Race versus culture

[davidm]

It is a useful hypothesis of yours ("gangsterism")that hierarchical control increases with environmental danger. That hypothesis extends into the consciousness of the plebs, who are manipulated by elites entrenching the hierarchical status quo, to believe that there is increased danger. Racism is one of the modes of control which is used by interested elites.

I actually think it's the other way around.

Equality is a tool and propoganda made up by manipulative elites as a tool to enslave the population.

lol

Racism. What is racism?

What you practice.

Abe lincoln said Blacks were inferior to whites. Was Abe lincoln a racist?

Anyone who studies Lincoln's brilliant words knows why a sly cat he really was. There's a wonderful statement about the races he made during the Lincoln/Douglass debates that can be read precisely in two different ways: blacks are inferior (said for the rubes) and blacks are NOT inferior (said for the very few non-dumb asses of his era). Even beyond that statement, however, Lincoln periodically expressed what today we would regard as unambiguously racist sentiments, BUT, there is an informal fallacy of judging figures of the past according to standards of today.

here's a song for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5hQb_71qLk

Nobody gives a shit about your stupid songs.

An example of this lie is like saying blacks and whites have the same personalities.

Races don't have personalities. Individuals have personalities.

What is racism?

What you practice.

What is not reasonable, is spreading a lie that all races are equal to each other, genetics do not exist, and that all races have the same personalities.

Of course genetics exist! That's the whole point, you blabbering dummy! Genetics offers no support whatever to your racism. It also offers no support to racial classifications -- at the bottom of evolutionary taxonomies is species, not race. Also, as I have already pointed out, there is more genetic variation among so-called whites, than between so-called blacks and whites! Of course you are oblivious to all of this.

Also, I don't believe you "hire" anyone.

[thedoc]

lol

Don't feed the Troll.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

Race is meaningless.
There is only culture.
You can bring up baby into any culture seamlessly. The fact that s/he might look a little different might affect the outcome negatively - but only if people in the culture believe that race is a valid category. And so we see competent, intelligent and successful black people in the USA whose only problem is racist bigots trying to undermine them, when such bigots are their inferiors in many respects.

In the TV show Eureka there is only 1 black genius in the entire town.

But in America there are four black geniuses.
The man who invented peanut butter. The woman who invented the hair dryer. A woman who was an engineer at NASA. And another woman astronaut.

Apparently female blacks are more masculine than male blacks.

But let's pretend all races are the same and that Genes and Genetics are evil/taboo/don't exist.

Lets compare this with white geniuses.
Bill Gates, inventor of the Windows. John Carmack, pioneer of efficient BSP technology to make 3D FPS games. The Frenchman who invented the automobile. The white man who invented the computer. The white woman who discovered DNA. Marie Curie, a white woman, who pioneered biology. The white man who invented the rocket engine. Wilbur and Orville Wright who invented the airplane. Leonardo Davinci. Michealangelo. Genesis, an all white band. Mozart. Tchaikovsky. Nikola Tesla.
I can keep going.

I close my eyes to reality. I ignore reality, say that all statistics are fake/irrelevant and that it doesn't matter. I sing the song of equality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5hQb_71qLk

As a matter of fact every genius has been a man. There are plenty of brainy women, but that's not the same thing.

[thedoc]

As a matter of fact every genius has been a man. There are plenty of brainy women, but that's not the same thing.

Is that a matter of ability or culture, In England, many years ago, a woman couldn't be anything but a man could be whatever he wanted.

[GreatandWiseTrixie]

How does a race have a personality?

Oh! And whilst we're here what do you mean by race?

I will reply nicely to you since you are polite and not rude.

Now imagine you are a scientist, in a lab coat, you have a computer that can birth life forms, and in the computer you put together different genes to make a lifeform. Certain gene codes are saved to different Race folders. Like there is a Folder called White, a file folder called African, and so forth. And in these file folders are subfolders. British folder, French folder, etc. Or Madagascar folder, Kenya folder, etc. And in these subfolders are Tribes. Then in these Tribes folders we have different preset, like human preset 1 human preset 2 and so forth.
And there is a little notepad file and in the file it says "Typical personality traits of these presets."
Because these genetic presets tend to have certain brain types, and personality types, inherently.
Still following?

What we are all equal in, however, is our humanity.

