Will Any Theist Believe in an Inferior God?

[gaffo]

Note I qualified 'generally'
If you research on religion in general, the central theme is avoiding 'Hell' and the hope of going to heaven with an eternal life. Most male Muslims are hopeful of 72 eternally renewable virgins [i.e. after each intercourse is finish, the lady is virgin again for the next f...].

I don't give a flying fuck about those that should generally be muzzled. And I don't give a flying fuck about religion in general either, I take it with a bunch of salt, generally it is man's assault on the mind.

But again from the source of the holy buy bull, what IS salvation?

If you don't give a damn about religion,

I think you do in comdeming Mooooooslims! the evil hoards!!!!!!!!!

and not noting the politics/ small theological diff bet the shia and sunni.

and the fact that neither of most those camps defend killing of the other (or infidels- exp the fanatics).

you a fanatic? VA? i think you are - look within and be honest with yourself

sorry ATT thought i was posting to VA above - i am in a way, my reply was to him WRT to Shia vs Sunni.

sorry about the confussion - mine - no dishonor to you Sir.

[gaffo]

The problem is 'religion' and 'politics' are very closely related within Islam

yes it is. i understand, Islam is now where "we" were 800 yrs ago - dark ages.

its a mentality outside of Religion - Islam is no more evil or less than Christianity or Judaism.

have you read the Koran or NT or OT?????????????

I've read some of all of them - 1/3 of - i got tired of reading the Koran - a 500 page of a 100 page work, so only read 1/3 of.

same with NT, more of the OT - read most of the latter (which is identical to the Koran and does not affirm the NT) - i personally reject the Torah as unworthy, but affirm the "minor Prophet's work in the NT - as concuring with the better parts of the Koran).

again, i ask you, have you read the Koran?

- if so you have a right to reject the lessers parts, but not the whole religion.


or maybe you are a tribal dick and affirm the filth of Leviticus (OT works unworthy of inclusion of any "devine book") - if so we have noting to discuss.


and you are unable to understand the related nuances. You should do more research to understand the difference between religion and politics, and its nuances where applicable.

[gaffo]

VA - get real with me/us.

what is your Story? - why do you hate Islam the religion?

I welcome your views of and why - if you are honest thereof - if not so, pound sand.

[gaffo]

I don't give a flying fuck about those that should generally be muzzled. And I don't give a flying fuck about religion in general either, I take it with a bunch of salt, generally it is man's assault on the mind.

But again from the source of the holy buy bull, what IS salvation?

If you don't give a damn about religion, why are you so busy body asking questions [i.e. salvation - soteriology] related to religion.

FFS. Because I KNOW God\'God' exists! ...and you made the point about salvation - what is it? -- in the buy bull?

you replied to me about your faith a few weeks ago but did not reply due to not undstanding your reply. welcome clairfication of if you are willing to speak to me as an athiest dummy (which i am).

I condem no Beleivers out of hand (in whatever God) - just here to learn others perspectives of such matter.

happy new year! sir.

[Veritas Aequitas]

The problem is 'religion' and 'politics' are very closely related within Islam

yes it is. i understand, Islam is now where "we" were 800 yrs ago - dark ages.

its a mentality outside of Religion - Islam is no more evil or less than Christianity or Judaism.

have you read the Koran or NT or OT?????????????

I've read some of all of them - 1/3 of - i got tired of reading the Koran - a 500 page of a 100 page work, so only read 1/3 of.

same with NT, more of the OT - read most of the latter (which is identical to the Koran and does not affirm the NT) - i personally reject the Torah as unworthy, but affirm the "minor Prophet's work in the NT - as concuring with the better parts of the Koran).

again, i ask you, have you read the Koran?

- if so you have a right to reject the lessers parts, but not the whole religion.

or maybe you are a tribal dick and affirm the filth of Leviticus (OT works unworthy of inclusion of any "devine book") - if so we have noting to discuss.

and you are unable to understand the related nuances. You should do more research to understand the difference between religion and politics, and its nuances where applicable.

