If God is so merciful, then why did Jesus have to be sacrificed?

[Greta]

No, the Bible is the word of men ...

Bet your life on it? You will.

Ha! Still playing with Pascal?

When I was young I was intimidated by such those kinds of veiled threats of dire consequences - as was clearly the intent of those who dreamed up those ideas.

[Harbal]

No, the Bible is the word of men ...

Bet your life on it? You will.

Waste your life on it?

[Greta]

No, the Bible is the word of men ...

Bet your life on it? You will.

Waste your life on it?

But is it waste if they enjoy it? Religious types tend to stick together so it opens up much in the way of job and social networking, and they no doubt enjoy that aspect.

It's no secret that the most important thing for theists and non-believers alike is that we survive to adulthood, and then try to enjoy the ride as much as possible, make ourselves vaguely useful and avoid doing more harm than is necessary.

[Dontaskme]

You were not there at your birth, and you won't be there at your death...You have never been born, and therefore cannot die.
You've always been here, you've never not been here.

Are you a nihilist?

Who or what would be a nihilist?

You ARE plain and simple prior to any thought about who or what THIS IS

[Dontaskme]

It's no secret that the most important thing for theists and non-believers alike is that we survive to adulthood, and then try to enjoy the ride as much as possible, make ourselves vaguely useful and avoid doing more harm than is necessary.

Even into the maturity of adulthood some people are still insecure and dependent on some other thing external to them that they hope will get them through their personal survival in the world, and that some other thing can be a ''Higher God Figure''..but that's a poor substitute for a simple dose of wisdom, and some plain old common sense in accepting their aloneness and embracing it while fully conscious ...often called dying before you die. And there lies the power to overcome all our unfounded fears.. when we can finally say ''fuck it'' and get on with enjoying life the way it's meant to be enjoyed. But then if one is simply not enjoying it then they can always kill them self, it's not like life is holding any of us hostage.

The problem with ''higher self''believers is that they haven't yet realised they are totally alone in the world, and that nothing outside of their beingness is coming to stay in a permanent sense, and that everything is literally made of going away. One is a lonely number, and so they are uncomfortable with their aloneness and will make-believe there's at least a something that is going to save them from the eternal abyss of their aloneness, and that it might even alleviate their unease. It's just total delusion of the human condition.

We imagine a God in the same context we imagine we have a Mother and a Father..none of which are true, truth is we are totally alone.

What we are fundamentally is without any label attached to it....and so we fill in the blank with just about anything we can make-up.And some people actually believe the make-belief to be real, which is fine of course, there's nothing much else available.

[Harbal]

But is it waste if they enjoy it?

Not necessarily. If someone can live happily, believing this stuff without hurting anyone, I think it would be wrong to tell them they are wrong. I just wonder why they can't adopt that attitude towards those who don't believe it. IC was born too late; he should have been a Victorian missionary, where his ideas and conduct would have been considered creditable. Who would have thought people like him would still be around today?

[Immanuel Can]

When I was young I was intimidated by such those kinds of veiled threats of dire consequences - as was clearly the intent of those who dreamed up those ideas.

And when you became older, you convinced yourself you were good enough to stand before God as you are?

Greta, you need to understand that there's no "veiled threat" here. Indeed, nothing's "veiled." I'm telling you in the most plain language I can that you will stand before God and give your account. And nothing's a "threat"; far from that -- it's a promise. I'm telling you because God has promised you will be called to account to Him; and as the topic of this strand implies, you now have a chance to do something about it.

For your sake and mine, I now have spoken as plainly, openly and literally as I know how. I have also shared with you what the Word of God says, so you might know it's not my word. And really, I don't think you can really be confused as to what it means.

The rest, as they say, is up to you. Choose your path.

[Greta]

When I was young I was intimidated by such those kinds of veiled threats of dire consequences - as was clearly the intent of those who dreamed up those ideas.

