The beginning of time

[jackles]

Yes is what you are saying james that nurture gives us this outlook this detached view of the event.nurture focuses a potential view of the world from personal to the impersonal.i must agree with that.something in the brain is opened up.which
otherwise would remain closed.

[LegendLength]

In my opinion the brain is a bridge between local reality.and an absolute existance the absolute existance doesnt flow in a timelike way.but causes the local reality to seem to be flowing or moving in a time like way.so consciousness dosnt move in any terms but the event the brain sees moves.or seems to move.

I think that is an important concept. Just because we feel like time flows doesn't mean it flows in an objective sense. I agree that when we see a rock it does exist objectively, but for time flow it is not so easy.

The question has to be clearly framed as: What is the mechanism that causes time / change? Explain in terms I can understand why we have this flow of time around us. Because that really is the question right? We want to know what 'causes' time.

Regardless if you believe in block time or presentism I think it's worth at least considering the mechanism behind block time. It claims the flow of time is an illusion and doesn't exist objectively. The brain thinks there's a flow of time just because of the way memories are stored in perfect order etc..

The 'mechanism' behind all this is the claim that during an instant you also feel the flow of time. Say we were suddenly frozen in time for all eternity. So we lived our lives up till now and then suddenly time stopped. At that very last moment in time, would it be correct to say we had experiences or felt the flow of time? If so then you don't need an objectively flow of time, it is enough to have a collection of instances. All that is required is that each instant has a 'correct' brain structure for each creature with proper memories etc.. They would 'feel' a flow (so the claim goes).

[Kurt]

If time within our universe is relative and as Einstein surmises that if we could travel the speed of light time would stop and our mass become infinite then would it be reasonable to think that the opposite is possible. That if we could come to a complete stop within the universe so that even gravity has no effect would our mass become zero and time infinite.
I see the universe not as being created as a Big Bang but rather a Big Freeze within zero mass, infinite time. Once linear time is created within infinity this gives rise to space. The events we perceive as space, matter, energy and motion are a consequence of the creation of time within infinity. Infinity allows for anything to be anywhere at the same time (within space time) or at least the possibility of. So the largest amount of quantum filters between infinity and our universe are where nothing but space exists, matter and energy are a representation of less quantum filters of different combinations (maybe strings). The more stuff if you like is a representation of less filters with different combinations between our perceived universe and infinity. A description of the Sun could be said to be a foggy window into infinity. The clearest window being where the most stuff is (Black Holes).
As we are moving in many different directions at the same time through space we never hold the same position so the representation or information of quantum filters we possess move with us, similar to how an image moves across an LCD TV screen the information (0,1) is generally the same but is continuously represented by different pixels. So as we move through space our information is transferred through quantum filters which might be different vibrational representations on strings for example instead of the 0,1 we use with computers.
So at the quantum level everything has the potential to be anywhere within space time due to infinity.

[Ginkgo]

If time within our universe is relative and as Einstein surmises that if we could travel the speed of light time would stop and our mass become infinite then would it be reasonable to think that the opposite is possible. That if we could come to a complete stop within the universe so that even gravity has no effect would our mass become zero and time infinite.
I see the universe not as being created as a Big Bang but rather a Big Freeze within zero mass, infinite time. Once linear time is created within infinity this gives rise to space. The events we perceive as space, matter, energy and motion are a consequence of the creation of time within infinity. Infinity allows for anything to be anywhere at the same time (within space time) or at least the possibility of. So the largest amount of quantum filters between infinity and our universe are where nothing but space exists, matter and energy are a representation of less quantum filters of different combinations (maybe strings). The more stuff if you like is a representation of less filters with different combinations between our perceived universe and infinity. A description of the Sun could be said to be a foggy window into infinity. The clearest window being where the most stuff is (Black Holes).
As we are moving in many different directions at the same time through space we never hold the same position so the representation or information of quantum filters we possess move with us, similar to how an image moves across an LCD TV screen the information (0,1) is generally the same but is continuously represented by different pixels. So as we move through space our information is transferred through quantum filters which might be different vibrational representations on strings for example instead of the 0,1 we use with computers.
So at the quantum level everything has the potential to be anywhere within space time due to infinity.