You are talking nonsense above!

I have stated many times; I had spent 3 years full time researching the Quran with very detailed analysis of the whole theme of the Quran.

Gaffo: I've read some of all of them - 1/3 of - i got tired of reading the Koran - a 500 page of a 100 page work, so only read 1/3 of.
Where did you learn your maths?
500 pages is not 1/3 of 100 pages.

You will not get much from reading the Quran from page 1 [chapter 1] to the end of the book. [last chapter].

There are 6236 verses in the Quran and to be effective you have to read them in the Chronological order and then in a thematic arrangement.

There are good elements in the Quran but those are only for the Muslims. The Quran has only a few verses that are not negative to the non-Muslims and these were raised in the earlier part of Muhammad prophethood when he was in a weak position.

The majority the the verses of the Quran represent a very malignant and evil ethos.

[Veritas Aequitas]

VA - get real with me/us.

what is your Story? - why do you hate Islam the religion?

I welcome your views of and why - if you are honest thereof - if not so, pound sand.

I don't waste my energy hating Islam.
I am anti-Islam and critique Islam for the good of humanity.

My Story is posted here;
Why the Focus on Religious-Based Evil Only?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=25284

Read the full story there.
One point therein is;

• Whilst not a Buddhist, I have adopted one of the Boddhisattva's vow re extending empathy and compassion to all living persons and things. Thus when one see so much sufferings, as a concern citizen of humanity one must strive to contribute in the most effective way possible.

Note this is one of the real results of evil and violent acts from the ideology of Islam;



Recently two Scandinavian girls were raped and had their head decapitated and the video was sent to their mother. These murderers claimed they did it for Islam.

Why are "you" such a COWARD in condemning Islam as the root cause while "trying" to shut others who critique the evil and violent potential of Islam?

[gaffo]

The problem is 'religion' and 'politics' are very closely related within Islam

yes it is. i understand, Islam is now where "we" were 800 yrs ago - dark ages.

its a mentality outside of Religion - Islam is no more evil or less than Christianity or Judaism.

have you read the Koran or NT or OT?????????????

I've read some of all of them - 1/3 of - i got tired of reading the Koran - a 500 page of a 100 page work, so only read 1/3 of.

same with NT, more of the OT - read most of the latter (which is identical to the Koran and does not affirm the NT) - i personally reject the Torah as unworthy, but affirm the "minor Prophet's work in the NT - as concuring with the better parts of the Koran).

again, i ask you, have you read the Koran?

- if so you have a right to reject the lessers parts, but not the whole religion.

or maybe you are a tribal dick and affirm the filth of Leviticus (OT works unworthy of inclusion of any "devine book") - if so we have noting to discuss.

and you are unable to understand the related nuances. You should do more research to understand the difference between religion and politics, and its nuances where applicable.

You are talking nonsense above!

not the first time.

I have stated many times; I had spent 3 years full time researching the Quran with very detailed analysis of the whole theme of the Quran.

I never noted this. most anit-Muslim screeds seem to be from Christ-fundies too afraid to read the Koran.

since, you have read it, i will in the future take your views with more credit than i have prior.

I welcome the fact that you have read it and your views of it hense (with my grain of salt).

There are good elements in the Quran but those are only for the Muslims. The Quran has only a few verses that is not negative to the non-Muslims and these were raised in the earlier part of Muhammad prophethood when he was in a weak position.

yes that is my undestanding as well - when Mohammed was trying to get Jews (people of the book) to convert to his religion.).

The majority the the verses of the Quran represent a very malignant and evil ethos.

this here seems like fear mongering from an Evangelical that never read from the Koran. but you have, so i stand corrected in knowledge thereof. you have read the Koran and that give you "creed" and so willing to hear you out on why you think Koran is malignant. I still think you are fear mongering/biased - but having read the work (would welcome your history about reading it) - give you creed and a level of credibility with me listening to.

thanks for reply, maybe i can learn from this thread something?

