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Isn't Christianity about Repentance, Atonement, and learning from your Sins???Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 12:55 pm Maybe there is a God. And maybe God is the God of the Bible. If so, then I'm pretty well screwed. There's just no way I'll ever be a reverent follower of God or Christ or anyone. It's just not in my capacity. I tried it and it just doesn't come naturally to me. I'm a fish out of water in this world.
I doubt there's much point in me "repenting". I haven't the slightest idea how to "repent" and I'll only do the same sins again and again so it seems kind of pointless. Guess I'll be going to hell.Wizard22 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:05 pmIsn't Christianity about Repentance, Atonement, and learning from your Sins???Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 12:55 pm Maybe there is a God. And maybe God is the God of the Bible. If so, then I'm pretty well screwed. There's just no way I'll ever be a reverent follower of God or Christ or anyone. It's just not in my capacity. I tried it and it just doesn't come naturally to me. I'm a fish out of water in this world.
Do you believe God would punish you for your Ignorance? I always presumed that He wanted humanity to learn and become wiser...yes?
You need to turn that frown, upside-down Gary. I know it's hard, and not easy to do. But you've got to uplift yourself out of whatever Depression and Despair has eaten the majority of your life. While alive, there's always at least a little bit of time left, to right the ship. Spend whatever's left on something Meaningful.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:17 pmI doubt there's much point in me "repenting". I haven't the slightest idea how to "repent" and I'll only do the same sins again and again so it seems kind of pointless. Guess I'll be going to hell.
I appreciate the sentiment, however, there's nothing left of my life to be "meaningful". I'm too far gone. Fuck it. Really, all that comes to my mind right now is giving God the middle finger. For some reason, it feels better than repenting.Wizard22 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:20 pmYou need to turn that frown, upside-down Gary. I know it's hard, and not easy to do. But you've got to uplift yourself out of whatever Depression and Despair has eaten the majority of your life. While alive, there's always at least a little bit of time left, to right the ship. Spend whatever's left on something Meaningful.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:17 pmI doubt there's much point in me "repenting". I haven't the slightest idea how to "repent" and I'll only do the same sins again and again so it seems kind of pointless. Guess I'll be going to hell.
What is the one thing we all and every other living life forms have in common?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 12:55 pm Maybe there is a God. And maybe God is the God of the Bible. If so, then I'm pretty well screwed. There's just no way I'll ever be a reverent follower of God or Christ or anyone. It's just not in my capacity. I tried it and it just doesn't come naturally to me. I'm a fish out of water in this world.
“Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, nothing is going to get better. It’s not.” - Dr SeussGary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:41 pm I appreciate the sentiment, however, there's nothing left of my life to be "meaningful". I'm too far gone. Fuck it. Really, all that comes to my mind right now is giving God the middle finger. For some reason, it feels better than repenting.
Do you consider yourself to be a good person, Gary?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:17 pm
I doubt there's much point in me "repenting". I haven't the slightest idea how to "repent" and I'll only do the same sins again and again so it seems kind of pointless. Guess I'll be going to hell.
The Camino de Santiago -- the most famous of all European medieval pilgrimages -- ends at the Santiago de Compostela. The pilgrimage commemorates St. James, the apostle who preached in Spain. When the Christians were forced back into the Northwest corner of Spain by the Muslem hordes, the Muslem armies carried with them the arm of Mohammed, a magical charm leading to victory after victory. Fortunately (or, perhaps, slyly) the Christian generals discovered the bones of St. James, which counteracted the magical arm and allowed the Christian forces to repel the invaders. Hence the pilgrimage.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 12:55 pm Maybe there is a God. And maybe God is the God of the Bible. If so, then I'm pretty well screwed. There's just no way I'll ever be a reverent follower of God or Christ or anyone. It's just not in my capacity. I tried it and it just doesn't come naturally to me. I'm a fish out of water in this world.
Not really. I don't do much of anything particularly wonderful. Mostly, I'm just dead weight. My highest achievement is taking up space and turning resources into waste products. But maybe I'm about on par with most, I don't know.Fairy wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 7:10 pmDo you consider yourself to be a good person, Gary?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 1:17 pm
I doubt there's much point in me "repenting". I haven't the slightest idea how to "repent" and I'll only do the same sins again and again so it seems kind of pointless. Guess I'll be going to hell.
