Obviously what we want is a lot more guns

[Greta]

Republicans and the NRA are doing to other Americans what America will increasingly do to the world. Unlike many, I remained a fan of the US long after others lost hope for them. 2017 has changed that.

I have little doubt that the US will fall into complete fascism in the next two decades. The US's best and brightest are already fleeing to Canada in record numbers, ever more leaving the ignorant and stupid types who still support Trump to lead the nation into an economic abyss. All the while the nation will be wracked by ever more hurricanes, tornadoes, droughts and floods.

This will create an even greater divide between Canada's democracy and the US's fledgeling fascism. When the situation is dire enough I expect the temptation to use the only power that remains for them - military power - will be too great. I expect them to eventually invade Canada and take their untapped oil reserves. I give it a decade or two.

I thought the US might be able to survive Trump but his relentless incompetence, blundering and lack of morality still leaves him with close to 50% support. If there was footage of Trump raping a a known Democrat I find it impossible to imagine his approval ratings being much affected. Many would probably approve and the rest would go into denial and talk about "fake news".

With such a large portion of the populace immune to both reason and morality in a nation with many times more arms than any other, there is only one way this can go - first civil war, then full scale war.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

Lucky Canada.

[Walker]

President Trump called it an act of pure evil.

I doubt if anyone can explain it better.

Any pro-arguments on the non-existence of evil?

[Walker]

Republicans and the NRA are doing to other Americans what America will increasingly do to the world. Unlike many, I remained a fan of the US long after others lost hope for them. 2017 has changed that.

I have little doubt that the US will fall into complete fascism in the next two decades. The US's best and brightest are already fleeing to Canada in record numbers, ever more leaving the ignorant and stupid types who still support Trump to lead the nation into an economic abyss. All the while the nation will be wracked by ever more hurricanes, tornadoes, droughts and floods.

This will create an even greater divide between Canada's democracy and the US's fledgeling fascism. When the situation is dire enough I expect the temptation to use the only power that remains for them - military power - will be too great. I expect them to eventually invade Canada and take their untapped oil reserves. I give it a decade or two.

I thought the US might be able to survive Trump but his relentless incompetence, blundering and lack of morality still leaves him with close to 50% support. If there was footage of Trump raping a a known Democrat I find it impossible to imagine his approval ratings being much affected. Many would probably approve and the rest would go into denial and talk about "fake news".

With such a large portion of the populace immune to both reason and morality in a nation with many times more arms than any other, there is only one way this can go - first civil war, then full scale war.

This is a very intricate chain of causation that allows no wiggle room for the unexpected, or for human nature.

It's like predicting the climate a hundred years hence. Or weather, which has been lovely lately, adding to the surrealism of real horror.

[Sir-Sister-of-Suck]

Jeez louis, some of you guys. Can't we get through one tragedy without trying to set up some kind of politically-charged message? A couple years ago, I would have never seen people stand on the fresh grave of dead people after a massive tragedy in order to advance their own political opinions, and ridicule the country it happened in - except on a place like 4chan. Now I pretty much have to expect it everywhere I go. I know it's become pretty cliche, but goddamn this world is divided like I ain't ever seen, fam.

I do think immediate activism has its role in certain cases, but the problem is nothing is actually being added that changes the debate on guns in america. Past shootings comparable to this one have happened before, and politicians have made their arguments for why they don't want stricter gun control. It's not that they refuse to pass any bill, in spite of knowing that it will in fact prevent future mass shootings, because the chances are they just don't think gun control will be effective.

I have little doubt that the US will fall into complete fascism in the next two decades.

So not just regular-old fascism, but complete fascism. I'll be sure to save this page to an archive site so we can hold your opinion to it. Well, ya know, if the internet is even still around, being under complete fascism, and all.

[Greta]

Jeez louis, some of you guys. Can't we get through one tragedy without trying to set up some kind of politically-charged message?

You could get through one tragedy, but what of the other 100+? It seems that accountability is not needed, just grieve - until next time, and the next and ...

By all means. You hold me to my predictions in 20 years. I don't think I'll be too far off looking at the shapes of things. A great proud nation brought to its knees by its own hubris, an angry and humiliated populace, but with much military might ...

If someone clever like you cannot see how obviously your country is giving away its natural advantages through its polity's corrupt relationships with energy and arms companies, then that makes clear the scale of your country's issues.

[Greta]

This is a very intricate chain of causation that allows no wiggle room for the unexpected, or for human nature.

Fair point. However, that's where the momentum appears to be headed at present.

