', like 'your noise', if you like?

They can simply listen to what you say, and then reconcile it with the truth that is already inside of them.

But that truth you talk about here may NOT be the real Truth of things. Can you SEE and UNDERSTAND this?

Can you SEE and UNDERSTAND that the truth you talk about may NOT be the real Truth of things?

That all depends on what 'truth' you are talking about exactly.

But I have ALREADY explained about HOW and WHY I could be WRONG.

I have also ALREADY asked to be SHOWN WHERE, HOW and WHY what I say IS WRONG.

I think this answers your question quite CLEARLY.

If what appears to me does NOT align with the truth in "others", then great. Just let me KNOW, then I become wiser. VERY simple and easy.

When you cannot understand what people are saying when they EXPLAIN that what appears to you does NOT align with the truth in them, how are you going to become wiser?

But I do understand. I just also question the so called "truth" in them.

If, and when, they are unable to answer my clarifying questions, then no response can speak truth loudly also.

If the Truth be KNOWN I write in specific way so that 'you' readers, in the times of when this is written, WILL ASSUME things INSTEAD of asking clarifying questions and challenging me. I do this SO I can SHOW to readers, in later times, WHY it is so important to remain OPEN always in order to gain full and true clarity of thing so that the Truth remains at the forefront.

That's why people feel jerked around by you. Like you're playing a game that you think you're being so clever at. When the reality is that you don't know anything more than anyone else, and your communication is convoluted and noisy which obscures clarity.

So, what would you like me to do?

What is it exactly that you want from me?

I wrote that for a specific reason, so you would then accuse me of some thing. I would then ask you to clarify some thing. You would not do it, and would intentionally leave it out. All of which has so far taken place.

Ah yes, you're orchestrating everything while not recognizing how YOU are being orchestrated.

I have ALREADY explained WHY I am doing what I doing and WHAT I am creating.

WHAT am I being orchestrated for?

I claim to KNOW thee Answers because thee Answers I KNOW can not be wrong.

And thee Answers I KNOW cannot be wrong.

From which 'I' is that being spoken from?

Who is thee 'I'?

You are also basing YOUR HONESTY solely upon your OWN past experiences only.

Is this what appears to you, or is it an assumption?

This is thee Truth.

Doesn't matter. It's WRONG.

Really? So, WHERE else do 'you' get YOUR HONESTY from?

'you' say that "I am WRONG", so there MUST BE some evidence and/or proof for this claim.

Where else could you get YOUR HONESTY from other than upon your OWN past experiences only?

To claim some thing is WRONG, then 'you' MUST KNOW what is RIGHT.

I can very easily and simple prove absolutely EVERY thing I am saying, and in a Truly logical, sensible, and reasonable way so that absolutely EVERY thing you now think and assume is impossible is actually possible.

So you SAY, over and over. "Saying" doesn't prove.

Of course it does not.

But until I KNOW what it is that any one wants me to prove, then there is not much use in me saying much else, is there?

I speak like that to antagonize people. I WANT people to try to challenge me. I want them to try their hardest to prove me WRONG.

Just saying that I can not prove what I am saying does not prove any thing also. And, OBVIOUSLY if I am not being asked clarifying questions, then no one is really curious nor interested in what I am saying anyway.

But what is really OBVIOUS is people LOVE to say what they assume and believe is True and Right. For example they LOVE to tell me that I am WRONG and that I can not do some thing, yet they do NOT ask me clarifying questions nor challenge me on about what I say. One reason for this is because they FEAR that really I am RIGHT and that really they are WRONG. The other reason is they actual BELIEVE that they are RIGHT.

An example of this is in our interaction, which I will post in my next post.

[Age]

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Why create human beings who need to learn from mistakes in such a way?

The 'I', in the physical sense, is EVERY physical thing.

Humans beings evolved the way they are because that is how 'I' create EVERY thing. Why human beings, like all animal beings with the ability to sense the environment around them, gradually learn from the mistakes they make. That is how all animals evolve into the way they are now.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Why not instill them with more awareness?

Awareness, like Consciousness, gradually emerges through evolving animals until an animal being, like the human being, with enough intelligence is able to uncover the Truth of things.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Why are you incapable of explaining -- and/or why not create humans with the ability to hear and understand?

To understand this there needs to be the understanding of who/what the 'you' is, which is very different from who/what thee 'I' is.

The 'you' here in your question, from your perspective, is just 'me', the person, who is just learning how to communicate has NO ability to create humans.

