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The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 10:21 am
by RickLewis
Hi. This is specifically a question for Americans or anyone knowledgeable about the US Constitution or - ideally - somebody who is a member of both of those sets. I'm asking out of curiousity to help me understand current news and commentary.
There are three linked parts to my question. In the event that the bigwigs of the US Republican Party decide that enough is enough:
(a) do they have a viable mechanism for removing or suspending President Trump from office?
(b) if "yes", then what is that mechanism?
(c) Is it then the case that J.D. Vance assumes the powers of President, or are there oother possibilities?
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 10:28 am
by Wizard22
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 10:21 am
Hi. This is specifically a question for Americans or anyone knowledgeable about the US Constitution or - ideally - somebody who is a member of both of those sets. I'm asking out of curiousity to help me understand current news and commentary.
There are three linked parts to my question. In the event that the bigwigs of the US Republican Party decide that enough is enough:
(a) do they have a viable mechanism for removing or suspending President Trump from office?
(b) if "yes", then what is that mechanism?
When Democrats sweep the US Congressional Midterm Elections this year in November, they will gain Impeachment power over President Trump, and possibly Removal depending on how large their success is.
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 10:21 am(c) Is it then the case that J.D. Vance assumes the powers of President, or are there oother possibilities?
The Republicans will not elect to Remove President Trump, although there could be defectors who vote to Impeach him. But you have to keep-in-mind that US Democrats and Republicans will not betray their own parties, for the most part. It depends on how unpopular President Trump becomes among Conservative, Traditionalists, Republicans (Rightwingers in general) from here to November.
Much of this depends on how high gas prices go in the US, how many troops die to Iran, and how his war with Israel, against Iran, continue to go or possibly end.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 11:16 am
by accelafine
Hasn't he been impeached a few times? I always thought 'impeached' meant booted out of office. Evidently it does not
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 11:33 am
by Wizard22
Yes, he has been impeached, twice I believe... Impeach does not mean 'Remove', but is the beginning of the removal process. The House of Representatives vote to impeach; the Senate then votes to Remove. The Senate has never before voted to remove a sitting US President. The President would have to be deeply egregious to warrant a full Removal... like ordering the US military to fire upon organized protests, would do it.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 11:36 am
by RickLewis
Thanks Wizard. My question was more about the constitutional mechanisms involved. I read a column theorising that Vance disappeared from sight right after the attack on Iran because he is ideologically a non-interventionist, and is now being proposed to head up negotiations for that exact same reason, because the Republican heirarchy are getting twitchy about whether Trump has any plan for what to do next. Therefore the obvious question is - if the Republican leaders decide that Trump has lost the plot, then do they have a way to remove him?
In the UK Conservative Party, famously, the procedure was that half a dozen old dudes from the 1922 Committee would tap softly on the party leader's door, cough politely and then tell him in sugared tones that - very sadly - the feeling in the Party was now that it would be best if he stood down. And the amazing thing is that he would then stand down, because he would realise that he had no choice. Can't see that approach working with Trump somehow, but I was wondering if there is an American equivalent.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 11:46 am
by Wizard22
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 11:36 amThanks Wizard. My question was more about the constitutional mechanisms involved. I read a column theorising that Vance disappeared from sight right after the attack on Iran because he is ideologically a non-interventionist, and is now being proposed to head up negotiations for that exact same reason, because the Republican heirarchy are getting twitchy about whether Trump has any plan for what to do next. Therefore the obvious question is - if the Republican leaders decide that Trump has lost the plot, then do they have a way to remove him?
In the UK Conservative Party, famously, the procedure was that half a dozen old dudes from the 1922 Committee would tap softly on the party leader's door, cough politely and then tell him in sugared tones that - very sadly - the feeling in the Party was now that it would be best if he stood down. And the amazing thing is that he would then stand down, because he would realise that he had no choice. Can't see that approach working with Trump somehow, but I was wondering if there is an American equivalent.
It really depends on how badly the Republican Party loses Congressional seats this November. If they lose a lot, then Trump could potentially face a removal, depending on his political opposition.
