Philosophy Now Forum

According to Husserlian phenomenology, 'consciousness' is always 'consciousness of...'

I experience the sight of what is called green grass, trees, shrubs, an asphalt road. They are phenomena.

But is consciousness itself a phenomenon? Is it something we experience? In some sense, is it like asking whether someone sees seeing? Can it be said that we see seeing? Do we experience experiencing? Are these valid statements or some kind of grammatical or syntactical confusion?

It seems that we humans operate to whatever extent according to language. Perhaps we are something like AI Large Language Models in that sense. But behind all my statements are experiences of phenomena. Do LLMs have any experience in the same sense that I do? Or are they empty gibberish if there is no human being to interpret or 'experience' their output?

'Trans' rights are men's rights. 'Transwimin' are conmen.

“Awareness is primordial; it is the original state, beginningless, endless, uncaused, unsupported, without parts, without change. Consciousness is on contact, a reflection against a surface, a state of duality. There can be no consciousness without awareness, but there can be awareness without consciousness, as in deep sleep. Awareness is absolute, consciousness is relative to its content; consciousness is always of something. Consciousness is partial and changeful, awareness is total, changeless, calm and silent. And it is the common matrix of every experience.”

- Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj

“The medium is the message.”
Marshall McLuhan

Comment: Consciousness is experienced by awareness as the mind’s medium for cognizing order and chaos.
For example, awareness perceives contradictions through the conscious-state-of-confusion filter.

AI is a medium, and it is the message.

Do you have anything relevant to my questions to add, especially any of your own original thoughts?

accelafine wrote: ↑Thu Jun 19, 2025 12:11 am 'Trans' rights are men's rights. 'Transwimin' are conmen.

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Gary Childress wrote: ↑Thu Jun 19, 2025 6:06 pm Do you have anything relevant to my questions to add, especially any of your own original thoughts?

Gary wrote: Do we experience …

Walker wrote: Consciousness is experienced ...

Here's another original, relevant thought, to follow that original, relevant thought: Rather than emphasizing your lack of comprehension via example, do you have a meaningful question, because that one whiffed. If you think you do, then rather than waste my time again, think it over first before blurting out another brain fart. Begin by reviewing the answers you've already received, because you display no evidence of cognition, let alone decency for the honest attention devoted to your enquiry, by me. And, you might not want to hold your breath waiting for the next response.

My original questions ask whether there is such a thing as "consciousness" as a separate real entity in reality. A reductive materialist believes that "consciousness" is an illusion or belief that is based on nothing physically observable; therefore, it is not itself an entity because it cannot be observed or measured, at least not a separate physical entity. Some might believe in epiphenomenalism when it comes to consciousness or they might believe that there is no such thing as consciousness at all.

So essentially, it boils down to the question, is "consciousness" something only humans have or is there no such thing as consciousness at all? Another question that concerns me is, does an LLM have a "conscious" mind just like us or does it not?

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:39 pm According to Husserlian phenomenology, 'consciousness' is always 'consciousness of...'

I experience the sight of what is called green grass, trees, shrubs, an asphalt road. They are phenomena.

But is consciousness itself a phenomenon? Is it something we experience? In some sense, is it like asking whether someone sees seeing? Can it be said that we see seeing? Do we experience experiencing? Are these valid statements or some kind of grammatical or syntactical confusion?

It seems that we humans operate to whatever extent according to language. Perhaps we are something like AI Large Language Models in that sense. But behind all my statements are experiences of phenomena. Do LLMs have any experience in the same sense that I do? Or are they empty gibberish if there is no human being to interpret or 'experience' their output?

