Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

For all things philosophical.

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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

5 let hers in the eng lish alpha bet.

Image A Pentagram

5+9=11

Illuminati Confirmed.

I say eat the Melon it helps your MELON (cure for insanity FOUND)

Tried to light the cig wouldnt light. Thought about pouring gasoline in it but I don't have any gasoline. Wat do I dew?

DEW=Mountain DEW=666= ILLUMINATI CONFIRMED

Dont think having a high IQ means you a genisu i no a girl with iq of 176 her philosophy was rather flat.

However, having low IQs in the 120 ranges probably makes you distracted by worldly pleasures, so they will too busy drowning in it to find there genis.

What is genius well its simple.

Artists why we call them genius when all they do is have sex with us mentally with their paintings?

Its simple.

Genius you can put your shoes in everyones shoes.

Why monalisa good? Cuz Leonardo DeCraporeo made it good for all cultures races n creeds. Black man say it good. White man say it good. Cave man say it good. Little girl say it good.

Tehfreor. Genius.

Anything else, is just talented.

Geniuses see the universe...the Universe...baby geneiusis
surreptitious57
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by surreptitious57 »

The word genius has to be the most misappropriated in all of English
Since it simply does not mean someone that you hero worship rather
someone whose mind is such they think differently to all others and
significantly so also. One may of course hero worship those who are
geniuses but it is not conditional on them being so in the first place
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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by Bill Wiltrack »

.


I visited the Genius Forum, where you drifted from...Posted a few times.


Nice group of people. Small group.


The Owner or Moderator of that forum seems quite immature. I'll never go back there again.


You have been a nice addition here.



.
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.


I visited the Genius Forum, where you drifted from...Posted a few times.


Nice group of people. Small group.


The Owner or Moderator of that forum seems quite immature. I'll never go back there again.


You have been a nice addition here.



.
Deibert isnt the owner, Kevin is, and he's been gone for months. Half of them seem nice but the topics are rather boring and repetitive, similar to this forum. I'd say these forums are of the same nature, this one is more Western oriented and the other one is more Eastern. They both have the same color scheme and structure too.
thedoc
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by thedoc »

Bill Wiltrack wrote:.
I visited the Genius Forum, where you drifted from...Posted a few times.
The Owner or Moderator of that forum seems quite immature. I'll never go back there again.
.
Probably a good idea, it's a nice forum but not very active, not much there for someone like you.
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

admin wrote:The word “genius” has gone through many different meanings throughout the course of history and none of them, I have to say, are particularly inspiring. It apparently originated in Roman times in reference to a “guardian spirit”. A genius was a kind of spirit being, an intermediary betweeen this world and the next, who looked after your affairs, protected you from misfortune and provided you with wise advice.

On the surface, this sounds like just another comical religious belief and no doubt the Romans, who were as irrational and superstitious as the rest of the human race, did everything they could to make the whole endeavour as insane as possible – and indeed they happily incorporated into the charade the use of omens, ritual sacrifices, oracles, soothsayers and the like. However, it seems there was at least a pretence of trying to associate the idea of genius with wisdom, which is not something we can say about our modern conceptions of genius. In other words, it appears that behind all the superstitiousness the Roman conception of genius made reference, not to extraordinary talent, but to something much larger and more important – namely, to enlightenment, knowledge of human psychology and the art of living. It had a connection to the absolute, at least in principle.

Maybe I am grasping at straws here. After all, the Romans lived in brutal and uncertain times and they were probably desperate for advice and reassurance from wherever they could find it, even from imaginary sources. But at least they were seeking wisdom from their geniuses. They weren’t seeking dazzling music or complex theorizing. They were looking for insight into life and death matters. And one can imagine that they occasionally sought it from a genuine source of wisdom – that is to say, from a Socrates-type figure. From an enlightened sage.

In any case, after the collapse of the Roman Empire, things began to change. The connection to the absolute was broken and the meaning of genius went into decline. It became synonymous with extraordinary talent in a particular field. As Andrew Robinson writes in an article in Psychology Today:

The word genius has its roots in Roman antiquity; in Latin, genius described the tutelary (guardian) spirit of a person, place, institution, and so on, which linked these to the forces of fate and the rhythms of time. Among the Romans, the idea of genius had no necessary relationship with ability or exceptional creativity.