I predict he'll be impeached again, but not Removed. Both sides of Congress approve the current war, because of how AIPAC funds both sides of Congress. It's a good cop, bad cop routine.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 12:29 pm
by accelafine
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 11:36 am
Thanks Wizard. My question was more about the constitutional mechanisms involved. I read a column theorising that Vance disappeared from sight right after the attack on Iran because he is ideologically a non-interventionist, and is now being proposed to head up negotiations for that exact same reason, because the Republican heirarchy are getting twitchy about whether Trump has any plan for what to do next. Therefore the obvious question is - if the Republican leaders decide that Trump has lost the plot, then do they have a way to remove him?
In the UK Conservative Party, famously, the procedure was that half a dozen old dudes from the 1922 Committee would tap softly on the party leader's door, cough politely and then tell him in sugared tones that - very sadly - the feeling in the Party was now that it would be best if he stood down. And the amazing thing is that he would then stand down, because he would realise that he had no choice. Can't see that approach working with Trump somehow, but I was wondering if there is an American equivalent.
It doesn't come more English than that
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 12:57 pm
by phyllo
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 10:21 am
Hi. This is specifically a question for Americans or anyone knowledgeable about the US Constitution or - ideally - somebody who is a member of both of those sets. I'm asking out of curiousity to help me understand current news and commentary.
There are three linked parts to my question. In the event that the bigwigs of the US Republican Party decide that enough is enough:
(a) do they have a viable mechanism for removing or suspending President Trump from office?
(b) if "yes", then what is that mechanism?
(c) Is it then the case that J.D. Vance assumes the powers of President, or are there oother possibilities?
That's the 25th amendment of the constitution
Twenty-Fifth Amendment
Section 1
In case of the removal of the President from office or of his death or resignation, the Vice President shall become President.
Section 2
Whenever there is a vacancy in the office of the Vice President, the President shall nominate a Vice President who shall take office upon confirmation by a majority vote of both Houses of Congress.
Section 3
Whenever the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that he is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, and until he transmits to them a written declaration to the contrary, such powers and duties shall be discharged by the Vice President as Acting President.
Section 4
Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall immediately assume the powers and duties of the office as Acting President.
Thereafter, when the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that no inability exists, he shall resume the powers and duties of his office unless the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive department or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit within four days to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office. Thereupon Congress shall decide the issue, assembling within forty-eight hours for that purpose if not in session. If the Congress, within twenty-one days after receipt of the latter written declaration, or, if Congress is not in session, within twenty-one days after Congress is required to assemble, determines by two-thirds vote of both Houses that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall continue to discharge the same as Acting President; otherwise, the President shall resume the powers and duties of his office.
https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 1:15 pm
by RickLewis
Thanks- that is very helpful. So in brief, the President's powers can be temporarily removed at any time by a written declaration from thnVice President and a majority of the principal officers of the executive department (who they?). But if the President asks for his powers back, he gets them back UNLESS a 2/3 majority of each House of Congress votes to stop him.
That makes sense. The constitutional bar for removing a sitting president should of course be set pretty high - otherwise people would be trying that all the time.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 1:42 pm
by phyllo
The "principal officers of the executive department[s]" are the 15 Cabinet members enumerated in the United States Code at 5 U.S.C. § 101:[11][12]
Secretary of State
Secretary of the Treasury
Secretary of Defense
Attorney General
Secretary of the Interior
Secretary of Agriculture
Secretary of Commerce
Secretary of Labor
Secretary of Health and Human Services
Secretary of Housing and Urban Development
Secretary of Transportation
Secretary of Energy
Secretary of Education
Secretary of Veterans Affairs
Secretary of Homeland Security
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fi ... nstitution
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 2:57 pm
by Immanuel Can
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 1:15 pm
Thanks- that is very helpful. So in brief, the President's powers can be temporarily removed at any time by a written declaration from thnVice President and a majority of the principal officers of the executive department (who they?). But if the President asks for his powers back, he gets them back UNLESS a 2/3 majority of each House of Congress votes to stop him.
