No Missing Link

[bobevenson]

Religion props up Capitalism and vice versa also. A society based on profit and gain. Another system and idea of madness.

You obviously have no understanding of religion, and even less of capitalism.

[Skip]

You obviously have no understanding of religion, and even less of capitalism.

On the contrary, Xenu is the one here, so far, who has made the clearest exposition on both those topics.

Religious institutions invariably prop up the prevailing political power structure, which, in turn, supports the state religion. They co-operate to stamp out any questioning of the rightness of the belief system they share (in this case, Almighty $God), to suppress any opposition to the ruling elite, any deviation from the economic arrangement that benefits the elite, any reform to the law-making and enforcing bodies which serve the elite. They can be seen as the two hands of control: one holds the carrot of seduction, the other holds the stick of armed force. Neither produces anything; both declare themselves above the citizenry, off whose labour they skim the cream for themselves.

One day as humans we will realise and say to ourselves collectively, "hey, we didn't need those crazy stories and beliefs, and hey, we didn't need that advertising department either, an area of which is surplus to requirements in a world without profit as it's defining motivation.

If only there were time! And if people were less credulous; not so easily persuaded to act against their own best interest.

[SpheresOfBalance]

So yes I agree , religion should be taxed to the max ,
no charitable trusts for religion if we ever want to get rid of it ,
currently most western governments fund religion ,
and then claim to be a secular democracy ,

I didn't say anything about taxation; only that science class must be kept free of religion.
But, OK, i'm not against taxing churches.

I don't think we'll ever get rid of religion, though, or some form of mumbo-jumbo. So many people need a connection to the Absolute, and there will always be somebody to conceptualize, codify and exploit that yearning. As long as we give special status to any institutionalized spirituality, we'll be giving power and money to charlatans.

Yet there is in fact a human connection to the absolute, as we are born of it. I think what you meant to say was that "so many people need to create a connection to the absolute, without evidence, as to what it really is."

[SpheresOfBalance]

Agreed the 'evolution' religion needs to be removed from public schools. But then what will the government do to destroy young peoples ability to think and turn them into good little citizens of the state. The 'evolution' religion is essentially the root of all evil in the world. Teach kids they came from crap in a pond billions of years ago and one removes all foundation for 'right' and 'wrong', 'good' and 'bad', ethics, justice, morals etc. Then kids get ak47's and murder their fellow classmates. There is no problem with that in the 'evolution' religion. Teaching truth (YEC) in schools would change the world. Murder, suicide, depression, violent crimes, would all plummet. One could predict it will never happen but that doesnt mean people should stop trying. 'Evolution'=the lie (not science).

contain then if they start exhibiting hydrophobic symptoms

Yeh that damn water!

Non-sequitur.

[SpheresOfBalance]

There is no need for religion...period.

Any specific religion, agreed! But the possibility of creation, no way! As no one can know either way. I can see the possibility of creation in any theory! The Big Bang for instance.

[Skip]

I think what you meant to say was that "so many people need to create a connection to the absolute, without evidence, as to what it really is."

No, i said what i meant to. An emotional need is separate from creativity. Most people can't make a connection to an absolute that they don't even understand, and that is why they so easily and in such large numbers fall prey to those who create and illusion and thus manipulate credulity.

[Godfree]

I think what you meant to say was that "so many people need to create a connection to the absolute, without evidence, as to what it really is."

No, i said what i meant to. An emotional need is separate from creativity. Most people can't make a connection to an absolute that they don't even understand, and that is why they so easily and in such large numbers fall prey to those who create and illusion and thus manipulate credulity.

Words can be different things to different people so I try to be as explicit and clear as possible ,
"the absolute"
sorry sounds like fudge for god or something else equally flaky ,
and if you don't define it more clearly then for the religious amongst us they will see that ,
as you saying people need to create a connection with god ,,??
you both seem like Atheists and I would be surprised if that was your intention,
I would say most people want religion to be real/true .
but don't want to go into the detail , because they have none ,
it's just a pretty dream that has been sold to the people for thousands of years ,
Horus 1000 years before jesus , same story same virgin birth resurrection etc bla bla,
and they kept trying it for a thousand years until the poor sucker jesus had his turn ,
for some reason they decided 1000 years of trying was enough , jesus is it ,
and we are stuck with him ,
will it be another 1000 before we can expose the story for the ignorance that it is ,,??