Not until the Enlightenment did genius acquire its distinctly different, chief modern meaning: an individual who demonstrates exceptional intellectual or creative powers, whether inborn or acquired (or both). Homer, despite two millennia of veneration as a divinely inspired poet, did not become a ‘genius’ until the 18th century. This later usage derives from the Latin ingenium (not from genius), meaning ‘natural disposition’, ‘innate ability’, or ‘talent’.


As we can see, what genius meant in Roman times is very different from how we conceive of it today. Nowadays, the term is reserved for people with freakish skills, regardless of whether or not they possess any wisdom. The most celebrated examples are men like Michelangelo, Rembrandt, da Vinci, Mozart, Beethoven, Bach, Newton, Darwin, and Einstein. These men are considered geniuses, not because they had any awareness or understanding of the absolute, but because their talents caused them to stand out from the mediocrity of the human race.

Once you uncouple genius from the absolute, all sorts of absurdities and anomalies arise. For example, if we were to pluck Einstein from the confines of the 20th century human race and place him in a community of beings whose intelligence and scientific abilities were far greater than his own, then what would become of his “genius”? It would miraculously disappear. Instead of being feted as a great thinker, he would be dismissed as a dunce. This alone shows that genius (in the sense we mean today, uncoupled from the absolute) is a relative quality, which effectively turns it into a mirage.

Another amusing anomaly involves the stark contrast between the exceptional skill displayed by the genius within his chosen field and his sheer ineptitude outside of it. Einstein was undeniably talented within the realm of physics, but as soon as he stepped outside the lab or office, his skill and insight into life seemed to vanish. His philosophical musings, for example, were nearly always uninspired and mediocre. The following quote more or less sums up his philosophic outlook on life:
- Albert Einstein, The World As I See It (1949) wrote:The most beautiful and deepest experience a man can have is the sense of the mysterious. It is the underlying principle of religion as well as all serious endeavour in art and science. He who never had this experience seems to me, if not dead, then at least blind. To sense that behind anything that can be experienced there is a something that our mind cannot grasp and whose beauty and sublimity reaches us only indirectly and as a feeble reflection, this is religiousness. In this sense I am religious. To me it suffices to wonder at these secrets and to attempt humbly to grasp with my mind a mere image of the lofty structure of all that there is.



In essence, what Einstein expresses with his philosophic views is a sense of awe at the size and structural complexity of the universe, an awe that is almost girl-like in its naivity. There is no specific knowledge on display, no depth of insight, no awareness of the logical pathways that extend beyond science, no understanding of the fundamental nature of things, not even an inkling that such an understanding is possible. Just a vague sense of astonishment that any happy-go-lucky teenager might experience when puffing on a joint. To put it bluntly, Einstein was a philosophical simpleton. If his expertise in physics went far beyond the greatest of PhD graduates, then his expertise in philosophy and spirituality went no further than the kindergarten.

This leads to another interesting point – namely, that the nature of genius, as exhibited by the likes of Einstein, Darwin, Mozart, Bach, etc, bears an uncanny resemblance to autism. The image of the idiot savant is brought to mind, a mishappen creature who can perform complex mathematical operations inside his head, but can barely cope with saying hello and buying a loaf of bread. In the late 19th century and early 20th century, there were traveling freak shows which featured bizarre people with long necks or no legs, or who were hairy all over, or who could pull trains along with their teeth. People used to flock to these shows and marvel at the strange amusements they housed. In a similar way, the pantheon of celebrated geniuses – the Mozarts and Bachs, the Rembrandts and da Vincis, the Darwins and Einsteins – constitute a sort of freak show for people to oggle at and express their amazement.

