Is transgender something to get upset about?

[Hobbes' Choice]

You haven't answered a single question.

I was following your lead.
I asked you to name a nation that was made this way; there is none.
This was easy since none of your questions were on topic.

As for what we do about Israel, stop supporting them until they respect human rights and comply with UN resolutions concerning the occupied territories and their responsibility as a member of the western family of nations, and stop acting like tin-pot dictatorship.

A lot depends on who is in power there at any given time. The present PM is very right wing I think. There are no nations that have been made because one side was stronger than the other? That's news to me. And name any Govt. that gets it right all the time. The US is the biggest shit-stirrer in the ME and you know it. It's been in cahoots with GB to destroy the ME for what seems like an eternity.

I'm pretty sure their long term aim is to keep the ME in a state of continual strife.
Even Obama's circuit speech about democracy which seems to stimulate the "Arab Spring" seem to have achieved that too.

[Hobbes' Choice]

I wondered why so much of what he says is ineffable bollocks.

Immanuel Can wrote:

Well, here are some basic facts.

1. Almost half of the people who have gender dysphoria are attempting suicide.

2. Neither normalizing the behaviour nor sex-reassignment surgery has ever statistically improved that rate.

3. Liberals want to encourage that condition.

Unsubstantiated made up on the spot bullshite.


1. If such people want to commit suicide it is because they are shunned by people in society like ImaCant.
2. IaCant does not know what 'normalising' means.
3) Transgender feeling are not choices to be encouraged. Like all sexual feelings, they emerge without the intentions or choices of the person.
"Liberals want to encourages", actually means most people do not want to impose suppression of natural feelings like ImaCant does..
Religious people have always suppressed personal, sexual feelings; It's what they do.

ANyone with any sense should take feelings over which you have no control as separate from free will, and obviously something god is trying o tell us.

[uwot]

ANyone with any sense should take feelings over which you have no control as separate from free will, and obviously something god is trying o tell us.

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." Schopenhauer.

[Hobbes' Choice]

ANyone with any sense should take feelings over which you have no control as separate from free will, and obviously something god is trying o tell us.

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." Schopenhauer.

I'd never imply that free will was absolute. I was talking to the mob in words they would understand.
I'm in utter agreement with Shop and have used that quote many times.

[uwot]

I'm in utter agreement with Shop and have used that quote many times.

Maybe that's where I got it from. In which case, Ta very much.

[Immanuel Can]

Immanuel Can wrote:
Well, here are some basic facts.

1. Almost half of the people who have gender dysphoria are attempting suicide.

2. Neither normalizing the behaviour nor sex-reassignment surgery has ever statistically improved that rate.

3. Liberals want to encourage that condition.

Unsubstantiated made up on the spot bullshite.

The sources are on page 1. Incorrect again.

1. If such people want to commit suicide it is because they are shunned by people in society like ImaCant.

A myth. See again, page 1. It's debunked by the facts.

2. IaCant does not know what 'normalising' means.

Sure I do. It's liberalese for "this is abnormal, but I'm going to pretend it IS normal -- and moral-- so all my friends will admire me as 'open-minded'."

3) Transgender feeling are not choices to be encouraged. Like all sexual feelings, they emerge without the intentions or choices of the person.

Your argument would work equally well, if true, for pedophiles and violent sex-offenders. We couldn't criticize their "feelings."

Religious people have always suppressed personal, sexual feelings; It's what they do.

Actually, Freud said exactly the same thing about Atheists -- even though he himself was one -- Atheism, he said, was a "wish-fulfillment fantasy," a desire to rid oneself of a cosmic "Father."

Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander there. If you can argue (ad hominem fallacy, of course) that "religious people" are only "suppressing," then you can argue exactly the same for Atheists. Good thing the tactic isn't legit, or Atheism would be dismissed ad hominem.

ANyone with any sense should take feelings over which you have no control as separate from free will...

Reeeeeally? So...anything you "feel" without "control" has to be legit, because it's "separate from free will"? And "anyone with any sense" thinks that?

I guess most sensible people "have no sense," then.

[henry quirk]

Joe, a white man, sez he's black, sez he 'feels' like a black man, sez he's a black man in a white man's body. He darkens his skin, flattens his nose, crimps his hair.

Is Joe black or deluded?


Stan, a black man, sez he's white, sez he 'feels' like a white man, sez he's a white man in a black man's body. He bleaches his skin, opts for a european nose, straightens his hair.

Is Stan white or deluded?

[Immanuel Can]

Is Stan white or deluded?

Excellent analogy.

Here's another...

The elevator in my building appears to work normally about 55% of the time. In the other cases -- about 45% of the time -- it plunges to the basement and kills or horribly maims its occupants. In fact, even those who survive the cataclysm long for death.

But I don't think it's nice to criticize landlords or tell people what to do, so I don't tell anyone about it: and whenever anyone asks me whether or not that elevator is operating "normally," I say, "Absolutely...why would you doubt it -- unless you are a fascist, anti-elevator bigot!"

Am I a good person? Do you admire my "tolerance" of alternate building codes?

[Harbal]

Joe, a white man, sez he's black, sez he 'feels' like a black man, sez he's a black man in a white man's body. He darkens his skin, flattens his nose, crimps his hair.

Is Joe black or deluded?


Stan, a black man, sez he's white, sez he 'feels' like a white man, sez he's a white man in a black man's body. He bleaches his skin, opts for a european nose, straightens his hair.

Is Stan white or deluded?

I can envisage a white man wishing he was black or a black man wishing he was white but I find it hard to imagine either of them being convinced they've been born into a body of the wrong race.

[Harbal]

Is Stan white or deluded?

Excellent analogy.

Watch him, henry, he's trying to butter you up. He'll be asking for a selfie of you in the shower next, you mark my words.

[henry quirk]

Harbal,

So, are Joe and Stan deluded?

And: Mannie is my buddy...I'd give him three bucks for a cuppa coffee and not one cent (or thing) more.

[henry quirk]

"I find it hard to imagine either of them being convinced they've been born into a body of the wrong race."

Is it easier to imagine a guy being convinced he's been born into the wrong sexed body?

If so, why?

[Harbal]

Is it easier to imagine a guy being convinced he's been born into the wrong sexed body?

It's not my business to imagine it. If that's the way these people say they feel and the medical profession takes that seriously then it's not for the likes of me to tell them they're wrong. It must be bad enough being in that situation without some bone head telling them they are freaks.

[henry quirk]

You dance (around the issue) real nice.

Let's try again...

Joe tells you sumthin' you know is false, but that he's convinced is true.

Do you agree with him?

...or...

Do you disagree with him?

...or...

Do you exit the situation quickly, sayin' nuthin' about nuthin' to Joe?

[Harbal]

You dance (around the issue) real nice.

Why thank you, henry. I like to think I'm pretty nimble for someone of my age.