Thee 'I', in the physical sense, is the Universe Itsel, which has created fuman beings have the ability to hear and understand. Human beings though have also evolved with the ability to assume and believe things, which is what prevents and stops them from hearing and understanding.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
This sounds like you just want people to keep listening to you as if there's a good reason to, such as: the salvation of man.

What it sounds like to you is NOT necessarily at all true.

When 'you' understand the difference between the 'you' and the 'I', then 'you' will understand better who/what it is better to listen to; for the salvation of EVERY one, and not just some.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Your claims and excuses are lame.

The only "claims and excuses" here are the ones that 'you', yourself, are assuming and/or are believing exist. Without clarifying with me first, then you are just only assuming and/or believing things.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
So was this all you were capable of?

Do you think that ALL-THERE-IS HERE-NOW is nothing much at all?

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
You keep talking about people fully hearing and understanding, as if what you meant things to be HERE-NOW is for there to be an inability of stopping all the destruction.

Depending on the 'you' and when the 'you' is existing, then how things ARE in the HERE-NOW will make more sense to some than it does to "others".

To those in the years of when then is written the destruction that is happening is just "normal" and "justified" behavior. But to those in later years looking back on the absurdity and ridiculousness of those and their behavior in those times, then things are understood. But how things ARE in ALL of the HERE-NOW's is exactly how things are meant to be.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Are you playing twisted games? .

No.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Why create humans that must learn .

How could evolution be able to create an ALL-knowing being, in the beginning?

1. There is NO beginning.
2. Through evolution created animal beings do learn.

How would the Universe be able to come to KNOW Thy Self if, through evolution, an animal species did not come to be created without the ability to learn?

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
-- so that you can revel in some kind of superiority, .

Thee 'I', or your True Self, does not revel in just KNOWING things

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
rather than acknowledging that you're a terrible creator?.

If 'you' think or believe that the Universe is terrible the way It is, then that is 'your' perception. The way the Universe is creating It Self HERE-NOW, to me, is perfect just the way It Is right NOW.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Why must they go through a process?

Do 'you' want, or expect, to just be given answers, without ever having to learn things for your self?

If 'you' do not learn things for, nor by, your self, then there is no self satisfaction nor self achievement.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
What's the point of that if the answers are within them already?

Things are bigger than just humans beings. Human beings are just one minute part of evolution and Life Itself. Human beings are NOT created in one moment ALL-Knowing. They are just one part of the evolutionary process of the Universe or Life, Itself becoming Conscious and Aware of It's Self.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
And why are you here telling them about their inability, if you're the one who created that inability?

What would you like me to tell 'you/them'?

Would you like me to tell you/them what you/them what to hear, which is how good you all are and to keep on just doing what you are doing?

Or, IF you/them want me to simply tell the Truth, then I WILL.

Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:39 am
Seriously, what kind of twisted, fucked up trip are you on?

Revealing Thy Self.

What "trip" do you assume or believe I am on?

[Atla]

In the eyes of "others", YES.

Did the universe tell you or is that an assumption?

Readers are ALREADY telling me.

You have readers?

[Age]

Do you think you know what's 'helping me' and what isn't?

In the eyes of "others", YES.

Did the universe tell you or is that an assumption?

Readers are ALREADY telling me this.

[Age]

Did the universe tell you or is that an assumption?

Readers are ALREADY telling me.

You have readers?

What do you mean?

'Readers' means the readers of what 'you' and 'I' are writing.

[Atla]

Readers are ALREADY telling me.

You have readers?

What do you mean?

'Readers' means the readers of what 'you' and 'I' are writing.

And you know them personally?

[Age]

You have readers?

What do you mean?

'Readers' means the readers of what 'you' and 'I' are writing.

And you know them personally?

What do you mean by 'personally'?

[Atla]

What do you mean?

'Readers' means the readers of what 'you' and 'I' are writing.

And you know them personally?

What do you mean by 'personally'?

You're not good at lying are you

[Atla]

What do you mean?

'Readers' means the readers of what 'you' and 'I' are writing.

And you know them personally?

What do you mean by 'personally'?

Okay, probing your really strange responses has become too boring for me now.
Also, after thousands of comments you still haven't shown anything that would imply that you are right about this 'Truth' stuff.

Case closed

[Age]

And you know them personally?

What do you mean by 'personally'?

You're not good at lying are you

You are absolutely useless as clarifying what you say, but this, like what you wrote, is also off topic.