Image of Freak Show


And yes, people do express their amazement. One of the more interesting aspects of the modern conception of genius is the way in which it is generally regarded to be a mysterious quality, one that is almost divine or supernatural in origin. When someone exults in the talents of a musician they admire, or a writer, or a scientist, and exclaims, “He really is a genius!”, it is invariably done with a sort of religious zeal. Even atheists are prone to this way of behaving. An atheist might loudly boast that he is beyond all religious belief, but as soon as a celebrated genius like an Einstein or a Feynman walks into the room, watch how he swoons as though in the presence of a god. The desire to bow down and worship is as strong as ever, it would seem, even in our so-called cynical age. “God may be dead, but his shadow lives on”, as Nietzsche once observed.

Yet there is nothing essentially mysterious about genius. It is basically the result of incremental steps deviating away from the norm at an early age. An unhappy childhood, perhaps. Unresolved family issues generating a life-long passion for something better. A genetic predisposition towards logic and introspection. A lack of emotional connection with childhood companions. A thirst for clarity and understanding. A desire to make a mark. A perfectionist streak. These are the building blocks of genius.

And so little by little, as he grows older, the budding genius deviates from the rest of his peers, so much so that by the time he reaches adulthood he is more or less in another world, making conceptual connections and leaps that no one else has made before. Often these connections and leaps are of little consequence and the budding genius remains no more than a peripheral figure. But when the circumstances are ripe, when the budding genius is in the right time and the right place, these connections and leaps can lead to major conceptual breakthroughs.

The mysterious nature of genius is thus an illusion. It is not unlike the way a stage magician is able to dazzle us with his tricks. From our perspective in the audience, the magician’s performances seem mysterious because we are not privy to the incremental steps involved. But once the trick is explained the magic suddenly vanishes, making it seem humdrum, which of course it is.

We like to laugh at the religious fundamentalists who, in their crude misunderstanding of evolutionary theory, often make absurd comments such as, “How can something as complex as the wing of a bird or the human eye be thrown together by chance!” Trapped within the fog of their own wishful thinking, they do not want to see that evolution is all about incremental steps occuring over prodigious amounts of time, and that when changes do occur they are built upon the legacy of past changes. Fundamentalists deserve to be laughed at because they are willfully blind. Yet the moment we regard genius to be a mysterious quality, we immediately fall into the same trap.

This applies to all areas of life, not just to genius. In reality, there is nothing mysterious about anything at all in the Universe. Everything comes into existence through incremental steps, through causes and conditions. We might be ignorant of many of the specific steps and causes behind many of the things that happen in life, but that does not make them mysterious.

Given that the label of “genius” is nowadays applied to freakish, mishappen creatures with little or no wisdom, the question needs to be asked: How much control does a genius actually have over his life? Does a genius really desire to be an ignorant freak? Or is he compelled by forces beyond his control to diminish and humiliate himself in this manner?

Or to put the question more succinctly, are we looking at evil or incompetence?

I always used to wonder at the choices people made in their lives. Given the sheer richness of existence, with its infinite complexities and the endless array of possibilities open to us all, and given that the primary question of why we are alive in the first place is constantly staring us in the face, how is it that an otherwise intelligent person can decide to devote his entire life to, say, studying the mating cycles of dung-beetles? Or the behaviour of amino acids? Or the Latvian underground art movement of the 1920‘s? Isn’t this just the strangest thing? How do people bring themselves to make such a decision? Are they really that blind to the madness of it?

This is bizarre enough for ordinary people, but it is even more strange and puzzling when it comes to geniuses. Mozart, for example, was obviously a very sensitive soul with a brilliant memory and an intuitive, well-structured mind. He had the potential to do anything, at least in theory. He could have opened his mind to the Infinite, grasped the fundamental nature of everything, solved all the great problems of philosophy, spiritually soared to every corner of existence, learned to live joyously and freely, helping everyone to become liberated with great skill and spontaneity – but no. He instead chose to confine himself to stringing pleasing noises together to entertain shallow people with dull minds. How is this possible? Are these really the actions of a genius?