[gaffo]

sort of off topic, but assuming your view of Islam is correct, what do you propose as a solution to the 2 billion adherents of such evil theology for the future peace of mankind?

[Veritas Aequitas]

yes it is. i understand, Islam is now where "we" were 800 yrs ago - dark ages.

its a mentality outside of Religion - Islam is no more evil or less than Christianity or Judaism.

have you read the Koran or NT or OT?????????????

I've read some of all of them - 1/3 of - i got tired of reading the Koran - a 500 page of a 100 page work, so only read 1/3 of.

same with NT, more of the OT - read most of the latter (which is identical to the Koran and does not affirm the NT) - i personally reject the Torah as unworthy, but affirm the "minor Prophet's work in the NT - as concuring with the better parts of the Koran).

again, i ask you, have you read the Koran?

- if so you have a right to reject the lessers parts, but not the whole religion.

or maybe you are a tribal dick and affirm the filth of Leviticus (OT works unworthy of inclusion of any "devine book") - if so we have noting to discuss.

and you are unable to understand the related nuances. You should do more research to understand the difference between religion and politics, and its nuances where applicable.

You are talking nonsense above!

not the first time.

I have stated many times; I had spent 3 years full time researching the Quran with very detailed analysis of the whole theme of the Quran.

I never noted this. most anit-Muslim screeds seem to be from Christ-fundies too afraid to read the Koran.

since, you have read it, i will in the future take your views with more credit than i have prior.

I welcome the fact that you have read it and your views of it hense (with my grain of salt).

There are good elements in the Quran but those are only for the Muslims. The Quran has only a few verses that is not negative to the non-Muslims and these were raised in the earlier part of Muhammad prophethood when he was in a weak position.

yes that is my undestanding as well - when Mohammed was trying to get Jews (people of the book) to convert to his religion.).

The majority the the verses of the Quran represent a very malignant and evil ethos.

this here seems like fear mongering from an Evangelical that never read from the Koran. but you have, so i stand corrected in knowledge thereof. you have read the Koran and that give you "creed" and so willing to hear you out on why you think Koran is malignant. I still think you are fear mongering/biased - but having read the work (would welcome your history about reading it) - give you creed and a level of credibility with me listening to.

thanks for reply, maybe i can learn from this thread something?

I have not presented my research yet.

Meantime I suggest you read these statistics of the Quran and Ahadith.

https://www.cspii.org/en/articles/statistical-islam

They also provide a free lesson to get you started - see bottom of the page, i.e.;

• Get our self-study course level 1 audiobook FREE OF CHARGE and subscribe to our educational newsletter.

Dr. Warner use the term 'Political Islam' and I do not agree with that. There is only one Islam, i.e. the ideology of Islam.

[gaffo]

thanks for the link, i may check it out - no promises - but might.

would appreciate it if you might try to answer my inquary about the "solution" even without research.

from your "Gut" this is a forum to discuss afterall.

I don't know your views of mankind, but I've always been a Univeral Humanist - so the same person being born a Christian/Jew or Muslim would act according to thier moral compass (defined by thier born nature - not their Faith).

and generally - though a depressant personality - view man more good than bad.

your views may differ than mine, and welcome your solution to the "Muslim Problem" (as I imtimated i do not perticualarly like Islam, but see it not userping the "Goodness" of each man/woman - so not a problem IMO). Good will winout overall (Islam will be "Tempered by modernity").

you my disagree - welcome discussion.

[Veritas Aequitas]

sort of off topic, but assuming your view of Islam is correct, what do you propose as a solution to the 2 billion adherents of such evil theology for the future peace of mankind?

There is no quick solution at present so we have to tolerate with the 1.5+ billion. The solution has to be a long term strategy to wean off Muslims from the ideology of Islam.