Once again HOW can just asking a clarifying question be 'lying'?

Or, if you are referring to 'readers' saying that you are not helping yourself here when you say things like;
Life is cruel and I admit that your people drew like the shortest stick out of a hundred. That can't be fixed. in relation to intelligence?

Then why would you assume and/or believe that I am lying?

This is what you said, right?

And, if you believe that speaking like this will help you, then so be it.

I have just been listening to and repeating what some 'readers' are saying.

I have just been questioning you about your remark when the "first humans, were only 12,000 years ago". You have so far refused to clarify on this. Then I just pointed out a culture, which has been around for at least tens of thousands of years earlier than only 12,000 years ago and which is still going and that this culture does not have a word for 'I', which separates one from "other things". You appeared to not have like this fact brought to light and so "TRIED TO" separate human beings into different groups, and then "TRIED TO" belittle and ridicule a "group", which you do not put yourself into. I then just suggested that you are NOT helping yourself by doing this as the readers can SEE 'you' for who and what 'you' really ARE. To which you then suggest I am lying, - for some reason.

If you believe that the way you are carrying on is "helping" you, then please proceed the way you are. I certainly do not want to stop you from doing what it is that you WANT to do. Or, if you profess to KNOWING what ALL 'readers' are thinking and saying, then please proceed this way also.

[Age]

And you know them personally?

What do you mean by 'personally'?

Okay, probing your really strange responses has become too boring for me now.
Also, after thousands of comments you still haven't shown anything that would imply that you are right about this 'Truth' stuff.

Case closed

Because 'you' are so CLOSED you have not even considered, let alone been able to fathom, that there is absolute NOTHING that even could, to you, be shown to imply that I am right about "this 'Truth' stuff".

Are you at all aware that it is impossible to show some thing to some one who believes otherwise?

Even the very Truth Itself can not be SEEN by a person who believes It does not exist.

'you', "atla", are a prime example and living proof of this FACT.

'you' are the actual PROOF that I NEED to provide and SHOW that I am Right "about this 'Truth' stuff", as you call 'it'.

The Truth is HERE-NOW in front of ALL of 'you', human beings. It IS ALWAYS. Just some of 'you' are NOT OPEN to SEEING It.

Case still OPEN.

[Lacewing]

You did NOT respond to any of those answers of mine.

As I explained, it is too much noise that I (and apparently other forum members) don't want to wade through. It does not need to be as convoluted as you make it.

I have ALREADY explained about HOW and WHY I could be WRONG.

Then when someone tells you you're wrong, you should go back to that and refresh your memory.

I have also ALREADY asked to be SHOWN WHERE, HOW and WHY what I say IS WRONG.

It is not up to other people to prove or teach anything to you. If you make a claim that somehow involves them, and they say you are wrong, then instead of asking them to prove that you are wrong, it's up to you to explore views that you may not have considered or been open to.

But I do understand.

You tell people all the time that they don't understand you or what you're saying, yet you claim to understand them and what they're saying.

If, and when, they are unable to answer my clarifying questions, then no response can speak truth loudly also.

It can also mean that your questions miss the main point that was just shown by another person, and are too noisy to interact with.

Ah yes, you're orchestrating everything while not recognizing how YOU are being orchestrated.

I have ALREADY explained WHY I am doing what I doing and WHAT I am creating.

So what? Your explanation/reasons don't change what I just said. People are doing to you what you're doing to them -- and their reasons could be similar to yours.

I claim to KNOW thee Answers because thee Answers I KNOW can not be wrong.

And thee Answers I KNOW cannot be wrong.

From which 'I' is that being spoken from?

Go ahead and answer your question for yourself.

'you' say that "I am WRONG", so there MUST BE some evidence and/or proof for this claim.

Where is YOUR proof when you claim that people are wrong about what they say?

I speak like that to antagonize people. I WANT people to try to challenge me. I want them to try their hardest to prove me WRONG.

It's easier just to recognize and point out that you're wrong, and challenge you to prove otherwise.

OBVIOUSLY if I am not being asked clarifying questions, then no one is really curious nor interested in what I am saying anyway.

Agreed!

they FEAR that really I am RIGHT and that really they are WRONG.

I don't think most people fear that!

The other reason is they actual BELIEVE that they are RIGHT.

Maybe they know the truth, and don't want to waste time showing or proving anything to you.

An example of this is in our interaction, which I will post in my next post.

You and I see different things. That is all the example shows.