Do logic and reason say that God is our servant?

[Greatest I am]

Do logic and reason say that God is our servant?

https://biblehub.com/matthew/20-28.htm
Even as the Son of man came not to be served, but to serve,

At the end of the day, there is no physical or real supernatural God for us to follow. If there were, then logic and reason say that if such a God wanted to be relevant to man, he would show up.

All there can be are rules and laws that we think a God would give. Men have written up many such sets of rules while lying about being inspired by God. That is basically the moral of the Moses story with his coming off the mountain, not with a God, but with rules and laws.

Man is not slaved to his laws and rules and changes them as better ones are found. We, in effect, are evolving God, defined as rules and laws, and making him better.

All people accept this except for those in religions who idol worship the older barbaric Gods, whose laws are inferior to secular law. That would include the Christian and Muslim demiurges.

Faith closes the mind. It is pure idol worship. Faith is a way to quit using your, "God given" power of Reason and Logic, and cause the faithful to embrace doctrines that moral people reject.

The God of the OT says, “Come now, and let us reason together,” [Isaiah 1:18]

How can literalists reason on God when they must ignore reason and logic and discard them when turning into literalist?

Those who are literalists can only reply somewhat in the fashion that Martin Luther did.
“Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.”
“Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.”

This attitude effectively kills all worthy communication that non-theists can have with theist. Faith closes their mind as it is pure idol worship.

Literalism is an evil practice that hides the true messages of myths. We cannot show our faith based friends that they are wrong through their faith colored glasses. Their faith also plugs their ears.

Do you serve God and the laws and rules of life, or do you expect the laws, rules of life and God to serve you?

Regards
DL

[Age]

Do logic and reason say that God is our servant?

To me, logic and reason does not imply God is a servant of human beings.

https://biblehub.com/matthew/20-28.htm
Even as the Son of man came not to be served, but to serve, [/quote]

What does this mean, to you?

At the end of the day, there is no physical or real supernatural God for us to follow. If there were, then logic and reason say that if such a God wanted to be relevant to man, he would show up.

But God has already showed up, to some.

All there can be are rules and laws that we think a God would give. Men have written up many such sets of rules while lying about being inspired by God.

Do you have any actual evidence of lying here?

That is basically the moral of the Moses story with his coming off the mountain, not with a God, but with rules and laws.

Where did those rules and laws actually come from?

Man is not slaved to his laws and rules and changes them as better ones are found. We, in effect, are evolving God, defined as rules and laws, and making him better.

Who and what God is exactly is not yet known by most people, when this is written, 'we', human beings, could actually being evolving into one God being? 'We', human beings, have after all evolved from other things and there is no evidence that 'we' will stop evolving. 'We' could just be evolving while discovering and knowing thy Self, and then just evolving into becoming the One who 'we' are just meant to be anyway.

Why would you call rules and laws a "he"?

And there are a multitude of rules and laws that are just plain wrong, bad and/or abusive, which is more or less the exact opposite of what God is meant to be.

All people accept this except for those in religions who idol worship the older barbaric Gods, whose laws are inferior to secular law. That would include the Christian and Muslim demiurges.

Not all people who do not accept what you say are christian nor muslim demiurges.

Faith closes the mind. It is pure idol worship. Faith is a way to quit using your, "God given" power of Reason and Logic, and cause the faithful to embrace doctrines that moral people reject.

Just like faith can very easily close the Mind so to can what some people call "reason and logic". These people base their own "reason and logic" as being infallible.

The God of the OT says, “Come now, and let us reason together,” [Isaiah 1:18]

And what does this mean, to you?

How can literalists reason on God when they must ignore reason and logic and discard them when turning into literalist?

But some times the actual literal definitions and meanings override what some people say is unreasonable and illogical. Sometimes some people try to use, so called, "reason and logic" to dismiss a literal interpretation, when it could quite easily be seen that the literal interpretation actual expresses more truth, which actually be shown and proven with far more reliable reason and logic.

Those who are literalists can only reply somewhat in the fashion that Martin Luther did.
“Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding.”
“Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.”