So Chinese, who torture dogs, are equal in humanity to Japanese, who led a peaceful vegetarian lifestyle for 1000 years?
And africans, who jail homosexuals, and stone them to death, are equal in humanity to whites who just shame homosexuals and say they can't married?
And pakistanis, who slaughter their wives brutally if their wife gets raped, are equal in humanity, to whites?
And yes, some Whites are evil, I know some American whites did unhuman things to the Native Americans. However these whites weren't true British, they were offshoots of the white race. And yes some Whites in government treat prisoners horribly and give prisoners solitary confiment.
These whites are evil whites, and should be removed from the planet, since they contaminate the white race.
Similarly, any good, noble black, should be allowed to breed, amongst interracials, island peoples, or blacks.

Racism. What is racism?

What you practice.

Nope I don't practice racism. I am an equal opportunity employer, if a black has a 160 IQ I will hire him.

Anyone who studies Lincoln's brilliant words knows why a sly cat he really was. There's a wonderful statement about the races he made during the Lincoln/Douglass debates that can be read precisely in two different ways: blacks are inferior (said for the rubes) and blacks are NOT inferior (said for the very few non-dumb asses of his era). Even beyond that statement, however, Lincoln periodically expressed what today we would regard as unambiguously racist sentiments, BUT, there is an informal fallacy of judging figures of the past according to standards of today.

You seem to think that Today's standards have some bearing on this, but they don't. Either something is true, or something is false. If in modern times, billions are brainwashed into believing something is false, doesn't mean it's true, like religion. So what lincoln said was either true or false. Unlike modern times, people weren't forced into acting like goodie-two-shoes 24/7. So he simply stated his honest unbiased observations of the different races. Tell me in modern times are you even allowed to state observations of the races without a horde and mob coming to attack you verbally? Hmm so which is more likely true, the Abe Lincoln/Charles Darwin was unbiased or that you are unbiased.

here's a song for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5hQb_71qLk

Nobody gives a shit about your stupid songs.

You are being rude.
I thought I was arguing with an adult and not a whiny brat.
Your next response is to say that it is a song from a "kid's show" and completely discount the political message the show was trying to advertise.
I am literally asking you to spend 2 minutes of your time to watch a video that is relevant to the discussion, and you won't, because you wish to be willfully ignorant. Then you act like your willful ignorance is your strength. You are a master of fallacies.
You are the equivalent of a religion person, that I send a 3 minute video to to make them think about their religion differently, and they refuse to watch the video because they have "faith" and are comfortable with their life.

Races don't have personalities. Individuals have personalities.

Both races and individuals have personalities.

Of course genetics exist! That's the whole point, you blabbering dummy! Genetics offers no support whatever to your racism. It also offers no support to racial classifications -- at the bottom of evolutionary taxonomies is species, not race. Also, as I have already pointed out, there is more genetic variation among so-called whites, than between so-called blacks and whites! Of course you are oblivious to all of this.

More rudeness and emotional hysteria.
You are literally telling me genetics proves there is no such thing as race classifications.
Are you serious or possibly insane.
So there is no such thing as different types of horses? A lion is the same as a tiger? No genetic difference? A poodle is the same as a bulldog? No way to tell genetically that a poodle is not a bulldog? Poodles and bulldogs have the same genes?
Are you bloody serious.

Are you talking about this claim from PBS?

First of all, lots of those documentaries on TV are unscientific and make logical fallacies to make a quick buck.
This quote is an example.
The guy is committing a fallacy. Of course there isn't one single gene that can prove a race. Its a cluster. Just like one single pixel doesnt make an image. And No shit, there are shared pixels. I bet if you took a picture of a black person, and a picture of a white person, you could find some of the same colored pixels.

But you are literally telling me that genes are meaningless, that white babies are just "born" out of some magic sauce that comes out of their mothers vagina, and that black tribes giving birth to people that look (and smell) like the same tribe, is do to some spiritual voodoo ritual stuff or something.

Also, I don't believe you "hire" anyone.

Whether or not you believe it doesn't matter, it was stated in the neutral tense anyway. Could mean the past present or future.

[GreatandWiseTrixie]

As a matter of fact every genius has been a man. There are plenty of brainy women, but that's not the same thing.

What is your definition of genius?

[Seleucus]

If you really read them, how could you think they support your 'cultural trainers' theory?

