Awakening

[sthitapragya]

Being aware of a connection with higher consciousness doesn't make one like Buddha or Jesus. Only a charlatan will tell you this. No, you are not God. Becoming aware of the potential for awakening makes a person first aware of their nothingness. This is a big first step. Then the inner struggle begins between the parts that want to consciously awaken and the parts of our collective consciousness that want to remain asleep. Consider the following story. Most want to remain chickens unaware of their conscious potential to be eagles. So people die as chickens.

My question was, what happens after the inner struggle is over and I awaken? What happens after I become aware of my nothingness? What advantage do I have over people who are stuck in everythingness? Let us say I become an eagle. Then what?

A man found an eagle's egg and put it in a nest of a barnyard hen. The eaglet hatched with the brood of chicks and grew up with them. All his life the eagle did what the barnyard chicks did, thinking he was a barnyard chicken. He scratched the earth for worms and insects. He clucked and cackled. And he would thrash his wings and fly a few feet into the air.

Years passed and the eagle grew very old. One day he saw a magnificent bird above him in the cloudless sky. It glided in graceful majesty among the powerful wind currents, with scarcely a beat on his strong golden wings. The old eagle looked up in awe. "Who's that?" he asked. "That's the eagle, the king of the birds," said his neighbor. "He belongs to the sky. We belong to the earth - we're chickens." So the eagle lived and died a chicken, for that's what he thought he was."

Anthony de Mello
(1931-1987) Jesuit Priest

Do you realize what this story means? So far only a few humans have made it. All of them made great sacrifices to get there. You are sitting at home everyday living an ordinary life because you are too chicken to actually leave everything. You are attached to your materialistic life, otherwise you would be long gone to the mountains. Spouting words about awakening is not how it can be achieved. Sitting in your air-conditioned home eating a pizza and contemplating while typing on your notepad is not how it is done. You have to leave everything. That is what is meant by not being a chicken. The eagle didn't have the courage to leave the coop. Just as you don't have the courage to leave your home and everything behind. Just thinking about stuff is not going to awaken you.

And the reason you are not leaving your home is you are not at all convinced that the stuff really works.

[Nick_A]

Sthit wrote: My question was, what happens after the inner struggle is over and I awaken? What happens after I become aware of my nothingness? What advantage do I have over people who are stuck in everythingness? Let us say I become an eagle. Then what?

You can become a conscious Man as opposed to a reacting atom of the Great Beast. A reacting atom of the Great Beast cannot understand conscious man anymore than a caterpillar can understand a butterfly or an acorn can understand an oak. Some are drawn to this struggle for reasons science cannot explain.

Do you realize what this story means? So far only a few humans have made it. All of them made great sacrifices to get there. You are sitting at home everyday living an ordinary life because you are too chicken to actually leave everything. You are attached to your materialistic life, otherwise you would be long gone to the mountains. Spouting words about awakening is not how it can be achieved. Sitting in your air-conditioned home eating a pizza and contemplating while typing on your notepad is not how it is done. You have to leave everything. That is what is meant by not being a chicken. The eagle didn't have the courage to leave the coop. Just as you don't have the courage to leave your home and everything behind. Just thinking about stuff is not going to awaken you.

Quite true. Only a minority “make it.” However good seed asleep in the body of the Christ in whtever for it takes is not lost. It can be planted again.

There is no reason to leave everything and go into the mountains. A person has to become free of foolish attachments and the need to express all sorts of negativity which blocks out the light. Does one really have to go to the mountains to struggle with foolish attachments and the pleasures of negative emotion which deny consciousness? A person can appear to be living a normal life to you but their inner life and inner freedom is something without practice is impossible to understand. As I’ve said I am also in Plato’s cave. My advantage is in admitting it and opening to what is meant by “know thyself.”

And the reason you are not leaving your home is you are not at all convinced that the stuff really works.

Doubt is normal. If one doesn’t doubt they are usually just expressing blind belief and escapism. However there are some “old souls” so to speak who have experienced enough in their lives both current and previous so as to be able to believe. I still suffer doubt.

