Why is nazism popular today?

[Gary Childress]

"You are...welcome to yadda yadda yadda."

I pay folks, folks pay me...it's called 'transacation'...it's called 'contract'...it's called 'civillization': 'polituburo' isn't needed or wanted (by me).

#

"Henry, you live in a society."

No: I live in close proximity to other folks, most of them strangers *who owe me nuthin' just as I owe them nuthin'.

#

"You can't cherry pick the good that benefit you and reject the obligations laid upon you to contribute."

Of course I can: I can vote for folks and props that reduce my taxes, reduce my obligations, reduce my dependence; I can out & out cheat on my taxes; I can shelter properties from pryin' eyes; I can fly low & quiet. And that's just within the sphere of being governed. In the marketplace I have even more options. Absolutely I can cherrypick & reject.









*slight amend: what is owed is that each & every one mind his own business & keep his hands to himself

"Cheating" on taxes would be unethical and akin to freeloading on the dime of those who meet their allotted tax obligations.

[henry quirk]

"Cheating" on taxes would be unethical and akin to freeloading on the dime of those who meet their allotted tax obligations."

If the bulk of my taxes are spent in ways I disagree with, and I get no relief through the ballot box, givin' less is protest.

As for the ethics: mine say 'don't get robbed' (yours?).

As for the law abiders: pffftt!

[FlashDangerpants]

"You can't cherry pick the good that benefit you and reject the obligations laid upon you to contribute."

Of course I can: I can vote for folks and props that reduce my taxes, reduce my obligations, reduce my dependence; I can out & out cheat on my taxes; I can shelter properties from pryin' eyes; I can fly low & quiet. And that's just within the sphere of being governed. In the marketplace I have even more options. Absolutely I can cherrypick & reject.

"Cheating" on taxes would be unethical and akin to freeloading on the dime of those who meet their allotted tax obligations.

That would be valid if the original point was that Henry "shouldn't" cherry pick, but is not applicable to "can't". There are things one can do, but mustn't, or shouldn't, and rejecting obligations freely entered into is one of them.

Henry may not feel that he freely entered into an obligation to provide money for the state to pay for certain dishonourable things. In which case he might feel honour bound to avoid paying for those things. It may therefore be his very honest judgment that he must withhold certain taxes due. In which case arguably he should reject the obligation to contribute to those things.

Just as climate change protesters arguably should reject some obligations to keep the peace when they are climbing up stuff to draw attention to their cause.

[henry quirk]

"Just as climate change protesters arguably should reject some obligations to keep the peace when they are climbing up stuff to draw attention to their cause."

Indeed: clamor and climb and chain (not on my roof, though, cuz I'll just shoot you down [with the kid's pellet gun]).

[Gary Childress]

"You can't cherry pick the good that benefit you and reject the obligations laid upon you to contribute."

Of course I can: I can vote for folks and props that reduce my taxes, reduce my obligations, reduce my dependence; I can out & out cheat on my taxes; I can shelter properties from pryin' eyes; I can fly low & quiet. And that's just within the sphere of being governed. In the marketplace I have even more options. Absolutely I can cherrypick & reject.

"Cheating" on taxes would be unethical and akin to freeloading on the dime of those who meet their allotted tax obligations.

That would be valid if the original point was that Henry "shouldn't" cherry pick, but is not applicable to "can't". There are things one can do, but mustn't, or shouldn't, and rejecting obligations freely entered into is one of them.

Henry may not feel that he freely entered into an obligation to provide money for the state to pay for certain dishonourable things. In which case he might feel honour bound to avoid paying for those things. It may therefore be his very honest judgment that he must withhold certain taxes due. In which case arguably he should reject the obligation to contribute to those things.

Just as climate change protesters arguably should reject some obligations to keep the peace when they are climbing up stuff to draw attention to their cause.

I think I'll just start cheating on my taxes, then. Apparently it's the noble thing to do.

[FlashDangerpants]

"Cheating" on taxes would be unethical and akin to freeloading on the dime of those who meet their allotted tax obligations.