That makes sense. The constitutional bar for removing a sitting president should of course be set pretty high - otherwise people would be trying that all the time.
Americans think differently about this than folks in the UK, Rick.
Englishmen are notoriously skeptical of their politicians. It's almost like no politician is really good...it's unEnglish to celebrate a public official TOO effusively, it seems. One always has to retain a modicum of dignified distance from one's affections, wot?
By contrast, as Toqueville noted, Americans are broadly effusive. They are "a nation of joiners," meaning they
join any sort of cause they decide upon with wild abandon, and its considered a kind of treachery, highly suspect, to be less than totally sold out to the cause once you have joined it. Since their process is essentially two-party system, one has to be an enthusiastic Republican or a sold-out Democrat; one cannot be half-committed to either side. And they even think of people from other countries as beholden to pick one of those two sides whenever asked to declare themselves. They just don't get British reserve.
So in the UK, you tend to think of them as brash, annoying and over-the-top. And they tend to find Brits cynical, uncommitted and disapproving. I don't think either impression is actually fair, but it's how they appear to each other.
The idea of unseating a President is far from their inclinations -- particularly if he has achieved power for your party. It would be done in cases like NIxon, where some extreme turpitude is uncovered, but that was also long ago. I think it will never be done now. Donald Trump's various character flaws, such as they may be, will be overlooked, just as Bill Clinton's philandering and Joe Biden's senility went unremarked by the Democrats (until they had a new candidate, at which point they finally 'noticed.') Expect the party to stay behind their candidate, whomever he is, if they can.
It's all about party in America. They're kind of "my guy, right or wrong" about their presidential candidates. It's not like the UK, where that tendency to remain cynically detached somewhat from even the best candidates makes room for the sort of English removal process you're talking about. It's not just way too disloyal, as they will see it, but also way too subtle to appeal. Their process would be spectacular and explosive, if it ever happened at all. Just don't expect it.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 3:51 pm
by FlashDangerpants
RickLewis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 1:15 pm
But if the President asks for his powers back, he gets them back UNLESS a 2/3 majority of each House of Congress votes to stop him.
If the vote is held.
Currently the United States is engaged in an undeclared war in West Asia because declaring an actual war would require votes in those same houses which would likely go the wrong way.
Meanwhile, since the US Attorney for New Jersey quit to avoid being forced into an unethical prosecution there was no properly appointed replacement
until this week (and this is just a properly appointed temp). That is because the office holder that was desired by the administration was an unqualified hack with pending disbarment investigations who couldn't possibly get senate confirmation, and thus no vote was held. That's always how they do these things.
It is quite inconceivable that the persons who would arrange the removal of the president on grounds of loss-of-marbles wouldn't know how to game that system such that his statement of intent to return to office would count for nothing. You don't have to deny that which you can kick into the long grass until the problem goes away. They would only have to arrange a press conference in which a doctor explains which drug is passing through that cannula bruise that has been on Trump's hand for the last year and there would be no vote on a restoration at all.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 4:07 pm
by phyllo
It's unlikely that the cabinet would find Trump "unable" no matter what he does.
You've seen their behaviour.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 4:17 pm
by FlashDangerpants
phyllo wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2026 4:07 pm
It's unlikely that the cabinet would find Trump "unable" no matter what he does.
You've seen their behaviour.
I think you are right. I said at the very start of the term when they appointed the WWE lady to Sec of Education and were still trying to get that pedo into the Attorney Gerneral's office that Trump seemed to be trying to ensure that over half the cabinet were personally dependent upon him so that they could never pull a 25th on him.
Re: The Hour of Vance
Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2026 4:44 pm
by Gary Childress
Trump is exactly the worst kind of person that should NOT be in a political office in a democratic society (nor any society for that matter). From the sounds of it, some of his loyalists will probably follow him to their own graves. What a waste. Why do some people get that enamored with an individual who is that devoid of ideas or ideals? It's like the Germans who followed Hitler down the tubes. They effectively died in the name of preserving Nazism.