[SpheresOfBalance]

I think what you meant to say was that "so many people need to create a connection to the absolute, without evidence, as to what it really is."

No, i said what i meant to. An emotional need is separate from creativity. Most people can't make a connection to an absolute that they don't even understand, and that is why they so easily and in such large numbers fall prey to those who create and illusion and thus manipulate credulity.

Words can be different things to different people so I try to be as explicit and clear as possible ,
"the absolute"
sorry sounds like fudge for god or something else equally flaky ,
and if you don't define it more clearly then for the religious amongst us they will see that ,
as you saying people need to create a connection with god ,,??
you both seem like Atheists and I would be surprised if that was your intention,
I would say most people want religion to be real/true .
but don't want to go into the detail , because they have none ,
it's just a pretty dream that has been sold to the people for thousands of years ,
Horus 1000 years before jesus , same story same virgin birth resurrection etc bla bla,
and they kept trying it for a thousand years until the poor sucker jesus had his turn ,
for some reason they decided 1000 years of trying was enough , jesus is it ,
and we are stuck with him ,
will it be another 1000 before we can expose the story for the ignorance that it is ,,??

I agree with your concept, Godfree, as I only see "the absolute" as that of the universe, whatever that might truly entail. But most find it hard to understand such a concept, as to words and their varying meanings, and then take the time to formulate sentences that can take into account the permutations of meaning of all possible peoples understanding, which is why reference materials such as dictionaries and encyclopedias are so important.

To me, I see that, "The Absolute," refers to all that gave rise to life, without that life's interpretation, of what it is, that caused it's rise. In my case, I see that it is the entire universe, where cause and effect, eventually, after billions of years, brought together chemicals that created life. Not that this necessarily speaks of chance 'creation,' though it surely may, just as well as it doesn't necessarily indicate intelligent purposeful creation, though it surely may, as the truth is, that no one can actually 'know' what happened back then, as no one was there to witness it, or at least no human was. That any interpretation, is purely conjecture.

[Godfree]

[
Creative people create things. Ipads, Movies,Paintings, Cars,Music, Computers, food, everything. They do it all. They dream it all up and then produce.

One day as humans we will realise and say to ourselves collectively, "hey, we didn't need those crazy stories and beliefs, and hey, we didn't need that advertising department either, an area of which is surplus to requirements in a world without profit as it's defining motivation.

A pyramid system that has Religion, Banks and redneck shitkicking scheisters who like guns running the show.

Xenu out.[/quote]
Many capitalistic empires started out as creative people trying to do something groovy ,
NZ used to have banks , I joined Canterbury Trustbank ,only for them to sell out ,
to big money , so how can we stop big money buying up all the groovy ideas ,
like electric cars , solar powered cars etc ,
how can we stop big money buying and holding back the good shit ,
how can we take the power back from big money , the capitalists have far too much power ,
they call the shots in many countries , the politicians , are just a figure head ,
and it's the capitalists/big money , legal or otherwise that are in control ,
so thats my question xenu ,
HOW DO WE TAKE THE POWER BACK ,,,???

[Godfree]

To me, I see that, "The Absolute," refers to all that gave rise to life, without that life's interpretation, of what it is, that caused it's rise. In my case, I see that it is the entire universe, where cause and effect, eventually, after billions of years, brought together chemicals that created life. Not that this necessarily speaks of chance 'creation,' though it surely may, just as well as it doesn't necessarily indicate intelligent purposeful creation, though it surely may, as the truth is, that no one can actually 'know' what happened back then, as no one was there to witness it, or at least no human was. That any interpretation, is purely conjecture.[/quote]

to know what happened back then they did the experiment that reproduced life ,
in the fifties , we do know what happened back then , we know the process and the result ,
we can repeat the process , and get the same result , and isn't that what science is all about ,
a repeatable experiment that proves and re-proves an idea or theory ,
so yes we do know what happened back then,the short version,
lightening provided the spark that the nuclaic acid soup needed to power it's self up ,
the ability to store and manipulate energy is essential to life ,
we have a spark carried all the way back to the primitive forms ,
each generation is given the spark of life , it arrives ,
in a sperm ,,.

[SpheresOfBalance]

[
Creative people create things. Ipads, Movies,Paintings, Cars,Music, Computers, food, everything. They do it all. They dream it all up and then produce.

