PHILOSOPHY, PSYCHOACTIVE DRUGS, HALLUCINOGENS, AND OPIATES

[Bill Wiltrack]

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..........PHILOSOPHY, PSYCHOACTIVE DRUGS, HALLUCINOGENS, AND OPIATES





Psychoactive drugs, hallucinogens, and opiates serve one purpose in relationship to true philosophy; That is, to open a door.


Once that door is opened, these mind altering drugs are of little or no value.



That door is consciousness; Our ability to see ourselves.


I maintain that self-consciousness is the root and lifeblood of true philosophy.




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We often see budding philosophers or individuals who may be philosophically attenuated perched upon the ledge of psychoactive drugs peering into the door of consciousness and potentially, a life directed philosophy.




Those who choose to stay upon that perch engage in mental, physical, and emotional masturbation. Nothing more.





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[SpheresOfBalance]

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..........PHILOSOPHY, PSYCHOACTIVE DRUGS, HALLUCINOGENS, AND OPIATES





Psychoactive drugs, hallucinogens, and opiates serve one purpose in relationship to true philosophy; That is, to open a door.


Once that door is opened, these mind altering drugs are of little or no value.



That door is consciousness; Our ability to see ourselves.


I maintain that self-consciousness is the root and lifeblood of true philosophy.




....................................





We often see budding philosophers or individuals who may be philosophically attenuated perched upon the ledge of psychoactive drugs peering into the door of consciousness and potentially, a life directed philosophy.




Those who choose to stay upon that perch engage in mental, physical, and emotional masturbation. Nothing more.





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No one can make blanket statements that covers all, necessarily containing any certainty. There are always variables outside ones scope. Of course everyone in entitled to their opinion.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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Yes. You are correct.


There are always exceptions.


As you inferred, all aspects of philosophy and psychology are from white to black with ALL SHADES OF GREY in-between.



And again, I am stating my opinion as I relate to philosophy. There is no direct science within this thread.





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[Toadny]

How do you think psychoactive substances give you an insight into consciousness that isn't available without them? Provide details please.

[SpheresOfBalance]

How do you think psychoactive substances give you an insight into consciousness that isn't available without them? Provide details please.

Read this to understand:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimethyltryptamine

[Toadny]

I don't come here to be sent off to read Wikipedia articles. If I wanted to hear the crazed rantings of some drug-addled fantasist, I would speak to one of my children. Now if you have some knowledge or insight of your own to impart, let's have it. However, the fact that you are willing to rely on the wisdom of wikipedia to make your argument for you suggests that you don't possess such knowledge or insight.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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I think the details that you desire are elements no one can ultimately provide to you...That is, if you are in fact directing your question towards me.



Psychoactive substances can provide experiences.


Experience is something you have to experience.


I know that seems circular but that is just the way it is.


Even then, with the ingestion of certain psychoactive substances there is no guarantee that you will be better able to see yourself.



There is no guarantee that you will experience clearer consciousness.


I think predisposition has something to do with it too.




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[Toadny]

That's what I thought, you have nothing of interest to say on this subject. Forget I asked.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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Already done...






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[jackles]

Bill you seam to love a wined up.had to laugh though.but drugs trash the brain its got to be said.

[SpheresOfBalance]

I don't come here to be sent off to read Wikipedia articles. If I wanted to hear the crazed rantings of some drug-addled fantasist, I would speak to one of my children. Now if you have some knowledge or insight of your own to impart, let's have it. However, the fact that you are willing to rely on the wisdom of wikipedia to make your argument for you suggests that you don't possess such knowledge or insight.

Since you're too lazy:

Here's the scientific FACT:

"N,N-Dimethyltryptamine (DMT or N,N-DMT) is a psychedelic compound of the tryptamine family. Its presence is widespread throughout the plant kingdom. DMT occurs in trace amounts in mammals, including humans, where it putatively functions as a trace amine neurotransmitter/neuromodulator. It is originally derived from the essential amino acid tryptophan and ultimately produced by the enzyme INMT during normal metabolism."

"When ingested, DMT acts as a psychedelic drug. Depending on the dose and method of administration, its subjective effects can range from short-lived milder psychedelic states to powerful immersive experiences; these are often described as a total loss of connection to conventional reality with the encounter of ineffable spiritual/alien realms."

