Dalek Prime wrote:
Adam and Eve not only ruined it for themselves, but for their progeny, which was not supposed to exist in the first place.
Well then it was a bit remiss of God to equip them with the apparatus to produce any, wasn't it Yes. I never said he wasn't an arsehole./quote]
But in a way, you are also correct, because the serpent (devil) did the tempting, and made us all work, because of the sin.
Yes but he gave us sex by way of compensation. Don't you like sex? I wouldn't care about sex if I wasn't given it. And really, sex is not compensatory for all the other hardships we were given. Its just another desire that requires fulfillment to be remotely satisfied.[/quote]
Last edited by Dalek Prime on Sun May 29, 2016 9:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Dalek Prime wrote:I wouldn't care about sex if I wasn't given it. And really, sex is not compensatory for all the other hardships we were given. Its just another desire that requires fulfillment to be remotely satisfied.
Dalek Prime wrote:I will mention that I do not believe this religious narrative, but am trying to discuss the issue within it's confines.
I'd be okay with that, if the confines were better defined. Lacewing already brought the story out of context by comparing it to other stories, including the Christian one, which comes from another period, a very different socio-political landscape and a very different moral sensibility, and then juxtaposing both against the modern world.
Dalek Prime wrote:I wouldn't care about sex if I wasn't given it. And really, sex is not compensatory for all the other hardships we were given. Its just another desire that requires fulfillment to be remotely satisfied.
You've got me on that one.
That's the idea behind antinatalism too. If you don't know what your missing because you don't exist, you don't care if you exist.
Dalek Prime wrote:I will mention that I do not believe this religious narrative, but am trying to discuss the issue within it's confines.
I'd be okay with that, if the confines were better defined. Lacewing already brought the story out of context by comparing it to other stories, including the Christian one, which comes from another period, a very different socio-political landscape and a very different moral sensibility, and then juxtaposing both against the modern world.
By the way, where does it say sex began with Satan? All the grasses and fishes and beasts and fowls were happily multiplying, each after its kind, before there was any human. And then:
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
Skip wrote:
I'd be okay with that, if the confines were better defined. Lacewing already brought the story out of context by comparing it to other stories, including the Christian one, which comes from another period, a very different socio-political landscape and a very different moral sensibility, and then juxtaposing both against the modern world.
I don't think a bit of mixing and matching is out of order, I mean it's not like we're dealing with factual material, is it?
Skip wrote:By the way, where does it say sex began with Satan? All the grasses and fishes and beasts and fowls were happily multiplying, each after its kind, before there was any human. And then:
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
Adam and Eve were created as God was. God didn't procreate (except with Mary, down the road). The fruitful/multiply stuff came after the sin.
Skip wrote:
I'd be okay with that, if the confines were better defined. Lacewing already brought the story out of context by comparing it to other stories, including the Christian one, which comes from another period, a very different socio-political landscape and a very different moral sensibility, and then juxtaposing both against the modern world.
I don't think a bit of mixing and matching is out of order, I mean it's not like we're dealing with factual material, is it?
Its not out of order, but its easier to work within one limited scenario/model at a time.
Last edited by Dalek Prime on Sun May 29, 2016 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Skip wrote:By the way, where does it say sex began with Satan? All the grasses and fishes and beasts and fowls were happily multiplying, each after its kind, before there was any human. And then:
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
For fuck sake, Skip, this is just about the only active thread around, don't derail it by introducing inconvenient material.
Dalek Prime wrote:
Adam and Eve were created as God was. God didn't procreate (except with Mary, down the road). The fruitful/multiply stuff came after the sin.
Nope. This is chapter one. The sin doesn't come till after the second version, and Eve's punishment is not procreation itself, but the pain of procreation. The inconvenient material is relevant and very much in context. I can't help it if people keep quoting a book they don't bother to read.
Lacewing wrote:Why have (the concept of) Satan and women been demonized for trying to liberate mankind from ignorance? ?
It's odd that so many posts begin with unsupported bizarre or idiosyncratic assertions.
Satan (whatever that is) is not demonised for" trying to liberate mankind". Satan is the demon, and is demonised for being a demon.
Women are often demonised, as are many other sub groups of humanity, but I can't think of any that are demonised for "trying to liberate mankind".
Maybe I should ask you; why are you demeaning women by using the phrase "MANkind"? Have you never heard of women's liberation and gender politics?
