Hobbes' Choice wrote:
This is not relevant. Unless you are a solipsist you ought to accept that the entire universe is in motion regardless of anyone observing it.
Even yourself when standing still, even when sleeping you are in constant motion.
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
This has noting to do with solipsist. I just mentioned that you need an observer in order to experience motion and that observer could have motion since only relative motion is meaningful thing.
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Assume the impossible, and then ask yourself for how long are you going to maintain this impossibility.
let me know.
bahman wrote:
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Time, I imagine, would freeze as well just like snapshot freezes a moment in time. There would be no before and after prior and subsequent to that instant. Of course this is only a possibility as a thought experiment. It's not possible to fathom or express with logic a frozen universe where time has evaporated existing anywhere within a multiverse of infinite universes.
ken wrote:
...What part, exactly, do you disagree with?...
The part that you try to use the similarity between time and space to push your argument. They are not similar. Space is a thing that allows us to embed forms within it, without it we cannot have any forms.
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
This is not relevant. Unless you are a solipsist you ought to accept that the entire universe is in motion regardless of anyone observing it.
Even yourself when standing still, even when sleeping you are in constant motion.
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Assume the impossible, and then ask yourself for how long are you going to maintain this impossibility.
let me know.
This is simply a thought experiment. Again what happen for time if everything freezes?
I have another proposal if you do not like this thought experiment. Just find a quite place and try to rest your mind, don't let anything disturb your mind. You will see that there is no passage of time.
bahman wrote:
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Time, I imagine, would freeze as well just like snapshot freezes a moment in time. There would be no before and after prior and subsequent to that instant. Of course this is only a possibility as a thought experiment. It's not possible to fathom or express with logic a frozen universe where time has evaporated existing anywhere within a multiverse of infinite universes.
No, time does not freezes if everything freezes since time is objectively real in your world view.
ken wrote:
...What part, exactly, do you disagree with?...
The part that you try to use the similarity between time and space to push your argument. They are not similar. Space is a thing that allows us to embed forms within it, without it we cannot have any forms.
Time is a thing that allows us to embed events within it, without it we cannot have any events.
Space is a concept that we define which is related to relative distances between objects.
Absolutely everything is relative to the observer, therefore, how you are observing 'space' and 'time' this will effect their existence or not.
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Assume the impossible, and then ask yourself for how long are you going to maintain this impossibility.
let me know.
This is simply a thought experiment. Again what happen for time if everything freezes?
I have another proposal if you do not like this thought experiment. Just find a quite place and try to rest your mind, don't let anything disturb your mind. You will see that there is no passage of time.
Okay - I'll play.
When you say "everything freezes", I suppose you mean that all motion ceases? How long for? And how?
bahman wrote:
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Time, I imagine, would freeze as well just like snapshot freezes a moment in time. There would be no before and after prior and subsequent to that instant. Of course this is only a possibility as a thought experiment. It's not possible to fathom or express with logic a frozen universe where time has evaporated existing anywhere within a multiverse of infinite universes.
No, time does not freezes if everything freezes since time is objectively real in your world view.
But this is question begging nonsense. You said EVERYTHING freezes. That has to mean time too. If time does not freeze you have to say for how long everything else freezes, but you have not.
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
But this is question begging nonsense. You said EVERYTHING freezes. That has to mean time too. If time does not freeze you have to say for how long everything else freezes, but you have not.
I mean all motion freezes for a period of time. What happen for time?
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
When you say "everything freezes", I suppose you mean that all motion ceases? How long for? And how?
Yes, I meant all motion ceases. Time should persist to exist if it is objectively real even if everything freezes.
DUH! But you said "everything' freezes, that would include time too. This might be happening every minute, but since not time passes when everything freezes you'd never know. However this just begs the question as to whether or not time exists. Since you cannot freeze everything, then you are just blowing up your own bum. Your 'thought experiment' is meaningless.
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
But this is question begging nonsense. You said EVERYTHING freezes. That has to mean time too. If time does not freeze you have to say for how long everything else freezes, but you have not.
I mean all motion freezes for a period of time. What happen for time?
"For a period of time"? - I think you need to think about what you are saying.
bahman wrote:
Assume that everything freezes. What would happen for time?
Time, I imagine, would freeze as well just like snapshot freezes a moment in time. There would be no before and after prior and subsequent to that instant. Of course this is only a possibility as a thought experiment. It's not possible to fathom or express with logic a frozen universe where time has evaporated existing anywhere within a multiverse of infinite universes.
No, time does not freezes if everything freezes since time is objectively real in your world view.
Time is useless if it doesn't serve a dynamic process whether objectively frozen or non-existent. But let's play your game. If the universe is a solid state of non-motion what is the purpose of time why would it still exist or need to exist if nothing MOVES?