It is commonly said that there is a fine line between genius and madness. And yes, to be sure, if we reduce the meaning of genius so that it applies to autistic-type people who are not really in control of their lives, then there is indeed a fine line between genius and madness. In fact, we can go a step further and say that genius, in this sense, is inseparable from madness. It just happens to be a more productive form of madness. But true genius – and by this I mean genius conceived in the greatest possible manner – is a very different matter. True genius is infinitely removed from madness. If madness represents a deviation away from the normality of human consciousness, then true genius represents a deviation in the opposite direction. For true genius is nothing other than the full expression of sanity.
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DesolationRow
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by DesolationRow »

I posted this question in the General Discussion forum where the essay was also posted. But I'll post it here as this looks like the more appropriate thread...

That's a very interesting essay on the nature of genius.

I have a question, though. What about philosophical "genius?" Like for instance, Kant or Nietzsche? These were individuals with profound understandings of the the absolute, our relation to it, the self, the structure of the mind, our psychology. The breadth of their knowledge would indicate a different kind of genius than an Einstein or a Beethoven. And yet, by some accounts these men were also "inept," as both were loners, somewhat isolated, no romantic relationships or family. Does this too fall under faux-genius?
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

DesolationRow wrote:I posted this question in the General Discussion forum where the essay was also posted. But I'll post it here as this looks like the more appropriate thread...

That's a very interesting essay on the nature of genius.

I have a question, though. What about philosophical "genius?" Like for instance, Kant or Nietzsche? These were individuals with profound understandings of the the absolute, our relation to it, the self, the structure of the mind, our psychology. The breadth of their knowledge would indicate a different kind of genius than an Einstein or a Beethoven. And yet, by some accounts these men were also "inept," as both were loners, somewhat isolated, no romantic relationships or family. Does this too fall under faux-genius?
How does it make one inept if one does not participate in the social customs of apes?

As for the word genius, if you couldn't tell from the original post this was kind of a joke. It's just a sticker you put on something like "radical" or "cool". The essay provides a more accurate definition of genius, however in the end it's only a sticker, a trophy, nothing more.
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by DesolationRow »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:
DesolationRow wrote:I posted this question in the General Discussion forum where the essay was also posted. But I'll post it here as this looks like the more appropriate thread...

That's a very interesting essay on the nature of genius.

I have a question, though. What about philosophical "genius?" Like for instance, Kant or Nietzsche? These were individuals with profound understandings of the the absolute, our relation to it, the self, the structure of the mind, our psychology. The breadth of their knowledge would indicate a different kind of genius than an Einstein or a Beethoven. And yet, by some accounts these men were also "inept," as both were loners, somewhat isolated, no romantic relationships or family. Does this too fall under faux-genius?
How does it make one inept if one does not participate in the social customs of apes?

As for the word genius, if you couldn't tell from the original post this was kind of a joke. It's just a sticker you put on something like "radical" or "cool". The essay provides a more accurate definition of genius, however in the end it's only a sticker, a trophy, nothing more.
Hmm well poor social skills seems to be an ineptitude not dissimilar to what was mentioned that would disenfranchise Einstein or da Vinci from being called a genius.

I'm new here, so bear with me as I get accustomed to how these forums operate. I'm wishing they were a bit more active!

But anyway, I dunno. It seems to me that genius is a useful way to describe people, especially if a descriptor is added i.e. musical genius, scientific genius, etc. The author's issue seems to simply be one of of semantics. Isn't every description just a label (trophy, sticker, gold star)? Genius indicates soaring, extraordinary abilities. I, for one, find it to be enormously inspiring. It seems incredibly disingenuous to dismiss figures of the label "genius" as merely autistic and to scoff at their only talent, because they lack other ones. Or is someone only worthy of the genius-like praise if they are Mozart, Isaac Newton, Aristotle, and Michelangelo all rolled into one? Or as the article would suggest, someone who has no special talents but who is, by some arbitrary standard, "sane?"
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

DesolationRow wrote:
GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:
DesolationRow wrote:I posted this question in the General Discussion forum where the essay was also posted. But I'll post it here as this looks like the more appropriate thread...

That's a very interesting essay on the nature of genius.