Mark 9: 23 Jesus said to him, “If you can believe,[a] all things are possible to him who believes.”
24 Immediately the father of the child cried out and said with tears, “Lord, I believe; help my unbelief!”

[sthitapragya]

You can become a conscious Man as opposed to a reacting atom of the Great Beast. A reacting atom of the Great Beast cannot understand conscious man anymore than a caterpillar can understand a butterfly or an acorn can understand an oak. Some are drawn to this struggle for reasons science cannot explain.

Okay, so you become a conscious man. That what happens? What advantage do you get over others?

Quite true. Only a minority “make it.” However good seed asleep in the body of the Christ in whtever for it takes is not lost. It can be planted again.

There is no reason to leave everything and go into the mountains. A person has to become free of foolish attachments and the need to express all sorts of negativity which blocks out the light. Does one really have to go to the mountains to struggle with foolish attachments and the pleasures of negative emotion which deny consciousness? A person can appear to be living a normal life to you but their inner life and inner freedom is something without practice is impossible to understand. As I’ve said I am also in Plato’s cave. My advantage is in admitting it and opening to what is meant by “know thyself.”

Well, show me one example where it was achieved sipping wine and eating good food. My going to the mountains, I meant having the guts to leave your job, leave your home, your family and having just enough with you to subsist. Till you live at home, you will want the latest version of the iphone, and the best internet connection, the best channels, the best women, the best food, the best drinks, good coffee, good tea, nice breakfasts. These are all material attachments and you cannot avoid them till you live a materialistic life. You might tell yourself you will reach a higher consciousness by just talking about it here and putting me down because I disagree with you, but it is not going to happen.

You still have not even reached the level where you can respect other people's choices of life. Even that is an attachment. You are attached to your own beliefs and you grade them to be better than the beliefs of others. And that is also attachment.

Doubt is normal. If one doesn’t doubt they are usually just expressing blind belief and escapism. However there are some “old souls” so to speak who have experienced enough in their lives both current and previous so as to be able to believe. I still suffer doubt.

Yeah, but the doubt is stopping you from leaving the chicken coop.

[Nick_A]

Sthit wrote: You still have not even reached the level where you can respect other people's choices of life. Even that is an attachment. You are attached to your own beliefs and you grade them to be better than the beliefs of others. And that is also attachment.

I respect the beliefs of others. I just neither emotionally blindly believe or deny them. A person has to become capable of belief but not emotionally attached to it. If it is found wrong a person cannot blindly defend it by refusing to see why it is wrong. Belief contains emotional force. If used wrong it can really hurt a person’s psyche.

Yeah, but the doubt is stopping you from leaving the chicken coop.

True. Awakening is a gradual process for the majority like me. The body and habits reject the process and as you said, prefer pleasure. It takes real need and courage to leave the chicken coup.

[Dontaskme]

It takes real need and courage to leave the chicken coup.

“Come to the edge," he said.
"We can't, we're afraid!" they responded.
"Come to the edge," he said.
"We can't, We will fall!" they responded.
"Come to the edge," he said.
And so they came.
And he pushed them.
And they flew.”


― Guillaume Apollinaire

[sthitapragya]

Yeah, but the doubt is stopping you from leaving the chicken coop.

True. Awakening is a gradual process for the majority like me. The body and habits reject the process and as you said, prefer pleasure. It takes real need and courage to leave the chicken coup.

You are missing the point. The path of awakening BEGINS with leaving the coop. It is a slow and gradual process AFTER you leave the coop. Unless you show the courage of the eagle and leave there cannot be awakening. The point I am trying to make is that you want to awaken. I don't. But right now, till I see your replies on this forum, you effectively are not interested in awakening. No amount of reading or thinking will get you there. It is a really big deal to leave everything behind. And till that is done, effectively we are the same.

Our friend who posted above is another case in point. He actually claims that he KNOWS. Now you and I both know that if the state of awakening exists, after you attain it, you would reach a mental state of sthitapragya (Not me. The state of mind I aspire to). After that, if one came back to a materialistic life, the achievements that would follow would be mindboggling. A mind that KNOWS would be out doing stuff. Not sit on a "philsosophy" of religion thread.