That would be valid if the original point was that Henry "shouldn't" cherry pick, but is not applicable to "can't". There are things one can do, but mustn't, or shouldn't, and rejecting obligations freely entered into is one of them.

Henry may not feel that he freely entered into an obligation to provide money for the state to pay for certain dishonourable things. In which case he might feel honour bound to avoid paying for those things. It may therefore be his very honest judgment that he must withhold certain taxes due. In which case arguably he should reject the obligation to contribute to those things.

Just as climate change protesters arguably should reject some obligations to keep the peace when they are climbing up stuff to draw attention to their cause.

I think I'll just start cheating on my taxes, then. Apparently it's the noble thing to do.

What exactly is your purpose in joining a philosophy forum? Is it the joy of posing with the 'love of wisdom' crowd, or are you trying to consider complex matters and properly to justify arguments in relation to them? Don't give me that childish eyeroll & sulk treatment if your avatar is a picture of a middle aged man.

[Gary Childress]

That would be valid if the original point was that Henry "shouldn't" cherry pick, but is not applicable to "can't". There are things one can do, but mustn't, or shouldn't, and rejecting obligations freely entered into is one of them.

Henry may not feel that he freely entered into an obligation to provide money for the state to pay for certain dishonourable things. In which case he might feel honour bound to avoid paying for those things. It may therefore be his very honest judgment that he must withhold certain taxes due. In which case arguably he should reject the obligation to contribute to those things.

Just as climate change protesters arguably should reject some obligations to keep the peace when they are climbing up stuff to draw attention to their cause.

I think I'll just start cheating on my taxes, then. Apparently it's the noble thing to do.

What exactly is your purpose in joining a philosophy forum? Is it the joy of posing with the 'love of wisdom' crowd, or are you trying to consider complex matters and properly to justify arguments in relation to them? Don't give me that childish eyeroll & sulk treatment if your avatar is a picture of a middle aged man.

Sorry, I thought I was on a philosophy forum. Philosophy means love of wisdom. So I was momentarily awestruck by the enormous wisdom of those advocating for "cheating" on taxes. I was mind blown by the philosophical prowess of comments like "As for the law abiders: pffftt!". I couldn't help the "childish" eyeroll, being surrounded by such prodigies. Please excuse my inferiority.

[Logik]

Sorry, I thought I was on a philosophy forum. Philosophy means love of wisdom. So I was momentarily awestruck by the enormous wisdom of those advocating for "cheating" on taxes.

Would you say that there are no wise reasons for "cheating" on taxes then?

Would you say that living in a country which taxes you at 45%, then further imposes 15% VAT on you, then adds further levies on commodities like petrol, electricity and water (for an total taxation of about 70%).

Did I mention that this country does not offer adequate medical care or education. So in addition to my taxes I have to pay for medical insurance and private schools.

Did I also mention that this country does not offer adequate security, electricity or water supplies? So in addition to my taxes I have to pay for private security, electrical generators, solar panels and water purification systems.

Did I mention that the 45% taxes do NOT contribute to any pension/retirement fund? So in addition to everything else I also have to plan for the future.

So in effect, I am left with 15-20% of my earnings to buy food, enjoy life, raise kids and plan for retirement.

At one point somebody has to ask the question: What the fuck am I getting for those 80% that are taken away from me?!?!

[Gary Childress]

Sorry, I thought I was on a philosophy forum. Philosophy means love of wisdom. So I was momentarily awestruck by the enormous wisdom of those advocating for "cheating" on taxes.

Would you say that there are no wise reasons for "cheating" on taxes then?

Would you say that living in a country which taxes you at 45%, then further imposes 22% VAT on you, then further taxes all sorts of commodities like petrol, electricity and water (for an total taxation of about 70%).

Did I mention that this country does not offer adequate medical care or education. So in addition to my taxes I have to pay for medical insurance and private schools.

Did I mention that this country also does not offer adequate security, electricity or water supplies? So in addition to my taxes I have to pay for private security, security systems, electrical generators, solar panels and water purification systems. All on-premises.

So in effect, I am left with 20% of my earnings to buy food and enjoy life.

Would you say it is unwise to boycott such an unjust tax system?