I have a question, though. What about philosophical "genius?" Like for instance, Kant or Nietzsche? These were individuals with profound understandings of the the absolute, our relation to it, the self, the structure of the mind, our psychology. The breadth of their knowledge would indicate a different kind of genius than an Einstein or a Beethoven. And yet, by some accounts these men were also "inept," as both were loners, somewhat isolated, no romantic relationships or family. Does this too fall under faux-genius?
How does it make one inept if one does not participate in the social customs of apes?

As for the word genius, if you couldn't tell from the original post this was kind of a joke. It's just a sticker you put on something like "radical" or "cool". The essay provides a more accurate definition of genius, however in the end it's only a sticker, a trophy, nothing more.
Hmm well poor social skills seems to be an ineptitude not dissimilar to what was mentioned that would disenfranchise Einstein or da Vinci from being called a genius.

I'm new here, so bear with me as I get accustomed to how these forums operate. I'm wishing they were a bit more active!

But anyway, I dunno. It seems to me that genius is a useful way to describe people, especially if a descriptor is added i.e. musical genius, scientific genius, etc. It seems to me that it's simply an issue of semantics. Isn't every description just a label (trophy, sticker, gold star)? Genius indicates soaring, extraordinary abilities. I, for one, find it to be enormously inspiring. It seems incredibly disingenuous to dismiss figures of the label "genius" as merely autistic and to scoff at their only talent, because they lack other ones. Or is someone only worthy of the genius-like praise if they are Mozart, Isaac Newton, Aristotle, and Michelangelo all rolled into one? Or as the article would suggest, someone who has no special talents but who is, by some arbitrary standard, "sane?"
NonononoNO. No noNOOO. They didn't meant THAT kind of sane. Like you know, clear to leave the hospital "sane". Because after all, the average Joe is quite insane. The doctors of course say he wasn't. And that he was quite sane. Of which of course, he wasn't. Oh and it's really not arbitrary either, look around you. Do you really think the people around you are at all sane? Not at all. For example the Joker in Batman is what we consider "super sane" because unlike the common people around him, he has vast intelligence. Though he may have bipolar disorder and other mental problems some would consider "mentally insane" he is still at heart, more sane than the average Joe.

Praise praise praise. What is this lady gaga? If someone makes a theory give them a beer, give them a back massage, a fancy hotel. So they can live happy healthy make more theories. It's not about praise. It's about gettin sh*t done. That's the truth of the matter.

As for your art rubbish, it's whatever. Fine put a sticker saying whatever you want, "Genius", "Platinum Hits", "10/10", whatever floats your boat. As far as music I think that Mozart was "ok" but there far more talented composers out there, like Yasunori Mitsuda for instance.
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DesolationRow
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by DesolationRow »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:
NonononoNO. No noNOOO. They didn't meant THAT kind of sane. Like you know, clear to leave the hospital "sane". Because after all, the average Joe is quite insane. The doctors of course say he wasn't. And that he was quite sane. Of which of course, he wasn't. Oh and it's really not arbitrary either, look around you. Do you really think the people around you are at all sane? Not at all. For example the Joker in Batman is what we consider "super sane" because unlike the common people around him, he has vast intelligence. Though he may have bipolar disorder and other mental problems some would consider "mentally insane" he is still at heart, more sane than the average Joe.

Praise praise praise. What is this lady gaga? If someone makes a theory give them a beer, give them a back massage, a fancy hotel. So they can live happy healthy make more theories. It's not about praise. It's about gettin sh*t done. That's the truth of the matter.

As for your art rubbish, it's whatever. Fine put a sticker saying whatever you want, "Genius", "Platinum Hits", "10/10", whatever floats your boat. As far as music I think that Mozart was "ok" but there far more talented composers out there, like Yasunori Mitsuda for instance.
Ahh. Okay. Yes, I did misunderstand what "sane" was conveying in that context. I agree that nearly everyone is insane. But since the fundamental underlying truth of everything is unclear at best, it still seems like choosing a criteria for what sanity consists of would be an arbitrary process.

Well, if you support technological advancement, then Einstein and Newton are the very definition of "getting shit done." We can explore space, we use GPS, we travel and communicate faster largely because of their theories.

