God and Human Dignity or Human Dignity without God

[Pluto]

I think they are connected, if there is no god what are we? It is hard to be dignified in a consumer-slave society.

[henry quirk]

You are a particular and peculiar animal capable of self-reflection and -direction.

Now, go forth and make of yourself what you will (and can)...

[Pluto]

Yes, but this is Nietzsche, I'm talking about a state of being, not become something through action.

[henry quirk]

"this is Nietzsche"

Well, I just thought it was 'Quirk'.

I've read little of Mad Fred and forgot all I did read.

He didn't grab me.

#

"...a state of being, not become something through action"

What is 'being'? It's 'doing', it's 'acting'.

[Pluto]

Action benefits capital. To act in the world benefits the system. Being is a state without action. What is a man without god and without action. Nothing. How to be dignified without a god, Satre. Dignified in opposing the system but you will lose, perhaps. I was once in the image of God, now I am open to a myriad of possibilities. Like you say go ahead and make of yourself what you will, but the borders within our system are defined and limited to that system.

[henry quirk]

I disagree with the idea, "To act in the world benefits the system".

For example: this afternoon, me and the eight year old will rat around the yard lookin' for water bugs...not seein' how this will benefit any-one or -thing 'cept me and the boy.

And this: "Being is a state without action" sounds a lot like being dead to me.

Lastly: instead of "opposing the system" try using it for your benefit.

[Pluto]

Yes, you and the boy are good, no trouble there. And you're right, use it to work for you. And this is the problem, if you are not action then you are passive dead. But going back to the title of thread, where does dignity come from, how can we feel good about ourselves, when we live in a system which is a consumer slave-state. That's what I was thinking about. I can bring up my boy in the way I see fit with dignity, but I think I'm talking about dignity for all as a collective.

[henry quirk]

Mebbe, instead of worrying about the collective's dignity, you ought to ponder on the old-fashioned notion 'self-respect' which is born of self-knowing, -reliance, and -direction.

Honestly: there's not a helluva lot any one can do to redirect seven billion lost souls, but there's an awful lot you can do with 'you' (and great, on-going, satisfaction to be had when you do).

[Pluto]

Yes, wise words again quirk.

[henry quirk]

Don't know about it being wise...just seems to be the sensible approach.

Anyway: hope it helps.

[Greatest I am]

I think they are connected, if there is no god what are we? It is hard to be dignified in a consumer-slave society.

You would be right but not to the bible God.

We each have our own spark of God within us but not the immoral genocidal bible God.

I think our real God is somewhere between that mythical p**** and what Freud dubbed his Father Complex.

I think we are all driven by our instincts to try to be the fittest of our species and that driver is within each of us and we Gnostic Christians relate the father Complex to the spark of God within us.

Science does not need to compete with religion but religions need to compete with our instincts.

That is why secular man has already moved his morality to a higher level than the mainstream homophobic and misogynous religions.

Regards
DL