[Nick_A]

sthit wrote:

You are missing the point. The path of awakening BEGINS with leaving the coop.

No, it begins with having the need and the courage to witness the coop with conscious attention and emotional detachment. Only then can the coop lose its control over you.

[sthitapragya]

sthit wrote:

You are missing the point. The path of awakening BEGINS with leaving the coop.

No, it begins with having the need and the courage to witness the coop with conscious attention and emotional detachment. Only then can the coop lose its control over you.

I think your low opinion of your fellow men comes out again. Do you seriously believe that no one on this forum has considered that? I will say that almost everyone has. Almost everyone here was born into a religious family.They have all read their respective religious theories. They all have contemplated awakening. Then some simply stopped believing. Others continued to believe. However, there is one thing in common among all of us. That is our attachment to our material needs.

Everyone views their coop with conscious attention. However, becoming PHYSICALLY detached from the coop is another kettle of fish. You cannot "view" your coop with emotional detachment. You BECOME physically detached. That day is the beginning of your process of awakening. Till then, we are all in the same boat. The non-believer, the believer who does not want to awaken and the believer who wants to awaken. We are all in exactly the same place. The problem is not the chicken. The problem is the coop. Thinking like an eagle without the ability to fly is still being a chicken. To fly you need to leave the coop.

[Dontaskme]

However, there is one thing in common among all of us. That is our attachment to our material needs.

No one can leave the coop, because no one is in it.
Awakening simply means realisation through the body/mind vehicle that "what is" (manifesting as "I am") awakens to it's formless nature. The two cannot be separated. Life goes on as before and no one is effected by anything that happens because nothing is actually happening.

Everyone views their coop with conscious attention. However, becoming PHYSICALLY detached from the coop is another kettle of fish. You cannot "view" your coop with emotional detachment. You BECOME physically detached. That day is the beginning of your process of awakening. Till then, we are all in the same boat. The non-believer, the believer who does not want to awaken and the believer who wants to awaken. We are all in exactly the same place. The problem is not the chicken. The problem is the coop. Thinking like an eagle without the ability to fly is still being a chicken. To fly you need to leave the coop.

[sthitapragya]

However, there is one thing in common among all of us. That is our attachment to our material needs.

No one can leave the coop, because no one is in it.
Awakening simply means realisation through the body/mind vehicle that "what is" (manifesting as "I am") awakens to it's formless nature. The two cannot be separated. Life goes on as before and no one is effected by anything that happens because nothing is actually happening.

Everyone views their coop with conscious attention. However, becoming PHYSICALLY detached from the coop is another kettle of fish. You cannot "view" your coop with emotional detachment. You BECOME physically detached. That day is the beginning of your process of awakening. Till then, we are all in the same boat. The non-believer, the believer who does not want to awaken and the believer who wants to awaken. We are all in exactly the same place. The problem is not the chicken. The problem is the coop. Thinking like an eagle without the ability to fly is still being a chicken. To fly you need to leave the coop.

Do you not realize that I am not replying to you because what you say is something I consider the most pointless and nonsensical crap I have ever heard in my entire life? You just make grandiose declarations which contradict each other and it is simply boring, tiring and irritating. Even the language you use is in contradiction with your own theory. If you can talk like a normal human, you will be welcome. But please stop trying to shove your completely ridiculous theory on me. I am not interested in discussing it AT ALL. I am not even interested in refuting it anymore.

[Dontaskme]

Do you not realize that I am not replying to you because what you say is something I consider the most pointless and nonsensical crap I have ever heard in my entire life? You just make grandiose declarations which contradict each other and it is simply boring, tiring and irritating. Even the language you use is in contradiction with your own theory. If you can talk like a normal human, you will be welcome. But please stop trying to shove your completely ridiculous theory on me. I am not interested in discussing it AT ALL. I am not even interested in refuting it anymore.

It's not aimed at you personally dude, don't think this revolves around you personally buddy.
I'm responding to what's being talked about...namely ''Awakening''

You will not be able to stop yourself responding to me because you are addicted / attached to you, and is why you'll always have to defend that you.