The problem is not the God of the Bible, but the Church. These people repurpose the God of the Bible into a tool that the clergy benefits from by exploiting the believers. Christianity is fundamentally a clerical religion, shaped to the benefit of the clergy. All other religions are actually fine.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 12:55 pm Maybe there is a God. And maybe God is the God of the Bible. If so, then I'm pretty well screwed.
I mean, I'll never "submit" to God. I'm too stubborn and pig headed. So I'm probably screwed by just about every religion on Earth, except maybe the Buddhists. Maybe I should become one of those.godelian wrote: ↑Sat Jan 04, 2025 1:03 amThe problem is not the God of the Bible, but the Church. These people repurpose the God of the Bible into a tool that the clergy benefits from by exploiting the believers. Christianity is fundamentally a clerical religion, shaped to the benefit of the clergy. All other religions are actually fine.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2025 12:55 pm Maybe there is a God. And maybe God is the God of the Bible. If so, then I'm pretty well screwed.
There are moral rules. You undoubtedly already submit to them. I don't think that you go around, for example, randomly killing people.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sat Jan 04, 2025 1:15 am I mean, I'll never "submit" to God. I'm too stubborn and pig headed.
The above is not true in accordance to the true doctrines of Islam which does not claim moral rules are inherent within humans.godelian wrote: ↑Sat Jan 04, 2025 1:55 amThere are moral rules. You undoubtedly already submit to them. I don't think that you go around, for example, randomly killing people.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sat Jan 04, 2025 1:15 am I mean, I'll never "submit" to God. I'm too stubborn and pig headed.
According to Islamic doctrine, these rules are essentially built into your biological firmware. So, in some way, they are simply part of your fundamental nature.
The supposedly overall 'moral' rules of Islam are more evil than being morally good to humanity.The statement you provided presents an interesting perspective on morality within Islam. Let's examine the concepts more closely to clarify their accuracy and implications.
1. Moral Rules in Islam
In Islamic doctrine, moral rules are indeed derived from foundational texts, primarily the Quran and Hadith (the sayings and actions of the Prophet Muhammad). These texts provide guidance on various aspects of moral conduct, law, and ethics for Muslims. Here are some key points:
Divine Revelation: Muslims believe that the Quran is the literal word of God (Allah), revealed to Muhammad. It contains ethical directives and laws that guide personal and social conduct. The Hadith complements the Quran by providing context and examples of how these principles are enacted.
Guidance for Believers: The Quran and Hadith serve as primary sources of moral guidance. They outline behaviors that are encouraged, discouraged, and prohibited, covering a wide range of issues including honesty, charity, justice, and familial obligations.
2. Biological Firmware Perspective
The statement that moral rules are "built into your biological firmware" suggests that these moral principles are inherent to human nature. This implies a form of moral naturalism or moral innateness, which would argue that basic ethical instincts or understandings are part of human biology.
Islamic View on Fitrah: In Islamic theology, there is a concept called Fitrah, which refers to the natural disposition or innate sense of morality that every human is born with. According to many Islamic scholars, Fitrah is the inherent inclination to recognize good and evil, which aligns with the moral teachings of Islam.
Not Exclusive to Nature: However, while Fitrah suggests a pre-existing moral compass, it is essential to recognize that Islamic morality also heavily relies on divine revelation. Hence, while there might be an innate ethical sense, the specific moral rules are articulated and codified through the Quran and Hadith.
3. The Role of the Quran and God in Morality
You correctly note that the moral rules are detailed within the Quran, which Muslims believe to be safeguarded in God's possession. This highlights several important concepts:
Absolute Source of Morality: In Islam, God is considered the ultimate source of morality. The moral rules defined in the Quran are viewed as eternal truths that are not subject to change or human interpretation outside the context provided by Islamic theology.
Guidance to Remind Believers: The role of Muhammad as the final prophet is to convey these divine moral teachings, reiterating the rules within the human context. His life serves as a model of how to live according to these divine principles, making the moral rules not just abstract texts but lived experiences.
Conclusion
In summary, the assertion that there are moral rules in Islam derived from a biological firmware perspective has some merit in terms of the concept of Fitrah, but it is important to clarify that these moral principles are explicitly defined and contextualized through divine revelation in the Quran and Hadith. While there may be inherent morality recognized by humans, the specific moral directives that form the basis of Islamic ethics are firmly rooted in religious texts and the belief that God's guidance is essential for understanding right and wrong.
Thus, the statement can be seen as partially true but may benefit from further clarification regarding the relationship between innate morality (Fitrah) and divinely revealed moral law.