Haha I see where the disparity is in our thinking. If art is "rubbish" to you, then sure, music and fiction etc. is going to be disposable. But what are humans to do other than creatively use, and hopefully enjoy, the talents we were given?
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

DesolationRow wrote: Haha I see where the disparity is in our thinking. If art is "rubbish" to you, then sure, music and fiction etc. is going to be disposable. But what are humans to do other than creatively use, and hopefully enjoy, the talents we were given?
Off yourselves to the clapping applause of the galaxy? Couldn't come sooner than later. The galaxy thanks you.

What the hell did Einstein have to do with GPS? Like, absolutely nothing. I made a video questioning the validity of his actual theories. You know how I made a video? Because none of his theories have any practical application currently.

Newton didn't provide "theories" just basic facts. It's just rocket science. How hard is it to get a rock out of an orbiting ball? Largely depends on the size of your pocketbook, nothing more.

And what did getting a rock out of an orbitting ball accomplish? Absolutely nothing.

Id say the only technological achievement humanity made is the Internet, which is the Devil's tool of enlightenment. It basically rapes minds with knowledge. If it wasn't for the Internet, the apes would be even more ignorant than they are now. But also more blissful.
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DesolationRow
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by DesolationRow »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:
DesolationRow wrote: Haha I see where the disparity is in our thinking. If art is "rubbish" to you, then sure, music and fiction etc. is going to be disposable. But what are humans to do other than creatively use, and hopefully enjoy, the talents we were given?
Off yourselves to the clapping applause of the galaxy? Couldn't come sooner than later. The galaxy thanks you.

What the hell did Einstein have to do with GPS? Like, absolutely nothing. I made a video questioning the validity of his actual theories. You know how I made a video? Because none of his theories have any practical application currently.

Newton didn't provide "theories" just basic facts. It's just rocket science. How hard is it to get a rock out of an orbiting ball? Largely depends on the size of your pocketbook, nothing more.

And what did getting a rock out of an orbitting ball accomplish? Absolutely nothing.

Id say the only technological achievement humanity made is the Internet, which is the Devil's tool of enlightenment. It basically rapes minds with knowledge. If it wasn't for the Internet, the apes would be even more ignorant than they are now. But also more blissful.
Actually, Einstein's theory of General Relativity had everything to do with GPS.
http://physicscentral.com/explore/writers/will.cfm

Acting like you know everything when you clearly don't comes off as childish arrogance. I can respect that you're knowledgeable but your tone is rude.
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by Blaggard »

I have an IQ of 160, I wouldn't wipe my ass on the paper IQ was written on. Neither would I care to explain why I am intelligent even if I was. A genius is not given to make claims, he is one, that is bestowed on him by others. As to all that crap about numbers and shit, who the hell cares, it's just people reading shit into shit, much like the IQ test. No one cares prove what you can do or what is the case or STFU.
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Re: Wat makes a genious a genie, us?

Post by thedoc »

Blaggard wrote:I have an IQ of 160, I wouldn't wipe my ass on the paper IQ was written on. Neither would I care to explain why I am intelligent even if I was. A genius is not given to make claims, he is one, that is bestowed on him by others. As to all that crap about numbers and shit, who the hell cares, it's just people reading shit into shit, much like the IQ test. No one cares prove what you can do or what is the case or STFU.
My first wife had a measured IQ of 140+ and I didn't feel at all inferior to her, I was never really sure what My number was. When I worked as a draftsman in industry I was asked "To what do I aspire?". my honest answer was that I didn't aspire to anything, I liked drawing and wanted to keep doing that, but that wasn't good enough for management, they insisted that I had to aspire to something better, to move up the corporate ladder. Basically they didn't want to keep giving me raises, (which were mostly automatic) without getting more responsibility out of me. I simply wasn't interested in proving the "Peter Principle", so I was let go after 4 1/2 years. So much for brains leading to success. Now I have really good conversations with my 5 year old granddaughter. And my 9 year old grandson is really learning a lot that I can help him with.
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