Do you live in a democracy where you are able to vote?

[Logik]

Do you live in a democracy where you are able to vote?

Since you are going to trivialise my argument down to one simplistic question, then I am going to do the same..

You mean a democracy like Zimbabwe?

[FlashDangerpants]

I think I'll just start cheating on my taxes, then. Apparently it's the noble thing to do.

What exactly is your purpose in joining a philosophy forum? Is it the joy of posing with the 'love of wisdom' crowd, or are you trying to consider complex matters and properly to justify arguments in relation to them? Don't give me that childish eyeroll & sulk treatment if your avatar is a picture of a middle aged man.

Sorry, I thought I was on a philosophy forum. Philosophy means love of wisdom. So I was momentarily awestruck by the enormous wisdom of those advocating for "cheating" on taxes. I was mind blown by the philosophical prowess of comments like "As for the law abiders: pffftt!". I couldn't help the "childish" eyeroll, being surrounded by such prodigies. Please excuse my inferiority.

Okay, so I can consider that question fully answered at least.

Do you see any difference between an obligation imposed on a person with no regard for their choice, and one into which they have freely entered? Have you the imagination to come up with an example of the former which people are right to reject?

You have lots of valid options to tackle the argument that withholding taxes could be valid. Rolling your eyes and being a pissy old man-bitch isn't one of them.

[Gary Childress]

Do you live in a democracy where you are able to vote?

Since you are going to trivialise my argument down to one simplistic question, then I am going to do the same..

You mean a democracy like Zimbabwe?

Do you live in England? If so is England not a democracy? And if it is, how on Earth did so many people vote for such high taxes?

I'm pretty sure you don't live in the US, because almost no one anywhere near (or anywhere in close proximity above) the poverty line gets 70% of their income taken away in taxes.

[Logik]

Do you live in a democracy where you are able to vote?

Since you are going to trivialise my argument down to one simplistic question, then I am going to do the same..

You mean a democracy like Zimbabwe?

Do you live in England? If so is England not a democracy? And if it is, how on Earth did so many people vote for such high taxes?

I'm pretty sure you don't live in the US, because almost no one anywhere near (or anywhere in close proximity above) the poverty line gets 70% of their income taken away in taxes.

Does it matter where I live?

Would you say that the argument (IF factual) it holds water towards "cheating" taxes?

Said differently: What would you deem to be a fair taxation bracket in exchange for absolutely-no-services being provided by government?

[Gary Childress]

What exactly is your purpose in joining a philosophy forum? Is it the joy of posing with the 'love of wisdom' crowd, or are you trying to consider complex matters and properly to justify arguments in relation to them? Don't give me that childish eyeroll & sulk treatment if your avatar is a picture of a middle aged man.

Sorry, I thought I was on a philosophy forum. Philosophy means love of wisdom. So I was momentarily awestruck by the enormous wisdom of those advocating for "cheating" on taxes. I was mind blown by the philosophical prowess of comments like "As for the law abiders: pffftt!". I couldn't help the "childish" eyeroll, being surrounded by such prodigies. Please excuse my inferiority.

Okay, so I can consider that question fully answered at least.

Do you see any difference between an obligation imposed on a person with no regard for their choice, and one into which they have freely entered? Have you the imagination to come up with an example of the former which people are right to reject?

You have lots of valid options to tackle the argument that withholding taxes could be valid. Rolling your eyes and being a pissy old man-bitch isn't one of them.

OK! I'll start cheating on my taxes. Sounds like the thing to do, right? I mean, if it's ok for each person to make that determination on their own whether or not they feel like they ought to cheat on their taxes, then by all means! I mean, I don't like paying for all that military hardware, since we seem to be using it in such atrocious ways.

[Logik]

OK! I'll start cheating on my taxes. Sounds like the thing to do, right? I mean, if it's ok for each person to make that determination on their own whether or not they feel like they ought to cheat on their taxes, then by all means! I mean, I don't like paying for all that military hardware, since we seem to be using it in such atrocious ways.

What do you propose one ought to do when democracy (despite 70% taxation) fails to meet their basic needs?