That you is like a drug that you cannot give up. It's the hardest drug to give up, but once you do you will cease to be irritated by what I say.

I agree this is not normal human interaction, but those who have left their human concept of them self will resonate with what I am saying...or not.

And bye the way...you have no control over whether I reply to this thread or not so quiet your whining.

[sthitapragya]

Do you not realize that I am not replying to you because what you say is something I consider the most pointless and nonsensical crap I have ever heard in my entire life? You just make grandiose declarations which contradict each other and it is simply boring, tiring and irritating. Even the language you use is in contradiction with your own theory. If you can talk like a normal human, you will be welcome. But please stop trying to shove your completely ridiculous theory on me. I am not interested in discussing it AT ALL. I am not even interested in refuting it anymore.

It's not aimed at you personally dude, don't think this revolves around you personally buddy.
I'm responding to what's being talked about...namely ''Awakening''

You will not be able to stop yourself responding to me because you are addicted / attached to you, and is why you'll always have to defend that you.

That you is like a drug that you cannot give up. It's the hardest drug to give up, but once you do you will cease to be irritated by what I say.

I agree this is not normal human interaction, but those who have left their human concept of them self will resonate with what I am saying...or not.

And bye the way...you have no control over whether I reply to this thread or not so quiet your whining.

Oh please. You are like a leaking faucet in the middle of the night. You are not worth whining about. You are just plain mindlessly irritating. I can do better and just put you on my ignore list.

[Dontaskme]

Oh please. You are like a leaking faucet in the middle of the night. You are not worth whining about. You are just plain mindlessly irritating. I can do better and just put you on my ignore list.

I told you so, that you wouldn't be able to resist replying to me.

Always make sure you get your two pence worth in if it makes you feel better.

[Dontaskme]

A mind that KNOWS would be out doing stuff. Not sit on a "philsosophy" of religion thread.

Bollocks.

What if that mind is unable to get out and do stuff because of a debilitating physical health condition that leaves it housebound ?

Being awake simply means being free from the fear of what other people think of you and not following the in crowd for fear of being rejected. It's the courage to face life head on as it is, ALONE without emotional crutches as it happens without fear or trying to run away from it.. it's not having any expectations or conditions on it...placing selfish what can I get out of this ..or what's in it for me mentality...is suffering.

No one can survive their own awakening...get it?

No other person or material thing can ever complete you, you are already complete. This is not selfish but quite the opposite in fact... it is being totally self less.

Sitting around posting on a forum is a perfect example of the limitless freedom of being alive. It's a perfect expression of empty boundlessness alive freedom of being here now expressing itself as what ever shape or form it takes on ...whether that is a cow munching on grass in a field all day or a human typing on a forum all day....it's really no one else's business, it's life living itself.

Awakening is not something to get now or in the future or work toward by being a certain way or having a certain attitude...it's here right now. as this open aliveness...One can veg away in the house all day and still be an awakened person, they can curse and scream words like mother f^cking c^nt and still be awake...because an awakened human being knows it is ultimately free to do and say what the fuck it wants...and knows the consequences of it's actions are put in place ONLY by humans imposing their self enforced will upon them...
Call a tree a f^cking whore, I doubt the tree would give a damn. Humans have self created their own hell. Humans are in the unfortunate position in life because they KNOW they exist because of the language they have created...aka knowledge.

The human that knows itself not to be a human, but to be life being a human can be amid all the hell and chaos and still be totally free. Identification with I am a human is bound by it's own self made prison walls.

An awakened person who gets out there and does things for the service of others....is still no one doing it, and the freedom comes with KWOWING that no one is doing life, rather it's KNOWING that life is doing them.

[Walker]

They both referred to awakening but what does that mean?

Hello.

Awakening is not an act of addition. It is a description of loss. Renunciation is not a doing, it is a description of what can no longer be done leading up to awakening. To awaken is to lose the comfort found in delusion. Awakening happens in a moment though the drum-roll may be extended.