The Multiverse Conundrum

[Atla]

That isn’t the problem I am pointing out.

The problem is when your curiosity leads you to a logical conclusion different than the philosophy you apply to your day-to-day life!

Isn’t that how cognitive dissonance unfolds?
Isn’t that how late-life regret works?

No, it's not. The philosophical conclusions can be so far removed from everyday life, that mixing them doesn't even make much sense. It can actually be a mistake, which can for example lead to an absolute-relative confusion. Or for example an irrational obsession with trying to beat entropy, even though we are safe for billions of years to come.

[TimeSeeker]

That isn’t the problem I am pointing out.

The problem is when your curiosity leads you to a logical conclusion different than the philosophy you apply to your day-to-day life!

Isn’t that how cognitive dissonance unfolds?
Isn’t that how late-life regret works?

No, it's not. The philosophical conclusions can be so far removed from everyday life, that mixing them doesn't even make much sense. It can actually be a mistake, which can for example lead to an absolute-relative confusion. Or for example an irrational obsession with trying to beat entropy, even though we are safe for billions of years to come.

Temporal discounting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_preference

The Heat Death is but the existential entropic risk that is certain. Yes it is billions of years away.

There is a much more immediate one that is not “far removed from every day life”: global warming.

The cause of global warming is whatever the cause is. What’s is the SOLUTION?

We have no solution. Therefore - we are ignorant.

Ignorance is the same as entropy

Here are a few more risks our ignorance has no solution for:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_th ... osmic_rays

[Atla]

The Heat Death is but the existential entropic risk that is certain.

It's not certain.

There is a much more immediate one: global warming.

The cause of global warming is whatever the cause is. What’s is the SOLUTION?

We have no solution. Therefore - we are ignorant.

Ignorance is the same as entropy

Here are a few more risks our ignorance has no solution for:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_th ... osmic_rays

One day you will have to learn to make a difference between entropy and human ignorance / human nature.

[TimeSeeker]

The Heat Death is but the existential entropic risk that is certain.

It's not certain.

There is a much more immediate one: global warming.

The cause of global warming is whatever the cause is. What’s is the SOLUTION?

We have no solution. Therefore - we are ignorant.

Ignorance is the same as entropy

Here are a few more risks our ignorance has no solution for:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_th ... osmic_rays

One day you will have to learn to make a difference between entropy and human ignorance / human nature.

If energy is a fundamental property of the universe, then thermodynamics are the fundamental laws of the universe. Conservation of energy!

In that framework there is no epistemic distinction between entropy and ignorance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_demon

So, one day you have to learn to stop making distinctions without a difference

[Atla]

The Heat Death is but the existential entropic risk that is certain.

It's not certain.

There is a much more immediate one: global warming.

The cause of global warming is whatever the cause is. What’s is the SOLUTION?

We have no solution. Therefore - we are ignorant.

Ignorance is the same as entropy

Here are a few more risks our ignorance has no solution for:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_th ... osmic_rays

One day you will have to learn to make a difference between entropy and human ignorance / human nature.

If energy is a fundamental property of the universe, then thermodynamics are the fundamental laws of the universe. Conservation of energy!

In that framework there is no epistemic distinction between entropy and ignorance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_demon

So, one day you have to learn to stop making distinctions without a difference

No, it's not, actually you are genuinely insane.
For example humans know that global warming can be stopped by killing most/all humans. No ignorance there.

[TimeSeeker]

It's not certain.


One day you will have to learn to make a difference between entropy and human ignorance / human nature.

If energy is a fundamental property of the universe, then thermodynamics are the fundamental laws of the universe. Conservation of energy!

In that framework there is no epistemic distinction between entropy and ignorance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_demon

So, one day you have to learn to stop making distinctions without a difference

No, it's not, actually you are genuinely insane.
For example humans know that global warming can be stopped by killing most/all humans. No ignorance there.

You call that a “solution”, in the same sentence as you call me “genuinely insane”?

Nobody gives a fuck about “solving global warming” if we are all dead/extinct!

Global warming is caused BY our DEMAND for energy! You know - because everything is connected.

So another way to “solve” global warming is to plummet us back to the dark ages.

So please, PLEASE don’t “solve” anything! OK?

[Atla]

So another way to “solve” global warming is to plummet us back to the dark ages.

Thank you for giving another example that human ignorance / our solutions on this little planet, aren't the same as entropy which seems to apply to the entire observable universe. Actually without entropy we wouldn't be here in the first place, and you couldn't ponder about how to beat it.

