Is the concept of "God" necessary, let alone real?

[Nick_A]

I admit the truth that I am the wretched man. do you admit that you are the wretched woman?

I think that's ridiculous. Do you think that believing and admitting such a thing about yourself gives you the excuse to spew your dishonesty without ever seeking clarity and offering apology when you are shown to be delusional and wrong?

What am I delusional and wrong about? We are all delusional and wrong in our own unique ways. Why do you have so much trouble admitting you are the wretched woman?

[Reflex]

You would be surprised how many people much brighter than me are aware of and value what you find repulsive.

You mean... the way you make up stuff to support your ego, such as hurling lies at people and not admitting that honorably? I mainly think it's stupid.

Imagine that....someone calling some of the most influential philosophers in history "stupid."

[Lacewing]

I admit the truth that I am the wretched man. do you admit that you are the wretched woman?

I think that's ridiculous. Do you think that believing and admitting such a thing about yourself gives you the excuse to spew your dishonesty without ever seeking clarity and offering apology when you are shown to be delusional and wrong?

What am I delusional and wrong about? We are all delusional and wrong in our own unique ways. Why do you have so much trouble admitting you are the wretched woman?

I'm not a wretched woman, Nick. Your beliefs are not mine. Very simple.

What are you delusional and wrong about, you ask? Everything that you accuse me of. You don't know me, but you make up crazy crap all the time. And when I tell you that you're wrong, you don't say anything. Don't you care that you're make false accusations? Don't you want to be more clear and truthful? Or are you so addicted to your imaginative view that you don't really care how accurate it is?

[Lacewing]

You would be surprised how many people much brighter than me are aware of and value what you find repulsive.

You mean... the way you make up stuff to support your ego, such as hurling lies at people and not admitting that honorably? I mainly think it's stupid.

Imagine that....someone calling some of the most influential philosophers in history "stupid."

Who did that, Reflex? I was talking about Nick. Go back to sleep.

[Lacewing]

Why do you have so much trouble admitting you are the wretched woman?

You know, we already previously clarified our differing perspectives... and here you are again trying to force your views on me. You see people as wretched. I see people as divine.

Why do you have so much trouble accepting that your perspectives and beliefs are not universal truth for everyone?

If you want to see yourself as wretched -- if that's your experience -- live it out fully for yourself. Why insist that other people experience the same? Do you want to imagine others to be wretched so that you won't feel so alone? Notice what you're doing. Notice what you're creating. You are not here to define everyone else's experience and capability. I continually see much more present potential than what you tend to speak of or demonstrate.

[-1-]

Why do you have so much trouble admitting you are the wretched woman?

Why do you, Nick_A, have so much trouble admitting you are a no-good, down-and-dirty, intolerant goddamned idiot?

A man-servant to his god, who doesn't even know who his god is, what the god is like, what the god likes, and what likes of the god like god-like licks.

[Reflex]

You mean... the way you make up stuff to support your ego, such as hurling lies at people and not admitting that honorably? I mainly think it's stupid.

Imagine that....someone calling some of the most influential philosophers in history "stupid."

Who did that, Reflex? I was talking about Nick. Go back to sleep.

By calling Nick's ideas "made up" and "stupid," you're saying the same of some of the most influential philosophers in history.

[Nick_A]

Imagine that....someone calling some of the most influential philosophers in history "stupid."

Who did that, Reflex? I was talking about Nick. Go back to sleep.

By calling Nick's ideas "made up" and "stupid," you're saying the same of some of the most influential philosophers in history.

That is the problem reflex. The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man. Can you imagine yourself in school and your mind is beginning to open to wonder about something greater than yourself and the reality you live with. Then these experts will do their best to destroy it in you by being bombarded with denial and negativity. Not so easy to survive. Is it any wonder why so many young people turn to drugs?

But if you consider that both Jesus and Socrates were killed by this negative intolerant mindset which questions its divinity, at least we may get out of it in one piece. However for some the normal tendency for contemplation will be scared out of them. Their first breath will be cut off.

“To think about God is to the human soul what breathing is to the human body.

I say to think about God, not necessarily to believe in God–that may or may not come later.

I say: to think about God.” ~Jacob Needleman in What Is God? p. 3

[Lacewing]

By calling Nick's ideas "made up" and "stupid," you're saying the same of some of the most influential philosophers in history.

I pointed out that Nick makes up shit. Do you deny that is true?

Nick would be more believable if he would take responsibility for the things he says, and correct them when they're wrong -- as opposed to convoluting things dishonestly to suit his purposes. It seems that in your eagerness to side with him and oppose me, you're disregarding that.