[Sir-Sister-of-Suck]

If someone clever like you cannot see how obviously your country is giving away its natural advantages through its polity's corrupt relationships with energy and arms companies, then that makes clear the scale of your country's issues.

It's not to say I don't have my concerns of certain authoritarian tendency gaining more traction in the US government, but I don't see what making oil and nuclear weapon deals have to do with fascism. I also don't see what the thread topic has to do with fascism, because it's typically the argument of people who don't want guns banned throwing out these wild claims of fascism. But let's not even exacerbate an issue just because it's fresh in our minds, the fact is violent crime in general is at a historic low within the USA. Even in gun violence, the rate isn't necessarily higher.

If Sci-Fi movies can tell us something about the world - it's that people are famously bad at predicting the far-away future. If I were you I wouldn't fall into the same trap.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

President Trump called it an act of pure evil.

I doubt if anyone can explain it better.

Any pro-arguments on the non-existence of evil?

Of course. 'Pure evil' because it's yanks being killed BWHAHAAAHAHAAA!!!! Waddaya expect in your gun-lovin tootin rootin yeehaain yankeedoodlin land of the free (to shoot each other)? I really think the rest of the planet is sick of hearing about your 'massacres'. Honestly. No one gives a shit.

[Philosophy Explorer]

President Trump called it an act of pure evil.

I doubt if anyone can explain it better.

Any pro-arguments on the non-existence of evil?

Of course. 'Pure evil' because it's yanks being killed BWHAHAAAHAHAAA!!!! Waddaya expect in your gun-lovin tootin rootin yeehaain yankeedoodlin land of the free (to shoot each other)? I really think the rest of the planet is sick of hearing about your 'massacres'. Honestly. No one gives a shit.

More mere opinions from the one who can't put up any solid arguments. I wonder how many members are sick and tired of your shit. Many are interested in what's happening here (including you - you could easily tell from the title what the thread is about).

Apparently you don't care about how many people lose their lives to terrorism (and I'm calling it terrorism). What makes it worse is your prejudice and monomania against America (you overlooked, btw, that with the Twin Towers, many people who died weren't Americans which makes you an equal-opportunity racist). I can say more, but your type sickens me.

PhilX

[Harbal]

President Trump called it an act of pure evil.

I doubt if anyone can explain it better.

Any pro-arguments on the non-existence of evil?

I wondered when some idiot would say something like that.

[Greta]

If someone clever like you cannot see how obviously your country is giving away its natural advantages through its polity's corrupt relationships with energy and arms companies, then that makes clear the scale of your country's issues.

It's not to say I don't have my concerns of certain authoritarian tendency gaining more traction in the US government, but I don't see what making oil and nuclear weapon deals have to do with fascism. I also don't see what the thread topic has to do with fascism, because it's typically the argument of people who don't want guns banned throwing out these wild claims of fascism. But let's not even exacerbate an issue just because it's fresh in our minds, the fact is violent crime in general is at a historic low within the USA. Even in gun violence, the rate isn't necessarily higher.

If Sci-Fi movies can tell us something about the world - it's that people are famously bad at predicting the far-away future. If I were you I wouldn't fall into the same trap.

Do you believe that this certain authoritarian tendency will increase or decrease?

I suggest that the interests of arms, energy and security companies were significant factors in the invasion of Iraq. Such invasions in this day and age are intrinsically fascist behaviours.

Yes, violent crime has reduced dramatically worldwide, aside from the main hotspots. Still, I would not be happy for my country to keep accepting mass murders of innocents as "well, that's just life", when worldwide stats make clear that strong gun regulation results reduces violent crime. However, the stats do not say how such a thing could play out in a nation with 300 million guns and millions who spark a civil war to retain their firearms. That's way I made the prediction. I think the genie is out of the bottle as far as the US is involved.

If Trump goes, do you think that a sane president is going to change the mania and divisions that's been whipped up in recent years? Or do you see ever widening circles of retribution?

[Sir-Sister-of-Suck]

If someone clever like you cannot see how obviously your country is giving away its natural advantages through its polity's corrupt relationships with energy and arms companies, then that makes clear the scale of your country's issues.

It's not to say I don't have my concerns of certain authoritarian tendency gaining more traction in the US government, but I don't see what making oil and nuclear weapon deals have to do with fascism. I also don't see what the thread topic has to do with fascism, because it's typically the argument of people who don't want guns banned throwing out these wild claims of fascism. But let's not even exacerbate an issue just because it's fresh in our minds, the fact is violent crime in general is at a historic low within the USA. Even in gun violence, the rate isn't necessarily higher.

