Wildlife (Nature) Programs as Ideology

[artisticsolution]

A:I do think that story made me think the 'Aesthetic' person was utterly rude and arrogant in their behaviour towards others who bored them.

AS: Yes, we agree that it is 'rude'. As far as arrogant, I think there is no way to prove your belief as there is no way to know for sure what goes on in the mind of another in order to know if what I say is true. And since, I (and k) am describing the "aesthetic" in this instance as being the one having these "episodes" and you are not (as you have not admitted to such), I would be more likely to know what goes on in my own mind than you. So, if you really want to get down to it....it is you who are being arrogant thinking you know what goes on in my mind and/or other's minds and not necessarily the other way around. By the way, I think it is important to mention that this phenomenon is not limited to people. It can happen when there is no one around too.

A:I think ADD is an example of a society and culture that medicalizes problems due to a need for quick-fixes and a shifting of responsibility rather than dealing with the social, family and educational systems that cause such behaviour. That and it makes a load of work for the pyscho-babblers and medical insurance companies.

AS: You may be right as I was just attaching a label without really knowing anything about ADD. The truth is I have noticed this 'thing' in others as well as myself and was glad to know I was not alone...I would not say I know what goes on in their mind...only in mine and only that it was similar to K's aesthetic.

I do think it rude when I lose focus...but that I can't always help it. Do you think I don't hate the behavior....or do you think it would help if I punish myself a little more? I just have lived with it so long and I try to compensate by being kind in other ways. So rude, yes....arrogant, not so much. When I am arrogant I know exactly what a person is saying as I have a very strong opinion and intend to share it with or without being asked....sound familiar?

A:I can only judge by what they write and as such this is my judgement upon their words.

AS: I can understand this...I do the same. But could there be an instance that perhaps you do not have the experience to be an authority on the thoughts of others?

[reasonvemotion]

What are those idiot parents of that, I presume Downs, boy thinking!? In fact what idiot parents of any child would allow this risk? I can only presume they're same idiot owners of the dog.

I agree. The dog is displaying dominant behavior, as it senses the child is defenseless. Perfect scenario for the dog to attack. If it did, there would be no blame on the animal as it is following its instincts. The parents are at fault and their abilities as parents and dog owners is highly questionable. Perhaps they don't care. It seems that way.

[Arising_uk]

Thank you.

Although I doubt its not care, just ignorance.

[Arising_uk]

Hi As,
Hope all is well with you and the work is still coming in.

Yes, we agree that it is 'rude'. As far as arrogant, I think there is no way to prove your belief as there is no way to know for sure what goes on in the mind of another in order to know if what I say is true. ...

But my memory has the passage in question as saying this act was consciously chosen?

And since, I (and k) am describing the "aesthetic" in this instance as being the one having these "episodes" and you are not (as you have not admitted to such), I would be more likely to know what goes on in my own mind than you. So, if you really want to get down to it....it is you who are being arrogant thinking you know what goes on in my mind and/or other's minds and not necessarily the other way around. By the way, I think it is important to mention that this phenomenon is not limited to people. It can happen when there is no one around too.

I think you are projecting upon this passage as he said it was consciously chosen. If you are saying that the 'aesthetically' minded have 'episodes' where the event is not under their control they my objection would not hold.

You may be right as I was just attaching a label without really knowing anything about ADD. The truth is I have noticed this 'thing' in others as well as myself and was glad to know I was not alone...I would not say I know what goes on in their mind...only in mine and only that it was similar to K's aesthetic.

Similar but apparently not the same.

I do think it rude when I lose focus...but that I can't always help it. Do you think I don't hate the behavior....or do you think it would help if I punish myself a little more? I just have lived with it so long and I try to compensate by being kind in other ways. So rude, yes....arrogant, not so much. When I am arrogant I know exactly what a person is saying as I have a very strong opinion and intend to share it with or without being asked....sound familiar?

Whats worong with saying, "Sorry, my mind is elsewhere at present. Would you mind if we continue this another time?"

I can understand this...I do the same. But could there be an instance that perhaps you do not have the experience to be an authority on the thoughts of others?

Yup, and its when they don't write about them. Although I'm not setting myself up as an authority here, just stating my opinion of what i think about what they've said.

[artisticsolution]

A:Hope all is well with you and the work is still coming in.

