Despair as an imperative for change

[madera]

Have you gone from despair to overcoming the cause behind it?
Madera

There is no single cause for logical despair (see my last post prior to your post), except the category of bad things that threaten your future and which aren't solved for, where logical despair can be infinitesimally small, or infinitely big, or anywhere between.

In emotional despair, infinitesimally small despair translates into despair that we do not feel on ourselves and therefore do not "experience" as such, whereas extreme amounts of despair can paralyse us and can equally be more trouble than it can be aiding, whereas more moderate amounts merely expands our horizon of thought to figure out more ways to deal with a problem.

In logical despair, we can more rationally weigh the opportunities for solving despairing situations of any quantity. In a way, to get to your question, you can better overcome despair by applying a logical rather than an emotional perspective of it. I cannot overcome that bad things will happen as a generality, but I can become aware of the bad things as early as possible, I can socialize it by bringing it into language (thereby possibly extending available manpower to solve the problems), and I can mathematize it to extend my ability to calculate solutions and optimizations.

And, I can recognize, that despair is an imperative for change! And that the more despairing I am, in a logical sense (or derived logically from an emotional sense), the more change is needed to statistically be able to solve the situation! This last realization CAN be a way of overcoming despair, yes, and it has happened to me, yes, that drastic change has solved drastic situations.

Can you tell me what logical despair is? I see no despair as logical, but, emotional and there is an underlying cause we have yet to be revealed to us.

I had been in despair for many years over being angry.
my anger is gone and so is the despair.

[The Voice of Time]

Well in my own defence I have said what it is.

Logical despair is the appropriation of some central (non-excessive) functions of emotional despair to logical thought.

When you experience emotional despair, you are experiencing stress and an enforced high functionality on your imagination, there may be other more subtle effects as well, but those are the primary and most visible features general for everyone. The "hint" of something bad, expands and accelerates your mind, and makes you increasingly agreeable. While the causes of emotional despair may be this or that, some chemical cocktail with external catalysts, it is not the point of it, the way in which we, in an evolutionary sense perhaps, "use it". The most visible and stereotype form of despair arise out of situations that seem increasingly impossible, and where you because of this impossibility, have to go a totally different path, or if it's hard enough on you, you flip out and become delusional, typical of movies featuring power maniacs that suddenly see their empire/pride crumbling. That's not all there is to despair though and far from what's usual, and you have many degrees of despair, but all the healthy degrees contain within themselves an increasing imperative for change, and that's why I've derived this term "logical despair" from its emotional cousin.

It is despair, re-appropriated from evolution, and given a proper civilized and highly functional and possibly insightful form.

[madera]

Have you gone from despair to overcoming the cause behind it?
Madera

There is no single cause for logical despair (see my last post prior to your post), except the category of bad things that threaten your future and which aren't solved for, where logical despair can be infinitesimally small, or infinitely big, or anywhere between.

In emotional despair, infinitesimally small despair translates into despair that we do not feel on ourselves and therefore do not "experience" as such, whereas extreme amounts of despair can paralyse us and can equally be more trouble than it can be aiding, whereas more moderate amounts merely expands our horizon of thought to figure out more ways to deal with a problem.

In logical despair, we can more rationally weigh the opportunities for solving despairing situations of any quantity. In a way, to get to your question, you can better overcome despair by applying a logical rather than an emotional perspective of it. I cannot overcome that bad things will happen as a generality, but I can become aware of the bad things as early as possible, I can socialize it by bringing it into language (thereby possibly extending available manpower to solve the problems), and I can mathematize it to extend my ability to calculate solutions and optimizations.

And, I can recognize, that despair is an imperative for change! And that the more despairing I am, in a logical sense (or derived logically from an emotional sense), the more change is needed to statistically be able to solve the situation! This last realization CAN be a way of overcoming despair, yes, and it has happened to me, yes, that drastic change has solved drastic situations.

Words, words.
Have you overcome your despair? If so, what have you learned from it? What experiences did you go through? There is always a cause for despair. What has changed?