One day as humans we will realise and say to ourselves collectively, "hey, we didn't need those crazy stories and beliefs, and hey, we didn't need that advertising department either, an area of which is surplus to requirements in a world without profit as it's defining motivation.

A pyramid system that has Religion, Banks and redneck shitkicking scheisters who like guns running the show.

Xenu out.

Many capitalistic empires started out as creative people trying to do something groovy ,
NZ used to have banks , I joined Canterbury Trustbank ,only for them to sell out ,
to big money , so how can we stop big money buying up all the groovy ideas ,
like electric cars , solar powered cars etc ,
how can we stop big money buying and holding back the good shit ,
how can we take the power back from big money , the capitalists have far too much power ,
they call the shots in many countries , the politicians , are just a figure head ,
and it's the capitalists/big money , legal or otherwise that are in control ,
so thats my question xenu ,
HOW DO WE TAKE THE POWER BACK ,,,???[/quote]
AMEN, err, ahh, I mean, Hear Hear!

[bobevenson]

Many capitalistic empires started out as creative people trying to do something groovy,NZ used to have banks , I joined Canterbury Trustbank ,only for them to sell out to big money , so how can we stop big money buying up all the groovy ideas, like electric cars , solar powered cars etc , how can we stop big money buying and holding back the good shit, how can we take the power back from big money , the capitalists have far too much power, they call the shots in many countries , the politicians , are just a figure head, and it's the capitalists/big money , legal or otherwise that are in control, so thats my question xenu,
HOW DO WE TAKE THE POWER BACK ,,,???

Hopefully, lunatics like yourself will never get the chance. You don't know anything about economics, so do yourself a favor and give it up. Taking cooking classes or something.

[SpheresOfBalance]

Many capitalistic empires started out as creative people trying to do something groovy,NZ used to have banks , I joined Canterbury Trustbank ,only for them to sell out to big money , so how can we stop big money buying up all the groovy ideas, like electric cars , solar powered cars etc , how can we stop big money buying and holding back the good shit, how can we take the power back from big money , the capitalists have far too much power, they call the shots in many countries , the politicians , are just a figure head, and it's the capitalists/big money , legal or otherwise that are in control, so thats my question xenu,
HOW DO WE TAKE THE POWER BACK ,,,???

AMEN, err, ahh, I mean, Hear Hear!

Hopefully, lunatics like yourself will never get the chance. You don't know anything about economics, so do yourself a favor and give it up. Taking cooking classes or something.

No Bob, it was Godfree that said that, not me. Here I'll fix it for you. Some people are just plain ----.

[Hjarloprillar]

"As the truth is, that no one can actually 'know' what happened back then, as no one was there to witness it, or at least no human was. That any interpretation, is purely conjecture"
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I think WE are the missing link. Between animal reaction and reason.
i stood in awe at local video shop today watching extreme reality [my 50 inch plasma is foe dvd's only . arial is not connected]
People sucking up maggot pies. vomiting on screen .

as a smart man said. just when you think you have hit rock bottom, someone throws you a shovel.

maybe we will evolve into something Less stupid.
one can only hope

[Skip]

Words can be different things to different people so I try to be as explicit and clear as possible ,
"the absolute"
sorry sounds like fudge for god or something else equally flaky ,
and if you don't define it more clearly then for the religious amongst us they will see that ,
as you saying people need to create a connection with god ,,??

There is no absolute: it's just an idea. Therefore, of course it has different meanings to various people who use it. I'm using it as nothing more than the nebulous idea, and so i can't define for anybody. But a priest does, and people believe him, even though neither he nor they can make up a coherent, self-consistent definition. They can only give it a name, such as God, and pretend that explains it - which if course it doesn't.

I don't much care what the religious say, as it's usually gobbledegook. But many people do seem to have such a need, and will go along with all the flavours, no matter how unsavoury, of gobbledegook for the illusion of an absolute.

... the poor sucker jesus had his turn ,
for some reason they decided 1000 years of trying was enough , jesus is it ,
and we are stuck with him

Only so long as the European heritage dominates the world. Even now, the majority of the world's population isn't christian, and they're coming up in power and wealth.

will it be another 1000 before we can expose the story for the ignorance that it is ,,??

The story is almost irrelevant. There have been many stories, all incredible and all fervently believed. The central factor in all religions is the promise of eternity in some post-mortal realm, and - more important still - superiority over one's rivals; a sacred excuse to take other people's land, wealth and lives.