AS: Work was very very slow...so I figured instead of getting a real job that paid minimum wage (which is all I am qualified to do) I figured I would make my own minimum wage job by selling my art dirt cheap on ebay. I figured if I could make ACEO's (art cards editions and originals) in about 15 mins and the sell them for 4.99 that would add up to minimum wage taking into account I may not sell them all. So that was my plan....and it just so happens that it is impossible (at least for me) to produce that much art...in "production line' mode so to speak...in order to make a living wage. I was sending out work I hated and not feeling good about it. So then I changed my strategy and decided to take my time and do art I love and charge a little more. They don't sell as quickly but I feel better about what I am selling. Sadly it doesn't pay my bills...so then....I advertised in a local magazine and only got one call...luckily I sold the one call for a teeny little job which luckily turned into tons of work. So now I have a few jobs lined up which will allow me a little extra money in order to go with my mom to UCLA for her surgery (all this because I could not/would not pay attention in school). Anyway...more information than you needed to know...I know.... lol

A:But my memory has the passage in question as saying this act was consciously chosen?

AS: Yes, but it begins that way ( consciously) sometimes. It puts me in the mind of a monty python film I saw once....a young prince was talking to his father and kept being swept away in his head by music...and his father would see it happening and say, "Stop that! Stop that! Not while I'm 'ere!" LOL I could soooo relate.

A:I think you are projecting upon this passage as he said it was consciously chosen.

AS:I might be...but then when he said other things....things that seemed cold...like I suppose some would think of the "shallow" aesthetic...but that....had a certain "feel" when I was reading...that was so not shallow. It's hard to describe...I would have to read the book again in order to pin point it. I know that in most everything I have read about k, they all describe a hierarchy , if you will, of levels of ethical enlightenment....starting with the aesthetic and then rising up to the ethical and then if you're lucky...you can achieve the religious ...which I guess is supposed to be 'best'. But in my mind...and just from the way K worded things...I think they have him wrong on that. I don't believe he was making any type of judgment that way...other than to say that is how our society is set up to view things. That is the shallow way they judge who is good and who is evil...so to speak. In my way of thinking, if he just set out to describe how one should live...then why on earth waste his breath reiterating what societal norms are or were? Why would he write book after book saying the same thing the church did/does?

I believe he set out to write in a way that would betray the religious idealist's mentality in order to show how it is pretty much close to that of the aesthetic, the only difference is that society accepts the lies of the religious simple because they have the word of God (an unprovable word at that thus no real authority which to me boils down to aesthetic authority....same as the aesthetic who gets swept away by music...since neither the aesthetic nor the religious can prove any real empirical evidence to support their claim of knowing what constitutes an authentic life...or a moral/ethical life... or whatever society believes is a 'good' life).

In other words, the way he writes, does not promote one individual over another...only to say that the true religious person could not be understood by anyone...because there is a dynamic there which in order to be a true religious person...faith is a huge part of that and that anyone who says they had faith is surely a liar..... hmmm...I am trying to think of a way to explain myself so please bare with me....let me put it this way...in the bible it says:

"Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."

So, any religious person who says to you, "there is no doubt there is a God. I know it for sure." He is a liar...he does not believe in what he says....and all we have to do to prove it is to say move that mountain. And if he can't...well then he does not have faith. And if he does move a mountain...then he has moved it only in his mind.... as it is impossible to command a mountain to move...and and thus...the person of faith is simply insane and truly believes a mountain has moved but that in his insanity he is at least not a liar and is authentic to a degree.

Sort of like the story K wrote about where the man had so much faith that he actually believe he was eating the finest meal when his wife served him the only thing they could afford...slop.

I believe k is saying that there is not a truly religious person alive....I mean religious in the sense that he understands his own mind and is in keeping with what I mention above about the hierarchy of the most ethical way to live. The religious person, if truth be told, is no better than the aesthetic in terms of ethics. They both lie...and there is a way to prove it.

Anyway, I may be wrong....but too many coincidences in the way he writes and the language he uses that make me think the way I do.

A:Whats worong with saying, "Sorry, my mind is elsewhere at present. Would you mind if we continue this another time?"

AS: I do that...but where I come from...it is still rude...especially when talking to a woman. However, it's not that I don't want to hear their story. I do....and not at a later date either, because many are very great stories...but then the damn music starts...and you wake up to discover they have said something really cool and you only got the end...

"and so the new car will be delivered to your door at 6 with the tickets inside...."

"Huh? Wha...where....new car? tickets?!"