As far as I'm concerned, hallucinogens, "not opiates," allow one to analyze things from perspectives, that would not normally present themselves. This can be of extreme importance, in eliminating prejudices and other limiting factors, as to the truth of things.

For instance Cannabis is by far a better substance for use in an after hours social setting, than alcohol, which dumbs one down, making them sluggish and ultimately incoherent. There's not much use in depressing the central nervous system, if one wants to remain fully functional. Many varieties of Cannabis are more of a stimulant, which allows one to function bright eyed and unhindered. I have found, in my studies, that hallucinogens can increase creativity, as well. It's now known that Carl Sagan used Marijuana, as well as many others that have credited hallucinogens with helping them find solutions to problems, encountered in their work.

List of Notable individuals that admittedly used LSD:

"Some notable individuals have commented publicly on their experiences with LSD. Some of these comments date from the era when it was legally available in the US and Europe for non-medical uses, and others pertain to psychiatric treatment in the 1950s and 1960s. Still others describe experiences with illegal LSD, obtained for philosophic, artistic, therapeutic, spiritual, or recreational purposes.

Dock Ellis, pitching for the Pittsburgh Pirates, threw a no-hitter against the San Diego Padres on June 12, 1970 while under the influence of LSD.
Italian film director Federico Fellini experimented with LSD under the supervision of his psychoanalyst Emilio Servadio in 1964.
Richard Feynman, a notable physicist at California Institute of Technology, tried LSD during his professorship at Caltech. Feynman largely sidestepped the issue when dictating his anecdotes; he mentions it in passing in the "O Americano, Outra Vez" section.[120][121]
Jerry Garcia stated in a July 3rd, 1989 interview for Relix Magazine, in response to the question "Have your feelings about LSD changed over the years?", "They haven’t changed much. My feelings about LSD are mixed. It’s something that I both fear and that I love at the same time. I never take any psychedelic, have a psychedelic experience, without having that feeling of, “I don’t know what’s going to happen.” In that sense, it’s still fundamentally an enigma and a mystery."
Bill Gates implied in an interview with Playboy that he tried LSD during his youth.
Aldous Huxley, author of Brave New World, became a user of psychedelics after moving to Hollywood. He was at the forefront of the counterculture's experimentation with psychedelic drugs, which led to his 1954 work The Doors of Perception. Dying from cancer, he asked his wife on 22 November 1963 to inject him with 100 µg of LSD. He died later that day.
Steve Jobs, co-founder and former CEO of Apple Inc., said, "Taking LSD was a profound experience, one of the most important things in my life."
In a 2004 interview, Paul McCartney said that The Beatles' songs "Day Tripper" and "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" are about LSD, although John Lennon explicitly declared that "Lucy" was never about LSD but rather inspired by a picture drawn by his son Julian. John Lennon, George Harrison, and Ringo Starr also experimented with the drug, although McCartney cautioned that "it's easy to overestimate the influence of drugs on the Beatles' music."
Kary Mullis is reported to credit LSD with helping him develop DNA amplification technology, for which he received the Nobel Prize in Chemistry in 1993."

Cannabis User:

"Carl Sagan was a user and advocate of marijuana. Under the pseudonym "Mr. X", he contributed an essay about smoking cannabis to the 1971 book Marihuana Reconsidered. The essay explained that marijuana use had helped to inspire some of Sagan's works and enhance sensual and intellectual experiences."

[Toadny]

Since you're too lazy:

Here's the scientific FACT:

What a load of shite. There aren't any scientific FACTS, only theories, but the wikigarbage you posted doesn't put forward any theories about how psychoactive substances would give you an improved understanding of consciousness.

This:

"When ingested, DMT acts as a psychedelic drug. Depending on the dose and method of administration, its subjective effects can range from short-lived milder psychedelic states to powerful immersive experiences; these are often described as a total loss of connection to conventional reality with the encounter of ineffable spiritual/alien realms."

isn't scientific fact, it's vacuous wibble. "Ineffable spiritual/alien realms"?