Kurt, could you explain what you mean by "quantum filters". You seem to be suggesting that when the universe becomes infinitely large it will actually be infinitely small. I think this theory is know as the, The Big Free Singularity. I think this theory is compatible with the idea that we live in a flat universe. According to the latest finding apparently we do.

[Kurt]

Hi Ginkgo,
Thanks for having a look, I am handicapped by not having any sort of science background so I'm not familiar with terms that may apply within quantum physics. I just been thinking of this for a while and would be interested for someone to pull it apart. Quantum filters is just a way of trying to describe what's in my head.
The idea is that within infinity/possibility a universe comes into existence due to the initiation of linear time which is partnered with space, one cannot exist without the other. The filters represent different values ( I'm not sure how they would be represented maybe vibrations, frequency, points coming in and out of existence or a combination) between infinity/possibility and space/time which gives us our possibility of anything at any point in space/time, different examples of matter, energy information etc. If you could progressively strip away the space/time barrier values, quantum filters more possibilities become apparent. So my main point is that infinity/possibility or infinite time/zero mass and space is the norm if you like and our universe is a creation within this. (No I'm not religious)

[Ginkgo]

Hi Ginkgo,
Thanks for having a look, I am handicapped by not having any sort of science background so I'm not familiar with terms that may apply within quantum physics. I just been thinking of this for a while and would be interested for someone to pull it apart. Quantum filters is just a way of trying to describe what's in my head.
The idea is that within infinity/possibility a universe comes into existence due to the initiation of linear time which is partnered with space, one cannot exist without the other. The filters represent different values ( I'm not sure how they would be represented maybe vibrations, frequency, points coming in and out of existence or a combination) between infinity/possibility and space/time which gives us our possibility of anything at any point in space/time, different examples of matter, energy information etc. If you could progressively strip away the space/time barrier values, quantum filters more possibilities become apparent. So my main point is that infinity/possibility or infinite time/zero mass and space is the norm if you like and our universe is a creation within this. (No I'm not religious)

Hi Kurt,


Sounds a bit like quantum field theory. This guy explains it really well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yplCob7_Ck

[Kurt]

Thanks ginkgo,
Especially allowing for my lack of correct terminology. I will check it out, do you know where this sits on the current thinking as unless your in the field it's hard to keep up.

[jackles]

before anything happen the big bang time was in a state of neverhappened.when energy came into existance time still is never happened as in it time is indisinguishable happening or neverhappening .its the same thing wether happening or not happening.so it didnt have a begining and has no end.consciousness and time are the same thing.you cant have consciousness without time.you cant have time without consciousness.so consciousness is time thats not associated or localised.consciousness is time that prexisted localisation of its self to an event.

[Kurt]

Yes that's what I meant by mass zero, time infinity

[jackles]

yes mass zero time infinite is good.time is indisinguishable to mass happening or not. but gives it mass /energy a past and future tense of its self.the rest state of time is infinity.

[Kurt]

Yes, I like the term 'rest state of time being infinity' that is how I see it. Possibly the only thing that can exist in this state is consciousness itself. When the brakes are put onto infinity it progressivly creates space/time/energy/mass/possibility. So rather than a Big Bang it is more of a big freeze of infinity into possibility.

[jackles]

yeah like you say as the brakes go on in neverhappen sizelessness.sizelike happen arises out of what seems to be no thing.

[Kurt]

It seems like a simple solution where infinity is the natural state and space time is the anomaly.

[jackles]

yeah so time as infinity is fact to energy in time as fiction.so we have change of state in energy as fictional time.

[Kurt]

So how real is linear time reality.