If Sci-Fi movies can tell us something about the world - it's that people are famously bad at predicting the far-away future. If I were you I wouldn't fall into the same trap.

Do you believe that this certain authoritarian tendency will increase or decrease?

I suggest that the interests of arms, energy and security companies were significant factors in the invasion of Iraq. Such invasions in this day and age are intrinsically fascist behaviours.

The 2 examples which came to mind was NSA spying, and the War on Drugs. I think both of these things are pretty unconstitutional, but given that it's the nature of governments in general to feed the administrations it's already established, and how long they've been allowed to operate, I don't see a way completely out of PRISM, or drug policy reform. No matter which president we've had, the NSA and the DEA has been expanded. Under bush they got bigger from Clinton, and under Obama the NSA got much bigger than it was under bush - the supposed progressive who was suppose to value our libertarian freedoms, and bragged about smoking weed.

I don't know. It sounds like a stretch to me. I obviously didn't agree with the war in Iraq, or any other conflict we have going on in the middle east, but what fascism brings to mind is how a country treats it's own people. I think when you say something as powerful as America adapting fascism within the next 2 decades, you then have to justify a fixture of getting there. What exactly do you think will happen?

Yes, violent crime has reduced dramatically worldwide, aside from the main hotspots. Still, I would not be happy for my country to keep accepting mass murders of innocents as "well, that's just life", when worldwide stats make clear that strong gun regulation results reduces violent crime. However, the stats do not say how such a thing could play out in a nation with 300 million guns and millions who spark a civil war to retain their firearms. That's way I made the prediction. I think the genie is out of the bottle as far as the US is involved.

If Trump goes, do you think that a sane president is going to change the mania and divisions that's been whipped up in recent years? Or do you see ever widening circles of retribution?

I know it's not optimal, but the point is that it's not actually getting worse, if you're trying to make the case that fascism or a civil war or whatever is going to arise partially based on it; While I understand the need to constantly compare the US to other countries and implementing laws that seemed to work elsewhere, I don't believe that's something which can be very consistently applied, in actuality. A place like Australia was able to successfully restrict guns mostly to hunting after a mass shooting happened there, but the population difference and America's significantly larger black market for guns adds something to consider, among other factors. The fact that we've actually experimented with gun control on a small-scale in places like Chicago, sort of gives me an example that we shouldn't expect the same thing.

I don't know, I've always blamed much of the division we see today on the rise of PC culture. Trump is clearly a divisive person and contributing to it, though. If we just had a president who can actually give good speeches and talk well, it'd probably help quite a bit. It wouldn't be the magic pill, but sure.

[Greta]

The trouble with "PC culture" is it's hard to find anyone who's not PC about their sacred cows. At some point people with competing ideas start shutting each other down. Then the one being shut down cried foul about political correctness.

PC is a symptom of divisions - that people of opposing ideologies offend each other. Then they chuck a fucking nellie about whatever bugs them. The conservatives are at least as precious about their sacred cows, but they don't like to call that PC. That's called "defending what is right".

With significant societal divisions, 300 million guns, a history of accepting mass murders followed by mourning basically as a regular ritual, racial tensions, religious tensions, Confederate tensions, more hate groups, increased tensions and anger online. I suspect the US's only hope of peace is to not only make cannabis legal in all states, but compulsory.

[vegetariantaxidermy]

That's not what PC is. The right can never be PC. They are detestable, but it's not PC detestable. The 'right' are openly vile and don't care who knows it. The PC are just as vile, but they try to hide it with a sickly sweet facade of moral superiority and zealous virtue.

How's this for PC. School librarian Liz Phipps Soeiro rejected Melania Trump's gift of Dr. Seuss books.
''Soeiro then explained her issues with Trump’s specific choice in books, calling Dr. Seuss “a bit of a cliché, a tired and worn ambassador for children’s literature,” and suggested that Trump could have reached out to Librarian of Congress Carla Hayden to discover other options. Additionally, she wrote that “another fact many people are unaware of is that Dr. Seuss’s illustrations are steeped in racist propaganda, caricatures, and harmful stereotypes,” linking out to the article “Is the Cat in the Hat Racist? Read Across America Shifts Away From Dr. Seuss and Towards Diverse Books.”

Nauseating cow even looks PC. Is there any such thing as a normal American?



Oh, and here she is being a gigantic hypocrite. A PC hypocrite? Isn't that tautology? Surely no one would stoop as low as to use children to push their own self-serving political agenda?