What would it take to convince you that somebody is a prophet?

[Arising_uk]

He was admitting that salvation itself might be in the game of Ouzo, that the Second Coming of Christ might be named Tor, and that the Holy Trinity might include the Ouzo Cross. Yes, I would say he was quite impressed with "The Ouzo Prophecy."[/size][/b]

Or he might just have been politely saying 'I don't believe it is true'.

You've still never explained how this game with provide 'salvation'. Now me, I'm sure to be 'saved' as I've seen through to the False Prophet and now know his name so I'll be on the right side. Unlike yourself.

[bobevenson]

You've still never explained how this game with provide 'salvation'.

Why don't you ask the guy at the Spiritual Counterfeits Project? I can't even teach you how to play the simplest game in the world.

[Lacewing]

Prior to that, he said "Your argument is fascinating, tightly-reasoned, for sure. But I have to wonder, is it true?" He was admitting that salvation itself might be in the game of Ouzo, that the Second Coming of Christ might be named Tor, and that the Holy Trinity might include the Ouzo Cross. Yes, I would say he was quite impressed with "The Ouzo Prophecy."

And in another thread you said...

I'm open to anybody who says or implies that he's a prophet,

It appears that your interpretations are quite flexible in order to fit and support what you want to believe, yes?

I'm wondering, however, if you are as flexible if someone disagrees with you -- or are they just wrong because you see yourself as right? How realistic might that be? Aren't there a whole lot of people doing that on this planet? How can they each be right while everyone else is wrong? Or how can you be right and all of them are wrong? Do you explore such reasoning... or are you so convinced by your interpretations and what you think, that anything to the contrary is invalid and unimportant? If it has some sort of meaning for you, great -- but why do you want other people to agree with you? Why should everyone else ditch their own inspired and favored interpretations for yours? Respectfully, Bob, I'm curious how you think this through?

[sthitapragya]

you know, I suddenly realized that while you are asking others what it would take them to be convinced someone was a prophet, you never really told us what it would take for YOU to be convinced someone was a prophet. So what works for you? If someone turns wine into water, or feeds a few people fish out of thin air, is that enough for you? Do you give a damn about all the kids who are dying horrible deaths and no miracle worker comes to their aid?

[sthitapragya]

or would it be more effective if I wrote it in larger font and in bold letters?

[bobevenson]

Prior to that, he said "Your argument is fascinating, tightly-reasoned, for sure. But I have to wonder, is it true?" He was admitting that salvation itself might be in the game of Ouzo, that the Second Coming of Christ might be named Tor, and that the Holy Trinity might include the Ouzo Cross. Yes, I would say he was quite impressed with "The Ouzo Prophecy."

And in another thread you said...

I'm open to anybody who says or implies that he's a prophet,

It appears that your interpretations are quite flexible in order to fit and support what you want to believe, yes?

I'm wondering, however, if you are as flexible if someone disagrees with you -- or are they just wrong because you see yourself as right? How realistic might that be? Aren't there a whole lot of people doing that on this planet? How can they each be right while everyone else is wrong? Or how can you be right and all of them are wrong? Do you explore such reasoning... or are you so convinced by your interpretations and what you think, that anything to the contrary is invalid and unimportant? If it has some sort of meaning for you, great -- but why do you want other people to agree with you? Why should everyone else ditch their own inspired and favored interpretations for yours? Respectfully, Bob, I'm curious how you think this through?

Your question reminds me of "that continual sifting and winnowing, alone by which truth may be found" inscribed on Bascom Hall at the University of Wisconsin in Madison, WI. Beyond that, if somebody claims to be a prophet, I would like to see something he has written, and be provided with some type of mystical certification of his claim.

[bobevenson]

you know, I suddenly realized that while you are asking others what it would take them to be convinced someone was a prophet, you never really told us what it would take for YOU to be convinced someone was a prophet. So what works for you?

Please see my reply to Lacewing.

[sthitapragya]

you know, I suddenly realized that while you are asking others what it would take them to be convinced someone was a prophet, you never really told us what it would take for YOU to be convinced someone was a prophet. So what works for you?

Please see my reply to Lacewing.

I read through everything and could not find any reply to Lacewing where you explain what it would take to convince you that somebody is a prophet. You seem to suggest that some pointless coincidences with numbers and some mystical certifications would convince you. But what are these "mystical certifications"? Also, can you explain why prophets never teach us some life changing technology which would revolutionize the way we live, make our lives better? And why does God need prophets? Hinduism and Buddhism have existed for a far longer period of time than the Abrahamic religions and they are doing perfectly well without any prophets. Also, from what I understand, prophets usually started a new religion and nursed it through it's infancy. So a prophet now would probably start a new religion. Christianity seems to be pretty well established. So what would a new prophet actually do? What would his job be?

[bobevenson]

I read through everything and could not find any reply to Lacewing where you explain what it would take to convince you that somebody is a prophet.

To determine whether a person is a prophet, I would need to hear what he has to say, and then I would need some type of mystical certification that he is divinely inspired. Obviously, such certification must be mystical in nature since the question is unrelated to the physical sciences.

[Lacewing]

I read through everything and could not find any reply to Lacewing where you explain what it would take to convince you that somebody is a prophet.

To determine whether a person is a prophet, I would need to hear what he has to say, and then I would need some type of mystical certification that he is divinely inspired. Obviously, such certification must be mystical in nature since the question is unrelated to the physical sciences.