Please identify the most influential philosophers that you feel are being disrespected by my direct comments to Nick, and please provide clarity for the views identified below (since you apparently share these views with Nick)...

So, an individual is NOT nature? An individual is somehow above and more capable than nature? Man's conscious self-awareness is somehow capable of such clarity as to know his creator? Organic life is a machine, but man is not? Together, evolved humankind can rise above universal laws like wars?

[Lacewing]

The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man.

And here we go... convoluted again... after we just talked about my perspective that people are divine!

You just can't accept any views other than your own, can you Nick? You're trying to idolize the human individual as divine above all else... while I'm saying that ALL IS DIVINE, there is no separation between nature and us, it's ALL the same stuff, and it's all divine.

So, HOW exactly is it that I have NO TOLERANCE as you claim above? PLEASE EXPLAIN YOUR ACCUSATION!

[Nick_A]

The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man.

And here we go... convoluted again... after we just talked about my perspective that people are divine!

You just can't accept any views other than your own, can you Nick? You're trying to idolize the human individual as divine above all else... while I'm saying that ALL IS DIVINE, there is no separation between nature and us, it's ALL the same stuff, and it's all divine.

So, HOW exactly is it that I have NO TOLERANCE as you claim above? PLEASE EXPLAIN YOUR ACCUSATION!

Your reactions speak for themselves. Why should I believe Man is divine? Wht about the hypocrisy of our species suggests divinity. You react and condemn with negativity.. That is intolerance

[Lacewing]

You react and condemn with negativity.. That is intolerance

Your statement was this: "The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man."
How does this apply to me? Where did I condemn with negativity? Stop hurling accusations at me and show me.

[Nick_A]

You react and condemn with negativity.. That is intolerance

Your statement was this: "The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man."
How does this apply to me? Where did I condemn with negativity? Stop hurling accusations at me and show me.

Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 pm
I admit the truth that I am the wretched man. do you admit that you are the wretched woman?

LW - I think that's ridiculous. Do you think that believing and admitting such a thing about yourself gives you the excuse to spew your dishonesty without ever seeking clarity and offering apology when you are shown to be delusional and wrong?

Not much positive thinking, impartiality, and acceptance. And you call me delusional???

[Lacewing]

You react and condemn with negativity.. That is intolerance

Your statement was this: "The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man."
How does this apply to me? Where did I condemn with negativity? Stop hurling accusations at me and show me.

Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 pm
I admit the truth that I am the wretched man. do you admit that you are the wretched woman?

LW - I think that's ridiculous. Do you think that believing and admitting such a thing about yourself gives you the excuse to spew your dishonesty without ever seeking clarity and offering apology when you are shown to be delusional and wrong?

Not much positive thinking, impartiality, and acceptance. And you call me delusional???

Okay... so you can say to me "do you admit that you are the wretched woman?"... and then my response of "I think that's ridiculous" is not showing positive thinking, impartiality, and acceptance -- whereas, do you think YOUR QUESTION WAS SHOWING THOSE THINGS to me? By asking me to "ADMIT" to something that makes absolutely no sense to me, but because it's your belief, you think you have a right to ask me to admit to it? How arrogant and/or delusional is that?

[Nick_A]

Your statement was this: "The secular progressives have no tolerance for ideas which question the imagined divinity of Man."
How does this apply to me? Where did I condemn with negativity? Stop hurling accusations at me and show me.

Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:38 pm
I admit the truth that I am the wretched man. do you admit that you are the wretched woman?

LW - I think that's ridiculous. Do you think that believing and admitting such a thing about yourself gives you the excuse to spew your dishonesty without ever seeking clarity and offering apology when you are shown to be delusional and wrong?

Not much positive thinking, impartiality, and acceptance. And you call me delusional???

Okay... so you can say to me "do you admit that you are the wretched woman?"... and then my response of "I think that's ridiculous" is not showing positive thinking, impartiality, and acceptance -- whereas, do you think YOUR QUESTION WAS SHOWING THOSE THINGS to me? By asking me to "ADMIT" to something that makes absolutely no sense to me, but because it's your belief, you think you have a right to ask me to admit to it? How arrogant and/or delusional is that?

I have explained the wretched man concept many times. I'll do it again:

Romans 7:

21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death?

I have experienced that I live in opposition to myself - my higher and lower natures. That makes me the wretched man.

If you do not live with the opposition between your higher and lower natures then you are not the wretched woman and have somehow become "one," free of hypocrisy, and an example of the relationship between the inner and outer man described by Socrates where there is no conflict and the lower becomes an expression of the higher:

“Give me beauty in the inward soul; may the outward and the inward man be at one.” ~ Socrates