Consciousness is life, life is consciousness. It is that which experiences, and is the meaning and measure of all things. In a somewhat flawed manner. The secret to existence/being is imperfection; change in motion is its process, consciousness follows the lead of change, linked by its nature to the greater reality of the changing cosmos. Imperfection allows for the adaptation of the organism and its consciousness to a changing world while the world adapts to a changing cosmos. We experience consciousness as what we are; experience is the intake of nourishment for a changing consciousness. A cosmology encased within our box-like skulls. The entire community of the body is consciousness; the body is the mind's first idea and its interface to an unknown world that is read through our bodies as apparent reality. If I were a scientist, I would look for a descriptive narrative of the workings of consciousness in the wonders of the cosmos; here in this bubbling caldron of creation is the answer to the nature of consciousness.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jun 20, 2025 4:52 pm My original questions ask whether there is such a thing as "consciousness" as a separate real entity in reality. A reductive materialist believes that "consciousness" is an illusion or belief that is based on nothing physically observable; therefore, it is not itself an entity because it cannot be observed or measured, at least not a separate physical entity. Some might believe in epiphenomenalism when it comes to consciousness or they might believe that there is no such thing as consciousness at all.

So essentially, it boils down to the question, is "consciousness" something only humans have or is there no such thing as consciousness at all? Another question that concerns me is, does an LLM have a "conscious" mind just like us or does it not?

This conscious materialist consciousness doesn't. And even some theoretical reductionist should not believe that "consciousness" is an illusion or belief that is based on nothing physically observable. The sixth state of matter is no illusion and is as real as quarks. And no, it obviously doesn't. Common sense always applies. As my Dad used to say, 'Get a bloody grip Martin!'.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:39 pm According to Husserlian phenomenology, 'consciousness' is always 'consciousness of...'

I experience the sight of what is called green grass, trees, shrubs, an asphalt road. They are phenomena.

But is consciousness itself a phenomenon? Is it something we experience? In some sense, is it like asking whether someone sees seeing? Can it be said that we see seeing? Do we experience experiencing? Are these valid statements or some kind of grammatical or syntactical confusion?

It seems that we humans operate to whatever extent according to language. Perhaps we are something like AI Large Language Models in that sense. But behind all my statements are experiences of phenomena. Do LLMs have any experience in the same sense that I do? Or are they empty gibberish if there is no human being to interpret or 'experience' their output?

Consciousness is the mind's first idea of the body, through which it senses the world, and through its reactionary nature to its altered biology, it is felt throughout the entire body; thus, the thought of body consciousness. Consciousness is awareness of the body as an interpreter of an apparent reality as a biological readout. The mind tends to attribute its meanings to a source outside itself and projects meanings onto a meaningless world. If you experience your body, you experience your consciousness; consciousness is to feel alive, be it pain, pleasure, or something in between. Its complexity, of course, is unfathomable.

Even consciousness has no way of knowing what consciousness is, or is not.

Imagination however can imagine it’s imagining. Nothing knows what anything is.

Start with the not/ knowing. Do that first.

All that can be explained is that nothing can be explained.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:39 pm According to Husserlian phenomenology, 'consciousness' is always 'consciousness of...'

I experience the sight of what is called green grass, trees, shrubs, an asphalt road. They are phenomena.

But is consciousness itself a phenomenon? Is it something we experience? In some sense, is it like asking whether someone sees seeing? Can it be said that we see seeing? Do we experience experiencing? Are these valid statements or some kind of grammatical or syntactical confusion?

Work out and discover what the 'we' word is referring to, exactly, then 'you' will be much better qualified to answer these, and other, questions, properly, Correctly, and fully.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:39 pm It seems that we humans operate to whatever extent according to language. Perhaps we are something like AI Large Language Models in that sense. But behind all my statements are experiences of phenomena. Do LLMs have any experience in the same sense that I do? Or are they empty gibberish if there is no human being to interpret or 'experience' their output?

remember that dream?

unconscious experiences consciously remembered are no less memories than that which occurred while awake yesterday...

-Imp

Impenitent wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 7:16 pm remember that dream?

unconscious experiences consciously remembered are no less memories than that which occurred while awake yesterday...

-Imp

Very good.

Good, good.