As just explained some people use the term "reason and logic" to try to trample others views, as though that "reason and logic" is irrefutably true, right, and correct.

This attitude effectively kills all worthy communication that non-theists can have with theist. Faith closes their mind as it is pure idol worship.

So called "reason and logic" can just as easily kill as well all worthy communication.This faith in unproven "reason and logic" is just as quick a Mind closer as faith is.

The actual reason communication is not open enough, in order to be able to find out and discover what is actual real, true, right, and/or correct is solely because human beings have an either/or view of things, like for example; I am an atheist or I am a non-thiest. As soon as any person believes or disbelievesany thing, then they are not open, and then proper and correct communication can not take place.

Literalism is an evil practice that hides the true messages of myths.

Are you absolutely sure of this?

Do you have any examples that we could look at, and discuss?

We cannot show our faith based friends that they are wrong through their faith colored glasses. Their faith also plugs their ears.

Can you show your "reason and logic" based friends that they are wrong through their "reason and logic" coloured glasses?

If yes, then I would love to learn how to do it. I would love to learn the secret of how it is possible to show a closed person where, when, and why they are wrong.

Any thing that closes a person off, including so called "reason and logic" plugs their ears.

Do you serve God and the laws and rules of life, or do you expect the laws, rules of life and God to serve you?

Regards
DL

'You' ault human beings expecting God and the so called "laws and rules of life" to be serving you is probably, if not, the main reason why you, human beings, are now living in the war-torn, pollution-riiddled, and very abusive "world" that you are all living in right now, when this is written.

[Greatest I am]

Thanks for this.

One serves a need or want.

You wish to serve god. Laws and rules to me.

What need or want do you see in god that you can possibly serve?

When did that want or need, --- a change, --- arise in your eternal god who never changes?

Regards
DL

[Age]

Thanks for this.

One serves a need or want.

You wish to serve god.

What led you to arive at such a wrong and silly conclusion?

Laws and rules to me.

What need or want do you see in god that you can possibly serve?

When did that want or need, --- a change, --- arise in your eternal god who never changes?

Regards
DL

I was just pointing out that when individuals expect others (God, rules and laws) to serve them, then this is why the world is in the mess that is in now., when this is written. This does not then translate to mean any thing else, especially like you have assumed.

[Greatest I am]

Thanks for this.

One serves a need or want.

You wish to serve god.

What led you to arive at such a wrong and silly conclusion?

Laws and rules to me.

What need or want do you see in god that you can possibly serve?

When did that want or need, --- a change, --- arise in your eternal god who never changes?

Regards
DL

I was just pointing out that when individuals expect others (God, rules and laws) to serve them, then this is why the world is in the mess that is in now., when this is written. This does not then translate to mean any thing else, especially like you have assumed.

What mess are you thinking of, when almost all the factors and stats for evils are at the best levels that we have ever enjoyed?

Sure, climate change will bring new challenges but so far, we enjoy the best life we ever collectively have ever had.

Regards
DL

[HexHammer]

Do logic and reason say that God is our servant?

https://biblehub.com/matthew/20-28.htm
Even as the Son of man came not to be served, but to serve

Because he's a servant og god and mankind, his mission was to obsolete 1st testament, and replace all the cruelty with kindness.
Just that stupid christians later mistook the hippie for being god/the father himself.

[Greatest I am]

Do logic and reason say that God is our servant?

https://biblehub.com/matthew/20-28.htm
Even as the Son of man came not to be served, but to serve

Because he's a servant og god and mankind, his mission was to obsolete 1st testament, and replace all the cruelty with kindness.
Just that stupid christians later mistook the hippie for being god/the father himself.

He blew it.

A son does not remain a son. He become a father.

Regards
DL

[HexHammer]

He blew it.

A son does not remain a son. He become a father.

No, he didn't blow it, since his teachings are now widespread across the globe, it was planned.

A son will always remain a son to the father, but only a father when he gets a son, so you are wrong!

[Age]

Thanks for this.

One serves a need or want.

You wish to serve god.

What led you to arive at such a wrong and silly conclusion?

Laws and rules to me.