History of madness does too come to think of it, the mental hospital being one of the institutions of control.

then people who became Muslims must have already been (in some sense) Muslims already. But in that case we should not describe their culture as 'Muslim', because their current religion would only be a superficial feature of that pre-Muslim culture.

You couldn't be more correct. Islam is the superficial expression of the underlying Middle-Eastern political system and Semitic El (sky father) centered proto-monotheism; a certain amount or reaction against Rome in there too.

That's even before we get into your infinite regression, when we have to explain how any pre-Muslim culture could have arisen, since the pre-pre- Muslims could not have changed their culture to become pre-Muslims.

You're a smart guy, what do you think? If writing was invented only two times in all of history as some suspect, once in the Old World and once in the New World, and all other systems of writing are just cultural transmissions and adaptations of the original invention, how was it invented in the first place?

[Seleucus]

Race is meaningless.
There is only culture.
You can bring up baby into any culture seamlessly. The fact that s/he might look a little different might affect the outcome negatively - but only if people in the culture believe that race is a valid category. And so we see competent, intelligent and successful black people in the USA whose only problem is racist bigots trying to undermine them, when such bigots are their inferiors in many respects.

In the TV show Eureka there is only 1 black genius in the entire town.

But in America there are four black geniuses.
The man who invented peanut butter. The woman who invented the hair dryer. A woman who was an engineer at NASA. And another woman astronaut.

Apparently female blacks are more masculine than male blacks.

But let's pretend all races are the same and that Genes and Genetics are evil/taboo/don't exist.

Lets compare this with white geniuses.
Bill Gates, inventor of the Windows. John Carmack, pioneer of efficient BSP technology to make 3D FPS games. The Frenchman who invented the automobile. The white man who invented the computer. The white woman who discovered DNA. Marie Curie, a white woman, who pioneered biology. The white man who invented the rocket engine. Wilbur and Orville Wright who invented the airplane. Leonardo Davinci. Michealangelo. Genesis, an all white band. Mozart. Tchaikovsky. Nikola Tesla.
I can keep going.

I close my eyes to reality. I ignore reality, say that all statistics are fake/irrelevant and that it doesn't matter. I sing the song of equality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5hQb_71qLk

Culture would be sufficient to explain the differences between races, but because race and culture are so closely concordant, and because control group studies on whole races is obviously out of the question, we can never be sure if something like being or not being disgusted by filthiness, which could be either a cultural or a genetically controlled psychological trait, is one or the other.

[Seleucus]

What is racism? Racism is a stupid terminology. There is either unfairness and unreasonableness, or fairness and logic and reason.
I am a reasonable woman. If a black has a 160 IQ I will hire him for a job. That is called being reasonable. What is not reasonable, is spreading a lie that all races are equal to each other, genetics do not exist, and that all races have the same personalities.

People who use words like "racist" tend not to be reasonable, but hysterical and unreasonable.

I define racism as unfair discrimination based on race. Strangely, the people who are always saying "you're a racist, you're a racist" are the same ones who are also saying "race doesn't exist".

[Seleucus]

What is not reasonable, is spreading a lie that all races are equal to each other, genetics do not exist, and that all races have the same personalities.

No one is saying anyone is "equal" to anyone else. Do you have the same strengths and weaknesses as other members in your own family? No, we are all individuals.

What we are all equal in, however, is our humanity.

I think the equality is in the holy eternal oneness of being.

[Seleucus]

Races don't have personalities. Individuals have personalities.

What is racism?

No no, it's fine to say like that, but we wouldn't call it a personality since that is what a person is. We'd call it something like a 'racial temperament'. The World Values Survey is a good example,

http://www.worldvaluessurvey.org/WVSContents.jsp

Genetics offers no support whatever to your racism. It also offers no support to racial classifications -- at the bottom of evolutionary taxonomies is species, not race.

Haplogroups supports race.

This quote is from stormfront.com, seems pretty clear,

"R1a1 most common in Slavs, Northen Indians, Iranians,
R1b most common in Western Europeans, although found in Palestinians/Lebanese due to the Crusader rule
I is found in Nordic countries and Iranians

R1a1 is in fact Caucasoid halpogroup Central Asia was Caucasoid before the Turko-Mongol invasion. Its in fact of Caucasoid origin. The Turkic halogroup is Q, and their usually similar to the Mongolian/East Asian markers.

Semitic Haplogroup:
J1 found were ever the Arab and Semitic populations expanded.