So you will know it in your heart/soul when you see it. I think that is true for most people. So when we consider the fact that many (most?) people here (elsewhere?) aren't seeing you as a prophet for them, does that mean (to you) that there's something wrong with THEM? Or might your vision/understanding of yourself primarily be of value to you? Maybe you are a prophet to yourself? Hey, a "bigger" part of me advises MYSELF all the time... ... so I'm not trying to be disrespectful of what you're doing. I'm just trying to be realistic about it. What is the scope of it really? This does not diminish it's value. But maybe the ego has to accept and appreciate the true scope of it. So many people, Bob, are claiming to see and know beyond others. And they all claim to be uniquely right. Do you see this happening too? How can they all be doing that? Why would that even make sense or be necessary? So what is it?

[bobevenson]

I read through everything and could not find any reply to Lacewing where you explain what it would take to convince you that somebody is a prophet.

To determine whether a person is a prophet, I would need to hear what he has to say, and then I would need some type of mystical certification that he is divinely inspired. Obviously, such certification must be mystical in nature since the question is unrelated to argument or the physical sciences.

So you will know it in your heart/soul when you see it. I think that is true for most people. So when we consider the fact that many (most?) people here (elsewhere?) aren't seeing you as a prophet for them, does that mean (to you) that there's something wrong with THEM? Or might your vision/understanding of yourself primarily be of value to you? Maybe you are a prophet to yourself? Hey, a "bigger" part of me advises MYSELF all the time... ... so I'm not trying to be disrespectful of what you're doing. I'm just trying to be realistic about it. What is the scope of it really? This does not diminish it's value. But maybe the ego has to accept and appreciate the true scope of it. So many people, Bob, are claiming to see and know beyond others. And they all claim to be uniquely right. Do you see this happening too? How can they all be doing that? Why would that even make sense or be necessary? So what is it?

I'm not trying to tell anybody to accept me as a divinely inspired prophet; I'm merely telling you what it would take for me to accept somebody as a prophet. And yes, I am claiming to see and know beyond others. What other explanation is there for my penetrating insight into all things spiritual, political and economic?

[Lacewing]

I'm not trying to tell anybody to accept me as a divinely inspired prophet...

Really? It seems that you've urged people to research various things that you say demonstrate that you are such. Isn't that the same thing?

And then you say things like this...

If somebody writes a mystical paper that connects Cincinnati to ancient Rome, the queen city of Babylon in the book of Revelation, and then proceeds to discover the origin of Cincinnati's queen city name in 20 minutes, something the entire world couldn't do in 170 years, and it sounds like a description of ancient Rome in the book of Revelation, don't you think that person might be a prophet?

I'm here to impart wisdom

I speak the unchallengeable words of God himself.

Sure sounds like you want to be recognized and accepted as a divinely inspired prophet, doesn't it?

yes, I am claiming to see and know beyond others. What other explanation is there for my penetrating insight into all things spiritual, political and economic?

What other explanation is there for ALL THE PEOPLE who claim to have penetrating insight above and beyond others -- which THEY claim is unique and true? Don't you see how bloated this all-knowledgeable collective has become? Or would acknowledging that draw too many questions back to the individuals... and yourself? Are we just supposed to pretend that everyone in general is lost and bad and stupid and inadequate (doesn't represent the theist's god's creative ability very favorably) except for the bright souls who certify themselves (or allow others to) so that they are considered above it all? How much sense does that really make? And why is it desired?

[bobevenson]

If somebody writes a mystical paper that connects Cincinnati to ancient Rome, the queen city of Babylon in the book of Revelation, and then proceeds to discover the origin of Cincinnati's queen city name in 20 minutes, something the entire world couldn't do in 170 years, and it sounds like a description of ancient Rome in the book of Revelation, don't you think that person might be a prophet?

The above is just one of many mystical certifications of my being a prophet. I'm not a researcher, it was just sitting there waiting for me to pick up.

[Lacewing]

Bob, I guess I'm being reminded again that you simply cannot, or don't want to, answer questions or explore/examine concepts beyond your focus of what you imagine yourself to be. Of course it makes me wonder if it's for your self-preservation. But it doesn't matter -- you're free to imagine this existence any way you want. You will be challenged though, when you ask other people to consider or buy into it. And it seems a bit unbalanced for you to expect them to do so, when you're not willing/able to reach/step beyond your views to see and discuss theirs. I would expect this ability from any person claiming to be divinely inspired. Otherwise it just sounds like someone maintaining a safe stance with their unique fantasy, you know?

[bobevenson]

Bob, I guess I'm being reminded again that you simply cannot, or don't want to, answer questions or explore/examine concepts beyond your focus of what you imagine yourself to be. Of course it makes me wonder if it's for your self-preservation. But it doesn't matter -- you're free to imagine this existence any way you want. You will be challenged though, when you ask other people to consider or buy into it. And it seems a bit unbalanced for you to expect them to do so, when you're not willing/able to reach/step beyond your views to see and discuss theirs. I would expect this ability from any person claiming to be divinely inspired. Otherwise it just sounds like someone maintaining a safe stance with their unique fantasy, you know?

A divinely inspired prophet, of course, is not open to other people's views since by definition his words are unchallengeable by mere mortal men. Do you think John on the isle of Patmos asked for a critique of the book of Revelation?