What need or want do you see in god that you can possibly serve?

When did that want or need, --- a change, --- arise in your eternal god who never changes?

Regards
DL

I was just pointing out that when individuals expect others (God, rules and laws) to serve them, then this is why the world is in the mess that is in now., when this is written. This does not then translate to mean any thing else, especially like you have assumed.

What mess are you thinking of, when almost all the factors and stats for evils are at the best levels that we have ever enjoyed?

Sure, climate change will bring new challenges but so far, we enjoy the best life we ever collectively have ever had.

Regards
DL

Okay so we will change the discussion and not look at the reason/s why you arrived at such a conclusion and instead now look at this.

I was not thinking of any particular mess. Just whatever mess there is will do. If you see climate change as being mess, then that mess will suffice.

If you can not see any other mess in the world, then just climate change will do as an example of what mess happens when human beings expect God, rules and laws to serve them.

[Greatest I am]

He blew it.

A son does not remain a son. He become a father.

No, he didn't blow it, since his teachings are now widespread across the globe, it was planned.

A son will always remain a son to the father, but only a father when he gets a son, so you are wrong!

We both know what your appeal is to in your first. I will ignore it.

As to your last, that has not been my experience. My sons are fathers and free men in their own rite.

Love frees. Love does not enslave.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

What led you to arive at such a wrong and silly conclusion?



I was just pointing out that when individuals expect others (God, rules and laws) to serve them, then this is why the world is in the mess that is in now., when this is written. This does not then translate to mean any thing else, especially like you have assumed.

What mess are you thinking of, when almost all the factors and stats for evils are at the best levels that we have ever enjoyed?

Sure, climate change will bring new challenges but so far, we enjoy the best life we ever collectively have ever had.

Regards
DL

Okay so we will change the discussion and not look at the reason/s why you arrived at such a conclusion and instead now look at this.

I was not thinking of any particular mess. Just whatever mess there is will do. If you see climate change as being mess, then that mess will suffice.

If you can not see any other mess in the world, then just climate change will do as an example of what mess happens when human beings expect God, rules and laws to serve them.

I said all markers for evil. Not just climate change.

One cannot deal with any one issue all on it's own, without looking at effects to the larger picture.

If you want to get to roots, money is where to look as it takes care of the ways and means to any legislation or endeavour.

Regards
DL

[RCSaunders]

Which God?

[HexHammer]

As to your last, that has not been my experience. My sons are fathers and free men in their own rite.

Love frees. Love does not enslave.

You are still the father of your sons!

But you enslave god and think of him as a slave of your needs, not as a god that you should worship and praise for all the things that he has granted us. Look around you, people still live in the stone ages, we in the west have been blessed with so much.

[Age]

What mess are you thinking of, when almost all the factors and stats for evils are at the best levels that we have ever enjoyed?

Sure, climate change will bring new challenges but so far, we enjoy the best life we ever collectively have ever had.

Regards
DL

Okay so we will change the discussion and not look at the reason/s why you arrived at such a conclusion and instead now look at this.

I was not thinking of any particular mess. Just whatever mess there is will do. If you see climate change as being mess, then that mess will suffice.

If you can not see any other mess in the world, then just climate change will do as an example of what mess happens when human beings expect God, rules and laws to serve them.

I said all markers for evil. Not just climate change.

One cannot deal with any one issue all on it's own, without looking at effects to the larger picture.

If you want to get to roots, money is where to look as it takes care of the ways and means to any legislation or endeavour.

Regards
DL

But, the love of money is only the third root/cause to ALL evil. There are two other root causes in front of the love of money.

[Greatest I am]

As to your last, that has not been my experience. My sons are fathers and free men in their own rite.

Love frees. Love does not enslave.

You are still the father of your sons!

But you enslave god and think of him as a slave of your needs, not as a god that you should worship and praise for all the things that he has granted us. Look around you, people still live in the stone ages, we in the west have been blessed with so much.

The role of father changes over time and our evolution.

Did Jesus not retire Yahweh as mankind's judge? He sure did. That Yahweh/Jesus was quite the p****.

Regards
DL