[TimeSeeker]

So another way to “solve” global warming is to plummet us back to the dark ages.

Thank you for giving another example that human ignorance / our solutions on this little planet, aren't the same as entropy which seems to apply to the entire observable universe. Actually without entropy we wouldn't be here in the first place, and you couldn't ponder about how to beat it.

And now you default to your absolutist/black and white view!

Yes. Entropy brought us here. Entropy is also what will remove us from here!

The part that we need anti-entropy for is to MAINTAIN our current form! This thing we all call “being” or “existence” or “consciousness”.

We need knowledge to survive/evolve/adapt despite natural selection!

The dualism you can’t seem to conquer is this “objectivity” vs “subjectivity” distinction in perspectives.

Ironically - the very concept of ‘objectivity’ is a pragmatic human invention! It is just a thinking tool.

Another definition for “objectivity” is “The Big Picture from a HUMAN consciousness!”

[Atla]

And now you default to your absolutist/black and white view!

Yes. Entropy brought us here. Entropy is also what will remove us from here!

The part that we need anti-entropy for is to MAINTAIN our current form! This thing we all call “being” or “existence” or “consciousness”.

We need knowledge to survive/evolve/adapt despite natural selection!

The dualism you can’t seem to conquer is this “objectivity” vs “subjectivity” distinction in perspectives.

Ironically - the very concept of ‘objectivity’ is a pragmatic human invention! It is just a thinking tool.

What forever goes over your head is that, on this forum, not every topic is about optimizing human survival.

For example, are multiverse hypotheses about optimizing human survival?

[TimeSeeker]

And now you default to your absolutist/black and white view!

Yes. Entropy brought us here. Entropy is also what will remove us from here!

The part that we need anti-entropy for is to MAINTAIN our current form! This thing we all call “being” or “existence” or “consciousness”.

We need knowledge to survive/evolve/adapt despite natural selection!

The dualism you can’t seem to conquer is this “objectivity” vs “subjectivity” distinction in perspectives.

Ironically - the very concept of ‘objectivity’ is a pragmatic human invention! It is just a thinking tool.

What forever goes over your head is that, on this forum, not every topic is about optimizing human survival.

For example, are multiverse hypotheses about optimizing human survival?

What seems to go over your head is that in this very moment, in this DIMENSION you aren’t extinct!

That is WHY you get to TALK about “multiverse hypotheses” on a forum!

Survival is a pre-requisite for philosophising/enquiry/science!

NOT the other way around! Arrow of time stuff...

[Atla]

What seems to go over your head is that in this very moment you aren’t extinct!

That is WHY you get to TALK about “multiverse hypotheses”.

Survival is a pre-requisite for philosophising/enquiry/science!

NOT the other way around! Arrow of time stuff...

You can't even tell the difference between already being here and future survival?

[TimeSeeker]

What seems to go over your head is that in this very moment you aren’t extinct!

That is WHY you get to TALK about “multiverse hypotheses”.

Survival is a pre-requisite for philosophising/enquiry/science!

NOT the other way around! Arrow of time stuff...

You can't even tell the difference between already being here and future survival?

You can’t even tell that you are the future of the generations that preceded you.

Nor that now is 60 seconds into the future since you typed that comment.

Here you still are - non-extinct!

[TimeSeeker]

Your model for future human life expectancy boils down to this (adjust to scale):

F24C6CBB-2675-4B03-BA49-594264BE8956.jpeg

According to the dinosaurs - it is a once in a lifetime Type II error

[Atla]

Your model for future human life expectancy boils down to this (adjust to scale):

F24C6CBB-2675-4B03-BA49-594264BE8956.jpeg

Again, very little to do with the multiverse hypothesis.
Maybe the scientists who propose such things should be shot too.

[TimeSeeker]

Your model for future human life expectancy boils down to this (adjust to scale):

F24C6CBB-2675-4B03-BA49-594264BE8956.jpeg

Again, very little to do with the multiverse hypothesis.
Maybe the scientists who propose such things should be shot too.

Everything is connected, except multiverses?
If multiverses interact Does that make it a universe or a multiverse?


And if they don’t interact then they are untestable/unfalsifiable?

So those “scientists” are wasting our tax money on bullshit? In one word: theft.

I don’t care what you do when you self-subsidize your research. When we pay for it - I care. A lot!