Berber Haplogroup:
E3b2 very common in North African Arabs and Berbers.

Negroid Haplgroup
E3a, A

East Asian
O,N, Q"

https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t500175/

Also, as I have already pointed out, there is more genetic variation among so-called whites, than between so-called blacks and whites! Of course you are oblivious to all of this.

There's more genetic diversity between men than there is between women. So what? What point would be proved by this?

[Londoner]

History of madness does too come to think of it, the mental hospital being one of the institutions of control.

If the way we treat madness has a history, that means it must have changed. If it has changed, then it isn't culturally fixed.

You couldn't be more correct. Islam is the superficial expression of the underlying Middle-Eastern political system and Semitic El (sky father) centered proto-monotheism; a certain amount or reaction against Rome in there too.

So you agree you were wrong to call Islam a culture.

But OK, then if Islam isn't the culture, what is? It can't be 'the underlying Middle-Eastern political system' because that changed before and during Islam. It can't be 'a certain amount or reaction against Rome' because Roman influence, and the character of the Roman empire itself, also fluctuated. So maybe the culture is the 'Semitic El (sky father) centered proto-monotheism'?

Let's say it is. But we are still no better off! Where did the 'Semitic El (sky father) centered proto-monotheism' culture come from?

If this culture exists - and is different from other cultures - then at some stage it must have diverged from them. But you do not think it is possible for cultures to change.

You cannot admit that cultures can change, because that would allow the possibility that they could change now. That there is nothing to stop black people adopting the culture of white people, or vice-versa. But if you cannot admit that cultures can change, you cannot explain how all these different cultures arose in the first place.

I have put this to you many times now. You cannot answer.

[Londoner]

This quote is from stormfront.com, seems pretty clear...

https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t500175/

And I thought you claimed you weren't a neo-Nazi

[Seleucus]

This quote is from stormfront.com, seems pretty clear...

https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t500175/

And I thought you claimed you weren't a neo-Nazi

I just had to see your reaction! Ha!

Anyway, regardless, the source it's basically right. What do we call that, 'poisoning the well fallacy'?

[Seleucus]

So you agree you were wrong to call Islam a culture.

I believe what Guenon said is that there is an exoteric level which is culture and politics, and an esoteric level which is selfless and eternal.

Let's say it is. But we are still no better off! Where did the 'Semitic El (sky father) centered proto-monotheism' culture come from?

Why do I have to do all the work? You can't do some research on the origin of Semitic religions? Due to the great fascination with Bible history this is one area of anthropology that is very well researched. In my view, paganism is quite blurred with anamism, so I suppose El etc emerged out of an earlier animism? What do you think?

Why not start with Wikipedia and head for deeper sources from there... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Semitic_religion

If this culture exists - and is different from other cultures - then at some stage it must have diverged from them. But you do not think it is possible for cultures to change.

Never said that. Did say, cultural change is a very slow and painful process.

You cannot admit that cultures can change

You've been strawmanning the whole discussion. Where, at any point in 18 pages have I written that? I've repeatedly asserted that culture changes slowly and painfully.

because that would allow the possibility that they could change now.

Obviously they do as anyone can see. Cultures are very very stable but they do change. I read last night Anthony's in the The horse the wheel and language that he estimates it takes 1000 years on average for one language to have changed sufficiently that speakers will no longer be mutually intelligible.

That there is nothing to stop black people adopting the culture of white people, or vice-versa.

Yeah, it's called Black-face and it is a total sham, not real cultural transmission. But yes, for example, North Africa was Arabized over hundreds and hundreds of years of Arab colonization. And somehow Europe was Indo-Europeanized, lack of writing makes it quite mysterious, but reasonable guesses include the establishing of an elite ethno-linguistic hierarchy, religious conversion, and exogenous marriage.

But if you cannot admit that cultures can change

I've never denied it. I'm sure you're not a troll right, but you actually have an interest in language, culture, race and spirituality and how they interact...

Here's a fun tiny related news item today:

"Zhang nonetheless praised Buddhism as a “Chinese religion” that “didn’t come from outside,” leaving open the question of religions that China claims are foreign in nature."
http://www.breitbart.com/national-secur ... -religion/

Yet meanwhile: https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/ques ... ddha-speak --->
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magahi_language --->
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/search/Bi ... 2,5z?hl=en

The Bodhi Tree is a long way from China!