• The Strategies:
  1. The first critical strategy is for the majority of non-Muslims to be educated with the truths of the ideology of Islam.
  I emphasized the truths, so there is no reason to avoid knowing the truths of Islam per se.
  
  2. Meanwhile the Muslims themselves must also correspondingly and simultaneously be informed to the truths of their ideology and why it is potential dangerous for humanity.
  
  3. Muslims must not be forced to convert to other religions or be non-theists.
  
  4. Religion is a very serious psychological issue in dealing with an inherent and unavoidable existential crisis. Humanity must find neutral fool proof alternative replacements for Islam while weaning it off and in transition. This has to be voluntary based on being informed of the truths.

The above strategy will not work overnight and it may take up to 50 years of more for the transition.

However we must begin the process with whatever we can do.
The best we can do is to discuss and critique the ideology of Islam given the evident evil and violent acts committed by SOME evil prone Muslims when inspired by the ideology of Islam.

It is antithetic to humanity's progress to prevent and shut up the discussion of the evil and violent nature inherent within Islam.
It is very shameful and cowardice for people to shut discussion* on Islam.
It is only a discussion, yet to some it is as if it is a real physical war.

[gaffo]

reasonable course of action - and sadly you are right it will take a generation or two.

also note that 1/5 (19-percent to be precise) of Arabs (even in the heartland of Saudi Arabia - are Agnotic/Athiestic - this is a fact, though they do not advertize this out of fear of their neighbors/governments - sadly.

so there remains hope in the above - when even there are millions (15-20) Saudis that doubt Allah exists when growing up in a society that demands "To Believe" gives me hope personally.

thanks for reply

[attofishpi]

If you don't give a damn about religion, why are you so busy body asking questions [i.e. salvation - soteriology] related to religion.

FFS. Because I KNOW God\'God' exists! ...and you made the point about salvation - what is it? -- in the buy bull?

you replied to me about your faith a few weeks ago but did not reply due to not undstanding your reply. welcome clairfication of if you are willing to speak to me as an athiest dummy (which i am).

I condem no Beleivers out of hand (in whatever God) - just here to learn others perspectives of such matter.

happy new year! sir.

Ya, happy NY to you gaffo. Don't question me with regards to 'faith', as I am beyond that it's a thing called know_ledge.

The last few posts of mine here should clarify part of my comprehension of the 3rd party intelligence that constructs our reality, if you have any questions post them there.:-

God\'God's existence is probable
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25753&p=389106#p389106

The non 'divine' A.I. comprehension of this 3rd party intelligence:-
It is rather simple.
Intelligent species require ever increasing amounts of energy to sustain their lifestyle.
Eventually as entropy increases, useful resources diminish, requiring said intelligence's to exist far more efficiently.
It is likely they would prefer to exist within a reality that they are accustomed to, hence an Artificial Intelligence would project reality to the consciousness's of individuals once interfaced to the system.
Their material bodies would be an illusion, and no longer requiring to draw energy from the original system.

This A.I. 'God' would have set rules, as to those born into the system, rules that govern whether they get the right to reincarnate or not.
Perhaps 10 commandments.
Those within the system would be left in GREAT DOUBT, as to its existence, since energy should only be provided, to those of higher moral fibre, indeed, a self realised higher moral fibre...those that are indeed WISE.

[gaffo]

FFS. Because I KNOW God\'God' exists! ...and you made the point about salvation - what is it? -- in the buy bull?

you replied to me about your faith a few weeks ago but did not reply due to not undstanding your reply. welcome clairfication of if you are willing to speak to me as an athiest dummy (which i am).

I condem no Beleivers out of hand (in whatever God) - just here to learn others perspectives of such matter.

happy new year! sir.

Ya, happy NY to you gaffo. Don't question me with regards to 'faith', as I am beyond that it's a thing called know_ledge.