And when you became older, you convinced yourself you were good enough to stand before God as you are?

Greta, you need to understand that there's no "veiled threat" here. Indeed, nothing's "veiled." I'm telling you in the most plain language I can that you will stand before God and give your account. .

I note that you refuse to ever question the veracity of your source material.

This is how I see your threats ... "Oowa oowa, if you don't do as I think you should do (based on my unreliable sources) then God is gunna getcha. Be afraid. Be very afraid".

If such a deity exists I have no fear because it will not be as unreasonable as Christians. That's the point - a deity is supposed to be exponentially better than we are, not have a mentality just like humans, as you posit. The things that concern Christians, Muslims and others who create a deity in their own image would not concern an actual deity in the least.

[Greta]

It's no secret that the most important thing for theists and non-believers alike is that we survive to adulthood, and then try to enjoy the ride as much as possible, make ourselves vaguely useful and avoid doing more harm than is necessary.

Even into the maturity of adulthood some people are still insecure and dependent on some other thing external to them that they hope will get them through their personal survival in the world, and that some other thing can be a ''Higher God Figure''..but that's a poor substitute for a simple dose of wisdom, and some plain old common sense in accepting their aloneness and embracing it while fully conscious

Whatever works. Life is hard and if one needs a metaphorical teddy bear to get them through the night, why not? In life, if not in philosophy and science, efficacy is more important than correctness.

[Greta]

Who would have thought people like him would still be around today?

Things are different in the US, Harbs. It's a very religious country. Every now and then a couple of Jehovah's Witnesses will come to my door, hoping to share their good news with me, and I decline to deal as I do with most cold callers. Otherwise, if theists are around, they either keep to their cliques or they are privately held beliefs. When travelling I found it odd how Americans casually referred to God in conversation as though everyone believed and approved. What do you do? Ignore it and avoid the topic.

[Dubious]

What does it mean to be a master
in the hemlock realms of scorched infinity,
no gods of creation or disaster
but stranger modulations of divinity.

...is how I view existence vis-à-vis the universe in which deities, gods of whatever kind are mere temporary stand-ins and placeholders until we come face to face with the much more real and profound mysteries which we seek to acknowledge by discovery. Theism, by comparison, as is plain from these posts, is a total dead-end arresting any such tendencies and requires a mind in thrall to medievalism. It makes no difference that the Biblical saga has long been debunked into secular history.

[Immanuel Can]

"Oowa oowa,...'

Interesting. You picked this OP to discuss, even though you don't believe in any of it, and now you can't make sense of any of it.

Actually, the Bible talks about your situation. It says, "...For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing..." (1 Cor. 1;18).

You must be one of "those who are perishing." That adds up.

[Belinda]

Greta wrote:

It's no secret that the most important thing for theists and non-believers alike is that we survive to adulthood, and then try to enjoy the ride as much as possible, make ourselves vaguely useful and avoid doing more harm than is necessary.

I wish there were more like you Greta, who can express what ordinary kindly men and women actually do. If this were not so even the world of business could not survive. The world of business is founded upon trust so that people can be trusted to keep their word and pay their debts. All persons who infringe this principle of trust are parasites upon the honourable mass of society.

[Belinda]

To answer the OP's question:
The basic myth tells that Christ is incarnated God. God so loved the World that He subjected Himself to the worst that the World could do. He did this so that His life and manner of dying would be a example to men of how life and dying should be done.

It is necessary to distinguish between the Jesus of history and the Christ of myth. The Christ of myth may seem ludicrous to many . Not to me. The myth of the Incarnation of God has a lot of shelf life yet.

[Dontaskme]

Pure awareness wed
To limitless sensation
Gives birth to being.

''I am that by which
I know I am" conscious of
Present existence.

For man to know God
It must really be God who
Knows Himself in man.

Though reflected in
The circumstance, God is
Found at the center.

From the book .. "Out of My Mind and Back to My Senses"