Madera

[The Voice of Time]

Words, words.

That's quite rude. May I ask why you are being rude?

Have you overcome your despair?

I'm currently not feeling any despair, and I don't know what despair you are talking about.

If so, what have you learned from it?

I once was in a very deeply despairing situation. I overcame it by rationalization. I learned the relationship between despair and change which I've now talked at length with you about, among things, the other being unrelated to despair itself.

What experiences did you go through?

Large uncertainty and rejections of myself.

There is always a cause for despair. What has changed?

My life and my ability to enjoy it.

[madera]

Words, words.

That's quite rude. May I ask why you are being rude?

Have you overcome your despair?

I'm currently not feeling any despair, and I don't know what despair you are talking about.

If so, what have you learned from it?

I once was in a very deeply despairing situation. I overcame it by rationalization. I learned the relationship between despair and change which I've now talked at length with you about, among things, the other being unrelated to despair itself.

What experiences did you go through?

Large uncertainty and rejections of myself.

There is always a cause for despair. What has changed?

My life and my ability to enjoy it.

Didn't mean to be rude, but, too many words can be misleading after a point.

Just want to say that you were not rejecting yourself, you were rejecting an entity that you think is yourself. There is one in everyone, It is biblical. ( Paul said he couldn't do what he wanted to do because sin made a home in him.)

You spoke of despair, that is where despair comes from. It does not come from God.

[The Voice of Time]

Sorry but I have no understanding or sympathy for theistic mysticism. Do you have a non-religious explanation of what you mean?

Just want to say that you were not rejecting yourself, you were rejecting an entity that you think is yourself.

That is, the sentence above. What entity? Why would I merely think it was myself, why can't it be a former version of myself for which I rejected and, to be metaphorical, like a larvae I sprouted forth a butterfly? To take the metaphor further, the larvae is as much a part of the butterfly as is the butterfly itself, it's just an earlier point in life in a different set of circumstance.

[madera]

Sorry but I have no understanding or sympathy for theistic mysticism. Do you have a non-religious explanation of what you mean?

Just want to say that you were not rejecting yourself, you were rejecting an entity that you think is yourself.

That is, the sentence above. What entity? Why would I merely think it was myself, why can't it be a former version of myself for which I rejected and, to be metaphorical, like a larvae I sprouted forth a butterfly? To take the metaphor further, the larvae is as much a part of the butterfly as is the butterfly itself, it's just an earlier point in life in a different set of circumstance.

The former version of you also had the same entity.
We are born innocent as children then because of our experiences in life we become corrupted and our natures change and the entity emerges.
I am not talking about butterflies, I am talking of our souls.

[The Voice of Time]

What's a soul? That's another theistic mystic term you'll have to bring down to the Earth for me.

[madera23]

What's a soul? That's another theistic mystic term you'll have to bring down to the Earth for me.

I am a christian that has had spiritual experiences.
whats a soul?
A Soul is the part that GOd has breathes into us. If you dont have a soul, May GOd help you.

[The Voice of Time]

Well I don't believe in either God, devils, santa claus, the easter bunny nor souls, and so the breath of God is absolutely unintelligible to me, for the sake of story I hope he had brushed his teeth before he decided to share his smells with me ^^ From my perspective obviously I don't have a soul since I don't believe in the existence of souls. Who knows what a Christian thinks of the matter though.

[madera]

Well I don't believe in either God, devils, santa claus, the easter bunny nor souls, and so the breath of God is absolutely unintelligible to me, for the sake of story I hope he had brushed his teeth before he decided to share his smells with me ^^ From my perspective obviously I don't have a soul since I don't believe in the existence of souls. Who knows what a Christian thinks of the matter though.

That makes you a mindless robot.
Goodbye.

[The Voice of Time]

So the characteristic of having a soul is having a mind? Why do you need to use the word "soul" then instead of just saying "mind"?

And where does the robot come from? Are you suggesting I'm made from mechanical parts and/or software, and that all people who do not have a soul are made from mechanical parts and/or based on software?