The last few posts of mine here should clarify part of my comprehension of the 3rd party intelligence that constructs our reality, if you have any questions post them there.:-

God\'God's existence is probable
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25753&p=389106#p389106

The non 'divine' A.I. comprehension of this 3rd party intelligence:-
It is rather simple.
Intelligent species require ever increasing amounts of energy to sustain their lifestyle.
Eventually as entropy increases, useful resources diminish, requiring said intelligence's to exist far more efficiently.
It is likely they would prefer to exist within a reality that they are accustomed to, hence an Artificial Intelligence would project reality to the consciousness's of individuals once interfaced to the system.
Their material bodies would be an illusion, and no longer requiring to draw energy from the original system.

This A.I. 'God' would have set rules, as to those born into the system, rules that govern whether they get the right to reincarnate or not.
Perhaps 10 commandments.
Those within the system would be left in GREAT DOUBT, as to its existence, since energy should only be provided, to those of higher moral fibre, indeed, a self realised higher moral fibre...those that are indeed WISE.

thanks for reply Att - my view differs - as you prob know. I view "man" (these last milion yrs or so as being "with the program" - in accord to nature.

since 15000 yrs or so - agriculture first, cities second, ,man has fallen out of accord with the rest of the animal kingdom.

IMO we will be removed by Mother Nature in the next few 10's of thousands of years - after destroying the Earths's biosphere- and we have removed most animals and plants too............Earth is stronger than man, she will removed us eventually (after we have removed most Fauna).

Earth is stronger than man - but not so WRT to sun, so there will be other Fauna to take our place of Pride once they get brains too big for themselves -and play the same game of ruining our Earth and being removed from it....................until eventually the Sun make our Earth to hot for life.

so be it.

thanks for reply Sir.

[gaffo]

you replied to me about your faith a few weeks ago but did not reply due to not undstanding your reply. welcome clairfication of if you are willing to speak to me as an athiest dummy (which i am).

I condem no Beleivers out of hand (in whatever God) - just here to learn others perspectives of such matter.

happy new year! sir.

Ya, happy NY to you gaffo. Don't question me with regards to 'faith', as I am beyond that it's a thing called know_ledge.

The last few posts of mine here should clarify part of my comprehension of the 3rd party intelligence that constructs our reality, if you have any questions post them there.:-

God\'God's existence is probable
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25753&p=389106#p389106

The non 'divine' A.I. comprehension of this 3rd party intelligence:-
It is rather simple.
Intelligent species require ever increasing amounts of energy to sustain their lifestyle.
Eventually as entropy increases, useful resources diminish, requiring said intelligence's to exist far more efficiently.
It is likely they would prefer to exist within a reality that they are accustomed to, hence an Artificial Intelligence would project reality to the consciousness's of individuals once interfaced to the system.
Their material bodies would be an illusion, and no longer requiring to draw energy from the original system.

This A.I. 'God' would have set rules, as to those born into the system, rules that govern whether they get the right to reincarnate or not.
Perhaps 10 commandments.
Those within the system would be left in GREAT DOUBT, as to its existence, since energy should only be provided, to those of higher moral fibre, indeed, a self realised higher moral fibre...those that are indeed WISE.

thanks for reply Att - my view differs - as you prob know. I view "man" (these last milion yrs or so as being "with the program" - in accord to nature.

since 15000 yrs or so - agriculture first, cities second, ,man has fallen out of accord with the rest of the animal kingdom.

IMO we will be removed by Mother Nature in the next few 10's of thousands of years - after destroying the Earths's biosphere- and we have removed most animals and plants too............Earth is stronger than man, she will removed us eventually (after we have removed most Fauna), then herself.

Earth is stronger than man - but not so WRT to sun, so there will be other Fauna to take our place of Pride once they get brains too big for themselves -and play the same game of ruining our Earth and being removed from it....................until eventually the Sun make our Earth to hot for life.

so be it.

thanks for reply Sir.