Don't get me wrong, some of my best friends are psychoactive substances and I have campaigned actively for a change to their legal status, but there is an awful lot of shite talked about the philosophical insights they are supposed to provide.

[RickLewis]

Richard Feynman, a notable physicist at California Institute of Technology, tried LSD during his professorship at Caltech. Feynman largely sidestepped the issue when dictating his anecdotes; he mentions it in passing in the "O Americano, Outra Vez" section.[120][121]

My recollection is that Feynman said in his books of anecdotes that he used dope but gave it up because he was afraid of anything that might mess up his brain.

Jean-Paul Sartre did a lot of mescaline and other drugs. I think opinion is divided between those who think he took drugs as part of his investigations into phenomenology, and those who think he took drugs as an aid to his concentration when writing. Maybe both are true.

Sartre did have drug-induced hallucinations that he was being followed around Paris by lobsters. I'm not making this up.

[Bill Wiltrack]

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Rick, which drug cocktail are you currently using to obtain significant philosophical experiences?


Which drugs gave you the best experiences over your life?


Could you briefly describe one bad experience?




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Word on the street is that you have finally begun to realize my ability to write and describe my active pursuit of philosophical experiences and you would like me to write an article for the Philosophy Now Magazine ASAP.


Can you just openly confirm this for me?



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[SpheresOfBalance]

Since you're too lazy:

Here's the scientific FACT:

What a load of shite. There aren't any scientific FACTS, only theories, but the wikigarbage you posted doesn't put forward any theories about how psychoactive substances would give you an improved understanding of consciousness.

This:

"When ingested, DMT acts as a psychedelic drug. Depending on the dose and method of administration, its subjective effects can range from short-lived milder psychedelic states to powerful immersive experiences; these are often described as a total loss of connection to conventional reality with the encounter of ineffable spiritual/alien realms."

isn't scientific fact, it's vacuous wibble. "Ineffable spiritual/alien realms"?
No it's not, I saw the documentary. Actually almost all of the recent study group, that took the DMT, which is naturally occurring, in nerve tissue, so then can be said to have something to do with consciousness, though it's not fully understood at this point, said they experienced these fantastic vistas, and edition most said they left it with more of a sense of spirituality. And I know you want something definite, RIGHT NOW, but the truth is that progress in understanding the human mind and consciousness, is still in it's infancy, and might require more of an understanding of the universe, to be fully unraveled. It's so easy for us to sit here and judge with our prejudices, either for or against something man has coined as DRUGS, But the truth is that anything that naturally grows on Planet Earth is already a part of us, as all life is related. Have you heard the news of how man is finding things in the strangest of places to cure some of our toughest deceases? In animal venom, and deep in the dwindling rainforests of the world. I see that all life is related, and that the more we kill it off, due to our causing imbalance, destroying ecosystems, we ensure our doom, as we cannot live without the other part of us, (all other life) and all because we seem incapable of keeping our numbers in check, THE PROPER WAY, NOT WAR, with birth control. I know it feels good but that's no intellectual excuse!

Sorry about the sidebars, though they are an important consideration. My point is that, at least DMT is naturally occurring in us, it is a part of us, and should not be shunned prematurely, as it could provide a cure for some mental illness, down the road. Or who knows, maybe mind expansion. As that is also the nature of our evolution, up to this point, as the animal encountered various environments, that gave way to mutations, such that we are as we are today. Who knows, maybe one of our ancient ancestors came in contact with a plant containing DMT to yield the modern intelligent man of the day. Our understanding of our selves is in it's infancy, and it is stupid indeed to not consider and preserve every living organism as important to our future, instead of by the chance encounter, of the ignorant, rather I see the purposeful targeted encounter through knowing.

I believe I found the documentary online, I'll try and find it and provide a link.

I'm not sure if this is the one I originally saw, because I just watched a few minutes of it, before posting it here, but it seems to be of the same quality:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/352717

P.S. Sorry I came on so strong earlier, but It seemed that you jumped the gun, by your declaration of Wiki being unsound material, in so many words, which it's not, necessarily!

Don't get me wrong, some of my best friends are psychoactive substances and I have campaigned actively for a change to their legal status, but there is an awful lot of shite talked about the philosophical insights they are supposed to provide.